Unpopular DB opinions

[Boo Machine]

because Goku got a damn rage boost like Vegeta that don't make any sense because rage boost is a gohan thing

Rage boost is a thing for everyone, It's just that Gohan hogged it for most of Dragon Ball Z. Also it didn't amount to anything in the end.

Uh no gohan is only character who got rage boost in DBZ and goku and Vegeta never got a rage boost in DBZ

To be fair though it's not as if "rage boost" is a form that is ever stated to be a Gohan only thing. Anger was just a means used to get gohan powerful enough to do whatever needed to be done. Like it was used it Super. Except in Super the rage boost ultimately doesn't win the day. So it's not terribly hard to believe other characters can do the same. Especially if the boost is only enough to get a few more hits in before the character gets smacked back down.

[Gog]

because Goku got a damn rage boost like Vegeta that don't make any sense because rage boost is a gohan thing

Rage boost is a thing for everyone, It's just that Gohan hogged it for most of Dragon Ball Z. Also it didn't amount to anything in the end.

Uh no gohan is only character who got rage boost in DBZ and goku and Vegeta never got a rage boost in DBZ

Goku actually did get a rage boost, in fact he got the largest rage boost. Super Saiyan. Another thing, if Goku had just gone dammit, then that scene would have been terrible and out of character

[The gr]

Rage boost is a thing for everyone, It's just that Gohan hogged it for most of Dragon Ball Z. Also it didn't amount to anything in the end.

Uh no gohan is only character who got rage boost in DBZ and goku and Vegeta never got a rage boost in DBZ

Goku actually did get a rage boost, in fact he got the largest rage boost. Super Saiyan. Another thing, if Goku had just gone dammit, then that scene would have been terrible and out of character

Your confusing rage boost with rage induced transformation

[Gog]

Uh no gohan is only character who got rage boost in DBZ and goku and Vegeta never got a rage boost in DBZ

Goku actually did get a rage boost, in fact he got the largest rage boost. Super Saiyan. Another thing, if Goku had just gone dammit, then that scene would have been terrible and out of character

Your confusing rage boost with rage induced transformation

But rage boosts are still something that Gohan isn't privy too. In fact it absolutely 100% would have been out of character for Goku to not get a rage boost

[The gr]

Goku actually did get a rage boost, in fact he got the largest rage boost. Super Saiyan. Another thing, if Goku had just gone dammit, then that scene would have been terrible and out of character

Your confusing rage boost with rage induced transformation

But rage boosts are still something that Gohan isn't privy too. In fact it absolutely 100% would have been out of character for Goku to not get a rage boost

I would have preferred if goku pull a Vegeta in the cell game saga he got angry but he did not damage the bad guy which in my opinion Vegeta rage about ft trunks death ≥≥≥≥≥ that's my Bulma

[Gog]

Your confusing rage boost with rage induced transformation

But rage boosts are still something that Gohan isn't privy too. In fact it absolutely 100% would have been out of character for Goku to not get a rage boost

I would have preferred if goku pull a Vegeta in the cell game saga he got angry but he did not damage the bad guy which in my opinion Vegeta rage about ft trunks death ≥≥≥≥≥ that's my Bulma

But it didn't even matter in the end, as Goku's rage boost didn't amount to much

[Soppa Saia People]

He might not be a native language speaker. If so, it's best to cut him some slack.

You guess it I'm not a native language speaker as a matter of fact my first language was Spanish and not English

but regarding the topic i find goku rage scene in DBS ep 61 stupid

I don't mind the occasional misspelling, or the grammar being flawed, but punctuation isn't really a barrier for non native speakers.

[TheUltimateNinja]

Toyotaro is totally incompetent and shouldn't have been given any freedom.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

Toyotaro is totally incompetent and shouldn't have been given any freedom.

If Toyotaro in his current capacity is incompetent in your eyes, you're unpleasable. Even if you don't like what he's doing, he's better than anyone else who's come along to date, that's a fact. Not to mention that taking away creative freedom from someone who's work a project depends on is evil in its own right.

[TheUltimateNinja]

Toyotaro is totally incompetent and shouldn't have been given any freedom.

If Toyotaro in his current capacity is incompetent in your eyes, you're unpleasable. Taking away creative freedom from someone who's work a project depends on is evil in its own right.

I doubt the anime's animators get much say in how the plot should go. Toyo should draw what a decent writer tells him to.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

I doubt the anime's animators get much say in how the plot should go. Toyo should draw what a decent writer tells him to.

The animators couldn't do shit on their own, it's an entirely different situation. What's your problem with Toyotaro's storytelling anyway? A know a lot of people say it without giving any legitimate reasons, cause it's the edgy thing to do now.

[Gog]

I doubt the anime's animators get much say in how the plot should go. Toyo should draw what a decent writer tells him to.

The animators couldn't do shit on their own, it's an entirely different situation. What's your problem with Toyotaro's storytelling anyway? A know a lot of people say it without giving any legitimate reasons cause it's the edgy thing to do now.

The problem with Toyataro's story telling in the Black arc at the very least, is that the power scaling is more consistent than it was in the anime, it also is more... Okay I'll just quote you to this godlike rant post I did to explain it.

[spoiler]

Post from /a/ regarding the anime and manga. Thoughts?


*gets triggered*

hey, hey, heh. I feel very, very triggered from this little'post' I'll break it down so that it's easier to read.

1. And why should Black have a regular SSJ form? The form would be useless, heck it's like Freeza and his two middle form. Nobody cares about them. Even the franchise doesn't care about them. So why even bother with it? It would essentially be useless padding. Another thing why the hell are everyone questioning what the fuck Super Saiyan Rose is? You can actually draw simple conclusions to what it is through the show. I'll spell it out to you, the aura, the colour, the fact that he has god ki and he even names it in a similar way to Super Saiyan Blue. I'll give you a second to think-, it's just evil Super Saiyan Blue.

In fact if he technically has Super Saiyan Rose, that would mean that he has Super Saiyan, but he never uses it. Because well why would he? There's no point in actually using the form. It's an inferior form, that would serve no purpose. Especially for Goku Black. Also why the hell would you even want Super Saiyan Goku black, we got that in the manga and nearly everyone hated how it was done.

2. The ducks don't give no fucks. ROF is a move that I enjoyed, even though it was insanely disappointing. And the movie was just basically Akira Toriyama, heck he was even surprised at how much was unchanged from what he originally planned. Just because there's Toriyama on it, does not mean it will be good.

3. Degradation of characters Oh no you fucking don't. You have no right and I will shred you for stating that. Your fucking opinion. Here's the thing Goku was literally acting like Goku in that scene. That was what set Zamasu off, the blatant disrespect that Goku showed to him. I'LL EVEN GET TO THAT LATER ON. Not going all out? You mean what Goku always fucking does and what is actually in character for Goku to do? What's your fucking problem with that? Goku's not superman which is apparently what you think he is? So you're judging his intelligence on the fact that he forgot something? What. The. Fuck, it's a momentary lapse of concentration, that shit happens, to all of us. Also happened again, jeez it's like these characters are people. Also I remember Goku's epic reaction to the death of his son and wife, he totally messed Black Goku and Zamasu- wait a minute that was the anime silly me. However that dammit was pretty hardcore as well.

Also, what the fuck is the problem with the Omni King button? What's your fucking problem with the fucking Omni King button, why don't you like the fact that Goku was literally forced to press the button, as all options had been literally wasted, and his enemy was stronger than ever? And the enemy was going to destroy all worlds? What's your fucking problem with this

Also degradation of characters? You have no fucking idea on the size of the supernova landmine of rage your stepping on. The manga version literally degraded the most important aspect of the arc. Black Goku and Zamasu, but more importantly Black Goku. The whole entire reason why Zamasu becomes evil is. Because. Of. Goku, seeing how dangerous and disrespectful mortals can be Zamasu grew hateful of them. And the Babari dino fucks just further escalated that. But the most important part of that is Goku. Apparently he watched a fucking GodTube(Tm) clip and got all mad about it. He still got the Babari, but the main reason Goku, was not there. So it wasn't as good.

And to the main dessert black Goku, *Gog embraces manga black Goku, and slowly strokes his head, "I'm so, so sorry for what he's done to you" Gog told him. Tears welled out of manga black Goku's eyes, he burrowed his head into Gog's chest, and started sobbing uncontrollably, "it can be fixed" Gog tightened his embrace of manga black Goku, "there's, there's still the anime..." Gog reminded him sadly. Black Goku's sorrow could be heard from everywhere"* Now the main problem with black Goku in this arc is that everything good about him in the anime, was stomped and pissed on by the artist. Basically turning him from a unique, intimidating, enjoyable villain. To generic Dragon ball villain, hey we've done this already. Everything unique about black, the level headiness especially in stressful situations, the masochistic part of him, his incredibly sense of determination which only Freeza himself rivals.

*Poof* gone instead where replaced with some egotistical, speech sprouting, arrogant, losses his head when under pressure, who wears fucking eye liner to make himself seem more savage, and psychopathic than his anime counterpart. Which his anime counterpart achieved without seemingly any effort. In fact i'd even go as far as to consider Goku black anime and Manga to be different characters.

In fact I even wished that the artist would have redesigned Black's appearance, for something more fitting.

This is more like it.

Extras. I can't fucking believe it, you really expected Dragon Ball to have a clear and consistent power line? Such a thing has never once been a piority for the franchise. Also if you want to get technical than even the super manga fucks up just as bad. I don't give much fucks about Frost, but his character in Super was expanded on more so than in the manga. TL;DR Manga Frost needs to be expanded on.

4. I really couldn't care much about the fact that Black wear's a time ring or not. I'd dare say that Black wearing a time ring is prehaps an important design choice for the anime, especially with the route they chose.

5. I cannot fucking believe this. Perhaps you should relabel this as removing good character motivations, such as Goku defeating. Humiliating Zamasu in battle and showing a complete lack of respect while doing so, also personalizing it was well. And instead replacing it with the fucking pathetic, piss poor, shit stained excuse that Zamasu saw Goku on GodTube, thus making his entire motivation on the level of an angry youtube comment.

6. Making characters useful.... I can't, but I must. How the hell is the manga the exception here? I seem to remember how big of a help Bulma is, how Gowasu is the only reason why there still alive, how Master Roshi gave them the mafuba, how Piccolo had the video. Listing off the manga for having this, means exactly jack shit as the anime has it as well.

7. And? Some scenes in the anime shit all over that beautiful art.

So in conclusion

You're free to have your preferences for which one adaption is better. However with all these points made it is clear without a shadow of a doubt. That what the fuck. I'll say it, your free to have whatever opinion you want, but you will admit that the manga is just painfully mediocre and it isn't healthy of you to consistently stroke it like that.

The anime story while having it's high ups and low downs, isn't the character burning, motivation burning, bland as sandland abomination that the manga is and nearly all your points can be applied to the manga as well. YOU FUCKING ARROGANT, CLOSE MINDED, OBNOXIOUS HYPOCRITE, You cannot say that, you cannot fucking say that the manga is the better adaption case close and basically wave away all points in favor of the anime. YOUR JUST DOING WHAT YOU SAID YOU SHOULDN'T BE DOING

[/spoiler]

[Jinzoningen MULE]

I was asking for legitimate reasons, not an incoherent rant over the inconsequential aspects that you may or may not prefer. Most of that has nothing to do with Toyotaro, even. Those are just regular Dragon Ball problems.

[Gog]

I was asking for legitimate reasons, not an incoherent rant over the inconsequential aspects that you may or may not prefer. Most of that has nothing to do with Toyotaro, even. Those are just regular Dragon Ball problems.

There to do with the Black Goku arc tale, I.E Toyotoro's version of the events. Also, what? Character degradation for Goku Black and Zamasu is because of Dragon ball?

[TheUltimateNinja]

I doubt the anime's animators get much say in how the plot should go. Toyo should draw what a decent writer tells him to.

The animators couldn't do shit on their own, it's an entirely different situation. What's your problem with Toyotaro's storytelling anyway? A know a lot of people say it without giving any legitimate reasons cause it's the edgy thing to do now.

I don't like how he can't decide whether he wants to rush through arcs or have some padding, and also how badly he manages the power scale. The anime isn't much better in the power scaling department, but at least its fights are flashy and entertaining and it has the excuse of poorly managed production. Since Toyo is already far behind the anime plot-wise, he should at least try to make the story more coherent. I guess he tried by removing the part where Goku fights Zamasu and Black somehow remembers it, but that alone isn't enough to change my opinion on his writing abilities.

The problem with Toyataro's story telling in the Black arc at the very least, is that the power scaling is more consistent than it was in the anime, it also is more... Okay I'll just quote you to this godlike rant post I did to explain it.

I haven't read the rest of your post yet, but let me stop you right here.

[Gog]

I doubt the anime's animators get much say in how the plot should go. Toyo should draw what a decent writer tells him to.

The animators couldn't do shit on their own, it's an entirely different situation. What's your problem with Toyotaro's storytelling anyway? A know a lot of people say it without giving any legitimate reasons cause it's the edgy thing to do now.

I don't like how he can't decide whether he wants to rush through arcs or have some padding, and also how badly he manages the power scale. The anime isn't much better in the power scaling department, but at least its fights are flashy and entertaining and it has the excuse of poorly managed production. Since Toyo is already far behind the anime plot-wise, he should at least try to make the story more coherent. I guess he tried by removing the part where Goku fights Zamasu and Black somehow remembers it, but that alone isn't enough to change my opinion on his writing abilities.

The problem with Toyataro's story telling in the Black arc at the very least, is that the power scaling is more consistent than it was in the anime, it also is more... Okay I'll just quote you to this godlike rant post I did to explain it.

I haven't read the rest of your post yet, but let me stop you right here.

Sorry could you explain? Would be nice to hear why, because I keep on hearing people praising it for that aspect:?

[Jinzoningen MULE]

Also, what? Character degradation for Goku Black and Zamasu is because of Dragon ball?

You didn't give any legitimate examples as to how he even "pissed on the enjoyable aspects of the character" or whatever you said. He's written almost exactly the same by Toyotaro, the only difference being that he had no prior drama with Goku. I guess the sheer bizarreness of his personality isn't played up as much, but that's it, nothing substantial at all. You can't just say things, you have to back them up with concrete reasons and priorities, that's how discussion work.

For example, the user Doctor. and I disagree on manga points fairly regularly. However, he almost always gives legitimate counterpoints to mine, pointing out structural flaws and why they matter even though he's usually wrong. Because of that, we can disagree and enjoy our discussions just fine. However, that can't be the case if the bulk of your post amounts to "This sucks and I hate it!" with nothing to back it up, I can't take it seriously.

[TheUltimateNinja]

Sorry could you explain? Would be nice to hear why, because I keep on hearing people praising it for that aspect:?

Primarily because the Hit fight suggests SSBlue is only 10x SSJ. That's probably been retconned, but there's issues in this arc as well.

For one, SSJ2 Vegeta is far stronger than SSJ3 Goku, potentially over 100x stronger since he can easily thrash SSJ2 Black who can destroy SSJ3 Goku/SSJ2 Trunks in base.

Second, the gap between Vegeta's SSJ2 and SSBlue isn't very big since with a single Zenkai SSJ2 Black goes from being clobbered by SSJ2 Vegeta to thrashing SSBlue Vegeta.

However, let's say he just got an absolutely massive Zenkai or was intentionally getting beaten (Unlikely given his reaction to getting wrecked and the fact that he would have died if Zamasu didn't save him), this means SSRose Black is thousands of times stronger than SSBlue Goku and Vegeta since his base is thousands of times stronger, we know that their multipliers are the same since SSRose is treated as Black's equivalent of SSBlue and Zamasu says SSRose is stronger than SSGod, just like SSBlue.

Essentially this is the power scale the manga gives us:
Goku/Vegeta/Trunks: 1
SSJ Goku: 50
SSJ2 Goku: 100
SSJ2 Trunks: 380
SSJ3 Goku: 400
Black: 600
SSJ2 Black: 60,000
SSJ2 Vegeta: 100,000
SSBlue Vegeta: 500,000 (This one's arbitrary, but there's no indication of the gap between his SSJ2 and SSBlue so I just gave it a 500,000x multiplier)
SSJ2 Black (Zenkai): 600,000
SSRose Black: 3,000,000,000

[Jinzoningen MULE]

I don't like how he can't decide whether he wants to rush through arcs or have some padding...

What? He rushed through consistently until the FT Arc, now he's taking his time to give a solid product. You make it sound as if he's vastly altering the direction every month, but that's just not the case.

...and also how badly he manages the power scale. The anime isn't much better in the power scaling department, but at least its fights are flashy and entertaining and it has the excuse of poorly managed production.

Really... are you really even taking it there? Not only does it not matter, but this community has devalued power scaling to the point where even if it had ever been consistent, no one cares.

Even if that wasn't the case, you even admit that it's not a Toyotaro problem. But the anime is better because it's badly produced and is animated? Talk about a non-sequitur!

ISince Toyo is already far behind the anime plot-wise, he should at least try to make the story more coherent. I guess he tried by removing the part where Goku fights Zamasu and Black somehow remembers it, but that alone isn't enough to change my opinion on his writing abilities.

You didn't even try to establish that it was incoherent, although you seem to be referencing the time travel plot hole, which is a flaw in that arc's skeleton. It has little to do with Toyotaro. The stories cohere just fine, you just don't like them.

I think that's what I'm taking away from this, you like X more than Y, therefore Y is incompetent. What I don't get is why you point out problems equally present both X and Y as evidence for X's objective superiority, but I get even less why you pointed out one problem that doesn't even exist. You insult and degrade someone's livelihood because they don't cater to your sensibilities. That's what this is, and it's gross.

[Gog]

Also, what? Character degradation for Goku Black and Zamasu is because of Dragon ball?

You didn't give any legitimate examples as to how he even "pissed on the enjoyable aspects of the character" or whatever you said. He's written almost exactly the same by Toyotaro, the only difference being that he had no prior drama with Goku. I guess the sheer bizarreness of his personality isn't played up as much, but that's it, nothing substantial at all. You can't just say things, you have to back them up with concrete reasons and priorities, that's how discussion work.

For example, the user Doctor. and I disagree on manga points fairly regularly. However, he almost always gives legitimate counterpoints to mine, pointing out structural flaws and why they matter even though he's usually wrong. Because of that, we can disagree and enjoy our discussions just fine. However, that can't be the case if the bulk of your post amounts to "This sucks and I hate it!" with nothing to back it up, I can't take it seriously.

Thanks for telling me that. Just take that as a rant, nothing more, nothing less.