"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[Lord Frieza]

Is he not a cyborg? A being with both organic and biomechatronic body parts.

Cybernetics are artificial/mechanical however that being said it was never said they cannot grow stronger normally. Their not robots and still have organic components so in theory they can still grow stronger naturally to. Infact that would explain why he's gotten stronger if he can tap into his cyborg energy and natural ki to.

Apparently not. I learnt from a huge 17 fan that there actually isn't any mechanical parts. It lines up with when Gohan said they're humans but rearranged on a cellular level a few episodes ago.

I can confirm this, all their modifications are biological including the infinity energy reactor..

So they are kind of like Proto-Types for Cell in a way. That also explains why he could absorb and integrate them so easily.

That also make it believable that they can still train and get stronger.

[King Jacku]

I actually won't even mind if 17 is beyond ssj3 levels. His upgrades are actually all biological and Toriyama said he could get stronger through training. Considering an untrained version was way beyond a ss, I wouldn't complain if he's much stronger than a ss3 10 years later. However, it'll be weird to exclude him from future material if the cast know how strong he is.

That just wouldn't make any sense TBH. In the past, Piccolo, who was on par with 17, and Vegeta have trained roughly the same amount of time (From Cell arc to Boo arc) and were no where NEAR SSJ3. In Vegeta's case he even had the gravity room which is how he was as strong as he was in the Boo arc. On earth there isn't many places to go that will give you a big boost besides the RoSaT, which it's obvious he didn't go there.

I personally don't think Toriyama/Toei's gonna make him that strong anyways, strong as SSJ2 tops.

[Ki Breaker]

That just wouldn't make any sense TBH.

When has it ever?

[SansrivaaL]

I dont mind 17 becoming stronger than ssj2 at all, despite the lack of motivation for how he got strong, they can just add up a part or imply where he was protecting the animals from a powerful foe behind the scenes, but if he pushes Goku to SSJB like how Krillin pushed Goku to SSJ again, I am gonna rage the hell out again

[Ki Breaker]

I dont mind 17 becoming stronger than ssj2 at all, despite the lack of motivation for how he got strong, they can just add up a part or imply where he was protecting the animals from a powerful foe behind the scenes, but if he pushes Goku to SSJB like how Krillin pushed Goku to SSJ again, I am gonna rage the hell out again

SS2 fine, SS3 alright I can live with that, anything beyond that and I flip

[emperior]

As for 17, if Goku spars with him he will comment how strong 17 is compared to his sister (implying he trained, if 17 doesn't outright state it) and transform into a SSJ so Goku's base power will still be a mystery.

I probably called it. This post is from a few days ago in the Power Levels discussion thread.
I knew 17 would get a power-up. It makes sense though considering he's been missing for 10 years in-universe and he it seemed like he enjoyed fighting so he would be the type to train off-screen. Though he should be SSJ2 level at max, he shouldn't be stronger than Buu. But I guess we will never know exactly how strong he got.

[Power Metal]

If he's been training for 10 years and super strong now I'm sure they could have used his help when Buu probably wiped out his family with his extinction wave...

Maybe it was Buu's extinction wave that motivated him to start training.

If 17 really is significantly stronger, I kinda expect him to permanently join the cast. That is assuming the story continues after this tournament anyway.

[kinisking]

I actually won't even mind if 17 is beyond ssj3 levels. His upgrades are actually all biological and Toriyama said he could get stronger through training. Considering an untrained version was way beyond a ss, I wouldn't complain if he's much stronger than a ss3 10 years later. However, it'll be weird to exclude him from future material if the cast know how strong he is.

That just wouldn't make any sense TBH. In the past, Piccolo, who was on par with 17, and Vegeta have trained roughly the same amount of time (From Cell arc to Boo arc) and were no where NEAR SSJ3. In Vegeta's case he even had the gravity room which is how he was as strong as he was in the Boo arc. On earth there isn't many places to go that will give you a big boost besides the RoSaT, which it's obvious he didn't go there.

I personally don't think Toriyama/Toei's gonna make him that strong anyways, strong as SSJ2 tops.

Piccolo and Vegeta had already trained their entire lives up until that point. 17 hasn't trained a day. He has more potential for growth. We already know what kind of growth people can go through if they've never trained with Freeza.

[pacz360]

I dont mind 17 becoming stronger than ssj2 at all, despite the lack of motivation for how he got strong, they can just add up a part or imply where he was protecting the animals from a powerful foe behind the scenes, but if he pushes Goku to SSJB like how Krillin pushed Goku to SSJ again, I am gonna rage the hell out again

Krillin only pushed goku for a ring out never due to his strength.

[pacz360]

Also guys piccolo depending on this weeks episode can train with gohan to get stronger.

[namekiansaiyan]

I am now waiting for power ups for Piccolo and Tien who are real fighters.

So if they're not in the Goku/Bulma's posse they're automatically not fighters who don't train?

Why does Tien still train? "To protect the earth hur durrr?" No. You can still be a martial artist training in the woods without having to come out and
help Goku/Bulma posse every time something happens.

You haven't seen what the man has been doing and you're automatically making assumptions about his life for the past 10 years; and if Toriyama
doesn't live up to your assumptions you'll complain about it.

I don't care what 17 has been doing. He shouldn't come back and tack screen time and potential fights from established members of the cast who are real fighters just becuase he is a returning character who has apparently got a lot stronger out of nowhere.

He's stronger? well then, expect Goku to go straight SSJB first and then gets forced to go SSJBKKx2 because his SSJB aint enough for 17.

It wouldnt be stupid for you if it were Piccolo tho.

I have mentioned before that I don't like characters getting left out when it comes to power ups as I like seeing all characters fighting as much as they can.

If 17 is one of the only ones to get a power it will be just because he is a returning characterand that is why it is stupid. 17 and 18 should be similar in power as that makes sense for them. I feel like I have a right to be annoyed as Piccolo has been around in action for a long time and gets nothing while 17 has not been involved but somehow can be really strong.

I am now waiting for power ups for Piccolo and Tien who are real fighters.

17 and Krillin getting power ups instead of Piccolo and Tien is just indefencible to me.

He is an Andriod though. That was super strong before without any sort of training, it has literally been years since we saw him.

Why is 18 not stronger then? It is just becuase 17 is a returning character. Bringing 17 back with a power up instead of using other permanent characters who have had nothing is just ridiculous and I will never agree with it.

Well it's not like piccolo can't get stronger training with gohan the guy has 38 hours to do it.

What can he do in 38 hours apart from going into the Hyperboloc Time Chamber.

Piccolo should already be stronger as Krillin has got stronger and Piccolo should have been training even harder aa he would be expecting to participate in this tournament anyway. Krillin getting stronger and Piccolo and Tien not is indefencible.

Piccolo and Gohan might be doing something and hopefully it is revealed in episode 85.

I actually won't even mind if 17 is beyond ssj3 levels. His upgrades are actually all biological and Toriyama said he could get stronger through training. Considering an untrained version was way beyond a ss, I wouldn't complain if he's much stronger than a ss3 10 years later. However, it'll be weird to exclude him from future material if the cast know how strong he is.

That just wouldn't make any sense TBH. In the past, Piccolo, who was on par with 17, and Vegeta have trained roughly the same amount of time (From Cell arc to Boo arc) and were no where NEAR SSJ3. In Vegeta's case he even had the gravity room which is how he was as strong as he was in the Boo arc. On earth there isn't many places to go that will give you a big boost besides the RoSaT, which it's obvious he didn't go there.

I personally don't think Toriyama/Toei's gonna make him that strong anyways, strong as SSJ2 tops.

Piccolo and Vegeta had already trained their entire lives up until that point. 17 hasn't trained a day. He has more potential for growth. We already know what kind of growth people can go through if they've never trained with Freeza.

Toriyama should have introduced him earlier instead of bringing him in and taking screen time in the most biggest arc in the whole franchise. If 17 was not here Yamcha would probably have been included. I still think 17 will not do as well as many of you are thinking anyway.

[Beyond]

It's clearly a civil right's movement for Piccolo fans right now. We gotta suffer A LOT.... but through perseverance and going through a lot of shit we don't deserve.... we still won't be equal to anyone above us but we'll eventually get a bone, and it won't be good enough because we suffered to much to get it, but we'll take it anyway cause it's all we're going to get.

[emperior]

Maybe 17 will be as strong as Piccolo is right now? It would be great to have them as equals once again.
By the way I'm very hyped for his episode, always thought he was a cool character and I like a lot his and 18's gimmick of having infinite energy.

[Yomi]

I don't care what 17 has been doing. He shouldn't come back and tack screen time and potential fights from established members of the cast who are real fighters just becuase he is a returning character who has apparently got a lot stronger out of nowhere.

What is a "real fighter" ?
I spent my last post dissecting that term and you just use it again.
Are real fighters people that fight evil and destruction? You know there are other reasons to practice martial arts.

[SansrivaaL]

I dont mind 17 becoming stronger than ssj2 at all, despite the lack of motivation for how he got strong, they can just add up a part or imply where he was protecting the animals from a powerful foe behind the scenes, but if he pushes Goku to SSJB like how Krillin pushed Goku to SSJ again, I am gonna rage the hell out again

Krillin only pushed goku for a ring out never due to his strength.

We are talking about Krillins ki wave, it had enough POWER to push Goku into SSJ.

[namekiansaiyan]

I don't care what 17 has been doing. He shouldn't come back and tack screen time and potential fights from established members of the cast who are real fighters just becuase he is a returning character who has apparently got a lot stronger out of nowhere.

What is a "real fighter" ?
I spent my last post dissecting that term and you just use it again.
Are real fighters people that fight evil and destruction? You know there are other reasons to practice martial arts.

People who like to train and fight and who actually have skill and not just power.

[TheMikado]

I actually won't even mind if 17 is beyond ssj3 levels. His upgrades are actually all biological and Toriyama said he could get stronger through training. Considering an untrained version was way beyond a ss, I wouldn't complain if he's much stronger than a ss3 10 years later. However, it'll be weird to exclude him from future material if the cast know how strong he is.

That just wouldn't make any sense TBH. In the past, Piccolo, who was on par with 17, and Vegeta have trained roughly the same amount of time (From Cell arc to Boo arc) and were no where NEAR SSJ3. In Vegeta's case he even had the gravity room which is how he was as strong as he was in the Boo arc. On earth there isn't many places to go that will give you a big boost besides the RoSaT, which it's obvious he didn't go there.

I personally don't think Toriyama/Toei's gonna make him that strong anyways, strong as SSJ2 tops.

Piccolo and Vegeta had already trained their entire lives up until that point. 17 hasn't trained a day. He has more potential for growth. We already know what kind of growth people can go through if they've never trained with Freeza.

More potential for growth? That's the epitome of head canon. I'm pretty sure 18 trains with Krillin occasionally and he's the strongest human in the world,( at least SSB levels- just kidding of course). Like I said I don't care about this at this point in Super but I'm not going to pretend that it's immediately justifiable. I'll wait for the explanation from the episode, but if things go as they normally do in Super it will be that he trained for a short time and discovered untold potential with a several magnitude increase in power after about a day and a half.

[Totamo]

I am now waiting for power ups for Piccolo and Tien who are real fighters.

So if they're not in the Goku/Bulma's posse they're automatically not fighters who don't train?

Why does Tien still train? "To protect the earth hur durrr?" No. You can still be a martial artist training in the woods without having to come out and
help Goku/Bulma posse every time something happens.

You haven't seen what the man has been doing and you're automatically making assumptions about his life for the past 10 years; and if Toriyama
doesn't live up to your assumptions you'll complain about it.

I don't care what 17 has been doing. He shouldn't come back and tack screen time and potential fights from established members of the cast who are real fighters just becuase he is a returning character who has apparently got a lot stronger out of nowhere.

I have mentioned before that I don't like characters getting left out when it comes to power ups as I like seeing all characters fighting as much as they can.

If 17 is one of the only ones to get a power it will be just because he is a returning characterand that is why it is stupid. 17 and 18 should be similar in power as that makes sense for them. I feel like I have a right to be annoyed as Piccolo has been around in action for a long time and gets nothing while 17 has not been involved but somehow can be really strong.

I am now waiting for power ups for Piccolo and Tien who are real fighters.

17 and Krillin getting power ups instead of Piccolo and Tien is just indefencible to me.



Why is 18 not stronger then? It is just becuase 17 is a returning character. Bringing 17 back with a power up instead of using other permanent characters who have had nothing is just ridiculous and I will never agree with it.

Well it's not like piccolo can't get stronger training with gohan the guy has 38 hours to do it.

What can he do in 38 hours apart from going into the Hyperboloc Time Chamber.

Piccolo should already be stronger as Krillin has got stronger and Piccolo should have been training even harder aa he would be expecting to participate in this tournament anyway. Krillin getting stronger and Piccolo and Tien not is indefencible.

Piccolo and Gohan might be doing something and hopefully it is revealed in episode 85.

That just wouldn't make any sense TBH. In the past, Piccolo, who was on par with 17, and Vegeta have trained roughly the same amount of time (From Cell arc to Boo arc) and were no where NEAR SSJ3. In Vegeta's case he even had the gravity room which is how he was as strong as he was in the Boo arc. On earth there isn't many places to go that will give you a big boost besides the RoSaT, which it's obvious he didn't go there.

I personally don't think Toriyama/Toei's gonna make him that strong anyways, strong as SSJ2 tops.

Piccolo and Vegeta had already trained their entire lives up until that point. 17 hasn't trained a day. He has more potential for growth. We already know what kind of growth people can go through if they've never trained with Freeza.

Toriyama should have introduced him earlier instead of bringing him in and taking screen time in the most biggest arc in the whole franchise. If 17 was not here Yamcha would probably have been included. I still think 17 will not do as well as many of you are thinking anyway.

Hahaha Piccolo has done next to nothing since the Buu saga and it wasn't even much there.

He and 17 are in the same boat. Fighters from z who got outshined by the saiyans.

[Beyond]

I don't care what 17 has been doing. He shouldn't come back and tack screen time and potential fights from established members of the cast who are real fighters just becuase he is a returning character who has apparently got a lot stronger out of nowhere.

What is a "real fighter" ?
I spent my last post dissecting that term and you just use it again.
Are real fighters people that fight evil and destruction? You know there are other reasons to practice martial arts.

People who like to train and fight and who actually have skill and not just power.

Don't pretend like we know if 17 likes to train or not. We know he has a family, so he probably can't do it as much as Goku, Vegeta, TIen, or Piccolo, but he probably does it often. I do agree if he is waaay stronger it's probably BS, but he is still a fighter.

[Lapislettuce]

I don't care what 17 has been doing. He shouldn't come back and tack screen time and potential fights from established members of the cast who are real fighters just becuase he is a returning character who has apparently got a lot stronger out of nowhere.

What is a "real fighter" ?
I spent my last post dissecting that term and you just use it again.
Are real fighters people that fight evil and destruction? You know there are other reasons to practice martial arts.

People who like to train and fight and who actually have skill and not just power.

You really are something aren't ya ? you're sounding like a baby right now i hope you know that.