Why so much hatred over the manga Zamasu?

[TheSaiyanGod]

In this post I'm going to leave in '' defense '' of the Zamasu presented in the manga. As most do not like this Zamasu, I think it's good to do this post.
I'll post all the pictures of the lines, so it's good to reread it, even to remember his actions in the manga.

It is common (I would say normal) to compare the two versions of Zamasu presented in the series (anime and manga), after all are two media covering the same sagas.
But in the manga several things are different from the anime, and this is nothing new, soon the presentation or exploration of the characters will also be. It is not obligation you compare the two Zamasu because they were developed in different ways with changes in the two personality(Influenced perhaps by the time of production, or the imagination of the creators themselves).

You can see Kaio Zamasu's great inferiority and superiority complex (which Black was "recruiting.") He says in the manga that he became immortal due to the fact that he would never trade his divine abilities for power like his other "I" did. He knew that he was weaker, but his complex of God mattered more
Because of this, his fragile ego caused an argument with Black and a moment of despair, for he was being despised by the mortal who hates, utterly imposing. As much he responds to Goku's provocation in this chapter in relation to Trunks.Different from the smug Zamasu of the anime

In Black it is possible to perceive the essence of Zamasu in his way of speaking and in his actions. But this was modified due to the fact of having robbed the body of a Saiyajin and obtained an extraordinary power, which made him presumptuous and arrogant, as if Had incorporated the desire of the Saiyans to always be strengthened, infinitely. Unlike the Black most '' philosopher '' of the anime
Of course, we also see similarity (after all it's the same script). That Zamasu's sociopathic coming back from the planet Babari and his questions about justice (present in the anime and manga, just read), and his sick mind talking about '' beauty ' (As the energy that Black releases to kill Trunks in the manga). In the anime really was more worked on some issues, even for the greater time of Toei, but the point is that they were exploited differently in the two media, You can not compare well.

Pictures of the lines I said:

[spoiler]






[/spoiler]

[The gr]

I think you meant Black,he is the character who gets the most hate

[Lord Beerus]

Well, for me, Zamasu/Goku Black just feels a bit too undercooked.

Goku battling Zamasu in the anime was huge a part of Zamasu descent into darkness and a very important aspect within the plot itself. After meeting Goku however and losing to him quickly in a sparring match, his views radically changed and his distrustful nature towards mortals only grew. Annoyed at Goku's carefree attitude and lack of respect, his distaste for the gods not quelling the dangerous nature of mortals evolved to a radicalism-level. Shocked at how a mortal like Goku could gain a power rivalling gods, let alone even obtaining such power, and so recklessly challenge a God and defeat him easily, Zamasu came to sternly believe that mortal life by nature is an evil. It's that meeting with Goku that also serves as the core purpose for why he steal Goku's body in the first place.

The anime makes the scenario with Zamasu's distrusts and resentment of mortals, and later Goku specifically, more logical and layered because he actually meets and fights Goku, and personally comes to the conclusion, following how Goku able defeat him with just a fraction of his strength, that mortals having that kind of power, let alone the power to challenge Gods, is a potentially great danger to the universe and a grave mistake of the Gods to let it happen in the first place. Hell, Merged Zamasu even further states to Vegetto that he chose Goku's body specifically because, in Zamasu, eye, Goku is the representation of all of the failures of the Gods, as Goku had obtained power surpassing the Gods, despite being mortal. Take all of that development out and Goku Black loses all of his unique symbolism and representation.

The manga just glosses over that aspect by having Zamasu's only knowledge of Goku be watching him through Godtube clips. He sees a few clips on Godtube of Goku fighting in the Universe 6/7 tournament is all like "Yeah. Fuck this guy." Seriously? I don't like that lack of motivation as why he would choose Goku's body to switch with and become Goku Black. There's literally no point to the concept of Goku Black even existing in the manga. Zamasu could have switched bodies with anyone in the manga with how more ambiguous and shallow they make his motivation towards hating mortals. For all intents and purposes, he could have swapped bodies with Hit or Vegeta.

The characterisation of Goku Black is even worse. Goku Black is portrayed as less of a menace and has more instances of grasping the idiot ball. His method of getting stronger, was needlessly convoluted and just outright dumb, when you realise the abilities he has at his disposal. I mean, if Goku Black knew how Zenkai's work, why didn't he just have Future Zamasu blast some holes in him and then heal again, to efficiently farm those cheap power-ups? If Goku Black knows that he can transform into Super Saiyan Rose, then why doesn't he have Zamasu beat him up and Zenkai his way into the form? This makes Black seem incredibly stupid, especially considering that Zamasu can heal him. So he could have done this a long time ago with Zamasu and it would much more safer and efficient. But he didn't. He decided to be a reckless idiot and hope that Vegeta doesn't kill him very quickly or that Zamasu miraculously arrived to save his ass before it was too late. Not mention he is far more prone to losing his composure in the manga, while the anime version of Goku Black always remained calm, cool and extremely pragmatic.

The manga basically made him a generic one dimensional villain, like something you would see in a Toei movie. While the anime actually tries to flesh out his motivations and character.

[Freeza9000]

I made this Twitlonger post a long time ago regarding which version of Goku Black is better (and yes, Black is Zamasu)

[spoiler]In the anime, Goku Black is introduced as this villainous Goku look-a-like with a sinister soft spoken voice/tone that adds up to how sadistic he is and a mystery hinging on the identity of this character which was the rouge god being Zamasu who found Goku's ability to achieve godhood and rival gods quite intriguing. Adding to the fact the Saiyan trait to grow stronger from near death experiences and the trait to improve in strength in the heat of battle. We see the dynamic between Goku and Zamasu and how much Zamasu has changed upon learning about Goku and taking his body. We saw how learning about Goku got Zamasu off the deep end and how his derogatory views towards mortals drastically amplified as a mortal (beings he so despised due to how they are prone to such violent behavior) has reached the realms of the gods. Upon taking his body, Zamasu starts to become increasingly disturbing and sadistic. Goku Black is seen to be aroused and at times influenced by his body's instincts such as when he once stated that his body wants to slaughter Goku in EP 57 and how he stabbed through Future Zamasu through Goku and told him how he killed Goku's family. Black is also know to have developed a masochistic side to his character as whenever he's been dealt pain or overwhelmed by characters like Goku, Trunks, and Vegeta, he relishes in it and grows stronger from it. This is also accentuated when he laughed manically at the humiliation Vegeta's causing him and even going as far as stabbing his other hand in order to manifest his anger and humiliation into a large scythe. All of this just adds up to how much of a well written villain Goku Black truly is.

Unfortunately in the manga, almost all of those traits are nonexistent. The aura of mystery surrounding the character of Goku Black doesn't last as long and how Black mentions how he killed Goku was just some random throwaway line that isn't even expanded on like the anime. The influence Goku's body had on Black like his masochistic side and how disturbingly aroused he was by Goku body's instincts are all gone. His dynamic with Goku isn't as present as the anime as the only time Zamasu met Goku was when he stole Goku's body and never had any prior meeting beforehand. When he gets humiliated by Vegeta in the anime, his masochism pops up and laughs manically at his own humiliation and stabs himself in order to grow stronger from his anger. That successfully shows how creepy and insanely psychopathic Black truly is. Whereas in the manga when he gets humiliated by Vegeta , he throws a giant bitchbest about how he's the epitome of justice and he could've died at the hands of Vegeta if it weren't for Future Zamasu. In the manga, he's just nothing but a generic egotistical rambling villain with dark outliners on his eyes drawn by Toyotaro in order to look "badass" when he's nowhere near as compelling as his anime counterpart.[/spoiler]

I also hate how the manga handled the Black and Zamasu duo. In the anime, it successfully showed how Black's teamwork with himself is dangerously effective whenever in sync with Future Zamasu. What made the Zamasu and Black tagteam so great was that they never argued and it's almost like they could tell what they are about to do. How they coordinate their opponents also makes them formidable in their own rights like Zamasu using his immortal body to block Goku and Black stabbing through him. It also conveys how Zamasu trusts, reveres, and loves only himself.

In the manga though, Toyotaro barely showed the duo coordinating on their opponents and when things don't go their way, they clash against each other .

[Doctor.]

Why does manga!Future Zamasu refuse to "give up" on his divine abilities if the two Zamasus aren't different? In the anime, one was changed by his fight with Goku, the other wasn't. These two should have the same personality. So if one was able to do it, the other shouldn't say "I'd never".

EVERY problem Zamasu and Black have in the manga compared to the anime ultimately lies in the fact that they don't have a personal connection with Goku like they should.

[Cipher]

I think Toyotaro's Zamasu and Black are fine for the length of the story. While they aren't the hammy supervillains of the anime (and make no mistake, those two are one of the better elements of the TV series), Toyotaro keeps focus on another element of Zamasu's personality the anime mostly leaves unaddressed for the sake of increasingly epic set pieces: He's a punk. He's an inexperienced zealot with a superiority complex. Why should he be any more collected, when situations crumble around him, than the main timeline Zamasu (in both versions) who was eager to attack Goku and Beerus? Toyotaro's choice to have Future Zamasu turn on Black, his altenate timeline counterpart who had pushed him into criminality and promised him so much, felt a long time coming.

As Black, Toyotaro's Zamasu becomes a bit more of a thug, so there is some minor change that accompanies his switching bodies, but remains true to the overall petulant nature of the character. They aren't the ultimate hammy gods they are in the anime. They're the overly entitled supervillains du jour who, despite biting off more than they can chew, still manage to put the heroes in increasingly tight spots. I think that works well for a story that, like Toyotaro's presentation of the Universe 6 arc before it, and like Battle of Gods and Resurrection "F", feels destined to be revisited within a single sitting.

Why does manga!Future Zamasu refuse to "give up" on his divine abilities if the two Zamasus aren't different? In the anime, one was changed by his fight with Goku, the other wasn't. These two should have the same personality. So if one was able to do it, the other shouldn't say "I'd never".

The entire idea that Black fought against, and lost to, Goku in the anime just as his main timeline counterpart did is premised on a fist-sized plot hole, so it's never something I've held central to the arc.

I think Future Zamasu's experience is different enough from Black's in either version to justify his subtly different personality. Black enacted the Zero Mortals Plan of his own volition. Future Zamasu is more or less forced into it when his weirdo alternate self shows up and murders his master without asking. It makes particular sense in the manga, then, that he'd only be on board with the plan so long as it's going their way.

[Doctor.]

The entire idea that Black fought against, and lost to, Goku in the anime just as his main timeline counterpart did is premised on a fist-sized plot hole, so it's never something I've held central to the arc.

Both versions butcher the time travel mechanics of the original series, so I don't think that criticism holds up, at least not when comparing one version to another; it certainly holds up when judging the arcs separately. When a character steals someone's body, I think it should be a main priority to set up the relationship between the two characters first.

[Cipher]

Both versions butcher the time travel mechanics of the original series, so I don't think that criticism holds up, at least not when comparing one version to another; it certainly holds up when judging the arcs separately. When a character steals someone's body, I think it should be a main priority to set up the relationship between the two characters first.

This is getting into another topic, but the manga's only sin against Dragon Ball's mechanics of time travel seems to be its illogical stance (from a rational cause-and-effect perspective) that the newest timeline split should be attributed to Beerus' killing Zamasu rather than Trunks' arrival. At any rate, the anime tying a major character detail (or is it? It's not particularly highlighted by the arc) into a time-travel explanation that flies in the face of both logic and the mechanisms established within the series doesn't leave a particularly strong impression.

I'll grant you that it's usually better to have that personal connection, but I also like how, in the interest of quicker pacing, Toyotaro ties the events of the previous story directly into establishing the conflict here. Goku is targeted because he and Beerus insisted on holding the Hakaishin Invitational last arc. Each story feels like a proper sequel to the last, while still being its own stand-alone adventure (which, again, is an approach I think works far better for the new material than trying to position it all into a sweeping serial).

I think I part ways from other posters here, though, in that I'm not starting from a point of wanting to find the ultimate, most enjoyable version of this arc's villains. If I were trying to do that, I'd probably have to give it to the anime. Instead, I'm looking for the version of the story I feel does more justice to the material, and which should be more enjoyable to revisit in the future. For a number of reasons primarily unrelated to the villains, I feel that's Toyotaro's manga (despite how amazing the final twenty minutes of the anime version are), and its presentation of Black and Zamasu works perfectly well, and makes them fun in their own right, given its quicker pacing. Yes, they're less effective villains. Yes, that still reads as a cogent presentation of their characters, and I don't think it particularly diminishes the story. Black/Zamasu as a bad apple who gets in over his head tracks. It's all a little breezier, but it tracks (and it's a hell of a lot more consistent with its characters all around).

[TheSaiyanGod]

Well, for me, Zamasu/Goku Black just feels a bit too undercooked.

Goku battling Zamasu in the anime was huge a part of Zamasu descent into darkness and a very important aspect within the plot itself. After meeting Goku however and losing to him quickly in a sparring match, his views radically changed and his distrustful nature towards mortals only grew. Annoyed at Goku's carefree attitude and lack of respect, his distaste for the gods not quelling the dangerous nature of mortals evolved to a radicalism-level. Shocked at how a mortal like Goku could gain a power rivalling gods, let alone even obtaining such power, and so recklessly challenge a God and defeat him easily, Zamasu came to sternly believe that mortal life by nature is an evil. It's that meeting with Goku that also serves as the core purpose for why he steal Goku's body in the first place.

The anime makes the scenario with Zamasu's distrusts and resentment of mortals, and later Goku specifically, more logical and layered because he actually meets and fights Goku, and personally comes to the conclusion, following how Goku able defeat him with just a fraction of his strength, that mortals having that kind of power, let alone the power to challenge Gods, is a potentially great danger to the universe and a grave mistake of the Gods to let it happen in the first place. Hell, Merged Zamasu even further states to Vegetto that he chose Goku's body specifically because, in Zamasu, eye, Goku is the representation of all of the failures of the Gods, as Goku had obtained power surpassing the Gods, despite being mortal. Take all of that development out and Goku Black loses all of his unique symbolism and representation.

The manga just glosses over that aspect by having Zamasu's only knowledge of Goku be watching him through Godtube clips. He sees a few clips on Godtube of Goku fighting in the Universe 6/7 tournament is all like "Yeah. Fuck this guy." Seriously? I don't like that lack of motivation as why he would choose Goku's body to switch with and become Goku Black. There's literally no point to the concept of Goku Black even existing in the manga. Zamasu could have switched bodies with anyone in the manga with how more ambiguous and shallow they make his motivation towards hating mortals. For all intents and purposes, he could have swapped bodies with Hit or Vegeta.

The characterisation of Goku Black is even worse. Goku Black is portrayed as less of a menace and has more instances of grasping the idiot ball. His method of getting stronger, was needlessly convoluted and just outright dumb, when you realise the abilities he has at his disposal. I mean, if Goku Black knew how Zenkai's work, why didn't he just have Future Zamasu blast some holes in him and then heal again, to efficiently farm those cheap power-ups? If Goku Black knows that he can transform into Super Saiyan Rose, then why doesn't he have Zamasu beat him up and Zenkai his way into the form? This makes Black seem incredibly stupid, especially considering that Zamasu can heal him. So he could have done this a long time ago with Zamasu and it would much more safer and efficient. But he didn't. He decided to be a reckless idiot and hope that Vegeta doesn't kill him very quickly or that Zamasu miraculously arrived to save his ass before it was too late. Not mention he is far more prone to losing his composure in the manga, while the anime version of Goku Black always remained calm, cool and extremely pragmatic.

The manga basically made him a generic one dimensional villain, like something you would see in a Toei movie. While the anime actually tries to flesh out his motivations and character.

Did you not read the pages I put in? Zamasu went to the planet Babari and saw everything the inhabitants of that planet did. He acted in the same way as the Zamasu of the anime.
After that, he and Gowasu have a long talk and Zamasu talks about that same subject of justice, and of humans, it's the same thing as anime too.
After that, he still sees Goku in the Kamitube, who in addition to possessing the divine Ki, manages to approach the power of a Hakaishin. This for him is inadmissible, and works in the same form as the anime (as I said, the animation works better Some points, but we could say that in comparison to the TV series, Zamasu motives were plausible considered what I said above). And who was at an advantage in the fight was Goku, not Hit.

And I think you did not really read the manga.
In chapter 20, Black himself says that he could not use all the power of Goku's body, but he figured out how to do it, and it was using the Saiyajins characteristic, Zenkai.
After this, Shin explains that Black made Zamasu leave him constantly on the verge of death, to make his mind connect more and more to his body. As Zamasu has healing powers, just like Kibito, he cured Black. But you think Is it easy to release all the power of someone's body so easily? It takes time, and the beating he took to Vegeta accelerated this process.

What is the meaning of a Zenkai who does not have to stand on the verge of death or even recover? This is not a Zenkai, it is a totally unexplained feature for Black to increase his powers in the anime and that the manga has fixed, since that ability has never been Explained.
Black was calm because all the time he got some Power Up. No matter what the reason, he got stronger and ready.

If so, why did not Black make Zamasu beat him until he increased his power, without needing healing or anything? He does not get stronger with that? It does not make sense in the same way.

Zamasu's plan in the manga is more expansive. He wanted to destroy humans from all time lines, not just Trunks'

[spoiler][/spoiler]
I really did not understand

Why does manga!Future Zamasu refuse to "give up" on his divine abilities if the two Zamasus aren't different? In the anime, one was changed by his fight with Goku, the other wasn't. These two should have the same personality. So if one was able to do it, the other shouldn't say "I'd never".

EVERY problem Zamasu and Black have in the manga compared to the anime ultimately lies in the fact that they don't have a personal connection with Goku like they should.

Yes, they are different in terms of personality.

It is easy to realize just how inexperienced Kaio Zamasu was. And how he had a complex of superiority and inferiority.

He went mad after fusing because the power he had obtained was incredible, and he went mad saying that Kaioshins, Kaios and no god in the 12 universes were no longer needed
In the anime he became calmer, as if he already knew this power, as if he were acting as the supreme God

_______

I think the only bad point was even the lack of even teamwork.
But why does it mean that the characters themselves are entirely bad?

Zamasu (Black) and Zamasu (Kaio) are the same people, but with different personalities. That's why they fought because their thinking is different. So much so that Zamasu Kaio without refusing to change his body and wanted to stay with immortality .
It is not strange that this happens to them because they are different personalities, even though they are the same people

[Beerus-sama]

I didn't like how Black/Zamasu didn't have a personal connection with Goku. It made more sense since this was part of Zamasu's decision into take Goku's body.

In the manga is most like "oh this guy has divine ki, unforgivable I must get his body"

while in the anime is like "This guy just beat me, a simple mortal and now I know he also has divine ki (wich probably is much much stronger than the form in which he fought me), I must take his body because I had enough of these mortals strenght that defies the gods strenght"

The first one doesn't make much sense since he doesn't know how strong is Goku, he just see that he had divine ki. If it was such a problem why he just didn't killed him, instead of making it personal by taking his body and destroy mortals with it?
I mean, he didn't need Goku's full power to kill all mortals he killed since he didn't exploited all of Goku's body potential until he traveled to the past in the anime and Vegeta beat him in the manga.

Now with Future Zamasu, I didn't like that he took his anger to his own self. He didn't have the thought that things could go wrong and took the blame on Black who wanted the same as him.

Then there's the change in personality mostly in Black than Zamasu. Black in the manga is just another villian that gets frustrated when things don't go his way. That was a huge let down in comparison to how flamboyant he was in the anime.

[TheSaiyanGod]

I didn't like how Black/Zamasu didn't have a personal connection with Goku. It made more sense since this was part of Zamasu's decision into take Goku's body.

In the manga is most like "oh this guy has divine ki, unforgivable I must get his body"

while in the anime is like "This guy just beat me, a simple mortal and now I know he also has divine ki (wich probably is much much stronger than the form in which he fought me), I must take his body because I had enough of these mortals strenght that defies the gods strenght"

The first one doesn't make much sense since he doesn't know how strong is Goku, he just see that he had divine ki. If it was such a problem why he just didn't killed him, instead of making it personal by taking his body and destroy mortals with it?
I mean, he didn't need Goku's full power to kill all mortals he killed since he didn't exploited all of Goku's body potential until he traveled to the past in the anime and Vegeta beat him in the manga.

Now with Future Zamasu, I didn't like that he took his anger to his own self. He didn't have the thought that things could go wrong and took the blame on Black who wanted the same as him.

Then there's the change in personality mostly in Black than Zamasu. Black in the manga is just another villian that gets frustrated when things don't go his way. That was a huge let down in comparison to how flamboyant he was in the anime.

But he never killed all mortals.

He only killed the Kaioshins, and consequently the Hakaishins died.
With Goku's body (even if it had not fully developed) and with the help of Zamasu who was immortal, it would not be very difficult, considering that the Kaioshins are not so strong.

In the anime he just says he killed countless mortals, and in the manga none of that is said.

And as I showed him, he also went to the planet Babari, saw everything he saw in the anime and wondered about the justice of the gods.
Knowing that a mortal had the divine Ki was just an impetus for him to start his plan. He knew of the Super Dragon Balls and already hated humans, I see nothing wrong with that yet.

Black of the anime would be what? Someone who is speaking some "philosophical" words that gives the idea of ​​a very complex plan, when is the same as the manga?
As I said, they were developed differently. The Black of the manga was in fact the Kaamhin Zamasu, in the anime was someone with quite different personality.
Zamasu also has a different personality in manga

[sintzu]

Nozawa brought him to life in a way the manga never could so no matter what Toyotaro did, it would never compare to what she did with him in the anime.

[Duo]

The manga version of the character is much more consistent and makes a great deal more sense in terms of the story being told. The anime version of Goku Black has an incredible presence that matches up to the likes of Z-era villains and offers something very unique in terms of Nozawa's performance.

But the criticisms of "Manga Zamasu" are pretty shallow and lacking in context for the most part. The passage of time will make better sense of things, overall. This new level of diversity between versions has been a lot for some people to process, I guess. Not sure why the incredibly irritating rage-boners are apparently necessary.

[OLKv3]

Why does manga!Future Zamasu refuse to "give up" on his divine abilities if the two Zamasus aren't different? In the anime, one was changed by his fight with Goku, the other wasn't. These two should have the same personality. So if one was able to do it, the other shouldn't say "I'd never".

EVERY problem Zamasu and Black have in the manga compared to the anime ultimately lies in the fact that they don't have a personal connection with Goku like they should.

They didn't have a personal connection to Goku in the anime either. Goku never fought Zamasu in Black's timeline.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

They didn't have a personal connection to Goku in the anime either. Goku never fought Zamasu in Black's timeline.

That's not true. Goku Black specifically references fighting Goku, and it's even indicated in the form of a flashback. This happened in... Episode 61? 60? Both maybe? Someone correct me if I'm wrong. It doesn't make sense, but it did happen.

[OLKv3]

They didn't have a personal connection to Goku in the anime either. Goku never fought Zamasu in Black's timeline.

That's not true. Goku Black specifically references fighting Goku, and it's even indicated in the form of a flashback. This happened in... Episode 61? 60? Both maybe? Someone correct me if I'm wrong. It doesn't make sense, but it did happen.

No, Goku Black says "I always wanted to fight you in this body." Their previous encounter was Black murdering Goku in Zamasu's body

In Black's timeline, Goku had no idea who Zamasu was and had no idea what was going on when he got body jacked. Making him easy prey. The line that confuses everyone is Future Zamasu saying "I thought we said I'd get to kill Son Goku". A line which makes no sense because Black had no idea that Goku and Vegeta would arrive in his timeline, since he destroyed the time machine to prevent them from arriving. He's surprised by their appearance when they show up, saying "I thought I destroyed the time machine.."

The only reference to their sparring match was from Goku. He was recognizing that Future Zamasu is fighting differently than how he did in their sparring match. This is before he finds out it's a different Zamasu.

EDIT: Nevermind, Black says "after I was defeated by you, I shed my body"
Jesus, the writing makes no sense. I was wrong, even though I should be right

[Jinzoningen MULE]

In Black's timeline, Goku had no idea who Zamasu was and had no idea what was going on when he got body jacked. Making him easy prey.

It sure would be nice if that were true, but it's demonstrably not. Goku Black specifically references the initial encounter from Episode 53, and the episode cuts to a flashback that specifically indicates this.

The line that confuses everyone is Future Zamasu saying "I thought we said I'd get to kill Son Goku".

Umm... yeah... but that has nothing to do with anything. You said that it didn't happen in Black's timeline. Did you misspeak? Because what you're saying would make total sense if you said that it didn't happen in the HoT timeline.

[OLKv3]

In Black's timeline, Goku had no idea who Zamasu was and had no idea what was going on when he got body jacked. Making him easy prey.

It sure would be nice if that were true, but it's demonstrably not. Goku Black specifically references the initial encounter from Episode 53, and the episode cuts to a flashback that specifically indicates this.

The line that confuses everyone is Future Zamasu saying "I thought we said I'd get to kill Son Goku".

Umm... yeah... but that has nothing to do with anything. You said that it didn't happen in Black's timeline. Did you misspeak? Because what you're saying would make total sense if you said that it didn't happen in the HoT timeline.

The line has to do with everything, because it insinuates that Black has a grudge with Son Goku from a previous battle. It means Black specifically mentioned Son Goku to F.Zamasu, and how he needs to die. Also, did you miss my edit? I already admitted I was wrong because of that line.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

Also, did you miss my edit? I already admitted I was wrong because of that line.

You can't expect me to go back and check your edits, it's your responsibility to let me know if I've missed it. We don't disagree on anything, then.

[Basako]

I don't have any issue with the manga Zamasu, Black or their fusion, in fact, I prefer them to the anime. Just want to point out the picture you show in the spoiler tag, where we can see Zamasu's face when he kills the babarian. That's his first kill, his expression is total enjoyment and satisfaction, prelude of what is going to come. He nailed it, Toyotaro is good.