Idea on how they could keep the series going forever?

[ABED]

I've never seen Ultraman, but I have seen several seasons of Super Sentai and it has the benefit of a new cast and a new story every year.

Yeah, just pointing out there are multiple ways to refresh any idea given the production has the freedom to do so.

Sure, but DB is Goku's story. I have little interest in DB that's not Goku's story except the limited number of one offs like the Bardock and Trunks TV specials.

[Xiao Long Li]

I've never seen Ultraman, but I have seen several seasons of Super Sentai and it has the benefit of a new cast and a new story every year.

Yeah, just pointing out there are multiple ways to refresh any idea given the production has the freedom to do so.

Sure, but DB is Goku's story. I have little interest in DB that's not Goku's story except the limited number of one offs like the Bardock and Trunks TV specials.

I'm aware of that. That's your own personal tastes though, some other people might feel differently. One opinion is not be all or end all, after all.

[ABED]

Yeah, just pointing out there are multiple ways to refresh any idea given the production has the freedom to do so.

Sure, but DB is Goku's story. I have little interest in DB that's not Goku's story except the limited number of one offs like the Bardock and Trunks TV specials.

I'm aware of that. That's your own personal tastes though, some other people might feel differently. One opinion is not be all or end all, after all.

I don't think it would work after this long with the same main character to switch so radically.

[precita]

I think a better comparison would be DC and Marvel comics. Characters like Batman, Superman, Spiderman, X-men, the Avengers, etc....are largely designed to run forever. Every few years the comics have soft-reboots or retools, but essentially they just keep going non-stop.

Batman has been around for over 70 years. Can you imagine if Dragonball went on for 70 years?

[ABED]

American comics also has a sliding timescale and constantly retcons its continuity. Toriyama is one single continuity. The Batman written by Miller is not the same one written by Snyder which isn't the same one as written by O'Neil and he's not the same one written by Bill Finger.

[sintzu]

Everything from Super is spawned from Beerus/Whis being introduced. So yeah, the movie did pave the way for the entire future of the franchise.

When the following stories actively hurt the thing that kicked them off, it's kind of hard to ignore.

Batman 89 was the reason we got to Batman&Robin but does that mean 89 shouldn't have happened ?

The Dark Knight Returns (one of the best comics ever written) was the reason we got all star batman and robin (one of the worst ever written) but does that mean we shouldn't have gotten TDKR ?

DB & Z are why we got to GT so does that mean they shouldn't have been made to prevent GT from happening ?

[ABED]

Everything from Super is spawned from Beerus/Whis being introduced. So yeah, the movie did pave the way for the entire future of the franchise.

When the following stories actively hurt the thing that kicked them off, it's kind of hard to ignore.

Batman 89 was the reason we got to Batman&Robin but does that mean 89 shouldn't have happened ?

The Dark Knight Returns (one of the best comics ever written) was the reason we got all star batman and robin (one of the worst ever written) but does that mean we shouldn't have gotten TDKR ?

DB & Z are why we got to GT so does that mean they shouldn't have been made to prevent GT from happening ?

Lawyered. I agree with sintzu wholeheartedly. Sure, if a story goes on long enough, they often get run into the ground (they can also be revived), but that doesn't mean we should never have franchises.

[sintzu]

DB is Goku's story. I have little interest in DB that's not Goku's story except the limited number of one offs like the Bardock and Trunks TV specials.

I'm aware of that. That's your own personal tastes though, some other people might feel differently. One opinion is not be all or end all, after all.

That opinion kind of is. DB has been about Goku and his friends from day 1 so to replace them with completely new characters will take away what makes DB...DB.

[ABED]

It would be like replacing the Duke brothers in Dukes of Hazard. It didn't end well.

[sintzu]

It would be like replacing the Duke brothers in Dukes of Hazard. It didn't end well.

They can have new characters alongside the old ones if they want but if they're going to go in a completely new direction to the point where nothing is the same then they should just start a new franchise instead.

[ekrolo2]

Everything from Super is spawned from Beerus/Whis being introduced. So yeah, the movie did pave the way for the entire future of the franchise.

When the following stories actively hurt the thing that kicked them off, it's kind of hard to ignore.

Batman 89 was the reason we got to Batman&Robin but does that mean 89 shouldn't have happened ?

The Dark Knight Returns (one of the best comics ever written) was the reason we got all star batman and robin (one of the worst ever written) but does that mean we shouldn't have gotten TDKR ?

DB & Z are why we got to GT so does that mean they shouldn't have been made to prevent GT from happening ?

No but when you're series has constantly been less and less wieldy and less good with the progression of time, a question has to be asked: where's the problem and who's ass needs to get tossed into a volcano to fix it? With Super? It's Toriyama, no doubt about it, he needs to go so someone can start making good material to justify its existence or the new material should stop period.

[ABED]

It would be like replacing the Duke brothers in Dukes of Hazard. It didn't end well.

They can have new characters alongside the old ones if they want but if they're going to go in a completely new direction to the point where nothing is the same then they should just start a new franchise instead.

An injection of new blood is good, as we saw with Vegeta, Gohan, Trunks, and Piccolo, but it works best when they don't try to push out the leads or the leads leave as is the case with some shows.

[Desassina]

I wanted them to try something different: a visit to Hell where the fighters have to use the power of their souls. They could enter it like humans got into the Matrix, by lending their bodies to a cause, and letting their mind do the rest. Yenma would take Goku and Vegeta's bodies for dead, under special conditions, so that they could enter Hell, but unrestrained unlike Freeza, due to their pure souls. The perils that they would meet would be based on the villains' cells, but the biggest one would be escaping or avoiding reincarnation, by falling or being taken to its entrance.

I would make Goku defeat the enemy in Hell by sacrificing his soul and reincarnating as a new kid. Vegeta would become the resident devil. The two of them would face each other like Goku did against Akkuman.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Everything from Super is spawned from Beerus/Whis being introduced. So yeah, the movie did pave the way for the entire future of the franchise.

When the following stories actively hurt the thing that kicked them off, it's kind of hard to ignore.

Batman 89 was the reason we got to Batman&Robin but does that mean 89 shouldn't have happened ?

The Dark Knight Returns (one of the best comics ever written) was the reason we got all star batman and robin (one of the worst ever written) but does that mean we shouldn't have gotten TDKR ?

DB & Z are why we got to GT so does that mean they shouldn't have been made to prevent GT from happening ?

No but when you're series has constantly been less and less wieldy and less good with the progression of time, a question has to be asked: where's the problem and who's ass needs to get tossed into a volcano to fix it? With Super? It's Toriyama, no doubt about it, he needs to go so someone can start making good material to justify its existence or the new material should stop period.

You are projecting your opinion like it is fact. Just because you think doesn't mean it is, sales figures keep going up that is the objective measuring stick for Super whether you like it or not, it absolutely justifies Dragon Ball coming back. It is kind of ridiculous to say they need to end it because in your opinion it is not creatively justifying itself. If people keep watching, keep supporting then it is justifying itself simple as.

[ekrolo2]

Batman 89 was the reason we got to Batman&Robin but does that mean 89 shouldn't have happened ?

The Dark Knight Returns (one of the best comics ever written) was the reason we got all star batman and robin (one of the worst ever written) but does that mean we shouldn't have gotten TDKR ?

DB & Z are why we got to GT so does that mean they shouldn't have been made to prevent GT from happening ?

No but when you're series has constantly been less and less wieldy and less good with the progression of time, a question has to be asked: where's the problem and who's ass needs to get tossed into a volcano to fix it? With Super? It's Toriyama, no doubt about it, he needs to go so someone can start making good material to justify its existence or the new material should stop period.

You are projecting your opinion like it is fact. Just because you think doesn't mean it is, sales figures keep going up that is the objective measuring stick for Super whether you like it or not, it absolutely justifies Dragon Ball coming back. It is kind of ridiculous to say they need to end it because in your opinion it is not creatively justifying itself. If people keep watching, keep supporting then it is justifying itself simple as.

On the business side of things Dragon Ball has absolutely justified itself with high merchandies sales and revenue coming in from it, you'd have to be stupid to argue otherwise. Sales and revenue to do not reflect quality when there's plenty of examples of mediocre or bad products from the franchise coming out and continuing to make money.

F is a bad product, a bad product that hurts a good one (BoG) the same way Minus is a bad product that hurts a much better one in the Bardock Special and yet it made money. Super is like Iron Man 2, entertaining to varying degrees on some surface level things but I'll eat dog shit before admitting it actually works once you get into the nitty gritty and for a franchise to come back, I feel like it should be hitting better quality storywise comperable to that one Iron Man movie nobody liked until 3 come out.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

No but when you're series has constantly been less and less wieldy and less good with the progression of time, a question has to be asked: where's the problem and who's ass needs to get tossed into a volcano to fix it? With Super? It's Toriyama, no doubt about it, he needs to go so someone can start making good material to justify its existence or the new material should stop period.

You are projecting your opinion like it is fact. Just because you think doesn't mean it is, sales figures keep going up that is the objective measuring stick for Super whether you like it or not, it absolutely justifies Dragon Ball coming back. It is kind of ridiculous to say they need to end it because in your opinion it is not creatively justifying itself. If people keep watching, keep supporting then it is justifying itself simple as.

On the business side of things Dragon Ball has absolutely justified itself with high merchandies sales and revenue coming in from it, you'd have to be stupid to argue otherwise. Sales and revenue to do not reflect quality when there's plenty of examples of mediocre or bad products from the franchise coming out and continuing to make money.

F is a bad product, a bad product that hurts a good one (BoG) the same way Minus is a bad product that hurts a much better one in the Bardock Special and yet it made money. Super is like Iron Man 2, entertaining to varying degrees on some surface level things but I'll eat dog shit before admitting it actually works once you get into the nitty gritty and for a franchise to come back, I feel like it should be hitting better quality storywise comperable to that one Iron Man movie nobody liked until 3 come out.

I don't follow your logic of "F" or Minus hurting BoG and Bardock special at all, how does it? BoG and Bardock special are there to be enjoyed regardless of what one thinks of the sequels etc. BoG came out, did it's business and as a franchise DB moved on and whether you think the franchise moved on for better or for worse doesn't change anything about BoG as a film. Plenty of sequels come out that aren't as good as their predecessors but none of them hurt their predecessor, T2 is still widely regarding as the best action movie ever for example.

[ABED]

The fact that something generates revenue doesn't justify keeping a story going forever.

[floofychan333]

The series needs a rest once every 10-15 years. We did had a nice rest after 1997 and I can see it happening again after Super ends.

I doubt they will end the series for long after Super ends. I can see them announcing a new series soon, if not immediately, after like they did with DBZ and GT because Super has been successful and lucrative. The series will only pause when a show similar to GT that's unpopular with fans and has some flaw that can bump it out of the canon ends.

[ekrolo2]

You are projecting your opinion like it is fact. Just because you think doesn't mean it is, sales figures keep going up that is the objective measuring stick for Super whether you like it or not, it absolutely justifies Dragon Ball coming back. It is kind of ridiculous to say they need to end it because in your opinion it is not creatively justifying itself. If people keep watching, keep supporting then it is justifying itself simple as.

On the business side of things Dragon Ball has absolutely justified itself with high merchandies sales and revenue coming in from it, you'd have to be stupid to argue otherwise. Sales and revenue to do not reflect quality when there's plenty of examples of mediocre or bad products from the franchise coming out and continuing to make money.

F is a bad product, a bad product that hurts a good one (BoG) the same way Minus is a bad product that hurts a much better one in the Bardock Special and yet it made money. Super is like Iron Man 2, entertaining to varying degrees on some surface level things but I'll eat dog shit before admitting it actually works once you get into the nitty gritty and for a franchise to come back, I feel like it should be hitting better quality storywise comperable to that one Iron Man movie nobody liked until 3 come out.

I don't follow your logic of "F" or Minus hurting BoG and Bardock special at all, how does it? BoG and Bardock special are there to be enjoyed regardless of what one thinks of the sequels etc. BoG came out, did it's business and as a franchise DB moved on and whether you think the franchise moved on for better or for worse doesn't change anything about BoG as a film. Plenty of sequels come out that aren't as good as their predecessors but none of them hurt their predecessor, T2 is still widely regarding as the best action movie ever for example.

F hurts BoG by basically ignoring the whole point of it: Goku became a prideful, arrogant prick who thought he was the best there ever was and he humbles himself to Beerus by conceding defeat. In F? He's basically back to doing it again, seeing it as beneath him to keep his guard up because he's convinced he's definitevly stomped the opposition. Forget Gohan, where's the scene of somebody chewing out Goku for this? Minus hurts the Bardock special because it pretty much overrides it and destroys a lot of the good thematic stuff the Saiyan arc, whether intentionally or not, with Goku's fight against Vegeta.

Follows ups can hurt or improve a movie. X-Men Origins is a great time that's not a very good movie but Logan bringing back an element from it and using it for good story & character purposes retroactively makes Origins better, if ever so slightly. The Avengers is the most boring, formulaic superhero team up story ever told and Iron Man 3 makes it better because it uses what happens to Tony as a launching pad for a great character piece in IM3. By that same token, AoU kind of fucks with Iron Man 3 by just ignoring it entirely just so it can retread it in a considerably shittier fashion. Kind of like how F tries to retread Goku's cockiness but in a far worse way than BoG did.

[ABED]

Goku became a prideful, arrogant prick who thought he was the best there ever was and he humbles himself to Beerus by conceding defeat.

I never saw it as that at all. He was the same as he always was. He didn't pick a fight with Beerus because he thought he was better and I don't think he's ever claimed he was the best there ever was.

The Avengers is the most boring, formulaic superhero team up story ever told

The joy of The Avengers lies in its characters, not in its plot. And every movie has a formula.

Kind of like how F tries to retread Goku's cockiness but in a far worse way than BoG did.

It's not a retread, he's the same character he always was.