Kienzan use ( bad writing )

[JulianStyles]

This is not a Krillin hate topic. I was concerned with this before. In Krillins promotional tournament material hes using the Kienzan. In Gohans image training Krillin is seen using the kienzan.

Minor spoilers

In epispde 97 he uses it against a group of enemies. Granted it didnt do anything ( which is bad writing with in itself. ) But to use such a dangerous technique that can kill in a tournament is careless from a character stand point. And the fact the writers are using it because it looks cool is more iresponsible and a spit in the fans and Akira Toriyamas face.

[Simere]

Maybe he used it, and maybe it didn't do anything, because contrary to assumption it's, in fact, not a technique that will cut through anything.

[Basako]

Yeah, they make him use it because looks cool, but the Kiezan has implications, it's very deadly. They should pay attention to this things when writing, this attack is not good for a tournament with the rule of not killing.

18 used it against Mighty Mask, precisely because she knew they were two beings and she wanted to literally cut the costume. Krilin other times pretended to kill, I remember Nappa and Freeza.

[HeroR]

This is not a Krillin hate topic. I was concerned with this before. In Krillins promotional tournament material hes using the Kienzan. In Gohans image training Krillin is seen using the kienzan.

Minor spoilers

In epispde 97 he uses it against a group of enemies. Granted it didnt do anything ( which is bad writing with in itself. ) But to use such a dangerous technique that can kill in a tournament is careless from a character stand point. And the fact the writers are using it because it looks cool is more iresponsible and a spit in the fans and Akira Toriyamas face.

The Kienzan has never been stated to be an unbreakable technique. It doesn't fall into no limit fallacy.

[Akyon]

Whilst we're talking about BAD TECHNIQUES that are designed to kill; Piccolo's Makankōsappō was a weird choice to break out too.

[GodKaio-Ken]

Literally any Ki Blast could kill someone. Every time you attack you may kill someone.

I found it slightly odd too but it doesnt bother me.

[TheMikado]

Maybe he used it, and maybe it didn't do anything, because contrary to assumption it's, in fact, not a technique that will cut through anything.

This is BS and a change from the original manga where he was able to cut through Frieza who is several times stronger than him. Based on past practice if the gap between Krillin and these characters is greater than the gap that was between him and Frieza, such that this attack was ineffective, then Krillin should be completely useless against them and Roshi should probably be dead just some them looking at him.

Just to clarify I hate that it was used, because it seems like this is the only attack they feel Krillin has and shows a lack of research. My number one complaint has been how Super changes past established lore so now we have yet another thing to check off. I understand it may not be an indestructible attack but Krillin can fight this guys on any level then based on established lore it should be completely deadly and not able to be tanked so easily.

[Akyon]

Maybe he used it, and maybe it didn't do anything, because contrary to assumption it's, in fact, not a technique that will cut through anything.

This is BS and a change from the original manga where he was able to cut through Frieza who is several times stronger than him. Based on past practice if the gap between Krillin and these characters is greater than the gap that was between him and Frieza, such that this attack was ineffective, then Krillin should be completely useless against them and Roshi should probably be dead just some them looking at him.

Don't forget Botamo was amongst those being attacked. He has the power to nullify every attack that hits him/send it to another dimension(depending on if you're anime or manga). If Krillin's Kienzan hit Botamo, it's perfectly within the series internal logic that it would be nullified completely.

[TheMikado]

Maybe he used it, and maybe it didn't do anything, because contrary to assumption it's, in fact, not a technique that will cut through anything.

This is BS and a change from the original manga where he was able to cut through Frieza who is several times stronger than him. Based on past practice if the gap between Krillin and these characters is greater than the gap that was between him and Frieza, such that this attack was ineffective, then Krillin should be completely useless against them and Roshi should probably be dead just some them looking at him.

Don't forget Botamo was amongst those being attacked. He has the power to nullify every attack that hits him/send it to another dimension(depending on if you're anime or manga). If Krillin's Kienzan hit Botamo, it's perfectly within the series internal logic that it would be nullified completely.

Yes but now we're are speculating, it didn't even have to be Botamo, just show a random character with nullification abilities and it would have heightened the tension for the audience 100 fold. It's lazy research, writing, presentation, and direction, period. There's literally tons of things then could have done to show some of their most dangerous and special techniques were in effective. They even had Tien do a solar flare and none of the enemies even blinked. It was incredibly lazy writing.

[Rhuagh]

You are absolutely right OP. And Toei did it because they wanted to reuse the same shots they made for when he used the Kienzan against Basil in Gohan and Goku's imaginary fight, right before they recruited Kuririn.

[Alruneia]

Both the Destructo Disk and the Special Beam Cannon (Kienzan and Makankousappou if you must) were odd choices for that scene. They're both killing techniques; one drills and one cuts. Using them in a setting like this where killing is not allowed is careless of the characters. I'm more upset with how they didn't work, though. They both resulted in generic explosions. I can understand Piccolo's attack doing that, since it is at the basic level still a beam, but I'm pretty certain that the disk does not just explode.

[Kanassa]

They're both killing techniques; one drills and one cuts

They're only killing techniques if you cut off a vital organ. Cut Frieza in half and he doesn't die. Using those techniques isn't really careless when both users know how to use them right.

[LightBing]

I can only think this is lack of knowledge from whoever wrote this scene. They just read which were the most famous techniques of the characters in question and shoved them in.
It's extremely disappointing. I was much more disheartened by this scene than by Basil using the same attack five times.

You don't even need to be a Dragon Ball buff to know this. It shows there's people working in Dragon Ball who don't care about what they are doing.

[Lord Beerus]

It's never, ever stated in the manga or even implied in the manga that the Kienzan can cut through anything. The Keizen cut a bit of Freeza's tail doesn't equate to the Keizen being invincible and indefensible. I do think using the technique was reckless given it's properties, but I think it used for the purposes of a scare tactic. That... and fan service.

But for the sake of clarity here is what is stated about the Kiezan in Daizenshuu 7 (Special Attack Dictionary):

Kienzan
First Appearance: Chapter 221
Category: ki manipulation
People: Krillin, Cell, others
Special Characteristics: A technique thought up by Krillin, that changes ki into a sharp edge and then fires it. First, a rapidly rotating disc-shaped ki appears above his raised hand, and he then throws it forward. This ki’s rapid spinning cuts through the opponent like an electric saw. Krillin used this technique during the battle with Nappa. In the battle after that, even Vegeta used a similar attack. This is the same attack as the Kienzan, but Vegeta didn’t give it a name. (Daizenshuu 2, p.211/Daizenshuu 4, p.112)
Anime: In the CG produced for the Akira Toriyama exhibit, “Hyper Anime DragonBall”, Cell fired a technique similar to the Kienzan.
Homing~
First Appearance: Chapter 325
Category: ki manipulation
People: Freeza
Special Characteristics: A Kienzan that senses the opponent’s ki and continues pursuing them. It can also be fired in a pair. It seems he imitated the Kienzan that Krillin used. Freeza used this as his final trump card during the battle on Planet Namek.

Rapid-Fire~
First Appearance: Chapter 299
Category: ki manipulation
People: Krillin
Special Characteristics: An attack that fires consecutive Kienzans at the opponent. Those hit by this attack would be cut to ribbons. Krillin launched this at Freeza during the battle on Planet Namek, saving Gohan from his pinch.

[DainIronfoot]

The moment I saw the episode title, I already knew who created it. The fact you used "This is not a Krillin hate topic" as your opening line made me Lol because everyone knows that is all you practically do. Saying you were concerned with it is laughable because anything pro Kuririn is never something you like, never.

However, that particular scene with all our heroes attacks doing literally nothing was certainly odd and didn't feel right at all nor make sense.

[LightBing]

It's never, ever stated in the manga or even implied in the manga that the Kienzan can cut through anything.

Having it cut any character it comes in contact with and having all opponents fleeing and dodging it doesn't imply it enough?
It's like the Mafuba, I'm pretty sure nobody ever said it works on everyone, yet nobody would dispute it does if it hits successfully.

The logic is the same. Why the double standards? Is because Toei provided filler where the technique failed?

[Basako]

They even had Tien do a solar flare and none of the enemies even blinked. It was incredibly lazy writing.

Now that you mention it, the opponents should have been blinded by the Tayoken and the team should have closed their eyes while doing it. Then everyone could attack, preferably more generic attacks or just hand to hand. Kiezan, no way, that was the worst choice.

The whole scene could have been much better, it had potential for it.

Edit: Rewatched it, they do blink and cover their eyes. The Tayoken part is fine.

[Neon Z]

Maybe he used it, and maybe it didn't do anything, because contrary to assumption it's, in fact, not a technique that will cut through anything.

This is BS and a change from the original manga where he was able to cut through Frieza who is several times stronger than him.

And Yajirobe cut Oozaru Vegeta's tail even though obviously was nowhere near even base Goku. Maybe tails are just weaker in general?

Although now at least Kuririn fans understand how annoyed I was with Tenshinhan using the Kikoho in that Gohan vs Goku episode while screaming about how they should hold back since the actual tournament match would be soon. Something like that just shows a lack of knowledge about the character. In this case though, it might not have been due to the writer, but just the animators, since Kuririn's attack was recycled footage.

[TheMikado]

Maybe he used it, and maybe it didn't do anything, because contrary to assumption it's, in fact, not a technique that will cut through anything.

This is BS and a change from the original manga where he was able to cut through Frieza who is several times stronger than him.

And Yajirobe cut Oozaru Vegeta's tail even though obviously was nowhere near even base Goku. Maybe tails are just weaker in general?

Although now at least Kuririn fans understand how annoyed I was with Tenshinhan using the Kikoho in that Gohan vs Goku episode while screaming about how they should hold back since the actual tournament match would be soon. Something like that just shows a lack of knowledge about the character. In this case though, it might not have been due to the writer, but just the animators, since Kuririn's attack was recycled footage.

The saiyan tail being a weak point has been consistent, even while oozaru and several times stronger the tail could always be cut. Plus I though Yajoribes sword has some special properties too.

The point I'm making is that this is a big contrast from Toei even DBZ era. They conceptually understand how powerful Krillins attack should be and even though they misused it against Cell the net effect was the same. It made you feel how incredibly powerful perfect Cell was and how hopeless underpowered Krillin and everyone else was by comparison to the point where his strongest attack was ineffectual at even the enemies lowest power state.

This feels like it was written and directed by someone with only a summary sheet of the characters and their special moves without understanding the history and established properties of the attacks.

[Neon Z]

The saiyan tail being a weak point has been consistent, even while oozaru and several times stronger the tail could always be cut.

It was specifically said that Nappa's and Vegeta's tails weren't a weakness though when they attempted to grab Nappa's.

Plus I though Yajoribes sword has some special properties too.

Nah, nothing was ever said about it.

But, in spite of that, I agree about your point. It's like they went with the Kienzan because it's Kuririn's signature technique, without considering context, which is why I brought up the Tenshinhan issue from a previous episode. Using the Kikoho while saying they should hold back because the real battle would be a few hours form then makes no sense if one knows the Kikoho's nature. It was clearly done by a writer that just saw the Kikoho as Tenshinhan's signature attack and ignored any context behind it.