"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[LowRyder2005]

I suppose you're right, but Buu did say he was stronger than Basil, and that's after he took the drugs. Base Basil was used in the imagine training for Krillin as well. While Basil looked good in this episode who knows the strength of his opponents.
On the opposite side, Piccolo could be weaker than Roshi for all we know.

Basil was the weakest of the brothers, which why Gohan and Goku mental trained him with Krillin, and Krillin got his ass kicked. Also, Basil lost to Buu mostly because he couldn't bypass Buu's regeneration and Buu out endure him.

While we know that Bergamo is the strongest among the three brothers there's nothing confirming or even suggesting that Lavenda is stronger than Basil, other than some arbitrary notion that "since they started with him, he must be the weakest". See "arbitrary". Like "you shouldn't really go promoting it as a fact". This while avoiding mentioning that the same would yield conclusions like "Goku in the U6 arc was weaker than Piccolo".
Besides, I'd say Lavenda depiction was representative of the "creepy guy who uses cheap tactics" trope. Basil's presentation is that of a "powerful kickboxer", something more similar to the "legitimate fighter" type; since we are talking about a show that tries to put things in often overly-simplistic layman's terms, I wouldn't exactly tend to picture the first as having more raw strength than the second one. Especially when, again, there's nothing else in the show hinting at it.

The way you downplay Buu's strength is also a little foolhardy. Basil was also completely outmatched against Mr. Buu before the drug. After the drug - which could've multiplied his natural power exponentially, for all we know; I'd say the presentation gives credence to this theory - he still couldn't do any lasting damage, whilst Buu flat-out stated he was still "much stronger".

The only argument I can see could be made for his "resistance" to Buu's fully powered Kamehameha, I suppose. Still, it was clear as day that the gap between regular Basil and Mr. Buu was at least as wide as the one between someone like Super Saiyan Gohan and Fat Buu - hence in the order of "many times stronger" (the gap between Mr. Buu and "drugged Basil" could be similar to the one between Majin Vegeta and the same Fat Buu).
Plain ol' Basil, in turn, would've most likely died the moment a not-so-playful Mr. Buu kept punching him at full force, regeneration or not.

[shadowmaria]

Anyone notice the symbols on the God Pad for each Universe? I think they look interesting and could be clues for the characters origins.

I was thinking about that, but the correlation 1-12 and the symbols don't add up.

4 is the fourth around clockwise, but 10 is where 11 should be

[HeroR]

While we know that Bergamo is the strongest among the three brothers there's nothing confirming or even suggesting that Lavenda is stronger than Basil, other than some arbitrary notion that "since they started with him, he must be the weakest". See "arbitrary". Like "you shouldn't really go promoting it as a fact". This while avoiding mentioning that the same would yield conclusions like "Goku in the U6 arc was weaker than Piccolo".
Besides, I'd say Lavenda depiction was representative of the "creepy guy who uses cheap tactics" trope. Basil's presentation is that of a "powerful kickboxer", something more similar to the "legitimate fighter" type; since we are talking about a show that tries to put things in often overly-simplistic layman's terms, I wouldn't exactly tend to picture the first as having more raw strength than the second one. Especially when, again, there's nothing else in the show hinting at it.

The way you downplay Buu's strength is also a little foolhardy. Basil was also completely outmatched against Mr. Buu before the drug. After the drug - which could've multiplied his natural power exponentially, for all we know; I'd say the presentation gives credence to this theory - he still couldn't do any lasting damage, whilst Buu flat-out stated he was still "much stronger".

The only argument I can see could be made for his "resistance" to Buu's fully powered Kamehameha, I suppose. Still, it was clear as day that the gap between regular Basil and Mr. Buu was at least as wide as the one between someone like Super Saiyan Gohan and Fat Buu - hence in the order of "many times stronger" (the gap between Mr. Buu and "drugged Basil" could be similar to the one between Majin Vegeta and the same Fat Buu).
Plain ol' Basil, in turn, would've most likely died the moment a not-so-playful Mr. Buu kept punching him at full force, regeneration or not.

Because there's no reason not to think they didn't go weakest to strongest. Even after Basil lost to Buu, they thought Lavenda would kill Gohan and they had no reason to conclude that Gohan was weaker than Buu.

Using the Champa Saga makes no sense since in they U7 did weakest to strongest and didn't have a load like Monaka. To be frank, nothing shows that they didn't do this.

Basil knocked Buu around until he hurt Satan and even then held his own. The match wasn't as one-sided as you're pushing.

You say I downplay Buu. No, you downplay Basil and Lavenda.

[dragon boss z]

While we know that Bergamo is the strongest among the three brothers there's nothing confirming or even suggesting that Lavenda is stronger than Basil, other than some arbitrary notion that "since they started with him, he must be the weakest". See "arbitrary". Like "you shouldn't really go promoting it as a fact". This while avoiding mentioning that the same would yield conclusions like "Goku in the U6 arc was weaker than Piccolo".
Besides, I'd say Lavenda depiction was representative of the "creepy guy who uses cheap tactics" trope. Basil's presentation is that of a "powerful kickboxer", something more similar to the "legitimate fighter" type; since we are talking about a show that tries to put things in often overly-simplistic layman's terms, I wouldn't exactly tend to picture the first as having more raw strength than the second one. Especially when, again, there's nothing else in the show hinting at it.

The way you downplay Buu's strength is also a little foolhardy. Basil was also completely outmatched against Mr. Buu before the drug. After the drug - which could've multiplied his natural power exponentially, for all we know; I'd say the presentation gives credence to this theory - he still couldn't do any lasting damage, whilst Buu flat-out stated he was still "much stronger".

The only argument I can see could be made for his "resistance" to Buu's fully powered Kamehameha, I suppose. Still, it was clear as day that the gap between regular Basil and Mr. Buu was at least as wide as the one between someone like Super Saiyan Gohan and Fat Buu - hence in the order of "many times stronger" (the gap between Mr. Buu and "drugged Basil" could be similar to the one between Majin Vegeta and the same Fat Buu).
Plain ol' Basil, in turn, would've most likely died the moment a not-so-playful Mr. Buu kept punching him at full force, regeneration or not.

Because there's no reason not to think they didn't go weakest to strongest. Even after Basil lost to Buu, they thought Lavenda would kill Gohan and they had no reason to conclude that Gohan was weaker than Buu.

Using the Champa Saga makes no sense since in they U7 did weakest to strongest and didn't have a load like Monaka. To be frank, nothing shows that they didn't do this.

Basil knocked Buu around until he hurt Satan and even then held his own. The match wasn't as one-sided as you're pushing.

You say I downplay Buu. No, you downplay Basil and Lavenda.

There is a good chance Lavender is stronger than Basil, but not roid Basil.

base Gohan<=>Lavender<=>Basil<<ssj Gohan<=>Roid Basil<Buu

[supercat]

While we know that Bergamo is the strongest among the three brothers there's nothing confirming or even suggesting that Lavenda is stronger than Basil, other than some arbitrary notion that "since they started with him, he must be the weakest". See "arbitrary". Like "you shouldn't really go promoting it as a fact". This while avoiding mentioning that the same would yield conclusions like "Goku in the U6 arc was weaker than Piccolo".
Besides, I'd say Lavenda depiction was representative of the "creepy guy who uses cheap tactics" trope. Basil's presentation is that of a "powerful kickboxer", something more similar to the "legitimate fighter" type; since we are talking about a show that tries to put things in often overly-simplistic layman's terms, I wouldn't exactly tend to picture the first as having more raw strength than the second one. Especially when, again, there's nothing else in the show hinting at it.

The way you downplay Buu's strength is also a little foolhardy. Basil was also completely outmatched against Mr. Buu before the drug. After the drug - which could've multiplied his natural power exponentially, for all we know; I'd say the presentation gives credence to this theory - he still couldn't do any lasting damage, whilst Buu flat-out stated he was still "much stronger".

The only argument I can see could be made for his "resistance" to Buu's fully powered Kamehameha, I suppose. Still, it was clear as day that the gap between regular Basil and Mr. Buu was at least as wide as the one between someone like Super Saiyan Gohan and Fat Buu - hence in the order of "many times stronger" (the gap between Mr. Buu and "drugged Basil" could be similar to the one between Majin Vegeta and the same Fat Buu).
Plain ol' Basil, in turn, would've most likely died the moment a not-so-playful Mr. Buu kept punching him at full force, regeneration or not.

Because there's no reason not to think they didn't go weakest to strongest. Even after Basil lost to Buu, they thought Lavenda would kill Gohan and they had no reason to conclude that Gohan was weaker than Buu.

Using the Champa Saga makes no sense since in they U7 did weakest to strongest and didn't have a load like Monaka. To be frank, nothing shows that they didn't do this.

Basil knocked Buu around until he hurt Satan and even then held his own. The match wasn't as one-sided as you're pushing.

You say I downplay Buu. No, you downplay Basil and Lavenda.

That user seems to downplay anyone who isn't Buu, despite there being numerous indications that both existing characters and new characters have long surpassed the overrated, unnecessarily comical blob.

Seriously, I said this before and I'll say it again. Universal powerhouses who debut with seemingly unparalleled power levels don't seem to mean much in the long run. How many times have characters surpassed seemingly unreachable benchmarks with little to no effort?

I seriously don't get all this hype about Buu. Even in his own saga, he was quite easily surpassed and humiliated moreso than any of the other main villains. Heck, had SSJ3 Goku taken it seriously, the Buu saga would have been over right then and there. I don't recall neither Frieza nor Cell having their saga prolonged just because the protagonist decided to hold back. And let's not even go into the embarrassing thrashings that he received from Ultimate Gohan and SSJ Vegetto; and we could have even added SSJ3 Gotenks to that list, if he weren't so caught up in his over confidence. Oh and nothing really amazing about a character who relies on absorptions as his main source of power ups.

But in all fairness, I do love the friendship Buu was able to form with Hercule. Probably the coolest thing he's done since his debut.

[precita]

We took Fat Buu seriously because Vegeta sacrificed himself and still couldn't stop him. Then Gohan and Supreme Kai were nearly killed. Even though Goku says his SSJ3 form could have stopped him, technically we don't know that for sure.

Fat Buu really was incredibly strong that nobody but Fusions or a Gohan with all his unlocked potential could beat him.

[supercat]

We took Fat Buu seriously because Vegeta sacrificed himself and still couldn't stop him. Then Gohan and Supreme Kai were nearly killed. Even though Goku says his SSJ3 form could have stopped him, technically we don't know that for sure.

Fat Buu really was incredibly strong that nobody but Fusions or a Gohan with all his unlocked potential could beat him.

I don't see any reason to doubt Goku's statement. From an out-of-universe standpoint, remarks pertaining to power are likely there to give at least some indication of where someone stands.

Super Buu in particular, along with his cheesy incarnations didn't seem to provide the same daunting experience for the heroes as his predecessors Cell and Frieza. Between all the times he was easily humiliated and his tacky transformations (if you could even call them that, since the metamorphosis was merely a result of borrowed powers), it's really hard to take him seriously. But then again, SSJ3 Gotenks didn't help the cause much with his own comic relief.

Seriously though, were there any other main villains who were as easily humiliated and surpassed as Super Buu was against Ultimate Gohan and Vegetto in their own sagas?

[HeroR]

We took Fat Buu seriously because Vegeta sacrificed himself and still couldn't stop him. Then Gohan and Supreme Kai were nearly killed. Even though Goku says his SSJ3 form could have stopped him, technically we don't know that for sure.

Fat Buu really was incredibly strong that nobody but Fusions or a Gohan with all his unlocked potential could beat him.

I don't see any reason to doubt Goku's statement. From an out-of-universe standpoint, remarks pertaining to power are likely there to give at least some indication of where someone stands.

Super Buu in particular, along with his cheesy incarnations didn't seem to provide the same daunting experience for the heroes as his predecessors Cell and Frieza. Between all the times he was easily humiliated and his tacky transformations (if you could even call them that, since the metamorphosis was merely a result of borrowed powers), it's really hard to take him seriously. But then again, SSJ3 Gotenks didn't help the cause much with his own comic relief.

Seriously though, were there any other main villains who were as easily humiliated and surpassed as Super Buu was against Ultimate Gohan and Vegetto in their own sagas?

Super Saiyan 2 Gohan vs. Perfect Cell comes to mind. Honestly, I think Cell had the worst record of being humiliated. He almost died to Piccolo, almost died to Android 16, become Semi-Perfect and got his ass handed him by Super Vegeta and would have died if Vegeta's ego didn't get in the way. Got beating up by Trunks and only lived because Trunks held back because of his daddy issues. Cell only became a real threat when perfect and looked at Super Saiyan 2 Gohan. Heck, Goku would have killed Perfect Cell if Toriyama didn't create a plot hole.

[Bullza]

Bergamo was supposed to be the strongest of the three brothers. He was about as strong as Base Goku.

Lavender was about as strong as Base Gohan at first until Gohan started to concentrate then Lavender couldn't even hit him until the poison got worse.

So one would likely assume that Basil is also around as strong as the Base Saiyans. Which would explain why Krillin was able to match him somewhat in their imagination battle.

[HeroR]

Bergamo was supposed to be the strongest of the three brothers. He was about as strong as Base Goku.

Lavender was about as strong as Base Gohan at first until Gohan started to concentrate then Lavender couldn't even hit him until the poison got worse.

So one would likely assume that Basil is also around as strong as the Base Saiyans. Which would explain why Krillin was able to match him somewhat in their imagination battle.

Krillin didn't match him at all. He got some attacks in that did nothing against Basil and then Basil wasted his butt. Plus, it was stated that Krillin was much weaker than base form Gohan before they sparred in Episode 84.

Also, Lavender hit Gohan several times once he flew and Gohan couldn't hear him anymore. Not before the poison got worse.

[LowRyder2005]

That user seems to downplay anyone who isn't Buu, despite there being numerous indications that both existing characters and new characters have long surpassed the overrated, unnecessarily comical blob.

Oh, is it deja-vu? I've just been in this place before!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dv13gl0a-FA

On a serious note, instead: I'm extremely fed up of your ridiculous line of personal attacks; I've lost count of the times in which you butt in in a conversation starting with "how I overrate Majin Buu", this and that. I think this is nothing short of the sixth or seventh time you bother to quote me to remark how you think I'm biased. Guess what: I also think you are horribly biased, go figure. That being said, I couldn't care less if you believe I have some deep-seated fanboyish-affection for some character and that I'm not lucid whenever it comes to the "overrated, unnecessarily comical blob".

(The irony is dripping).

However, if you don't have anything relevant to say or add to a conversation in a constructive fashion - and you need to redirect the attention towards the poster constantly, yours truly, I suggest you refrain from posting in some discussion in which I'm involved or at least quoting me. I take no pleasure in your condescending attitude, which by the way already warranted many warnings here.
I would've bothered reading the rest of your post, but this incipit is enough to make me want to avoid that. Try to avoid reading my posts in the future if possible, more or less I already do the same for yours.

Because there's no reason not to think they didn't go weakest to strongest

Even after Basil lost to Buu, they thought Lavenda would kill Gohan and they had no reason to conclude that Gohan was weaker than Buu.

Using the Champa Saga makes no sense since in they U7 did weakest to strongest and didn't have a load like Monaka. To be frank, nothing shows that they didn't do this.

Basil knocked Buu around until he hurt Satan and even then held his own. The match wasn't as one-sided as you're pushing.

You say I downplay Buu. No, you downplay Basil and Lavenda.

This post is literally a bulging mass of confirmation bias. With order, just so we are clear:

1. There's literally no reason to think they had to go from weakest to strongest all the same. All the more since they didn't even have any idea on how strong the guys were.
And no, using the Champa Arc makes plenty of sense, since following your arbitrary rationale, judging solely form the order of the fights you would have concluded Piccolo was stronger than Goku, up until the very last fights.

2. No: I'm still convinced you're overrating Basil. And you're dialing it up to eleven in this very post. Regular Basil would've clearly been defeated by a serious Buu without any problem at all. Which is self-evident since he can only knock around an unfazed Buu, "feat" which is there literally only to reinforce the idea that Buu isn't even thinking about the fight or giving it much thought in the first place.

The drugged Basil put a semblance of a fight with Mr. Buu for some seconds, and had Buu tanking his hits; however, even at that point he didn't do any better than what Majin Vegeta did to Fat Buu (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-GVFsDxWPs), which is the gap I personally have between them. Buu tanks everything, then gets up without breaking a sweat. Also, if you give visual cues that much weight other than lasting effects, you may as well conclude bullets hurt Majin Buu of all things. Buu needs to regenerate from everything in the series, but it doesn't mean he's actually hurt.

Again, I don't believe I even have to say these things, because the fight acts as self-demonstrating evidence, with little to no interjection on the viewer's part. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wd7Dc2U9JTI

- 0 to 1:35 minutes. The part where a non-serious Buu "plays" with Basil, Basil thinks Buu is not much but he can't knock him down.
- 1:35 to 3. A serious Buu overwhelms Basil. Hence, Majin Buu at full strength is far above him.
- 3 to end. Amped Basil exchange fists with a Buu who isn't in some frenzy anymore, showers him with attacks, Buu regenerates and hasn't any lasting injury, meaning not even an amped Basil's best shots can hurt him at all. Amped Basil survives Buu's max power Kamehameha, but he drops out of the form either from the blow or from stamina issues. The end.

3. Like pointed in the post above this out there's plenty of leeway to put Lavenda, Basil and Bergamo at base Saiyan levels. In fact it's probably the thing that would make more sense. Goku and Bergamo appeared to be evenly matched, like Lavenda and Base Gohan. The same Gohan was weaker than his Buu saga counterpart - this is an established fact, through narration and official synopses - so this kind of reasoning about proving something about where Buu and Basil stood in power is especially off.

Using the Champa Saga makes no sense since in they U7 did weakest to strongest and didn't have a load like Monaka. To be frank, nothing shows that they didn't do this.

I can't even understand what you are trying to say on so many levels. "U7 did go from weakest to strongest, so the fact U6 didn't doesn't count"? ... No.

tl;dr It's incredible I had to make such a gargantuan post only to reiterate that "no, there's nothing proving that Lavenda is stronger than Basil".

[Basako]

I don't recall neither Frieza nor Cell having their saga prolonged just because the protagonist decided to hold back. And let's not even go into the embarrassing thrashings that he received from Ultimate Gohan and SSJ Vegetto; and we could have even added SSJ3 Gotenks to that list, if he weren't so caught up in his over confidence.

Well, there's is this time when Vegeta decided to let Cell complete. Also, Trunks thought he was stronger than his father, he decided not to intervine until he was unconscious not to hurt his feelings. He really wasn't stronger, USS was useless, but the intention is what counts. They all decided not to search for Gero too, that would have ended the arc right there.

Also the villains. Vegeta and Nappa could have killed all the Z gang except Piccolo and wait for Goku. They decided to let Gohan and Krilin live and wait for Goku three hours, for unknown reasons. Same in the Namek arc, Freeza could have killed Goku before he transformed, then go for the rest. The Ginyu force prolonged the fight too. Cell gave them nine days to train, instead of taking them right there.

[dragon boss z]

While we know that Bergamo is the strongest among the three brothers there's nothing confirming or even suggesting that Lavenda is stronger than Basil, other than some arbitrary notion that "since they started with him, he must be the weakest". See "arbitrary". Like "you shouldn't really go promoting it as a fact". This while avoiding mentioning that the same would yield conclusions like "Goku in the U6 arc was weaker than Piccolo".
Besides, I'd say Lavenda depiction was representative of the "creepy guy who uses cheap tactics" trope. Basil's presentation is that of a "powerful kickboxer", something more similar to the "legitimate fighter" type; since we are talking about a show that tries to put things in often overly-simplistic layman's terms, I wouldn't exactly tend to picture the first as having more raw strength than the second one. Especially when, again, there's nothing else in the show hinting at it.

The way you downplay Buu's strength is also a little foolhardy. Basil was also completely outmatched against Mr. Buu before the drug. After the drug - which could've multiplied his natural power exponentially, for all we know; I'd say the presentation gives credence to this theory - he still couldn't do any lasting damage, whilst Buu flat-out stated he was still "much stronger".

The only argument I can see could be made for his "resistance" to Buu's fully powered Kamehameha, I suppose. Still, it was clear as day that the gap between regular Basil and Mr. Buu was at least as wide as the one between someone like Super Saiyan Gohan and Fat Buu - hence in the order of "many times stronger" (the gap between Mr. Buu and "drugged Basil" could be similar to the one between Majin Vegeta and the same Fat Buu).
Plain ol' Basil, in turn, would've most likely died the moment a not-so-playful Mr. Buu kept punching him at full force, regeneration or not.

Because there's no reason not to think they didn't go weakest to strongest. Even after Basil lost to Buu, they thought Lavenda would kill Gohan and they had no reason to conclude that Gohan was weaker than Buu.

Using the Champa Saga makes no sense since in they U7 did weakest to strongest and didn't have a load like Monaka. To be frank, nothing shows that they didn't do this.

Basil knocked Buu around until he hurt Satan and even then held his own. The match wasn't as one-sided as you're pushing.

You say I downplay Buu. No, you downplay Basil and Lavenda.

That user seems to downplay anyone who isn't Buu, despite there being numerous indications that both existing characters and new characters have long surpassed the overrated, unnecessarily comical blob.

Seriously, I said this before and I'll say it again. Universal powerhouses who debut with seemingly unparalleled power levels don't seem to mean much in the long run. How many times have characters surpassed seemingly unreachable benchmarks with little to no effort?

I seriously don't get all this hype about Buu. Even in his own saga, he was quite easily surpassed and humiliated moreso than any of the other main villains. Heck, had SSJ3 Goku taken it seriously, the Buu saga would have been over right then and there. I don't recall neither Frieza nor Cell having their saga prolonged just because the protagonist decided to hold back. And let's not even go into the embarrassing thrashings that he received from Ultimate Gohan and SSJ Vegetto; and we could have even added SSJ3 Gotenks to that list, if he weren't so caught up in his over confidence. Oh and nothing really amazing about a character who relies on absorptions as his main source of power ups.

But in all fairness, I do love the friendship Buu was able to form with Hercule. Probably the coolest thing he's done since his debut.

Buu is definitely stronger than plenty of people in Super. There is a reason he keeps getting written out of sagas. He would of solod all of Frieza's soldiers in the RoF arc and he would of beat all the U6 fighters except Hit unless he was dumb enough to get knocked out of the ring.

[HeroR]

Buu is definitely stronger than plenty of people in Super. There is a reason he keeps getting written out of sagas. He would of solod all of Frieza's soldiers in the RoF arc and he would of beat all the U6 fighters except Hit unless he was dumb enough to get knocked out of the ring.

He isn't writing out because he's too strong. He's written out because Toriyama doesn't want to used him. Everyone in Resurrection 'F' could waste Freeza's soldiers and Tagamo could probably beat Buu. Buu would have not beat all the U6 fighter since all of them could trade blows with base form Goku who could waste Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks. The same Gotenks who was an even match with Super Buu and Fat Buu got his ass kicked by the far weaker Grey Buu. Chances are, Buu would have lost to Botamo if he didn't figure out how to ring him out.

[dragon boss z]

Buu is definitely stronger than plenty of people in Super. There is a reason he keeps getting written out of sagas. He would of solod all of Frieza's soldiers in the RoF arc and he would of beat all the U6 fighters except Hit unless he was dumb enough to get knocked out of the ring.

He isn't writing out because he's too strong. He's written out because Toriyama doesn't want to used him. Everyone in Resurrection 'F' could waste Freeza's soldiers and Tagamo could probably beat Buu. Buu would have not beat all the U6 fighter since all of them could trade blows with base form Goku who could waste Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks. The same Gotenks who was an even match with Super Buu and Fat Buu got his ass kicked by the far weaker Grey Buu. Chances are, Buu would have lost to Botamo if he didn't figure out how to ring him out.

Tagoma would of got one shot by Buu. I'm almost certain the writers forgot how strong Piccolo was or just didn't care and Gohan was as weak as ever and couldn't even go ssj2 anymore meaning he was most likely weaker than he was in the Cell games and he beat Tagoma.

As for the U6 fighters Botamo was fodder and you can't beat Buu without a ring out either. So it's too fighters who need a ring out but Buu can turn him to candy or absorb him plus he is most likely way stronger. I doubt Botamo was even namke Frieza level. Final form Frost could of been around Buu tier, but Buu's regen would probably give him the win and Buu most likely can't be poisoned. Magetta really can't do much to Buu. Heat won't do anything to him. Buu should be way above base Cabba, and Cabba won't turn ssj against Buu so that wouldn't be a problem.

Base Goku's and Vegeta's strength varies by a lot and this is most likely because there are different writers for different episodes. Piccolo was able to hold his own against Frost which means Frost definitely isn't leagues above ssj3 Gotenks tier. In the Super manga Goku and Vegeta aren't even that far ahead of their Buu saga versions.

[Bullza]

Krillin didn't match him at all. He got some attacks in that did nothing against Basil and then Basil wasted his butt. Plus, it was stated that Krillin was much weaker than base form Gohan before they sparred in Episode 84.

Also, Lavender hit Gohan several times once he flew and Gohan couldn't hear him anymore. Not before the poison got worse.

They were evenly matched when they fought in martial arts. They dodged each attacks etc. It wasn't an instant stomping. Sure Krillin was weaker than him and Gohan but that's ok if Basil is around as strong as Base Gohan.

Gohan and Lavender fought equally for a bit and then he got poisoned. Lavender beat away at Gohan but couldn't keep him down, then Gohan dodged all his attacks no problem and got the upperhand. He was able to hit him afterwards when he used Ki attacks but up close he couldn't.

And like I said Goku fought Bergamo evenly before he started gaining more power. So them being around Base level strength is what makes most sense, a bit below perhaps.

[LowRyder2005]

If you follow the notion that everyone who matches base Goku needs to be superior to Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks - which is not entirely devoid of intellectual honesty; I mean, trying to follow the more apparent conditions that's what you end up with - then it's obvious you would end up with everyone dwarfing most forms of Buu; it still is some narrative that is outright contradicted within the show's later progression itself, regardless.

For instance: you literally need to have Ultimate Gohan as strong as base Gohan - yet production-related material references about Gohan "training with Piccolo in order to regain his lost strength". There's also Piccolo becoming hundreds of times stronger off-screen without any rhyme or reason, which is obviously filmsy. But one could go as far as claiming Krillin also needs to become thousands of times stronger with some new weight machine if he's even remotely entertain this base Gohan who needs to unlock his Ultimate form and yet he's just as strong in base for some reason. There're the Gods of Destructions stating Goku belongs to the "realm of the gods" only after he goes Blue, and yet even his Super Saiyan 2 form should be "dozens of times stronger than the Super Saiyan God".

Far too many contradictions, and strength increases no one addresses and are nearly impossible to reconcile within the narrative they have proposed so far. The "Beyond God" base forms are clearly not a thing anymore - something that was quietly put on shelves, in fact, with the Copy Water Arc being one of the last examples to reflect that kind of power Goku and Vegeta had displayed in the movies' original outline, power which was comparable to that of the Super Saiyan God.
Every other instances bar Gotenks vs. Vegeta, possibly the Goku vs. Beerus spar and the ROF adaptation should reasonably need to be reconciled in some other fashion.

[shadowmaria]

Buu is definitely stronger than plenty of people in Super. There is a reason he keeps getting written out of sagas. He would of solod all of Frieza's soldiers in the RoF arc and he would of beat all the U6 fighters except Hit unless he was dumb enough to get knocked out of the ring.

I think this is probably the best way of justifying the decision regarding Buu's involvement from an out of universe perspective.

Look at it this way: Basil was the MVP of the first minute of the Tournament of Power, getting the first major elimination with ease and having an all-round great showing.

Basil got rekt by Buu, who barely even broke a sweat and got pushed in battle more by Super Saiyan 3 Goku and Kid Buu, than he did Basil.

[Akyon]

Using the Champa Saga makes no sense since in they U7 did weakest to strongest and didn't have a load like Monaka. To be frank, nothing shows that they didn't do this.

This line confused me.
Are we talking about U7 or U6's team being in strength order?

Hit and Goku are clearly the strongest, and fair enough they were the last battle(ignoring Monaka), but Goku also went first and I'm not sure I believe Cabba>Magetta going by the battles they had with Vegeta.

[Freeza9000]

There're the Gods of Destructions stating Goku belongs to the "realm of the gods" only after he goes Blue, and yet even his Super Saiyan 2 form should be "dozens of times stronger than the Super Saiyan God".

Gowasu described Goku's SSJ2 power as powerful enough to be rivaling a Hakaishin (at least when suppressed). Zamasu, who was on-par with SSJ2 Goku, was scouted as a fighting prodigy which, in Goku's words, can potentially be powerful enough to surpass Beerus one day.