Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.
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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by Lord Beerus » Thu Jul 13, 2017 9:44 am

The fact that four universes were deliberately left out should all but indicate that every universe taking part in the Tournament Of Power, excluding Universe 7, is going to bit the dust and that Toriyama still has plans to tinker with the multiverse concept. And Super has already shown that they pull no punches when killing off a universe so I don't know what now is going to be any different.

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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by MagmonKai » Thu Jul 13, 2017 9:58 am

I agree, I personally don't see why people don't believe they will leave the universes destroyed. I don't think the genre of the show has any bearing on the direction it's heading. Besides we still have 4 universes plus U7 left. That's plenty of people/material for future arcs. I dislike the idea of going against the Zenos by undoing everything that happened in the tournament. While I agree the super dragonball can be used in that manner. I can see the Great Priest putting limitations on the wishes made such as: "Do not undo what has been done" kind of thing. It would invalidate the whole concept of an omnipotent being if everything he does can be undone. So, I hope Toei/Toriyama isn't stupid enough to do that. But then again Super is unpredictable and it might just surprise us.

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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by Ki Breaker » Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:30 am

I am all for universe 7 only surviving in the end somehow..
More than happy to trade all the life if universe 6 sadala ends up destroyed as well with it..
If there are more Cauliflowa like creatures there it's better to transfer them where they belong most, afterlife..
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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by Son Goku » Thu Jul 13, 2017 12:06 pm

Alternative: The universes remain erased and Super Shenron is unable to restore them for some reason (maybe the power to create/restore entire universes is reserved only for Zen-Oh?), but it is able to revive all the worlds with sentient life and they're folded into the surviving participating universe.

Solves the moral dilemma of so many beings ceasing to exist, could bring back with it the erased Gods of Destruction (maybe it leads to a literal Battle of Gods to decide which God of Destruction will be in charge of this combined universe?), would allow popular characters from U6 and U11 to easily show up in future arcs, and then you have plenty of plot potential not only exploring the non-native worlds but also dealing with the ramifications of so many new worlds suddenly coming into existence.
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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by Shinda Forever » Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:03 pm

Son Goku wrote:Alternative: The universes remain erased and Super Shenron is unable to restore them for some reason (maybe the power to create/restore entire universes is reserved only for Zen-Oh?), but it is able to revive all the worlds with sentient life and they're folded into the surviving participating universe.

Solves the moral dilemma of so many beings ceasing to exist, could bring back with it the erased Gods of Destruction (maybe it leads to a literal Battle of Gods to decide which God of Destruction will be in charge of this combined universe?), would allow popular characters from U6 and U11 to easily show up in future arcs, and then you have plenty of plot potential not only exploring the non-native worlds but also dealing with the ramifications of so many new worlds suddenly coming into existence.
I expressed the same opinion as well and i think it is the best solution for the series.

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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by BlueBasilisk » Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:05 pm

I think 7, 11, 6, and maybe 2 will come out of the tournament unscathed if they don't wish everyone back. Yeah, the show did erase Trunks' universe but that was also in one of at least two alternate timeline where the entire main cast was unceremoniously killed off for good. You know they're never going to do that in the main timeline. The alternate timelines seem like sandboxes where the writers can play around with things that wouldn't fly in the "normal" timeline, like having Black murder Goku, Goten and Chi Chi. I don't feel like Toriyama or Toei's writers would have Goku and friends take part in a massacre numbering in the hundreds of trillions and not hit some kind of reset button on it.

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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by aravinthan » Thu Jul 13, 2017 2:00 pm

Son Goku wrote:Alternative: The universes remain erased and Super Shenron is unable to restore them for some reason (maybe the power to create/restore entire universes is reserved only for Zen-Oh?), but it is able to revive all the worlds with sentient life and they're folded into the surviving participating universe.

Solves the moral dilemma of so many beings ceasing to exist, could bring back with it the erased Gods of Destruction (maybe it leads to a literal Battle of Gods to decide which God of Destruction will be in charge of this combined universe?), would allow popular characters from U6 and U11 to easily show up in future arcs, and then you have plenty of plot potential not only exploring the non-native worlds but also dealing with the ramifications of so many new worlds suddenly coming into existence.

That will be better than the BoG we had..... :clap: joker god wins and marcarita will train Goku. Ot will be :thumbup: great

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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by Super_Divine_Genki » Thu Jul 13, 2017 2:10 pm

How could the Super DB's play into this? If U6 is erased, what happens to their, uh... balls? They are shared between only U6/U7. Maybe the unseen universes hold a key?

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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by precita » Thu Jul 13, 2017 2:25 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:The fact that four universes were deliberately left out should all but indicate that every universe taking part in the Tournament Of Power, excluding Universe 7, is going to bit the dust and that Toriyama still has plans to tinker with the multiverse concept. And Super has already shown that they pull no punches when killing off a universe so I don't know what now is going to be any different.
Because you're talking about 7 designs of the Gods of Destruction being completely wasted since those characters didn't do anything yet for no reason. If the Gods of Destructions were spared like the Angels, it'd be a different story. Why would they erase all those God's this early in the series? Some of them have interesting and unique designs and I don't think they'd bother to give the memorable looks if they were going to get rid of them so easily without doing anything with them.

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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by Lord Beerus » Thu Jul 13, 2017 2:39 pm

precita wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote:The fact that four universes were deliberately left out should all but indicate that every universe taking part in the Tournament Of Power, excluding Universe 7, is going to bite the dust and that Toriyama still has plans to tinker with the multiverse concept. And Super has already shown that they pull no punches when killing off a universe so I don't know what now is going to be any different.
Because you're talking about 7 designs of the Gods of Destruction being completely wasted since those characters didn't do anything yet for no reason. If the Gods of Destructions were spared like the Angels, it'd be a different story. Why would they erase all those God's this early in the series? Some of them have interesting and unique designs and I don't think they'd bother to give the memorable looks if they were going to get rid of them so easily without doing anything with them.
Toriyama obviously has some specific plans for some of the new Hakaishin introduced but not all of them. That's why four specific universes were spared. Toriyama still wants to do something with the concept of the multiple universes. If he didn't, all of the universes would have taken part in the Tournament Of Power. My guess is that Toriyama introduced the concept Tournament Of Power and just to show off how disposable some of the universes and Hakaishin could be in the grand scheme.

I'll admit, it really sucks that some of the new universes and Hakaishin introduced are being wasted like this. But that's how Toriyama crafts his story. If he feels that he can't the most out of a plot-point or concept previously introduced, he'll discard it like nothing.

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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by WittyUsername » Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:21 pm

I would assume that the Super Dragon Balls being presented as the price for winning the tournament would men's that the erased universes will be brought back by the end of it all. I guess it's possible that the other universes will all stay dead, but that seems too cynical for Dragon Ball.

I know people will point the the Future Trunks arc as an example of characters staying dead, but even that case ended with Trunks and Mai going to a timeline where Black never existed. Plus, Future Trunks' timeline has always had it pretty bad compared to the main timeline.

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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by t0ffe3m4n » Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:08 am

Kanious wrote:
GodKaio-Ken wrote:I think this topic has been discussed to its brink but oh well.

I actually think they may bring those universe back but they shouldnt. I dont think the Super Dragon Balls should be able to bring back things erased from the fabric of the cosmos itself. These people arent even dead in DB world...their very exidtence has been taken.

I also think a play of...oh well we were never really erasing them chuckle chuckle would be lame.
but it was implied that Super Shenron can grant ANY wish. But after what happened in the previous arc, i don't doubt that there is a possibility that only one universe will survive and the others will be permanently erased... this would be dark, sad and i hope it doesn't happen
There'd still be 5 universes left, only 7 are getting wiped out in this tournament. Unless of course you mean just one universe left standing from the tournament.

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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by Ki Breaker » Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:51 am

Son Goku wrote:Alternative: The universes remain erased and Super Shenron is unable to restore them for some reason (maybe the power to create/restore entire universes is reserved only for Zen-Oh?), but it is able to revive all the worlds with sentient life and they're folded into the surviving participating universe.

Solves the moral dilemma of so many beings ceasing to exist, could bring back with it the erased Gods of Destruction (maybe it leads to a literal Battle of Gods to decide which God of Destruction will be in charge of this combined universe?), would allow popular characters from U6 and U11 to easily show up in future arcs, and then you have plenty of plot potential not only exploring the non-native worlds but also dealing with the ramifications of so many new worlds suddenly coming into existence.
This has one major problem, Berrus's hakai erases the being and their soul ceases to exist, the entire being is gone like vegeta would have if he had died again in majin buu fight after he died once already..
I assume Zeno's erasure works the same, he was able to kill an immortal with it..
Now can the dragon revive someone who has no soul?
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Re: Reasons why it's likely the universes are not being erased, at least not permanently from a writer perspective

Post by WittyUsername » Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:34 am

Ki Breaker wrote:
Son Goku wrote:Alternative: The universes remain erased and Super Shenron is unable to restore them for some reason (maybe the power to create/restore entire universes is reserved only for Zen-Oh?), but it is able to revive all the worlds with sentient life and they're folded into the surviving participating universe.

Solves the moral dilemma of so many beings ceasing to exist, could bring back with it the erased Gods of Destruction (maybe it leads to a literal Battle of Gods to decide which God of Destruction will be in charge of this combined universe?), would allow popular characters from U6 and U11 to easily show up in future arcs, and then you have plenty of plot potential not only exploring the non-native worlds but also dealing with the ramifications of so many new worlds suddenly coming into existence.
This has one major problem, Berrus's hakai erases the being and their soul ceases to exist, the entire being is gone like vegeta would have if he had died again in majin buu fight after he died once already..
I assume Zeno's erasure works the same, he was able to kill an immortal with it..
Now can the dragon revive someone who has no soul?
The Super Dragon Balls are said to be able to grant any wish with virtually no limitations. At least, that's how Champa described them.

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