"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[Boo Machine]

I'll wait for more pages and translation, but so far it seems the ending is the same as the anime's. Which is disappointing. I was looking forward to something different. But I guess Toriyama wanted Trunks world to blow up. And then for him to hang out with himself in another world. Which is really weird.

[Zephyr]

And this makes me a troll, how?

"Troll" might not be the right word, but trying to 'call the manga out' for doing standard classic Dragon Ball stuff, without qualifying the complaint as something you also disliked back then, makes you come across as an axe-grinding pest with a complete and utter lack of perspective.

[Kanassa]

And this makes me a troll, how?

"Troll" might not be the right word, but trying to 'call the manga out' for doing standard classic Dragon Ball stuff, without qualifying the complaint as something you also disliked back then, makes you come across as an axe-grinding pest with a complete and utter lack of perspective.

You're assuming I didn't find it stupid back then. But even if I didn't, my point was how fitting the expression was.

[OLKv3]

I'll wait for more pages and translation, but so far it seems the ending is the same as the anime's. Which is disappointing. I was looking forward to something different. But I guess Toriyama wanted Trunks world to blow up. And then for him to hang out with himself in another world. Which is really weird.

It seems to be missing the somber feel of the anime ending, which is jarring. Trunks and Mai seem entirely too happy in these panels

[Zephyr]

You're assuming I didn't find it stupid back then. But even if I didn't, my point was how fitting the expression was.

Again, without even attempting to convey an awareness of how standard the expression is, you practically invite the assumption. Peoples' complaints about the anime often invite similar assumptions.

Humor comes from subverting expectations, and you seemed incredibly amused by his having a standard DB death expression. Were you expecting something different from the norm?

I just don't see what's so uniquely fitting about it, is my only thing. I mean I get the "lol manga black is pathetic xD" meme, but in a Toriyama series, humorous death expressions are normally fitting, whether the newly-deceased was pathetic or frightening, or both at different points. As was the case with Nappa, Freeza, Cell, and now Zamasu.

[TheSaiyanGod]

I'll wait for more pages and translation, but so far it seems the ending is the same as the anime's. Which is disappointing. I was looking forward to something different. But I guess Toriyama wanted Trunks world to blow up. And then for him to hang out with himself in another world. Which is really weird.

It seems to be missing the somber feel of the anime ending, which is jarring. Trunks and Mai seem entirely too happy in these panels

In fact, it's the same thing as anime

Unfortunately, neither man was able to give the dark atmosphere necessary for this end
In the anime, it seemed like everyone was happy even after the world of Trunks was destroyed.
In the manga it seems that they are even happier.

[SansrivaaL]

Guess that Trunks being the definition of HOPE packs in the deal of them being this happy despite losing almost everything. Cant blame him tho, he still has his waifu and they technically won in a way its not a win-win but still ok, never had a problem with Trunks being happy despite of what happened even back in the anime, I feel like its telling us things dont always go as planned, no matter how bad of an outcome happens, greet that shit with a smile, a better future awaits us all or something cheesy like that.

[Basako]

If you're going to try to defend something, at least defend it on its own merits instead of deflecting and using straw man's. Trunks was still useless regardless of what happened in the anime

Besides, Trunks didn't really even get a new transformation. He got a bit bulkier and his hair got a little spikier. That's literally any generic Ssj transformation. The only new thing is the appearance of the aura.
The logic behind it is hardly bullshit since the angry power boost thing is a trait of the Saiyan's and has been done numerous times before with Gohan, Vegeta, and Goku. What is there to explain? The only bullshit thing about it is the size of the power jump but at least Trunks wasn't a background character.

So that was Trunks SS2 with SSB equivalent power? That's new, but, hey, with all the clarifications we got, it's one more theory to the list. Always welcome.

The thing is, his response is fair, because ignoring all Trunks did in the arc just because he didn't got a power up leads to that. He fought Black three times, helped his friends escape, cured Goku and others in lesser grade and he did cut merged Zamasu and stab Black, although this meant no victory. The nonsense of the Genki sword didn't mean victory either, by the way.

People hype it up as a new transformation but the series never stated that it was. As I mentioned, there was hardly any difference which leads me to believe that "Ssj rage" is simply just an enraged powered up version of ssj2 like Vegeta when he fought Beerus.

You're just listing miniscule things and making them seem grander than they really are.

In the anime Trunks was actively involved in the fight against Black and Zamasu.

In the manga Trunks did small things on occasion and helplessly stood in the background the majority of the time while Goku and Vegeta handled everything as usual.

I'm not listing minuscule things, Trunks fought Black one on one three times, that's huge and animated would have been amazing. As it was, with that huge power difference, that makes it more epic. Did it mean something? Indeed, it did, this permited Goku and Vegeta escape and return with the new strategy.

What did Trunks do in the anime? The same with fireworks and a nonsensical power up. If you don't want to call it transformation, I don't care, nobody knows what it was, there are just theories around. People complained his SS2 could be similar to Goku's SS3, they must be like crazy with that in SSB level.

In both versions Trunks cut merged Zamasu in half. One it was a total nonsense, the other was a not. In both versions it made Zamasu get a more powerful state, it wasn't a winning move in the anime.

I go with the manga aproach by so far. A hype means nothing if it doesn't make sense, looks artificial, that's what the anime brought us.

[Ki Breaker]

Guess that Trunks being the definition of HOPE packs in the deal of them being this happy despite losing almost everything. Cant blame him tho, he still has his waifu and they technically won in a way its not a win-win but still ok, never had a problem with Trunks being happy despite of what happened even back in the anime, I feel like its telling us things dont always go as planned, no matter how bad of an outcome happens, greet that shit with a smile, a better future awaits us all or something cheesy like that.

You know even if it's cheesy as hell, now that I see it, I much prefer this scenario to what we got with trunks crying over his failures in anime..

[FortuneSSJ]

Welp, the ending is really the same than the anime!
I wonder how some complainers will feel about that now that they know it comes from Toriyama himself again. Even though it was obvious such big thing couldn't came just from Toei.

Half the cast didn't even appear in this arc, but the worst thing is that FT Trunks and Gohan never met here. Another big fail to the manga version.

FT Trunks farewell in the anime obliterates the manga version.

I will give my full thoughts about the chapter and the whole arc when I read the next chapter properly.

I can already say it was far better and much more memorable than Champa arc was, but overall it's still inferior to the anime version.

[Kanassa]

You're assuming I didn't find it stupid back then. But even if I didn't, my point was how fitting the expression was.

Again, without even attempting to convey an awareness of how standard the expression is, you practically invite the assumption. Peoples' complaints about the anime often invite similar assumptions.

Yeah, and it's stupid when it happens there too.

Humor comes from subverting expectations, and you seemed incredibly amused by his having a standard DB death expression. Were you expecting something different from the norm?

I just don't see what's so uniquely fitting about it, is my only thing. I mean I get the "lol manga black is pathetic xD" meme, but in a Toriyama series, humorous death expressions are normally fitting, whether the newly-deceased was pathetic or frightening, or both at different points. As was the case with Nappa, Freeza, Cell, and now Zamasu.

'd say that in other circumstances the stupid expressions weren't fitting, which is why they were funny, just in a different way. For people like Frieza and Cell they had their great moments of competence and feeling like threatening villains (Well, for Frieza it was before he came back as Mecha Frieza), so their stupid expressions are gold. Along with a touch of irony. With Manga!Zamasu the humour for me is simply in how even in death he's still being humiliated.

[Basako]

Welp, the ending is really the same than the anime!
I wonder how some complainers will feel about that now that they know it comes from Toriyama himself again. Even though it was obvious such big thing couldn't came just from Toei.

Half the cast didn't even appear in this arc, but the worst thing is that FT Trunks and Gohan never met here. Another big fail to the manga version.

FT Trunks farewell in the anime obliterates the manga version.

I will give my full thoughts about the chapter and the whole arc when I read the next chapter properly.

I can already say it was far better and much more memorable than Champa arc was, but overall it's still inferior to the anime version.

If it's the same, Trunks and Mai going to live to a new timeline with their copies, I feel it was bad before and bad now. Yes, the manga ending is bad, isn't that music for your ears?

Trunks meeting Gohan again. Ok, I can say this was a good idea with potential, if it had been written correctly. That was one of the worst written episodes of DBS, Gohan was a total zombie. He didn't even ask Trunks what he was doing in the present again. Man, for that, better if they hadn't meet at all.

[Marlowe89]

I'm in agreement with the people who are saying that Zamasu's last moment cowardice kind of besmirches the memory of his character.

I think it's quite fitting, really. Zamasu was a god who wanted to cleanse mortals from existence and have them fear him; now that the shoe's on the other foot, he's experiencing fear by a god of gods who is about to wipe him from existence. The point was probably to convey a sense of irony and I think it plays rather well to the tragic nature of Zamasu's downfall.

Besides, can we say with certainty that he wouldn't have reacted the same way in the anime if he wasn't some stationary blob in the sky?

[FortuneSSJ]

Trunks meeting Gohan again. Ok, I can say this was a good idea with potential, if it had been written correctly. That was one of the worst written episodes of DBS, Gohan was a total zombie. He didn't even ask Trunks what he was doing in the present again. Man, for that, better if they hadn't meet at all.

FT Trunks being updated about everyone's lives while the time machine is getting prepared, emphasizing his bond with Gohan, FT Yajirobe, Present Bulma going to the Future with them, and Piccolo being the one to suggest the Mafuba are some examples of how Toei handled the overall cast much better.

Leave half of the main cast out doesn't make any sense, unless it was a Movie. It isn't.

[Ki Breaker]

Him being a coward at the end and trying to run from a supreme being for his life, the same kind of life's he took considering himself a supreme being not long ago, is a fitting ending for him, the best possible one..

[Will]

Welp, the ending is really the same than the anime!
I wonder how some complainers will feel about that now that they know it comes from Toriyama himself again. Even though it was obvious such big thing couldn't came just from Toei.

Half the cast didn't even appear in this arc, but the worst thing is that FT Trunks and Gohan never met here. Another big fail to the manga version.

FT Trunks farewell in the anime obliterates the manga version.

I will give my full thoughts about the chapter and the whole arc when I read the next chapter properly.

I can already say it was far better and much more memorable than Champa arc was, but overall it's still inferior to the anime version.

If it's the same, Trunks and Mai going to live to a new timeline with their copies, I feel it was bad before and bad now. Yes, the manga ending is bad, isn't that music for your ears?

Trunks meeting Gohan again. Ok, I can say this was a good idea with potential, if it had been written correctly. That was one of the worst written episodes of DBS, Gohan was a total zombie. He didn't even ask Trunks what he was doing in the present again. Man, for that, better if they hadn't meet at all.

I thought it was a nice episode where Trunks saw what he wanted to have, what he was fighting for.
(Speaking about that, the rebellion/the kids/ Yajirobe were a great addition from Toei.)
And then later when Gohan learn about what happens in the future, he express regret to not have ask why Trunks was here.

[Basako]

Trunks meeting Gohan again. Ok, I can say this was a good idea with potential, if it had been written correctly. That was one of the worst written episodes of DBS, Gohan was a total zombie. He didn't even ask Trunks what he was doing in the present again. Man, for that, better if they hadn't meet at all.

FT Trunks being updated about everyone's lives while the time machine is getting prepared, emphasizing his bond with Gohan, FT Yajirobe, Present Bulma going to the Future with them, and Piccolo being the one to suggest the Mafuba are some examples of how Toei handled the overall cast much better.

Leave half the main cast out of the show doesn't make any sense, unless it was a Movie. It isn't.

Future Yajirobe was a terrible addition and it wasn't well handled. He could have asked about the other timeline he didn't know it existed or about himself. It was cheap fan service and don't make me speak about android 8 and Umigame.

Nothing against Trunks asking for the cast, but they weren't necessary in this arc, that's the truth. But, the encounter of Trunks and Gohan was pathetic as hell, for that, better if it didn't happen. It was written in other timeline for a reason, to keep the Hakaishins out of the picture. And Bulma's contributions in the anime were artificial as hell, for that, better like in the manga. She prepared the machine and with a supporting role, which is totally fine.

I thought it was a nice episode where Trunks saw what he wanted to have, what he was fighting for.
(Speaking about that, the rebellion/the kids/ Yajirobe were a great addition from Toei.)
And then later when Gohan learn about what happens in the future, he express regret to not have ask why Trunks was here.

It could have been a good episode, but it was really bad. Gohan in Super has been so pathetic and not himself and this was his peak. He wasn't that zombie in Z. Well, at least he regreted, but it's not on him, it's the writer who wrote that who should regret it, because that was no Gohan.

Nah, the rebelion and Yajirobe weren't nice, at least for me, but I can get if some people liked it. The two kids were so generic, in characterization and design, sometimes it's so obvious when something comes from Toei.

[Zephyr]

For people like Frieza and Cell they had their great moments of competence and feeling like threatening villains (Well, for Frieza it was before he came back as Mecha Frieza), so their stupid expressions are gold. Along with a touch of irony. With Manga!Zamasu the humour for me is simply in how even in death he's still being humiliated.

Freeza and Cell still had significant moments of humiliation. After their respective Saiyan rivals unlock their new transformations, they get severely humbled. Freeza's only worsens when he cuts himself in half, begs for pity ki, gets it, and wastes it.

Zamasu was likewise not without his moments of competence and threat. His whole plan is plenty genius in the first place, using the other Zamasu to heal him to close the gap via Saiyan biology. Plus he's scary as fuck when he unlocks Rose, and when he becomes an army.

[Overlord78]

Garbage ending for a garbage arc, how fitting that it's just as shit as the anime version.

Zamasu was a terrible villain so it's very refreshing to see him running like a bitch from Zeno. Thank God he is gone.

[FortuneSSJ]

Future Yajirobe was a terrible addition and it wasn't well handled. He could have asked about the other timeline he didn't know it existed or about himself. It was cheap fan service.

I liked it and I give it extra points for the beard. It was a good opportunity to do something with a character that was nothing more to offer in the main timeline.
My only complaint is how they didn't brought FT Lunch too. Her blond side loves gun and she would would give me entertaining interactions with the Resistance Team.

Nowadays I see some people calling fan service to everything they don't like. Remember the cast that you have at your disposal and characters abilities it's not fan service, it's good writing.
I don't think Yajirobe has a fanbase big enough to even call it "fan service".

Fan service would be Kale being a complete Female Broly so far.