So according to the NEP for 104 (SPOILERS) is coming back

[Low Tone G]

I believe it is going to be the Super Saiyan Version of Super Saiyan God, would you like that aswell?

Isn't SSJ Blue the Super Saiyan version of Super Saiyan God?

No it isn't. I don't understand why people seem to think that, but SSJB is, for starters, ofcourse Blue, and we also know that it's just normal Super Saiyan tapping into God ki, self evidently, as you'd be well able to see for yourself, it's a completely different Form from Super Saiyan God. It doesn't even have the lean body of God Goku, and doesn't look younger either.

Also, they can access SSJ Blue from Base and regular SSJ, so this can NOT be the Super Saiyan version of Super Saiyan God.

The Super Saiyan version that i'm talking about, the "Real" Super Saiyan Version of Super Saiyan God will/should ofcourse be Red. I.e. Just God Goku with his hair spiked up as Super Saiyan.

This what I consider to think myself, too. But If the normal SSJ is golden in color, then the Super Saiyan of the red God form should be someting else.. orange or something.

By the way, I don't think anime Vegeta has this Super Saiyan Red form, to begin with. In my head canon, both Goku and Vegeta learned to tap into the God(Blue) form on their own, but Goku had a very huge jump from the ritual and that energy was totally converted into normal Ki. Vegeta did it by Whis' traning, as he has never transformed into Red.

I don't like Toyotaro's depicition of the Red as being a form which can be learned on one's own when a ritual was needed to unlock it.

[Lord Beerus]

In the manga he can transform into SSG at will, but I have no idea why he would suddenly start using it now but went right to SSB previously, and I doubt it will be explained.


He uses SSG in the manga.

Yes in the manga. Not in the anime. In the anime he never learned it, though that's not to say he can't somehow achieve it on his own in the future.

He must have learned it at some point, probably while training with Whis, because SSB is SSG + SS.

The anime does all but state that Vegeta attained the power of Super Saiyan God while training with Goku and Whis. When Vegeta turns into a SSJB in Episode 27, Goku comments that unlike himself who needed the strength of other Saiyans to obtain the power of Super Saiyan God, Vegeta did it on his own with his own power. That would strongly imply Vegeta, at some point after Goku joined him to train with Whis, simply brute forced his way to becoming a Super Saiyan God.

It would actually work in a thematic sense given Vegeta often brute forces his way to new levels of strength, despite the previously stated criteria need to achieved that power in the first place. Like how he became a SSJ despite not having a pure heart.

[ekrolo2]

Yes in the manga. Not in the anime. In the anime he never learned it, though that's not to say he can't somehow achieve it on his own in the future.

He must have learned it at some point, probably while training with Whis, because SSB is SSG + SS.

The anime does all but state that Vegeta attained the power of Super Saiyan God while training with Goku and Whis. When Vegeta turns into a SSJB in Episode 27, Goku comments that unlike himself who needed the strength of other Saiyans to obtain the power of Super Saiyan God, Vegeta did it on his own with his own power. That would strongly imply Vegeta, at some point after Goku joined him to train with Whis, simply brute forced his way to becoming a Super Saiyan God.

It would actually work in a thematic sense given Vegeta often brute forces his way to new levels of strength, despite the previously stated criteria need to achieved that power in the first place. Like how he became a SSJ despite not having a pure heart.

At least Vegeta has something of a better heart to have this make sense. Him brute forcing SS is just a croak of shit I'll never accept.

[Low Tone G]

Yes in the manga. Not in the anime. In the anime he never learned it, though that's not to say he can't somehow achieve it on his own in the future.

He must have learned it at some point, probably while training with Whis, because SSB is SSG + SS.

The anime does all but state that Vegeta attained the power of Super Saiyan God while training with Goku and Whis. When Vegeta turns into a SSJB in Episode 27, Goku comments that unlike himself who needed the strength of other Saiyans to obtain the power of Super Saiyan God, Vegeta did it on his own with his own power. That would strongly imply Vegeta, at some point after Goku joined him to train with Whis, simply brute forced his way to becoming a Super Saiyan God.

It would actually work in a thematic sense given Vegeta often brute forces his way to new levels of strength, despite the previously stated criteria need to achieved that power in the first place. Like how he became a SSJ despite not having a pure heart.

No, it can also mean that Goku was referring to the Blue as Vegeta has also become a God on his own via Blue... Maybe, Goku didn't want to make a difference between the Blue and the Red, as both posssess God Ki.

[fadeddreams5]

A last ditch effort to keep me interested in an otherwise uninteresting arc. Just kidding.

No you're not.

[Lord Beerus]

He must have learned it at some point, probably while training with Whis, because SSB is SSG + SS.

The anime does all but state that Vegeta attained the power of Super Saiyan God while training with Goku and Whis. When Vegeta turns into a SSJB in Episode 27, Goku comments that unlike himself who needed the strength of other Saiyans to obtain the power of Super Saiyan God, Vegeta did it on his own with his own power. That would strongly imply Vegeta, at some point after Goku joined him to train with Whis, simply brute forced his way to becoming a Super Saiyan God.

It would actually work in a thematic sense given Vegeta often brute forces his way to new levels of strength, despite the previously stated criteria need to achieved that power in the first place. Like how he became a SSJ despite not having a pure heart.

No, it can also mean that Goku was referring to the Blue as Vegeta has also become a God on his own via Blue... Maybe, Goku didn't want to make a difference between the Blue and the Red, as both posssess God Ki.

No, that's not really the case.

Roshi questions, in amazement, that Vegeta obtained the power of Super Saiyan God, given how Goku previously explained the mechanics of how he attained Super Saiyan Blue when he transformed into the form in front of Freeza. Goku then specifically states that Vegeta obtained the power of Super Saiyan God on his own. Unlike Goku himself who had to borrow the power of other Saiyans to obtain the form (The Super Saiyan God ritual). This pretty much spells out to us that Vegeta brute forced his way to becoming a Super Saiyan God while he was training with Whis and Goku. Remember, Vegeta got a 6 month head-start when it came to training with Whis and when Goku meets up with Vegeta on Beerus' Planet with Whis, Goku is impressed with how much stronger Vegeta has grown since he last saw him, saying Vegeta might even be stronger than him now.

[julianix]

A crazy idea I had a few days ago regarding this SSG business.

Okay, so SSB is supposed to be a SS who is a Saiyan with the power of SSG. We've never actually seen the first transformation into SSB in Whis's staff dimension, though, have we? Well, it's a stretch, but maybe the return of SSG could be linked back to that training.

My headcanon is that Vegeta and Goku were learning how to control their own power, using what Whis taught them, to bring in the power of SSG without a ritual, and without its power dissipating on its own. So, the rest of this train of thought goes that Goku and Vegeta use the perfect Ki control taught to them by Whis to tap into the power of SSG, and just as they're on the cusp of turning into the actual SSG form, they turn SS, thus resulting in SSB. Doing this perfect Ki control thing whilst already SS is basically a faster way of doing it, but ONLY results in SSB because it's done from SS.

However, if they were to do it in base form, they could potentially transform into SSG on their own if they don't turn SS whilst possessing the power of SSG. Heck, maybe Goku AND Vegeta DID transform into SSG in Whis's staff dimension at some point, and realized that they could try turning SS instead of SSG to become even stronger.

Nice theory for sure. I hope they explain ssb and ssg a lot better because the fandom is confused.

[MKJ]

Also, the fact that Vegeta never seemed to have achieved SSJ God and thus how he by-passed or "skipped" it proves that aswell. Remember how Whis told Vegeta that all he needed to do in order to surpass Goku (who had already achieved SSJ God during that time) was learning to "control his ki" HIS own ki, not getting some magical dose of special "god ki" from nowhere without any explanation at all. It's all about making the best of what you already have. Your own energy. We are reminded of this fact several times during the series. Later we are reminded (twice) that Goku and Vegeta needed to raise their ki's only within their bodies, internally rather than externally, in "That Place" which was entirely filled with "God ki" it was the only way they could move, and Yes! The moment when Whis adviced them to raise their ki's only within their bodies and prevent it from leaking out into the atmosphere for others to sense, something remarkable happened! We got a glimpse of SSJ Blue's special "God ki".

Short version: SSJ Blue (and god ki as a whole) are about perfect ki control.

What does this mean? It means that SSJ Blue has nothing at all to do with Super Saiyan God and is thus completely independent on it. Afterall, Vegeta never achieved the Form.

I completely agree with everything you have pointed out on this thread. One of the "spoilers" mention something about Goku stating that"my body is throbbing" . If I remember correctly i believe he said something similar during the ritual. The only reason I bring it up is that it leads me to believe that this transformation is going to be somewhat spontaneous and not controlled. That is if the spoiler is correct.

[Low Tone G]

The anime does all but state that Vegeta attained the power of Super Saiyan God while training with Goku and Whis. When Vegeta turns into a SSJB in Episode 27, Goku comments that unlike himself who needed the strength of other Saiyans to obtain the power of Super Saiyan God, Vegeta did it on his own with his own power. That would strongly imply Vegeta, at some point after Goku joined him to train with Whis, simply brute forced his way to becoming a Super Saiyan God.

It would actually work in a thematic sense given Vegeta often brute forces his way to new levels of strength, despite the previously stated criteria need to achieved that power in the first place. Like how he became a SSJ despite not having a pure heart.

No, it can also mean that Goku was referring to the Blue as Vegeta has also become a God on his own via Blue... Maybe, Goku didn't want to make a difference between the Blue and the Red, as both posssess God Ki.

No, that's not really the case.

Roshi questions, in amazement, that Vegeta obtained the power of Super Saiyan God, given how Goku previously explained the mechanics of how he attained Super Saiyan Blue when he transformed into the form in front of Freeza. Goku then specifically states that Vegeta obtained the power of Super Saiyan God on his own. Unlike Goku himself who had to borrow the power of other Saiyans to obtain the form (The Super Saiyan God ritual). This pretty much spells out to us that Vegeta brute forced his way to becoming a Super Saiyan God while he was training with Whis and Goku. Remember, Vegeta got a 6 month head-start when it came to training with Whis and when Goku meets up with Vegeta on Beerus' Planet with Whis, Goku is impressed with how much stronger Vegeta has grown since he last saw him, saying Vegeta might even be stronger than him now.

That doesn't mean that Vegeta has become Red at some point, wasted his form and entered Saiyan beyond God training with Whis...

For me, it's more simply to guess that Vegeta trained himself to the level of Goku when fought Beerus and absorbed the God nature within himself and made his own normal Ki.

Let's check it out:
1. Whis stated Goku and Vegeta reached a power level when they are able to sense the Ki of a God.
2. Mortals such as Hit and Freeza are able to sense it too and they don't possess God Ki.
3. Vegeta never displayed the Red form only in the manga.
4. Both Goku and Vegeta attained Blue after their training in Whis' staff, where they sensed the God Ki's pressure.
5. Goku(and Vegeta) treats Blue as a God form calling it Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan.

[Chuquita]

A last ditch effort to keep me interested in an otherwise uninteresting arc. Just kidding.

No you're not.

Yeah I am.

Nobody at Shueisha makes choices about Super's plot based on fan posts on a forum that isn't even based in Japan.

One person liking ssjg Gokû does not equate to the thousands who like that Yamcha explosion meme.

[GodVegetto91]

Also, the fact that Vegeta never seemed to have achieved SSJ God and thus how he by-passed or "skipped" it proves that aswell. Remember how Whis told Vegeta that all he needed to do in order to surpass Goku (who had already achieved SSJ God during that time) was learning to "control his ki" HIS own ki, not getting some magical dose of special "god ki" from nowhere without any explanation at all. It's all about making the best of what you already have. Your own energy. We are reminded of this fact several times during the series. Later we are reminded (twice) that Goku and Vegeta needed to raise their ki's only within their bodies, internally rather than externally, in "That Place" which was entirely filled with "God ki" it was the only way they could move, and Yes! The moment when Whis adviced them to raise their ki's only within their bodies and prevent it from leaking out into the atmosphere for others to sense, something remarkable happened! We got a glimpse of SSJ Blue's special "God ki".

Short version: SSJ Blue (and god ki as a whole) are about perfect ki control.

What does this mean? It means that SSJ Blue has nothing at all to do with Super Saiyan God and is thus completely independent on it. Afterall, Vegeta never achieved the Form.

I completely agree with everything you have pointed out on this thread. One of the "spoilers" mention something about Goku stating that"my body is throbbing" . If I remember correctly i believe he said something similar during the ritual. The only reason I bring it up is that it leads me to believe that this transformation is going to be somewhat spontaneous and not controlled. That is if the spoiler is correct.

Thanks. Yeah his body started to hurt during the SSJ God ritual as a side effect since he literally transformed his actual body into that of a God, not just his ki. His body became much leaner, seemingly taller and gained a darker skin tone. This is completely different from SSJ Blue, since that's literally just Super Saiyan Goku using God ki.

SSG: has god ki and a godly body
SSB: has god ki but a mortal body

Therein lies the difference, SSJ God is a True God and has been refered to as such several times, SSJ Blue has not. It's just a mortal using it's ki.

Now what i personally believe is going to happen in the tournament, is that Goku is somehow going to transform into a Super Saiyan while already in God form. The Super Saiyan Version of Super Saiyan God if you will (since SSJG is basically just Base Goku with God ki, not SSJ at all).

This would be the TRUE ascension of Super Saiyan God, to become a True Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan. SSJ Blue was basically a false version. A pseudo version.

[BlueBasilisk]

We know that anime Vegeta never did the ritual before he went to train with Whis and didn't come back to Earth until Frieza showed up. To me the scenes where he was training with Whis suggested that he got the same level of power of a Super Saiyan God but not necessarily the form. But at the same time it never explicitly confrimed he didn't and I think the writers left themselves some wiggle room when they had Goku tell Frieza that the explanation for Blue is more complicated than the one he gave.

A question for someone more familiar with the magna: Did Toyotaro give an explanation for Goku still having God during the U6 or Black arcs? I'm kinda rusty on the early chapters and don't want to get the details mixed up between versions. I didn't think manga Shenron said the form was temporary in the BoG manga but I was rereading it last night and he did.

If Toyo didn't then this arc could be a nice opportunity for some convergent storytelling and to clean up the lore surrounding both forms.

[Low Tone G]

Also, the fact that Vegeta never seemed to have achieved SSJ God and thus how he by-passed or "skipped" it proves that aswell. Remember how Whis told Vegeta that all he needed to do in order to surpass Goku (who had already achieved SSJ God during that time) was learning to "control his ki" HIS own ki, not getting some magical dose of special "god ki" from nowhere without any explanation at all. It's all about making the best of what you already have. Your own energy. We are reminded of this fact several times during the series. Later we are reminded (twice) that Goku and Vegeta needed to raise their ki's only within their bodies, internally rather than externally, in "That Place" which was entirely filled with "God ki" it was the only way they could move, and Yes! The moment when Whis adviced them to raise their ki's only within their bodies and prevent it from leaking out into the atmosphere for others to sense, something remarkable happened! We got a glimpse of SSJ Blue's special "God ki".

Short version: SSJ Blue (and god ki as a whole) are about perfect ki control.

What does this mean? It means that SSJ Blue has nothing at all to do with Super Saiyan God and is thus completely independent on it. Afterall, Vegeta never achieved the Form.

I completely agree with everything you have pointed out on this thread. One of the "spoilers" mention something about Goku stating that"my body is throbbing" . If I remember correctly i believe he said something similar during the ritual. The only reason I bring it up is that it leads me to believe that this transformation is going to be somewhat spontaneous and not controlled. That is if the spoiler is correct.

Thanks. Yeah his body started to hurt during the SSJ God ritual as a side effect since he literally transformed his actual body into that of a God, not just his ki. His body became much leaner, seemingly taller and gained a darker skin tone. This is completely different from SSJ Blue, since that's literally just Super Saiyan Goku using God ki.

SSG: has god ki and a godly body
SSB: has god ki but a mortal body

Therein lies the difference, SSJ God is a True God and has been refered to as such several times, SSJ Blue has not. It's just a mortal using it's ki.

Now what i personally believe is going to happen in the tournament, is that Goku is somehow going to transform into a Super Saiyan while already in God form. The Super Saiyan Version of Super Saiyan God if you will (since SSJG is basically just Base Goku with God ki, not SSJ at all).

This would be the TRUE ascension of Super Saiyan God, to become a True Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan. SSJ Blue was basically a false version. A pseudo version.

Yes, that is. Goku is not a literal God in Blue only his Ki is.

[GodKaio-Ken]

Also, the fact that Vegeta never seemed to have achieved SSJ God and thus how he by-passed or "skipped" it proves that aswell. Remember how Whis told Vegeta that all he needed to do in order to surpass Goku (who had already achieved SSJ God during that time) was learning to "control his ki" HIS own ki, not getting some magical dose of special "god ki" from nowhere without any explanation at all. It's all about making the best of what you already have. Your own energy. We are reminded of this fact several times during the series. Later we are reminded (twice) that Goku and Vegeta needed to raise their ki's only within their bodies, internally rather than externally, in "That Place" which was entirely filled with "God ki" it was the only way they could move, and Yes! The moment when Whis adviced them to raise their ki's only within their bodies and prevent it from leaking out into the atmosphere for others to sense, something remarkable happened! We got a glimpse of SSJ Blue's special "God ki".

Short version: SSJ Blue (and god ki as a whole) are about perfect ki control.

What does this mean? It means that SSJ Blue has nothing at all to do with Super Saiyan God and is thus completely independent on it. Afterall, Vegeta never achieved the Form.

I know the manga and anime dont match 100% but Vegeta uses SSG in the manga. Its never been said he skipped SSG.

[PerhapsTheOtherOne]

I saw the exchange a few posts ago about Vegeta achieving or not achieving SSG on his own.

Well, a compromise with my own ideas, then!

So, in Whis's staff dimension, both of the Saiyans learn to use the method of perfect Ki control to tap into the power of SSG. Maybe Goku turns into a SSG because of this and is all "Neat, I can use this form without the ritual, now!", whilst Vegeta says "F**k that! I didn't need that form before, I don't need it now!" and then turns SS and becomes the first SSB instead.

Then, Goku could see this and be like "Wow, we can just use SS and become even stronger than SSG!" and turns SS like Vegeta to become a SSB, and Vegeta can be like "GODDAMMIT, KAKAROT, I WAS SUPPOSED TO SURPASS YOU, NOW WE'RE EQUAL AGAIN!".

Best of both worlds! Goku learns to transform into SSG at will, Vegeta doesn't, both decide to use SSB from now on, and both are capable of transforming into SSG again if they really want to.

[gofishus]

Also, the fact that Vegeta never seemed to have achieved SSJ God and thus how he by-passed or "skipped" it proves that aswell. Remember how Whis told Vegeta that all he needed to do in order to surpass Goku (who had already achieved SSJ God during that time) was learning to "control his ki" HIS own ki, not getting some magical dose of special "god ki" from nowhere without any explanation at all. It's all about making the best of what you already have. Your own energy. We are reminded of this fact several times during the series. Later we are reminded (twice) that Goku and Vegeta needed to raise their ki's only within their bodies, internally rather than externally, in "That Place" which was entirely filled with "God ki" it was the only way they could move, and Yes! The moment when Whis adviced them to raise their ki's only within their bodies and prevent it from leaking out into the atmosphere for others to sense, something remarkable happened! We got a glimpse of SSJ Blue's special "God ki".

Short version: SSJ Blue (and god ki as a whole) are about perfect ki control.

What does this mean? It means that SSJ Blue has nothing at all to do with Super Saiyan God and is thus completely independent on it. Afterall, Vegeta never achieved the Form.

I completely agree with everything you have pointed out on this thread. One of the "spoilers" mention something about Goku stating that"my body is throbbing" . If I remember correctly i believe he said something similar during the ritual. The only reason I bring it up is that it leads me to believe that this transformation is going to be somewhat spontaneous and not controlled. That is if the spoiler is correct.

Thanks. Yeah his body started to hurt during the SSJ God ritual as a side effect since he literally transformed his actual body into that of a God, not just his ki. His body became much leaner, seemingly taller and gained a darker skin tone. This is completely different from SSJ Blue, since that's literally just Super Saiyan Goku using God ki.

SSG: has god ki and a godly body
SSB: has god ki but a mortal body

Therein lies the difference, SSJ God is a True God and has been refered to as such several times, SSJ Blue has not. It's just a mortal using it's ki.

Now what i personally believe is going to happen in the tournament, is that Goku is somehow going to transform into a Super Saiyan while already in God form. The Super Saiyan Version of Super Saiyan God if you will (since SSJG is basically just Base Goku with God ki, not SSJ at all).

This would be the TRUE ascension of Super Saiyan God, to become a True Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan. SSJ Blue was basically a false version. A pseudo version.

I dont know this begs the question of why didnt Goku use SSG in the anime before and not until now?? And this also implies that SSG is more powerful than SSJ Blue by calling Blue a 'false' god. This doesn't make any sense. If SSG was more powerful why wouldn't Goku have used it in the U6 tournament or against Zamasu? I assume there must be some tradeoffs with the form and I also assume Goku can transform into the form by will and doesn't have to do the ritual again judging from NEP...

[Lord Beerus]

No, it can also mean that Goku was referring to the Blue as Vegeta has also become a God on his own via Blue... Maybe, Goku didn't want to make a difference between the Blue and the Red, as both posssess God Ki.

No, that's not really the case.

Roshi questions, in amazement, that Vegeta obtained the power of Super Saiyan God, given how Goku previously explained the mechanics of how he attained Super Saiyan Blue when he transformed into the form in front of Freeza. Goku then specifically states that Vegeta obtained the power of Super Saiyan God on his own. Unlike Goku himself who had to borrow the power of other Saiyans to obtain the form (The Super Saiyan God ritual). This pretty much spells out to us that Vegeta brute forced his way to becoming a Super Saiyan God while he was training with Whis and Goku. Remember, Vegeta got a 6 month head-start when it came to training with Whis and when Goku meets up with Vegeta on Beerus' Planet with Whis, Goku is impressed with how much stronger Vegeta has grown since he last saw him, saying Vegeta might even be stronger than him now.

That doesn't mean that Vegeta has become Red at some point, wasted his form and entered Saiyan beyond God training with Whis...

For me, it's more simply to guess that Vegeta trained himself to the level of Goku when fought Beerus and absorbed the God nature within himself and made his own normal Ki.

Let's check it out:
1. Whis stated Goku and Vegeta reached a power level when they are able to sense the Ki of a God.
2. Mortals such as Hit and Freeza are able to sense it too and they don't possess God Ki.
3. Vegeta never displayed the Red form only in the manga.
4. Both Goku and Vegeta attained Blue after their training in Whis' staff, where they sensed the God Ki's pressure.
5. Goku(and Vegeta) treats Blue as a God form calling it Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan.

It's not enough for Vegeta to be as strong as Goku when Goku fought Beerus. He needs the raw power of Super Saiyan God to become Super Saiyan Blue, and the power of Super Saiyan God innately has God ki. Goku himself states that. Otherwise when Goku arrived on Beerus' planet to train with Vegeta, Vegeta would have already become a Super Saiyan Blue by that point, but he hadn't.

We also don't know exactly when Goku and Vegeta attained Super Saiyan Blue. Whis training is quite vague. What we know is that Goku and Vegeta were exposed to the atmosphere of God ki itself in Whis staff. Although, whether it lead to them attaining Super Saiyan Blue in that scenario is unclear. Especially since Goku already absorbed the power of Super Saiyan God when fought Beerus and had God ki within him from the get-go of training with Whis. For all we know, Vegeta being exposed to God ki in the scenerio lead to him attaining Super Saiyan God while he was in Whis' staff. I mean, Goku and Vegeta were in Whis' staff for quite a while.

And for the record, Goku and Vegeta don't call the new form "Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan". At least in the anime. Vegeta formally calls in Super Saiyan Blue when he transforms into it in front of Cabba in the Universe 6/7 Tournament.

[GodVegetto91]

Also, the fact that Vegeta never seemed to have achieved SSJ God and thus how he by-passed or "skipped" it proves that aswell. Remember how Whis told Vegeta that all he needed to do in order to surpass Goku (who had already achieved SSJ God during that time) was learning to "control his ki" HIS own ki, not getting some magical dose of special "god ki" from nowhere without any explanation at all. It's all about making the best of what you already have. Your own energy. We are reminded of this fact several times during the series. Later we are reminded (twice) that Goku and Vegeta needed to raise their ki's only within their bodies, internally rather than externally, in "That Place" which was entirely filled with "God ki" it was the only way they could move, and Yes! The moment when Whis adviced them to raise their ki's only within their bodies and prevent it from leaking out into the atmosphere for others to sense, something remarkable happened! We got a glimpse of SSJ Blue's special "God ki".

Short version: SSJ Blue (and god ki as a whole) are about perfect ki control.

What does this mean? It means that SSJ Blue has nothing at all to do with Super Saiyan God and is thus completely independent on it. Afterall, Vegeta never achieved the Form.

I know the manga and anime dont match 100% but Vegeta uses SSG in the manga. Its never been said he skipped SSG.

This argument doesn't work here. It's never been implied or even hinted that Vegeta achieved the actual SSJ God Form, all we know is that he was learning to control his ki so that it doesn't leak after having raised it, and boom, he turns Super Saiyan and voila, SSJ Blue was born. There are two different methods towards gaining God ki, and that is the Super Saiyan God ritual, or learning to control your ki to that of a divine level so it turns Blue. It's up to you to prove that Vegeta DID achieve SSJ God, not the other way around.

Instead of doing the SSJ God ritual and stealing the energy of 5 other saiyans, Vegeta got super-special training from the ultimate Grand Master, Whis, for 6 whole months! There was no need for the ritual, plus there weren't any saiyans around on Beerus' planet. It's extremely safe to say Vegeta didn't achieve SSJ God. That's not to say he won't in the future ofcourse!

[PerhapsTheOtherOne]

A different idea I also had was the reason Goku can use SSG now being because he actually did the ritual and became one the old-fashioned way. Thus, the crimson radiance of SSG still burns within him, allowing him to make use of that power at will. Only, instead of it being in his regular forms or in SSB, it can be used to transform into SSG itself once again.

With Vegeta, it took him months of training under Whis to get to Goku's level after he had become a SSG, and a lot more indeterminate time in Whis's staff dimension to become a SSB.

Of course, I still prefer my original conclusion, that Goku AND Vegeta can transform into SSG if they want thanks to Whis's tutelage, but Vegeta didn't/doesn't because he was the one that came up with SSB in the first place and resents the form for taking Goku to new heights he never thought possible and making the catch-up game extremely daunting.

[GodKaio-Ken]

Also, the fact that Vegeta never seemed to have achieved SSJ God and thus how he by-passed or "skipped" it proves that aswell. Remember how Whis told Vegeta that all he needed to do in order to surpass Goku (who had already achieved SSJ God during that time) was learning to "control his ki" HIS own ki, not getting some magical dose of special "god ki" from nowhere without any explanation at all. It's all about making the best of what you already have. Your own energy. We are reminded of this fact several times during the series. Later we are reminded (twice) that Goku and Vegeta needed to raise their ki's only within their bodies, internally rather than externally, in "That Place" which was entirely filled with "God ki" it was the only way they could move, and Yes! The moment when Whis adviced them to raise their ki's only within their bodies and prevent it from leaking out into the atmosphere for others to sense, something remarkable happened! We got a glimpse of SSJ Blue's special "God ki".

Short version: SSJ Blue (and god ki as a whole) are about perfect ki control.

What does this mean? It means that SSJ Blue has nothing at all to do with Super Saiyan God and is thus completely independent on it. Afterall, Vegeta never achieved the Form.

I know the manga and anime dont match 100% but Vegeta uses SSG in the manga. Its never been said he skipped SSG.

This argument doesn't work here. It's never been implied or even hinted that Vegeta achieved the actual SSJ God Form, all we know is that he was learning to control his ki so that it doesn't leak after having raised it, and boom, he turns Super Saiyan and voila, SSJ Blue was born. There are two different methods towards gaining God ki, and that is the Super Saiyan God ritual, or learning to control your ki to that of a divine level so it turns Blue. It's up to you to prove that Vegeta DID achieve SSJ God, not the other way around.

Instead of doing the SSJ God ritual and stealing the energy of 5 other saiyans, Vegeta got super-special training from the ultimate Grand Master, Whis, for 6 whole months! There was no need for the ritual, plus there weren't any saiyans around on Beerus' planet. It's extremely safe to say Vegeta didn't achieve SSJ God. That's not to say he won't in the future ofcourse!

How does that argument not work? Youre using your own head canon to disregard fact. I cant argue with that, its head canon.

I'm simply saying it cant be assumed he can or cant. Its never been implied either way.