Why was goku bothered to use kaioken x10 against hit ?

[ssbgoku]

Hello guys , I know question can be little confusing but based on current showdown of our heroes in compare to GOD and higher beings I believe currently goku would be made to use kaioken x2 against hit so it could make more sense in-universe. Logically goku should used kaioken x3 against Merged Zamasu at the most, possible x4 just once. Only in current arc Tournament of power goku should be capable of using kaioken times 5 at the most without being too much damaged. I would like to know reasons for in-universe and out-universe logics for why it happened as in title.

1) In akira's barebone outline it was mentioned that hit was supposed to be close to ten times stronger then u6 ssb goku/vegeta. It could be combined with fact that Toei was still going by ss goku being close to bog ssg goku, in opposite to Toyatoro. Either that or Toei just wanted to go with progress of characters getting stronger instead of trying to scale hit in compare to other characters as Toyatoro smartly made vegeta being only able to use 10% of ssb power.

2) Toei just went ape shit to increase Merchandise and hype of show.

also along with ssg being brought back to anime with next episode, it is very possibly that anime will try to follow manga or rather Toyatoro's overseeing plot of future arc. Possible already retcons in DBS:

[*] Goku has never absorbed any close power to ssg in either base or ssj. I don't mean that he hasn't gotten any stronger since that as he definietly did(probably suprassed buu arc ssj goku/vegeta in base by rof)
[*] First Form Freeza being weaker then rof ssj gohan , also ssj gotenks(if he didn't get any weaker in super)
[*] Gotenks keeping getting weaker by flow's of time in super.
[*] Final form freeza could be ssj2 tier or even ssj3 by current standards
[*] Buu arc Ultimate gohan was most likely around current ssj goku
[*] Hit is supposed to be ssb kaioken x2 by u6 arc.
[*] Ssj2 trunks was compared to cell arc ssj2 kid gohan
[*] Toppo is supposed to be ssb kkx2 of current goku

Let me know , Discuss PS. Current ssb kkx10 kaioken is above beerus

[Basako]

It was excessive for a tournament without fatal consecuences. It wasn't very smart to endanger his life that much, he could have used the x2. Also, SSB was already great, ten times that had to be even greater than Beerus.

[ssbgoku]

It was excessive for a tournament without fatal consecuences. It wasn't very smart to endanger his life that much, he could have used the x2. Also, SSB was already great, ten times that had to be even greater than Beerus.

Yeah I definietly agree with that . Exactly not even pointing out that goku shouldn't even be able to use more x4 as even only at the first use he was only able to use x2, x3 with pain and only x4 with it being too much. For me the moment of obtaining divine ki would seemilingly reset kaioken use so goku need to relearn how to stack kaioken over it, feeling effects of lower multiplier of it.

Exacly at the most I see Current beerus being current ssb kkx3 goku tier by raw power, possibly with techniques and experience giving him chance to kkx5.

[ekrolo2]

Because Super Goku won't take something seriously to when he needs to but in a pointless tournament? He'll use a nuke to swat a fly. I mean, beating Hit is REALLY important guys! Black's neck is gonna totally snap itself!

And no, don't tell me Black would just learn KK, if Goku used it and then rammed his fist through Black's chest, he'd fucking die no questions asked.

[Lord Beerus]

Because Goku really wanted to win the match and was looking to see how hard he could push himself to his limits. Even though there could be serious consequences with combining Super Saiyan Blue and Kaioken at tenfold and it was a match of no real stakes.

[ssbgoku]

Because Goku really wanted to win the match and was looking to see how hard he could push himself to his limits. Even though there could be serious consequences with combining Super Saiyan Blue and Kaioken at tenfold and it was a match of no real stakes.

Sure I could understand goku's own motivation but I mean out universe logic + How could he already going overkill and risk dying when he barerly managed to learn how to use it along with ssb... it doesn't just make sense and broke power scaling, so what was the point of it , besides being visually appealing + pure worthless hype ?

Not even mentioning goku shouldn't be able to go past x3 at first try with divine ki...

[Lord Beerus]

Because Goku really wanted to win the match and was looking to see how hard he could push himself to his limits. Even though there could be serious consequences with combining Super Saiyan Blue and Kaioken at tenfold and it was a match of no real stakes.

Sure I could understand goku's own motivation but I mean out universe logic + How could he already going overkill and risk dying when he barerly managed to learn how to use it along with ssb... it doesn't just make sense and broke power scaling, so what was the point of it , besides being visually appealing + pure worthless hype ?

Not even mentioning goku shouldn't be able to go past x3 at first try with divine ki...

Considering Goku mastered using the Kaioken back in the Freeza arc. To the point where he could use it constantly and could even crank its multiplier in strength up to twenty. I don't see why he can't apply Kaioken to a form that is less strenuous (Super Saiyan Blue) than the original Super Saiyan form is.

[KuririnNoKotoKa]

Goku used Kaioken x10 because Toriyama's outline had him become x10 stronger than Vegeta. The manga got around by insanely convoluted rules with Blue's transformation and the anime just made Hit overwhelmingly more powerful.

However, since Goku was far above Hit so the desire to fight him again makes no sense in the manga. Classic case of trying to make sense of thematically appropriate nonsense actually breaking the story in half really.

[LowRyder2005]

Goku used Kaioken x10 because Toriyama's outline had him become x10 stronger than Vegeta. The manga got around by insanely convoluted rules with Blue's transformation and the anime just made Hit overwhelmingly more powerful.

However, since Goku was far above Hit so the desire to fight him again makes no sense in the manga. Classic case of trying to make sense of thematically appropriate nonsense actually breaking the story in half really.

That might only be partly true, for all we know; Toriyama's outline could also have had "Vegeta fighting at 10% the power of Goku" without establishing any reason.
Hit's power in the manga was ultimately revelead to be on par with the Super Saiyan God, so even if Goku's instincts told him he had a potentially fearsome opponent in front of him they weren't exactly wrong.

[Marlowe89]

The simplest explanation is that Goku was relying on Kaioken's speed boost first and foremost; multiple Super Saiyan Blues combined could probably "move even faster than time" or something ridiculous like that.

The basic point was to overcome Hit's Time-Skip, which has none of the weaknesses it was established to have in the manga (can still work against stronger opponents) and additional advantages exclusive to the anime (the duration can be extended). It's just an absurdly overpowered technique that required an equally absurdly overpowered counter to properly circumvent.

[ssbgoku]

Goku used Kaioken x10 because Toriyama's outline had him become x10 stronger than Vegeta. The manga got around by insanely convoluted rules with Blue's transformation and the anime just made Hit overwhelmingly more powerful.

However, since Goku was far above Hit so the desire to fight him again makes no sense in the manga. Classic case of trying to make sense of thematically appropriate nonsense actually breaking the story in half really.

That might only be partly true, for all we know; Toriyama's outline could also have had "Vegeta fighting at 10% the power of Goku" without establishing any reason.
Hit's power in the manga was ultimately revelead to be on par with the Super Saiyan God, so even if Goku's instincts told him he had a potentially fearsome opponent in front of him they weren't exactly wrong.

Yeah I also think that it could be Toryiama's outline mentioning Vegeta being only 10% against hit or being condition where goku was ten times stronger. Yeah I think so.

The simplest explanation is that Goku was relying on Kaioken's speed boost first and foremost; multiple Super Saiyan Blues combined could probably "move even faster than time" or something ridiculous like that.

The basic point was to overcome Hit's Time-Skip, which has none of the weaknesses it was established to have in the manga (can still work against stronger opponents) and additional advantages exclusive to the anime (the duration can be extended). It's just an absurdly overpowered technique that required an equally absurdly overpowered counter to properly circumvent.

Yeah it could be good way to see it ;p., but then what was the point of using kaioken if only speed was suppossed to be issue. Why did they decide to ignore strength and energy boost with Kaioken for only speed advantage

[KuririnNoKotoKa]

Goku used Kaioken x10 because Toriyama's outline had him become x10 stronger than Vegeta. The manga got around by insanely convoluted rules with Blue's transformation and the anime just made Hit overwhelmingly more powerful.

However, since Goku was far above Hit so the desire to fight him again makes no sense in the manga. Classic case of trying to make sense of thematically appropriate nonsense actually breaking the story in half really.

That might only be partly true, for all we know; Toriyama's outline could also have had "Vegeta fighting at 10% the power of Goku" without establishing any reason.
Hit's power in the manga was ultimately revelead to be on par with the Super Saiyan God, so even if Goku's instincts told him he had a potentially fearsome opponent in front of him they weren't exactly wrong.

Vegeta fighting at 10% of Goku's power is exactly the same thing as Goku being 10x more powerful than Vegeta when divorced from any real story context, making the argument fall into pedantry.

The reason the fight doesn't work in the manga is because Hit at his absolute max could at best hang with Super Saiyan God Goku. Blue Goku completely trashed him in one blow. There is nothing at all to support that Goku would be excited to fight Hit again in the manga simply because he is already far above him to begin with. That's how Goku's character works. He wanted to fight Vegeta again after the Saiyan arc because he couldn't beat him by himself, however once he realized he was above Vegeta by Namek, there was no real interest in going back to that anymore.

Toyotaro's version of the U6 arc requires us to ignore some of the most basic traits of Goku's character in order to work force the story to kinda sorta work and it still ends up not really saying or showing anything to us at all, besides the lore dumps.

[TheMikado]

Short answer, the production of Super was rushed and poorly done, the outline is thin and the freelance writers generates inconsistencies even between episodes and the fandom deserves better.

[MaskedRider]

Speed boost if the fight Hit had against Dyspo means anything. Of course that brings the question "Why didn't he just transform into God for the speed?" and that is valid though honestly I see using both the Kaio Ken in the anime and SSJG in the manga as being okay because KK would also amplify Goku's power/strength that he already has in Blue giving him the speed he needs so its like a win-win despite it being dangerous but this is Goku we're talking about.