Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

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Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by Herms » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:15 pm

NOTE: Please be sure to have watched the episode with any necessary subtitles (see: Crunchyroll / Daisuki / FUNimation) before discussing. Otherwise, why bother?

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General Discussion for Dragon Ball Super episode 104, aired 20 August 2017

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超絶光速バトル勃発!悟空とヒットの共同戦線!!
Chōzetsu Kōsoku Batoru Boppatsu! Gokū to Hitto no Kyōdō Sensen!!
A Faster-Than-Light Battle Begins! Goku and Hit's Joint Front!!


Summary:
The Pride Trooper Dyspo introduces himself to Hit, declaring that he’s come to beat Hit’s Time Skip for the sake of his universe. On the side-lines, Caulifla reassures Kale that there’s no need for them to help Hit out; he’s sure to beat the tar out of his opponent. Yet when they square off, Dyspo manages to land a solid blow to Hit’s face. Champa freaks out, but writes it off as a fluke. He notices that Dyspo resembles Beerus, but objects when Vados points out this means Champa looks like him too, claiming that his face is far more “fashionable” than theirs.

Dyspo is impressed that Hit has still managed to keep his cool after that first attack, but Hit’s confidence displeases him. They go at it again, and Dyspo lands a second attack. Champa is now panicking over Dyspo’s speed, and asks Vados if she could see Dyspo’s attack. While Vados could, it was too fast for the two Omni-Kings, so the Great Priest helpfully explains how their godPads allow them to watch slowed-down replay footage of the match.

Observing the fight, Toppo brags that Dyspo is battle-hardened to the point that he’s now faster than sound and light. Baffled, to Hit it appears as if Dyspo is using Time Skip against him. But it doesn’t take him long to figure out the truth: Dyspo attacks at incredible speed immediately before he can use his Time Skip. In fact, Dyspo explains that he can momentarily move thousands of times faster than normal, although this still leaves unanswered how he knows exactly when Hit is about to use Time Skip.

For their next round, Hit doesn’t even try to guard against Dyspo’s attack, which lands the same as before. Now though, Hit has figured out that Dyspo is listening for the sound his muscles make as they tense up before he uses Time Skip. Champa figures they should make lots of noise to drown out the sound of Hit’s muscles, but Vados points out that Dyspo can probably pick out different frequencies to distinguish his target sound from any background noise.

Hit abandons trying to use Time Skip and engages Dyspo in hand-to-hand combat instead. While it looks like Hit’s getting pummeled, Toppo can tell that he’s actually adjusting to Dyspo’s speed and dodging to avoid any critical damage. This suggests Hit’s letting the attacks land on purpose, which may mean he’s plotting some sort of trap. Toppo therefore orders the Pride Trooper Kunshi to go help Dyspo out, while Jiren continues watching the fight in silence.

As Hit continues to be knocked around by Dyspo, he is at last pushed right up to the edge of the arena. Dyspo closes in for the finishing blow, but passes straight through Hit as if he were a hologram (the same dimension-hopping technique he used in his rematch with Goku), and ends up falling out of the arena himself. Just as it looks like Dyspo is finished, Kunshi steps in and saves him with his energy ropes (being made from his own energy, these don’t violate tournament rules against using weapons).

Dyspo and Kunshi now team up against Hit, but when it looks like he’s had it, Goku joins the fight…in Super Saiyan God form. Using this form means that Goku is faster than in his regular Super Saiyan form, but can still conserve his stamina better than with Super Saiyan Blue. While Hit objects that Dyspo is his prey, Goku is itching to fight someone so strong, and dares Hit to stop him. Goku goes off to fight Dyspo, while Hit is literally roped into fighting Kunshi.

Though Dyspo moves too fast for Goku to even have time to teleport, Goku soon figures out that he tends to move in a straight line. This means that as long as Goku times things right, he can counter Dyspo by temporarily transforming into Super Saiyan Blue to maximize his power and speed. Meanwhile, Kunshi covers the ground around himself with landmine-like energy ropes to prevent Hit from approaching, but Hit simply attacks Kunshi from afar using the same shockwave-like attack he used against Goku during their rematch.

When Goku and Dyspo’’s fight happens to bring them close to Hit and Kunshi, Hit insists that he and Goku trade partners. Going after Dyspo again, this time Hit manages to successfully attack him by first making the same noise as when he does Time Skip, then using another attack to catch him off-guard. For his part, Goku handles Kunshi by going Super Saiyan Blue and going right over all his landmine ropes, whose explosions fail to harm him. He counters Kunshi’s energy blasts and gets in close to mercilessly attack him.

Hit’s tactics continue to confuse Dyspo, who can now no longer tell if he’s about to use his Time Skip for real or is only pretending. Even this sort of momentary hesitation makes all the difference in so fast a battle. With Dyspo beaten to a pulp, Hit gives him the ultimatum of jumping out of the arena himself or being thrown out. Dyspo refuses to surrender, but Kunshi again saves him from a ring-out. He tells Dyspo to retreat and recover, and plans to cover Dyspo’s escape by taking Hit down with him. However, Hit doesn’t waste much time knocking Kunshi out of the arena.

Now Universe 11 is down to only three warriors, but with two of them being Toppo and Jiren, their Kaioshin isn’t too worried. Dyspo vows vengeance in the name of justice, but Toppo says that they should drop the hero act; here there is no good or evil, only survival. Hit decides to pay back Goku’s help by letting him go without fighting him. Goku is still determined to defeat Dyspo himself, and vows to finally settle the score with Hit if they both can survive to the end of the tournament.

35 minutes remain in the Tournament of Power.
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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by Noah » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:15 pm

Damn! This episode was good! Probably the best in the tournament yet!

- I wonder about Caulifla relationship with Hit, she seems to like/respect him and I think that's nice :)

- I lol'd at the 'vuvuzela' gag, did Champa watched the 2010 World Cup? :lol:

- All the fighting in this episode was good with nice display of techniques used by each fighter :thumbup:

- In my mind Hit didn't gave a damn about Goku in a form he "never" saw before, he was just concerned about him interrupting in the fight, but I don't know the scene was like Hit already saw Goku in SSJ God before :?

- And just as I thought no explanations why Goku was able to use the said form again, I get it that was for battle strategy, but no one addressed that how could he use this transformation again? :|

- They really want us to believe that only has passed 13 minutes of the tournament yet? They got to be kidding :lol:

- NEP indicates that Roshi will use Mafuba, can't say I'm not interested though, it could be good :)
Last edited by Noah on Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by Torturephile » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:16 pm

-Good fights with a bit of nice choreography during a few segments involving Hit and Dyspo, thought the first half of the episode felt very slow in terms of events, like usual. It felt like Z. I liked that they explained the mechanics of the characters (Dyspo and Hit) in this episode. Reused animation didn't bug me this time.
-I'm starting to think Dyspo looks more like a bunny than a cat like Beerus and Champa, and he has a punchable face in this episode. I'm glad that they referenced that he looks like Beerus and Champa. While I'm also glad another one of those Pride Troopers is out, Kunshi and Dyspo were fine here. Toppo deciding to get serious and dropping the justice thing for once was good.
-It makes me wonder why some thought that Hit would job hard when we know he can improve his time manipulation abilities. At least seeing those arguments saved me a trip to the store to buy salt.
-It is interesting that the Zen-Ohs couldn't see Dyspo's attacks despite ranking above Vados, yet she saw them. That will fuel to the theory that they aren't as strong as we're led to believe.
-Champa and Vados, like usual, provide for some humor that I enjoy.
-Has Toei/Sumitomo been adding more new tracks in the last few episodes? I like them quite a bit, specially the one playing when Hit punches Dyspo really hard and when Goku takes on Kunshi. Quite refreshing to hear from the overly-cheery ones back in the Battle of Gods saga, which I'm rewatching in the Latin American dub.
-Absolutely no one of Universe 7 asides from Goku appears in this episode. I don't mind.

A few memorable quotes:
-Beerus about Goku: "He saved Hit's bacon."
-Hit about Kunshi's technique: "You've dropped trash everywhere."
-Hit about to beat up Dyspo: "Use your ears and listen carefully."
-Hit grabbing Dyspo by the ear: "If you can't stand, I'll make you."
-Champa: "I've got a fashionable, cherubic face. Beerus and that guy [Dyspo] have outdated, hard-looking faces!"

Seems that Noah and I are usually the first ones to post.
From Super episode 113 thread:
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Torturephile wrote:
hunduel wrote:I liked this episode. I seriously don't know why people hate it.
namekiansaiyan wrote:I seriously don't see why some of you like this episode when nothing happened and was basically filler.
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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by sintzu » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:25 pm

This was easily one of the best episodes in the torunament.
Noah wrote:Hit didn't gave a damn about Goku in a form he "never" saw before, he was just concerned about him interrupting in the fight, but I don't know the scene was like Hit already saw Goku in SSJ God before :?

And just as I thought no explanations why Goku was able to use the said form again, I get it that was for battle strategy, but no one addressed that how could he use this transformation again? :|

They really want us to believe that only has passed 13 minutes of the tournament yet? They got to be kidding :lol:

NEP indicates that Roshi will use Mafuba, can't say I'm not interested though, it could be good :)
He saw it in the manga.

The writers probably think everyone reads the manga so what the hell, who cares if they're completely different formats that each follow their own set of rules. Now Vegeta might get it (some writer or producer said it on twitter) out of nowhere as well, never mind the fact they went out of their way to establish him not doing the ritual.

Remember Freeza's 5 minutes ?

If using it against Piccolo killed him then surely :crazy: it will here.
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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by TheShadowEmperor8055 » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:28 pm

Not surprised, it isn't explained how Goku can now use SSG again. That being said, kinda miffed how Goku ended up using Vegeta's strategy in the manga and how now he gets the credit for it lol.

That being said, wow, what an episode. It went by fast for me, and it was hella nice seeing focus on Hit again. :) But it seems Goku vs Hit is more like than Vegeta vs Hit like I wanted to see... oh well. I guess Vegeta vs all the U6 Saiyans and then maybe Toppo (or Dispo)?

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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by Boo Machine » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:29 pm

Damn Good episode. But not for the reason I thought it was going to be.

I come into the episode with "SSJ God Hype" and I leave with "Fuck SSJ God, HIT HYPE!"

Dyspo is a dangerous dude. But not because he has god like strength but rather because of his ability to read his opponents movements through sound and his ability to go lightning fast for an instant. It was enough to Give Hit a rough time. For a while...

Until Hit figures it out and makes a trap for Dyspo to fall out of the ring! Awesome!

Kushni is cooler than I thought he would be.

SSJ God goku coming in with an sweet ass entrance. However....

If SSJ God doesn't have a continued role to play in the tournament then this is a dumb way to bring it back and will feel like they're just reminding us that the form exists. Goku uses the speed to keep up with Dyspo. Cool, and he uses the "Switch out" method Vegeta used in the manga, but he only does it once, and he misses. We didn't even get to see that strategy in action so I really hope he gets a chance to do it agian, otherwise it's just a massive waste. Though Goku did point out a flaw in Dyspos Speed attack so that was cool.

But back to Hit, using his Heart stopper attack as a counter to Kushnies String bomb land mine. Awesome.

And that music when Hit takes on Dyspo again. My god! It's so epic. And Hit figuring out a way to get around Dyspos advantages and takes back control. Super cool.

You know what was bad ass and also really hilarious in a dumb way? Goku fucking Leroy Jenkinsing Kushni's String mines.

HIt: Watch out Goku! He can-

Goku: Don't care! RAAAAGGGHHHH!!!

*Explosions*

Like I said, it was bad ass so I don't really care, but my god.

Kushini sacrificing himself to give Dyspo a chance to run and try to take Hit with him. Sweet. In vain, but sweet.

Oh shit, Toppo... "Time to stop playing hero. There is no justice or evil. Only survival". Wow. When he and Jiren finally decide it's time to do something they are going to be monsters. Can't wait.

Episode wasn't super crazy on animation, but it was fine. I noticed they reused a beat down from episode 38. Kind of iffy on that but whatever.

Not super excited for next week. Just kind of meh about it. So I guess we will see.
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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by MajinMan » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:31 pm

Other than the terrible Fifa flashback from many years ago, this was a really good episode. Good fights, fantastic music, and a very interesting concept in Dyspo. Back to the music, it was just so good. They used the "Saiyan trailer" song for the first time, and introduced I believe two more new tracks. This makes me wonder why they insist on using the dull Buu Kai OST so much. The Universe Survival arc OST is the best that Sumitomo has ever come up with for Dragon Ball.

I do have one problem, though. And it's the whole switching between SSG and SSB. I don't care for this concept, and it doesn't really make much sense. Why didn't he do this with SS2 and SS3 since the latter was draining? It's a very cool idea, but it makes Goku look like an idiot if he could have done this all the time. It also accomplished literally nothing. He switched to SSB, swung at Dyspo, missed, and switched back. That's literally it. Oh well, it was nice to see SSG back at least.
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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by sintzu » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:35 pm

TheShadowEmperor8055 wrote:Kinda miffed how Goku ended up using Vegeta's strategy in the manga and how now he gets the credit for it lol.
Are you really that surprised ? Ever since this arc started Goku has been forced into everything so this is just the logical next step.

Thank god for the manga.
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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by TheShadowEmperor8055 » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:37 pm

sintzu wrote:
TheShadowEmperor8055 wrote:Kinda miffed how Goku ended up using Vegeta's strategy in the manga and how now he gets the credit for it lol.
Are you really that surprised ? Ever since this arc started Goku has been forced into everything so this is just the logical next step.

Thank god for the manga.
Not "surprised" at all, just "kinda miffed" like I said... it's really not a big deal.

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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by Torturephile » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:41 pm

sintzu wrote:
TheShadowEmperor8055 wrote:Kinda miffed how Goku ended up using Vegeta's strategy in the manga and how now he gets the credit for it lol.
Are you really that surprised ? Ever since this arc started Goku has been forced into everything so this is just the logical next step.

Thank god for the manga.
Who thought that the Goku & Vegeta Show is slowly turning back on to the Goku Show lately.
From Super episode 113 thread:
MaskedRider wrote:
Torturephile wrote:
hunduel wrote:I liked this episode. I seriously don't know why people hate it.
namekiansaiyan wrote:I seriously don't see why some of you like this episode when nothing happened and was basically filler.
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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by sintzu » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:43 pm

TheShadowEmperor8055 wrote:It's really not a big deal.
It is for me cause Goku in the anime already has sooooo much going for him, he's been in nearly every fight in the tournament, he recruted everyone to name a few things and will get a new form in the next few episodes so did they really have to take that away from Vegeta ? it's not enough to give Goku everything new, they have to take old things from others and give them to him too ?
Torturephile wrote:Who thought that the Goku & Vegeta Show is slowly turning back on to the Goku Show lately.
Like I said, thank god for the manga. Goku has been forced into everything in this arc while the manga starts out with Vegeta training with Whis then fighting Beerus. If that's anything to go by then the manga is safe from that.
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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by Marlowe89 » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:43 pm

Absolutely one of the better episodes in the tournament by far. We're quickly and immediately introduced to Dyspo and his unique traits without any other distractions interfering with the pacing, there's some appropriate build-up to a good climax with a satisfying pay-off, some nice callbacks and character dynamics, and everyone's strategies are implemented rather well as a whole.

Most importantly, this episode actually didn't suffer from "mediocre first half" syndrome for once.

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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by incarnati0n » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:45 pm

The episode was enjoyable. Honestly Hit was as great as ever and it's always great to know what the fighters are thinking strategically instead of just putting more power and crap like that.
Champa once more was great as well, he is by far at his best when things don't go his way.
Art was solid throughout the episode which is always a plus.

Now onto the bad, no explanation whatsoever to how Goku can suddenly use SSG again. The explanation that he could always use it but just didn't want to doesn't make much sense, especially with all the holding back crap we had to endure during the recruiting arc.
Goku was also the only member from U7 that we saw this episode, we didn't even get to see Krillin in the sidelines during the time Beerus was talking, almost as if they forgot he already got eliminated.

Next week looks like it will be a solid episode. Hopefully Roshi will show the real fruits of his training and he won't get disqualified for taking a jar with him.
Also is the break going to be after next week or the week after?

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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by TheShadowEmperor8055 » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:47 pm

sintzu wrote:
TheShadowEmperor8055 wrote:It's really not a big deal.
It is for me cause Goku in the anime already has sooooo much going for him, he's been in nearly every fight in the tournament, he recruted everyone to name a few things and will get a new form in the next few episodes so did they really have to take that away from Vegeta ? it's not enough to give Goku everything new, they have to take old things from others and give them to him too ?
Lol, I was referring to me being "kinda miffed". Not as big a deal as being "surprised" would entail.

And yeah, I pretty much agree there. Wondering what big moves are in store for Vegeta in this tournament...

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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by Yomi » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:50 pm

I enjoyed the fact that the fights weren't one dimensional this time. This episode could have been very different (shitty) under a different writer.

There are moments in this fight that I really love, and I'd have to say that this is my favorite fight of this arc so far. It gives justice to blitzers
the likes of which Burter never did. (Well Burter caught a Dragon Ball... so I guess that's something.)

I don't mind Goku's goofy disposition in this show, but I really liked that he wasn't like that this time and pointed out the flaws in Dyspo's techniques pretty early on.

I've seen a lot of people questioning Caulifla's motives and why she wants to help hit. It's not out of character, she's been shown fangirling over the two people she's had negative/disrespectful interactions with.
[spoiler]Image
Image[/spoiler]
She's not a hard disinterested punk that everyone seems to make her out to be.

SSG coming back was a complete waste of everyone's time. So Goku has had this form in his back pocket and never thought to use the light switch fighting style in all of the life threatening situations he's been in so far?

Bringing back an old form from 100 episodes ago seems pretty foolish, considering you want to release another new form in this same arc.

Are we really going to let Universe 6 and 7 keep racking up eliminations? It's becoming quite apparent that nobody is going to have a fight unless it is with a member of universe 6 and 7. Can we please get a long fight between two other fighters from other universes (Like Ganos vs Ribrianne for example?) It would make the series less redundant.
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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by sintzu » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:52 pm

TheShadowEmperor8055 wrote:Wondering what big moves are in store for Vegeta in this tournament...
He's already getting things in the manga so you can be sure to see him with other things in the tournament. If the anime is taking things from him to prep Goku up then chances are he won't get anything new.
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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by avasatu » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:54 pm

Loved it. Some of the commentary was quite useful, too. I also now feel much more liberated applying some of the manga power scaling of Goku's forms to the anime, since it's evident that the anime is behind the manga conceptually, and trying to catch up.

Great choices and placement of music. Good animation. Hit vs. Dyspo, along with much of the dialogue therein, was great all the way through. Goku's entrance was awesome. Hit eliminating Kunshi was well done. Toppo going into serious mode is great, and matches with a prognostication I had months ago. U11 is going to start fodderizing people.

Would have liked a moment acknowledging U10, but I don't mind too much that they chose to forego it. I have very few complaints about the episode as far as its specific contents were concerned. Dyspo's past performance was a little weird, but maybe that monster was just strong. Kunshi's power scaling is a little weird, but probably fine. I'm not sure how I feel about Champa having a hard time tracking Dyspo, regardless of the in-universe DB speed of light. He should be leagues above Dyspo in speed.

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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by KuririnNoKotoKa » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:57 pm

TheShadowEmperor8055 wrote:Not surprised, it isn't explained how Goku can now use SSG again. That being said, kinda miffed how Goku ended up using Vegeta's strategy in the manga and how now he gets the credit for it lol.

That being said, wow, what an episode. It went by fast for me, and it was hella nice seeing focus on Hit again. :) But it seems Goku vs Hit is more like than Vegeta vs Hit like I wanted to see... oh well. I guess Vegeta vs all the U6 Saiyans and then maybe Toppo (or Dispo)?
It was his idea to begin with in the manga as well. Goku pointed out to Trunks that Vegeta took it from his fight with Hit.

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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by Boo Machine » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:58 pm

Yomi wrote: Are we really going to let Universe 6 and 7 keep racking up eliminations? It's becoming quite apparent that nobody is going to have a fight unless it is with a member of universe 6 and 7. Can we please get a long fight between two other fighters from other universes (Like Ganos vs Ribrianne for example?) It would make the series less redundant.
To be fair, I'm trying to imagine a fight between Ganos and Ribrianne, and I just can't bring myself to care. We don't know them nearly as much so if they went at it I wouldn't even know who to root for. I liked the fight this episode because I like and know Hit. Maybe if we had sometimes to get to know them before hand. But I guess this complaint kind of lines up with those who say the tournament shouldn't have happened yet.
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Re: Super Episode 104 (20 August 2017)

Post by Bullza » Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:00 am

That was a fantastic episode so it's always nice when an episode delivers after being hyped up so much.

I would say that it was in the Top 5 best episodes of the series so far.

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