Complete BT3 Info and Discussion Thread [UPDATED 10/02/07]

[Silvor]

About this whole can Dragon Ball characters fly or not thing.
I see no evidence of Chichi not being able to fly in the video.
The cpu is probably just changing her altitude/height in the air.
Hovever I really hope she actually can't fly.
I had no problem with the way it worked in bt2.
EDIT
After having checked that video in hd it does in fact seem like Chichi is descending while she is charging up. Sorry for not inspecting it closely enough before my post.

[Victator Supreme]

Different play style? Oh, you mean spamming his rush attacks? Yeah, that's reeeeal fun.

Better to make him like every other fighter. Because god knows, there aren' fifty characters who can fly perfectly. I was able to beat 18 while only using my rush move once. I guess they had to change the game for the more shitty players.

[baragon_kun]

About this whole can Dragon Ball characters fly or not thing.
I see no evidence of Chichi not being able to fly in the video.
The cpu is probably just changing her altitude/height in the air.
Hovever I really hope she actually can't fly.
I had no problem with the way it worked in bt2.
EDIT
After having checked that video in hd it does in fact seem like Chichi is descending while she is charging up. Sorry for not inspecting it closely enough before my post.

Nope, She Can Fly in the game, Dont you watch the beginning of the video when she Dash to Akkuman????

[mckeg]

Bang on, someone said before 18 vs satan was a hard fight, well it wasnt if you used him appropriately. His rush blast2 + trap blast2 made it pretty easy once you adapted to his different play style.

Different play style? Oh, you mean spamming his rush attacks? Yeah, that's reeeeal fun.

lol, I know what you mean but no. I did use the trap blast2 a lot to counter her rush attacks and if i was getting hammered on, but i dont spam rushes in matches. Everyone can agree that spaming rushes looks and makes matches boring as hell.

Since we are on the topic of spaming rushes, who else hates fighting videl the cheap arse?

[Adey]

About this whole can Dragon Ball characters fly or not thing.
I see no evidence of Chichi not being able to fly in the video.
The cpu is probably just changing her altitude/height in the air.
Hovever I really hope she actually can't fly.
I had no problem with the way it worked in bt2.
EDIT
After having checked that video in hd it does in fact seem like Chichi is descending while she is charging up. Sorry for not inspecting it closely enough before my post.

Nope, She Can Fly in the game, Dont you watch the beginning of the video when she Dash to Akkuman????

Characters can Dash and Dragon dash even if they can't fly

[Xyex]

While we wait for the game's release, we can play "find the character" with this.

Does anyone have a non .png version of that image (ie, a file format with a lower file size)? 'Cause that takes WAY too long to download on my connection. :\

Had to resize it cause of Photobucket's resolution limitations.

Why is Seripa on the heroes side of that poster? I'd even argue and say that Bardock shouldn't be there either.

Bardock's probably there cause he tried to take on Freeza and is Goku's father and no one really wants to think of him as a bad guy. And Seripa's probably there just cause she's from Bardock's team.

Better to make him like every other fighter. Because god knows, there aren' fifty characters who can fly perfectly. I was able to beat 18 while only using my rush move once. I guess they had to change the game for the more shitty players.

Well, considering that the game is heavily geared toward flight, to the point that lack of ability to remain in the air or properly ascend, or even power up in the air, makes a character utterly worthless... no, they changed it because it was a broken game mechanic that had just been tacked on without any thought as to the consequences.

Assuming what we see with Kid Chi-Chi applies to all the non-fliers then I love what Spike's done here. They've found themselves a nice middle ground where you don't fall like a rock (which no one in the series ever did anyway, for those of you complaining about being more true to the series), you can power up in the air, etc.

Nope, She Can Fly in the game, Dont you watch the beginning of the video when she Dash to Akkuman????

That's not what we're talking about. We're talking about when they aren't moving or doing anything. In BT2 they had the Flail and Fall™ where they would swing their arms wildly (or in Goku's case, spin his tail wildly) and then suddenly flip onto their back and drop like a rock. Here it's just a gentle sinking.

lol, I know what you mean but no. I did use the trap blast2 a lot to counter her rush attacks and if i was getting hammered on, but i dont spam rushes in matches. Everyone can agree that spaming rushes looks and makes matches boring as hell.

I much prefer use of his trap move over the actual rush myself. Faster animation so it's not quite as annoying when you need to use it four or five times in a fight. But by all rights, in a video game, you shouldn't have to resort to cheap tactics in order to work around bad game mechanics.

[Victator Supreme]

Well, considering that the game is heavily geared toward flight, to the point that lack of ability to remain in the air or properly ascend, or even power up in the air, makes a character utterly worthless... no, they changed it because it was a broken game mechanic that had just been tacked on without any thought as to the consequences.

It was not broken, it was put in intentionally. If you are actually good at the game, you can work around not being able to fly. As in having the good sense, to avoid taking the flghts to the air. Unless you really stink, you should only fall out of the sky when you want to.

I much prefer use of his trap move over the actual rush myself. Faster animation so it's not quite as annoying when you need to use it four or five times in a fight. But by all rights, in a video game, you shouldn't have to resort to cheap tactics in order to work around bad game mechanics.

Yeah dawg, every single character should play exactly the same. Just so people who suck at the game don't feel bad.

[Xyex]

It was not broken, it was put in intentionally. If you are actually good at the game, you can work around not being able to fly. As in having the good sense, to avoid taking the flghts to the air. Unless you really stink, you should only fall out of the sky when you want to.

Well, let's see, first of all, just because they added it intentionally does not mean it's not broken. Look at Sagas. Everything in that game was added intentionally and I don't think there's anyone here that would claim the gameplay isn't broken. Same goes for Taiketsu or the first LoG game's horrid hit detection.

Secondly, you don't fall when you want, you fall every 15 seconds (I think I counted it as 15, I can't remember now). So unless you cheat you fall every 15 seconds, not when you want to.

Again, since you're one of the ones saying that falling is more like the show, point out to me one instance where the characters hovered via flailing their limbs only to turn onto their backs and fall out of the sky faster than jumped into it. You can't. Because it doesn't happen. So why are you saying it's more like the show?

Yeah dawg, every single character should play exactly the same. Just so people who suck at the game don't feel bad.

Did I say that every character should play the same? No. Did I say that the game shouldn't have broken mechanics? Yes. And all you're doing by claiming that those of use who don't like the falling suck is making yourself look like an idiot. I can use the fallers. I can beat other people with the fallers. I can even use Hercule and get a Perfect against SSJ4 Gogeta. That doesn't mean that the falling isn't broken. That doesn't mean that the falling doesn't suck. And obviously Spike agreed or they wouldn't have changed it.

[The S]

Why if I did not know better, I Would think "balancing" is an empty buzzword with no real meaning. Every character is unique and requires unique strategy. IF a character can't fly you adjust your plan accordingly. But if you run in using Roshi like you would Goku, then you are going to lose.

Have you ever, and I do mean ever, played a fighting game before? Balancing is not an empty buzzword, it's an essential to a good versus fighter. If you have an unbalanced fighter, you'll have one or two characters everyone is going to choose, maybe two to three that some will have developed strategy for that you may see every so often, and the rest will be crap. What's the use of having an extensive amount of characters if only a handful of them are even usable?

[Victator Supreme]

Every character is usable if you know what you are doing.

Did I say that every character should play the same? No. Did I say that the game shouldn't have broken mechanics? Yes. And all you're doing by claiming that those of use who don't like the falling suck is making yourself look like an idiot. I can use the fallers. I can beat other people with the fallers. I can even use Mr. Satan and get a Perfect against SSJ4 Gogeta. That doesn't mean that the falling isn't broken.

I don't think that word means, what you think it does.

[Drunken Master]

Tenshinhan was flying because he seemed to boost his speed upward to catch up to Goku, but at the end of the battle Tenshinhan said something like "I didn't even have a chance to use the Bukuu-justsu (Flying technique).

No, he was flying, he said that because at the end Goku knocked him out of bounds...He was saying he got hit so fast that he didn't have time to recover by flying away from the ground.

[Xyex]

Every character is usable if you know what you are doing.

And Saga's is playable if you know what you're doing. That doesn't make it enjoyable.

I don't think that word means, what you think it does.

EDIT
Anyway. We now know everyone in the game. All that's left to learn are some of the new modes I think. Didn't they mention something about minigames? Or was that a misunderstanding involving have a Babidi space ship battle arena and not the minigames ala B2?

Also, anyone know what new levels we're getting? I know we've seen Capital City, the Desert, and Grandpa Gohan's.... That one screen showed we've got an Otherworld tournament mode, but do we have the Otherworld arena as well?

[Jerseymilk]

I don't think that word means, what you think it does.

I don't think commas are used the way you think they are.

[kvon]

Tenshinhan was flying because he seemed to boost his speed upward to catch up to Goku, but at the end of the battle Tenshinhan said something like "I didn't even have a chance to use the Bukuu-justsu (Flying technique).

No, he was flying, he said that because at the end Goku knocked him out of bounds...He was saying he got hit so fast that he didn't have time to recover by flying away from the ground.

Oh, really? I'll take that answer. But, there should be some other good examples of the characters in early DB who seemed to dash through the air rather than flying. How about adult Chichi? That's a pretty good example of dashing and fighting in the air, right? Right? Right?!?! *Cooling down*

And about the point made earlier regarding balancing fighters in fighting games, it's actually really important. Besides DBZ fighting games, I've played some pretty serious stuff such as Tekken 3, Marvel vs Capcom, a little SoulCalibur III, and Digimon Tamers: Battle Evolution. I had a really fun time playing the first three, but the last one on that list, while contained unique moves for every monsters, it looks a little shallow compared to the others. Sure, the Sparking! series became way fun for me after spending a long time learning every single tricks and twists of the combo system, but a part of me always curse at this series (the Budokai series as well) for lacking total individualism. People can flame me, saying "They have 161-ish characters, so adjusting everyone and giving them unique combo's gonna take an awful lot of time." Well, to counter against that comment, I can say "Then don't pump out the game every year!" They have the Dual-Layered DVD option, so why not do a lot of stuff within 3+ years instead of less than a year. If they do that with the Kingdom Hearts series, we'd have 7 crummy KH games already. God of War II is a different story because it was already phenomenal in the first game. Any series developed under that kind of pace would start sucking very quickly, especially nowadays where more time is needed to develop PS3 and XBox 360 games.

[Adamant]

The game really lacks distinction between characters and variety between moves. Sure, in DBZ almost all characters are fast, energy-throwing strong characters who can fly, but do they have to be SO similiar to each other? There are a 100+ different rush attacks in the game, but the difference is rarely more than the energy cost, damage done, and animation used. Likewise, other specials can pretty much be divided into "energy dome", "beam", "energy ball", "homing energy ball", "multiple energy balls" and "multiple homing energy balls". There are some interesting, different takes, like Kuririn's.. scatter shot thing, but it's largely the same attacks over and over with different names and looks.

Come on, look at the original Street Fighter II, it had more variety than this. Was much more fun too.

[Drunken Master]

I wanted to support you kvon, so I whipped out the old manga, and studied all the fights. Especially the 22nd tournament. But...in all the instances, the people who couldn't fly were jumping. They jumped and fought, and fell and fought. Everytime a direction changed, or someone sped up was because of another factor...Goku using his kamehameha's for speed boosts, and direction changes. Kuririn sucking in air to float down like a ballon, and Goku exhaling a bunch of air to slow down to dodge King Chappa's attack.

Anyhow, I'm ALL for flying Dragon Ball characters. Let them fly! It's bad enough they have frickin' yellow health bars at the start of battle.

[TripleRach]

I see some inconsistent points here.

Yes because the DRagonball characters could not fly. It made using those characters a challenge. There are at least 40 guys in the game who can fly at super speed, use one of them. I want to use Roshi abd Namu in hopeless battles with the Ginyu Force. If I want to have super speed in flight battles, I have other options.

...

Why if I did not know better, I Would think "balancing" is an empty buzzword with no real meaning. Every character is unique and requires unique strategy. IF a character can't fly you adjust your plan accordingly. But if you run in using Roshi like you would Goku, then you are going to lose.

...

Better to make him like every other fighter. Because god knows, there aren' fifty characters who can fly perfectly. I was able to beat 18 while only using my rush move once. I guess they had to change the game for the more shitty players.

So which is it? Are they "more challenging" to use, or are they just "unique"? And thanks for being courteous with the "shitty players" comment.

Those are rhetorical questions, by the way. Different play styles for each character are one thing, but you yourself have admitted that those characters are harder to use, and to what advantage? It's not like one of them are the most powerful or anything. At best, it's slightly annoying and requires adapting, but at worst, it's frustrating and a major handicap.

There are much better ways to make the characters unique than having certain ones frequently drop to the ground suddenly, especially in a game with a huge bias towards flight. But even with the falling in Neo, everyone was still relatively similar anyway.

[Magica]

I think this might've been posted already, but here it is again.

http://www.gametrailers.com/game/5194.html

Developer Walkthroughs (The newest has Chichi fighting somebody), European Trailer, E3 2007 trailer, and user submitted videos.

http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/action/drag ... index.html
http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/action/drag ... mages.html

New screens and Tokyo Game show stuff.

[Rocketman]

There are some interesting, different takes, like Kuririn's.. scatter shot thing, but it's largely the same attacks over and over with different names and looks.

Welcome to Dragonball!

[Taku128]

Why is Seripa on the heroes side of that poster? I'd even argue and say that Bardock shouldn't be there either.

Because they don't fit in with the "heels", which is a despisable person. Can you really despise Seripa for following orders?