Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

[Noah]

My goodness, what was that? I don't remember the last time I got so impressed with Super episode(s)!

109 Part:

- Man, that Ribrianne part really sucked, she's a boring character with meaningless and repetitive speeches about love, too bad she was not eliminated there

- I think someone in Toei has something against Super Saiyan 3, it was epic Goku trying to use all his transformations on Jiren, but I didn't like it he gone to SSJ2 to SSJ God, oh well.

- Man, that fight had some really fast movements, I couldn't even see it right way at first!

- It didn't felt like Goku was using Kaioken x20 already, I was expecting something like this but along with Super Saiyan Blue of course.

- I wonder what people have to say about Krillin referencing his same statement in Movie 7 about Goku using the Genkidama as a Super Saiyan. "Oh no, I can't believe they took something from a movie, this was not even in the manga!"

- Another glimpse of Vegeta character regression, why would you not give energy to the Genkidama, you fool? You did it back in the Boo arc where the stakes where lower than a universe survival tournament, for f***'s sake! Even Freeza gave his energy!

- What is more stupid is that Goku thought that a Genkidama only formed by the energy of the U7 team would be enough to defeat Jiren, I mean for realsies? It took you better than that to finish Kid Boo, mate!


110 Part:

- Damn, I can't believe Jiren is actually the mortal Whis was talking to, that's so damn obvious!

- Ultra Instintic, huh? And it seems it's technique that not even the Gods mastered yet, no wonder they freak out

- Was Goku roaring like a Oozaru when he was attacking Jiren?

- Oh please, like Freeza would hurt/kill Goku now? What a bait ending, we all know he might do some stuff like giving energy to him just like Goku did it on Namek, it would be a good callback, but I don't like the route they're going with Freeza, I hope he has a plan or something, I could not stand him ending as a good guy in the end of the day

- NEP seems to be HYPE, I don't know but I feel like Hit could manage to push Jiren, even if just a little bit! GO HIT!

[Jaden]

So why exactly does Goku need yet another new form in order to achieve this "ultra instinct" technique, which is presumably the same technique Whis was trying to teach Goku and Vegeta? Couldn't he have mastered the technique in Blue form?

It seems to me that they are just pushing it for the sake of new forms, which is getting quite ridiculous by the way..God, Blue and now this "Ultra Instinct" form.

I don't know if it's only me, but I find this form to be meaningless, until proven otherwise (if at all). Makes you wonder what'll Goku's next form look like?

Great episode overall, choreography was a bit different than usual.

[Jigurashi]

Jiren is the worst most boring character in Dragon Ball history.

How and why can anyone like him? Please explain to me.

Mmmm...unique design, silent, mega strong. The dialogue surrounding him piqued a lot of interest, such as one saying he obviously obtained this power through a special type of training, Toppo saying he needs to get the Super Dragon Balls to get his wish, implying he has a greater purpose, and then the bomb itself being dropped by Whis that he's stronger than a Hakaishin. I mean, how is he so dis interesting to you that he's boring?

Probably because he's a stoic, taciturn character who prefers to say ver few words. It's a legit reason not to like the character. I personally like the dude. Of the stoic characters in this series, only one I even somewhat dislike is Tenshinhan. But showing little emotion is a legit reason to dislike him.

[Hellspawn28]

I felt like it was worth the wait. I don't think I seen animation in Super this good since the Vegito vs. Zamasu fight in my opinion.

[Yedis]

Interesting note that the U11 Kaioshin stated if the other fighter saw Jiren beat Goku they would lose the will the fight, but the opposite happened.

[Forte224]

Jiren is the worst most boring character in Dragon Ball history.

How and why can anyone like him? Please explain to me.

Mmmm...unique design, silent, mega strong. The dialogue surrounding him piqued a lot of interest, such as one saying he obviously obtained this power through a special type of training, Toppo saying he needs to get the Super Dragon Balls to get his wish, implying he has a greater purpose, and then the bomb itself being dropped by Whis that he's stronger than a Hakaishin. I mean, how is he so dis interesting to you that he's boring?

Probably because he's a stoic, taciturn character who prefers to say ver few words. It's a legit reason not to like the character. I personally like the dude. Of the stoic characters in this series, only one I even somewhat dislike is Tenshinhan. But showing little emotion is a legit reason to dislike him.

I mean, I guess yeah I can see why people would dislike him but to be as insistent as Vados_chan seems a bit excessive

[TheOne]

See everyone seems to really like this episode but then in a couple episodes time there will be an episode that will just be mediocre and then people will turn on the series again and complain about it and how the show does so much wrong.

Toei has shown that it's capable of stepping up their game animation wise. I don't think it's unfair for them to continue on being somewhat consistent about it. They raised the bar this episode.

[DainIronfoot]

Special was fantastic, that's the best way to put it.

It's weird how the part where Whis mentions the mortal stronger than a GoD. It's like he only thought of it as a rumor and seemed confused. Though originally, when he mentioned it it sounded like he knew who the mortal was, or at least should of known it was from Universe 11, since he said said mortal is stronger than his GoD who's stronger than Beerus.

The wording of that sequence was annoying, because it wasn't totally confirmed, but was implied...especially with the shot turning to Vermoud right after.

Anyways, NEP looks great too...let's keep the good streak going!

[DragonHermit]

Haven't been commenting in these forums for a long time, but this ep. was hype. Not great writing or anything, but the hype level was

[TheOne]

A roller coaster of an episode. Both of highs and lows.

Good
-Fantastic fighting. Really awesome battles the whole way through.
-The new form in motion looks amazing. Love it.
-The transformation sequence was also pretty awesome too.
-Goku's enlightenment and paying of the moving without thinking thing for each body part.
-Goku's entire fight choreography and movement was phenomenal. It was like he was a zombie or his body was pushing him while he was along for the ride.
-Freeza call back and reverse of him looking to give Goku ki.
-Awesome new music and placement.
-Whis' reaction to Goku was awesome. Love how excited he was.
-Beerus feeling threatened himself rather than happy. He's too busy worrying about how he compares rather than Goku coming back XD.

Bad
-Lot's of copy paste of Freeza arc. A lot of it. Almost as much as 100 and Broly references.
-Genki dama from 9 people somehow accumulates that much power, when raw ki has never been how it worked, and if it were they'd go full power before sending their energy.
-All the Ribrianne stuff. Cept for getting bitch smacked by Vegeta.
-Vegeta not giving his energy when fucking Freeza of all people did....that's really lame. He is NOT that petty. If anything the reverse would make more sense with Freeza refusing but Vegeta donating.
-The whole feeling out thing despite already having an idea of where he ranks. Toppo already made him go practically all out, so of course anything beneath that basically is not going to give any new information
-A lot of the new insert was wasted on talking instead of the awesome fight.
-Genki Dama bit as a minor nitpick, kinda went on a little too long and felt like a game of Hot Space Potato.

I think you hit the nail on some of the negatives. Overall it was a magnificent episode.

There were definitely some inconsistencies with the whole Spirit Bomb thing. I'm just remembering the buu saga and how much energy they gave to that and I think about the energy they got from this one. It doesn't equal out anything that would be considered overwhelmingly powerful. Honestly the only person there who wasn't giving their energy in the Buu saga was Frieza. And even then the z fighters gave everything they had including Goten and Trunks on top of the whole planet draining themselves. That was strong enough for Kid Buu, but definitely wouldn't be enough to stand up against someone like Jiren. It didn't make any sense. If anybody tries to defend this Spirit Bomb that somehow turned out unbelievably powerful without the entire team giving up an enormous amount of energy, is just blind.

[hardcorefakes]

Well yeah, these were great episodes, but that doesn't mean the rest of the arc hasn't been pretty shitty. Two gems can't compensate for 90+ episodes of mediocrity/trash.

All you've ever done is complain like a broken record for 2 years anyway.

I'm referring to the all the fickle people who keep having yo-yoing opinions.

He's not wrong, btw.

[kingkamehameha]

Best Episode in a very long time!
Haven't felt so much hype since Vegetto Blue Vs Fused Zamasu/Hit vs Kaio Ken Blue Goku.
Thank you Toei!
What a time to be alive

[Forte224]

There were definitely some inconsistencies with the whole Spirit Bomb thing. I'm just remembering the buu saga and how much energy they gave to that and I think about the energy they got from this one. It doesn't equal out anything that would be considered overwhelmingly powerful. Honestly the only person there who wasn't giving their energy in the Buu saga was Frieza. And even then the z fighters gave everything they had including Goten and Trunks on top of the whole planet draining themselves. That was strong enough for Kid Buu, but definitely wouldn't be enough to stand up against someone like Jiren. It didn't make any sense. If anybody tries to defend this Spirit Bomb that somehow turned out unbelievably powerful without the entire team giving up an enormous amount of energy, is just blind.

Yeah I was scratching my head too during all that. Even GT went to better lengths explaining why the Genki Dama should work. Seems like something a subpar DBZ movie would do. I feel like they didn't know how else to put the Genki Dama in to help Goku reach his new form so they were like "Trust us guys, this Genki Dama is way more powerful"

[TheOne]

Special was fantastic, that's the best way to put it.

It's weird how the part where Whis mentions the mortal stronger than a GoD. It's like he only thought of it as a rumor and seemed confused. Though originally, when he mentioned it it sounded like he knew who the mortal was, or at least should of known it was from Universe 11, since he said said mortal is stronger than his GoD who's stronger than Beerus.

The wording of that sequence was annoying, because it wasn't totally confirmed, but was implied...especially with the shot turning to Vermoud right after.

Anyways, NEP looks great too...let's keep the good streak going!

I thought the whole thing with the revealing of Jiren being that mortal was weird.

They handled this so poorly. Belmoud was concerned about Goku when Toppo fought him, and showed no evidence that he even knew who Jiren was. If Belmoud knew Jiren was this strong, he wouldn't of cared about what Toppo could do. He'd know Jiren could solo everyone. He had to assure him his friend Jiren would take care of it.

It almost came across as Toei was willing to just overlook little stuff like that just to keep things under wraps. Kinda like lying just for the sake of a dramatic moment.

[omaro34]

Incredible. It was well worth the wait. Amazing music and animation. You can tell they really worked hard on this special.

Vegeta not giving Goku energy was strange especially considering the fact that Freeza did it.

I guess it was within the rules for the eliminated earthlings to give their energy, I thought someone would have protested.

[TheOne]

There were definitely some inconsistencies with the whole Spirit Bomb thing. I'm just remembering the buu saga and how much energy they gave to that and I think about the energy they got from this one. It doesn't equal out anything that would be considered overwhelmingly powerful. Honestly the only person there who wasn't giving their energy in the Buu saga was Frieza. And even then the z fighters gave everything they had including Goten and Trunks on top of the whole planet draining themselves. That was strong enough for Kid Buu, but definitely wouldn't be enough to stand up against someone like Jiren. It didn't make any sense. If anybody tries to defend this Spirit Bomb that somehow turned out unbelievably powerful without the entire team giving up an enormous amount of energy, is just blind.

Yeah I was scratching my head too during all that. Even GT went to better lengths explaining why the Genki Dama should work. Seems like something a subpar DBZ movie would do. I feel like they didn't know how else to put the Genki Dama in to help Goku reach his new form so they were like "Trust us guys, this Genki Dama is way more powerful"

Honestly? Everyone could've been so overwhelmed by how powerful Jiren was, they were willing to contribute their energy for the sake of not having to fight Jiren. The enemy of my enemy is my friend kinda approach. Getting energy from the the strongest fighters in 8 universes sounds like a more realistic plan than just U7.

But that's just my approach I guess.

[Analytical Delusion]

Aside from how long it took for the servers of the streaming services to get in order, I think the two episodes were pretty exciting. Some thoughts:

• I liked how it was observed by Beerus/Whis that Goku was using KKx20 already against Jiren. Nice flashback to the Freeza fight (when he was using KKx10 from the start).
• I feared that Goku was going to launch the genki-dama at a surprised Jiren caught off guard, which would've been awkward. Instead, Jiren opts to take it on head-on, so the technique's slow speed doesn't break immersion.
• It was a big character development moment for Freeza to donate energy (it also seems he's going to give Goku some energy in a throwback to Namek, based on where the episode left off). It was kind of lame that Vegeta didn't kick in though (wish he did, even if a bit delayed).
• I love that the technique isn't another Saiyan-exclusive transformation, and the Gods of Destruction all knew exactly what was happening once Whis spoke on it. It is unclear if it'll be hard for other top-tier characters to obtain because the role the genki-dama played is uncertain (so it helped him get back some energy, but it was also the technique hitting him that hard which triggered it?).
• In the next episode preview, Hit and Jiren seem pretty immersed in battle. Neither is mentioned in the spoilers for the following episode either, or the titles for the next two episodes. I wonder if one or both is knocked out? It is nice to see that Toei (and presumably Toriyama) is committed to keeping Hit in that top tier fighters (in terms of power and screen-time/relevancy).
• Hoping that Toppo and Dyspo last a while. Would be nice if each had at least one more major fight in the tournament (Toppo hasn't really had one yet).

[MaskedRider]

Well yeah, these were great episodes, but that doesn't mean the rest of the arc hasn't been pretty shitty. Two gems can't compensate for 90+ episodes of mediocrity/trash.

All you've ever done is complain like a broken record for 2 years anyway.

I'm referring to the all the fickle people who keep having yo-yoing opinions.

He's not wrong, btw.

He isn't though I think the replyer is feeling the same way that I do in that there always has to be THAT GUY who can't just comment on an episode without "Daily reminder" about how mediocre the series has been, it really brings negativity in with that you have people going off topic from the episode to another "Super is / isn't bad..." hoo ha or really enjoy a entertaining episode without making them feel bad though I know that isn't the intent of the first guy.

[TheOne]

Incredible. It was well worth the wait. Amazing music and animation. You can tell they really worked hard on this special.

Vegeta not giving Goku energy was strange especially considering the fact that Freeza did it.

I guess it was within the rules for the eliminated earthlings to give their energy, I thought someone would have protested.

I was half expecting Grand priest to say something

[Forte224]

There were definitely some inconsistencies with the whole Spirit Bomb thing. I'm just remembering the buu saga and how much energy they gave to that and I think about the energy they got from this one. It doesn't equal out anything that would be considered overwhelmingly powerful. Honestly the only person there who wasn't giving their energy in the Buu saga was Frieza. And even then the z fighters gave everything they had including Goten and Trunks on top of the whole planet draining themselves. That was strong enough for Kid Buu, but definitely wouldn't be enough to stand up against someone like Jiren. It didn't make any sense. If anybody tries to defend this Spirit Bomb that somehow turned out unbelievably powerful without the entire team giving up an enormous amount of energy, is just blind.

Yeah I was scratching my head too during all that. Even GT went to better lengths explaining why the Genki Dama should work. Seems like something a subpar DBZ movie would do. I feel like they didn't know how else to put the Genki Dama in to help Goku reach his new form so they were like "Trust us guys, this Genki Dama is way more powerful"

Honestly? Everyone could've been so overwhelmed by how powerful Jiren was, they were willing to contribute their energy for the sake of not having to fight Jiren. The enemy of my enemy is my friend kinda approach. Getting energy from the the strongest fighters in 8 universes sounds like a more realistic plan than just U7.

But that's just my approach I guess.

That's a good idea. Since it would be a temporary thing they wouldn't have to worry about Goku using it on them too, since it's reliant on their power and temporary. But then Goku would've had to assume they'd help, or ask for their help, neither of which I think he'd do.

Incredible. It was well worth the wait. Amazing music and animation. You can tell they really worked hard on this special.

Vegeta not giving Goku energy was strange especially considering the fact that Freeza did it.

I guess it was within the rules for the eliminated earthlings to give their energy, I thought someone would have protested.

I was half expecting Grand priest to say something

Haha I guess we're on a similar wave length today. That and when the eliminated girl gave "love" or whatever to Ribrianne seemed like illegal actions that would disqualify someone