Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

[Noah]

Loved the reference:

[The gr]

Loved the reference:

Cool goku is chaneling the bruce lee,he really needed to use the one inch punch to jiren then the package is complete

[Olympian]

Not sure what you`re trying to say. Is it that this Special supposely makes sense of a widely dislike return story and thus makes Freeza clearly the better choice character over the others you mention because of his development?

Yes because his power is actually needed and made his movie important and connected,I'm looking at the narrative point of view and not the fandom POV

Ah agreed. Narrative over fandom.

[ekrolo2]

BTW I haven't seen your full episode breakdown either on your thoughts, what you found good, were mixed on, bad, etc.

I usually don't do full episode backgrounds, more snide remarks here and there but I do have some thoughts on the whole package.

PROS:
- The animation, sick as all hell, besides a couple of expected iffy Tate moments everyone was at the very least pretty damn good. Particularly the first fight before the Spirit Bomb, it does a really good job of just visually showcasing how fucked Goku really is no matter what he does.
- The music, Sumitomo's work has been largely forgetable thus far but he pulled out some great new tunes and brought back old ones to great effect. The insert song perfectly fit.
- The new forms explanation exists and it doesn't suck. It's not great but fine is the equivalent to Shakespeare in Super land so I'll take it.
- Goku's new form isn't an end battle one sided curb stomp. He's got much to learn about it and now that he's mostly tired, he has to make due with what power he has left and figure out how to go from here in the 25 minutes left in the tournament. That's great. One of my biggest problems with a lot of form reveals is that the guy with the sparkly new form usually just one sided curb stomps the opposition (fuck Gohan vs Cell).

MIXED:
- Having so much talking during the insert song, cool fight is something that makes sense as the explanation is delivered there but I think they could've cut down on the amount of reaction shots.
- Jiren having no personality. On one hand, it is nice to see a DB fighter who doesn't legitimately dick around but on the other hand, he doesn't have much personality. SS2 Gohan's reveal, as loathe as I'm to admit it, works better because Cell did some really nasty things and left an impression on you. Jiren so far is just really strong, almost like a force of nature but he has nothing memorable to him besides that. I think he should've smashed Kale right out of the tournament instead of simply knocking her down for a bit.

CONS:
- Vegeta's "I'm not gonna help but I'm gonna help anyway!" attitude. Seriously? Could they not simply write him smashing Ribriane's face in THEN giving Goku the Genki afterward? What the fuck was the intent here, exactly?
- The Spirit Bomb not getting more people. Everyone saw Goku get his shit kicked in so I think it would've made perfect sense for all the other universes to join in on the bomb and get rid of Jiren because he's CLEARLY way too much of a threat. Plus, Goku will be really tired afterwards, meaning he'll be easier to beat. Hell, at the very least give Hit and Cabba a shot of giving him power out of respect.
- Ribrianes fight taking so much time. Ribriane, much like almost every DB parody/gag character, doesn't work long term. Her shtick was funny at first but like I said, this series always runs those characters into the ground really quickly. The only big exception is Mister Satan and even he was grating on my nerves well into the Boo arc until his redemption arc with Boo singlehanded saved the character.

[Jigurashi]

Loved the reference:

Cool goku is chaneling the bruce lee,he really needed to use the one inch punch to jiren then the package is complete

Personally, it wasn't just Bruce Lee for me. I legit got a Hokuto no Ken vibe from Goku.

[Olympian]

That`s where Hokuto No Ken took the reference from as well. Kenshiro is Bruce Lee on steroids.

Might as well ask, anyone got that scene animated? I still haven`t been able to see the Special.

[SHINOBI-03]

Was the wait worth it? Sure. I was excited when Goku and Jiren finally duked it out after months of waiting.

Goku's new form reminds me of the original Super Saiyan God, only blue. The circumstances are interesting though. Absorb/hit with the energy of the Genki-Dama while in Super Saiyan Blue (did he also use the Kaioken?) and you get a form that combines everything but not a Super Saiyan. I welcome a new form that's not a Super Saiyan hair color.

The new outro is terrible. I loved the previous one so much I don't think anything will top it.

[Pannaliciour]

Did they adress the fact that the spirit bomb should be useless against a not evil person?

Would be nice if king kai was there to the whole tournament. Seeing Goku using kaio ken en spirit bomb in one episode (or 2)

[SHINOBI-03]

That`s where Hokuto No Ken took the reference from as well. Kenshiro is Bruce Lee on steroids.

Might as well ask, anyone got that scene animated? I still haven`t been able to see the Special.

Here ya go.

[Olympian]

Oh thank you! That`s beautifully animated.

Breaks my heart that most of the other figthers of the cast don`t get sweet scenes like this. Is it okay if I use it?

[CJStriker_CBR]

-Ribrianne in general while i do find her funny as well i like her voice but the constant love stuff got old old real fast as well her ability wasn't that impressive,really dissapointed with her character they better improved her character otherwise she is just a one note parody which i'm not impressed.

That is the reason why freeza needed to be here,it F is actually meaningful and not pointless trash because of this,they say yamcha,buu or the kids were better picks than him same with whis training in F also feeling important thanks to the TOP

I agree with ribrianne being flat and one note,she seriously need to have character like how mr satan did in the buu saga,that why I'm having hope for jiren and ribrianne they might become good character later on if the writers use them properly

This is my View Exactly The Gr, especially being a Comic Fan and Here is a new way to look at Ribrianne as well Spider-Man my friend.

We really are in the Infancy of these Characters Like Jiren, Ribrianne and others like Toppo, Kale, Caulifla as well as others. They will need time to develop and give us more of who they are, likely the rest of THIS ToP arc and the majority of the next one to say the least. But fans need to be willing to take a breath and stop with the few episodes and done ideal and that is it on a character. The Storyteller needs time to tell their story, you can feel the flow of that with how the story is going and by how many of these characters seem to be going, it is going to be much longer then this tournament will give us.

That is the fair and reasonable thing to do, Honor the Storyteller and Give the Time for the Development to happen. One can like characters right away Like I did with Ribrianne and Toppo, but I Hunger for more to be told Greatly indeed and more will be needed.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

The way Tomioka wrote #110 compared to #66 kinda confirms my suspicions that Toei requested he rush things due to the staff they had for #66. This was so much better written, mostly because it didn't feel rushed we as the audience could digest things a lot better and got some much needed exposition and a decent enough explanation to tide us over until we get more later on.

Also I really loved the moment the other universes didn't lose the will to fight, it felt like they were all in solidarity for Goku. Good stuff.

[mAcChaos]

I can totally buy Vegeta not giving his energy to the Spirit Bomb because he realized that other fighters would try to prey on Goku's weak state.

Someone has to play defense for the team when Goku was setting up the Spirit Bomb.

I just wish they explained that part since it made Vegeta just look petty. But it makes more sense that he did it for a real reason if the writers went out of their way to show even Freeza giving the energy, who had way more reason to be petty.

[Lord Beerus]

Loved the reference:

[spoiler][/spoiler]

Funny thing is that Goku's new Ultra Instinct form/technique closely resembles the real-life martial art concept of Mushin (無心, "No Mind"), a mental state that highly-trained martial artists are said to be capable of entering during combat. It is essentially a moment where their body reacts without the need of having any specific intentions or plans in mind, having refined their instincts and intuition to a level where they can respond to any threat without the need for thought.

[HeroR]

To be fair, in this form he probably has. Jiren > Belmod > Beerus. And Goku can go toe to toe with Jiren, who isn't even at full power. This Goku is most def stronger than Beerus.

Is this based on the manga?

Of course not, it's based on EPs 109 and 110. Why do you care though? The manga isn't the source material here, and the anime isn't an adaptation. It's not like with the DB manga and the anime.

I asked because it was never said Beerus is stronger than any god other than Champa.

[Legion]

And you know for this for certainty, how?

Goku still need to improve his "new form/technique" and literally nothing suggest that is above the Gods because one ability. He wasn't equal to Jiren, the guy never fought at full power and Goku didn't damaged him at all. Also, we don't know if Goku will beat Jiren alone. We know that Jiren is Hakaishin level (if is stronger than Beerus in raw power or no it doesn't metter, is still Hakaishin tier and pretty sure that he can't stomp the Gods).

Say that Goku is right now above Beerus it's just nonsense. I'm sure that it will be told if Goku surpass him.

[Marlowe89]

Not much I can say that others haven't commented on already. The special was amazing, but I think it was Goku who carried these two episodes more than Jiren. The latter turned out to be exactly as boring as I thought he'd be.

[Asura]

I can totally buy Vegeta not giving his energy to the Spirit Bomb because he realized that other fighters would try to prey on Goku's weak state.

Someone has to play defense for the team when Goku was setting up the Spirit Bomb.

I just wish they explained that part since it made Vegeta just look petty. But it makes more sense that he did it for a real reason if the writers went out of their way to show even Freeza giving the energy, who had way more reason to be petty.

For some reason I keep seeing this excuse used a lot to explain Vegeta's behavior, but it still makes no sense. Why are people treating it like a one-or-the-other type of deal? You're telling me Vegeta couldn't give energy and then have plucked off Ribrianne? Not only that but Ribrianne wasn't even a factor when Vegeta decided to not give any energy.

It's just straight up bad writing, and this shouldn't come as a surprise. Vegeta's character has been horribly butchered this arc so why would this situation be any different?

[Baggie_Saiyan]

I can totally buy Vegeta not giving his energy to the Spirit Bomb because he realized that other fighters would try to prey on Goku's weak state.

Someone has to play defense for the team when Goku was setting up the Spirit Bomb.

I just wish they explained that part since it made Vegeta just look petty. But it makes more sense that he did it for a real reason if the writers went out of their way to show even Freeza giving the energy, who had way more reason to be petty.

The cut scene further emphasised this with Vegeta essentially cheering Goku on to push it back. I don't think they needed to do more, those actions showed why. Vegeta is smart he knew exactly what would happen.

[Nickolaidas]

On a totally unrelated note, does anyone know the title of the music when Jiren KOs Goku? It's also the music theme when U9 & 10 were erased.