Did Goku and jiren create a black hole?

[Vegito Black]

During that scene where Goku and Jirens struggle makes the spiritbomb implode, it looked like it became a black hole, was this just a specail effect to make the explosion look cool or was it a legit mini black hole?

[Polyphase Avatron]

No one said anything about a black hole (they only talked about the genki dama exploding), and there didn't appear to be any gravity inversion, time dilation, or other weird things going on, so probably not.

I thought it was a cool effect - Jiren contained the genki dama and imploded it, and Goku narrowly avoided it going off right in his face.

[HEDGESMFG]

I would argue yes, simply because that massive force from the gravity of a micro black hole, combined with the energy Goku absorbed from the imploding genki dama would perfectly explain the stress his body endured to be forced to unlock a new found power. It's kind of cool for me to think that it took this much force being exerted on Goku to give him power beyond even the gods, as it shows us the sheer scale of how absurdly high we've gotten now.

I already stated this in another theory post, but I stand behind it.

And yes, I know a black hole needs matter to form (it's actually super-condensed matter collapsing under its own gravity), and other science-y stuff, blahblah, but it fits the visuals we saw, and who knows how the matter that formed the TOP stage works if some of it got swept up in the event. It's not normal stuff, that's for sure.

[Asura]

I hope they explain what it was and where Goku went, since he was completely gone for quite an extended period of time and then just reappeared.

[Polyphase Avatron]

I hope they explain what it was and where Goku went, since he was completely gone for quite an extended period of time and then just reappeared.

I thought he was underneath the arena floor.

[Ziegander]

I would argue yes, simply because that massive force from the gravity of a micro black hole, combined with the energy Goku absorbed from the imploding genki dama would perfectly explain the stress his body endured to be forced to unlock a new found power. It's kind of cool for me to think that it took this much force being exerted on Goku to give him power beyond even the gods, as it shows us the sheer scale of how absurdly high we've gotten now.

I already stated this in another theory post, but I stand behind it.

And yes, I know a black hole needs matter to form (it's actually super-condensed matter collapsing under its own gravity), and other science-y stuff, blahblah, but it fits the visuals we saw, and who knows how the matter that formed the TOP stage works if some of it got swept up in the event. It's not normal stuff, that's for sure.

Having the particles of your body stretched into silly string, crushed into a hyper-dense, minuscule grain of carbon, and incinerated by impossible heat and pressure doesn't explain anything about learning how to do something he couldn't do before. In fact, enduring incredible physical damage and pain in any general sense doesn't in any way explain how anyone learns how to do anything. Furthermore, the massive force from gravity of a micro black hole wasn't shown to exist in any capacity in the show, so whether or not such a thing could perfectly explain why Goku learned a new technique is irrelevant, because it didn't actually happen.

[MaskedRider]

I would say it created a hole of some sort but not a black hole due to what Ziegander said with the stretching and the pain. An anime hole that churns out cool stuff

[Asura]

I hope they explain what it was and where Goku went, since he was completely gone for quite an extended period of time and then just reappeared.

I thought he was underneath the arena floor.

Seemed like the black hole explosion happened in the air so I'm not too sure about that, plus there wasn't any kind of eruption when he appeared, the crater was already there before if I'm not mistaken.

[Ziegander]

I hope they explain what it was and where Goku went, since he was completely gone for quite an extended period of time and then just reappeared.

I thought he was underneath the arena floor.

Seemed like the black hole explosion happened in the air so I'm not too sure about that, plus there wasn't any kind of eruption when he appeared, the crater was already there before if I'm not mistaken.

The crater was already there, but there was a massive eruption of energy when Goku rose in the center of it.

[Polyphase Avatron]

I thought he was underneath the arena floor.

Seemed like the black hole explosion happened in the air so I'm not too sure about that, plus there wasn't any kind of eruption when he appeared, the crater was already there before if I'm not mistaken.

The crater was already there, but there was a massive eruption of energy when Goku rose in the center of it.

That's what I was basing it on. I'm guessing he was just like a meter or so below the bottom of it. Probably the force of the explosion smashed him into the ground, or it's how he evaded it.

[Ziegander]

Oh, yeah, I was just responding to the "wasn't any kind of eruption," thing someone else said. I agree, it definitely seemed to me like Goku was rising from underneath the arena itself.

[Asura]

Seemed like the black hole explosion happened in the air so I'm not too sure about that, plus there wasn't any kind of eruption when he appeared, the crater was already there before if I'm not mistaken.

The crater was already there, but there was a massive eruption of energy when Goku rose in the center of it.

That's what I was basing it on. I'm guessing he was just like a meter or so below the bottom of it. Probably the force of the explosion smashed him into the ground, or it's how he evaded it.

There would have been another crater/more damage if he came from the ground with the eruption of energy though.

[Arugela]

I think it had to have been a black whole. If it wasn't why did he disappear? Goku may have reamerged from the gravity well and quickly landed on the ground a millisecond before the eruption. They can't fly in the arena unless the theory of flying after this form is achieved is true. And that could be jumping. Either way he may not have transform until he got out of the gravity well and landed on the ground an instant later. Or he ITed into the crater from the gravity well.

The gravity of a micro black hole was possibly shown. When he went into the light they did make it look like he was moving extra fast like in a black hole. The white light then black flashes could be interpreted as entering the anomaly and going past the horizon.

[GodKaio-Ken]

I see it as a sort of black hole, but not one that follows our own physics. Stop trying to apply physics to DB...it doesnt work on infinite levels. Just because in real life a black hole would behave a certain way dont expect it to in DB.

All we know for now is that it was a massive amount of energy that sort of imploded upon itself when it detonated and turned black.

[Pluto]

No one said anything about a black hole (they only talked about the genki dama exploding), and there didn't appear to be any gravity inversion, time dilation, or other weird things going on, so probably not.

I thought it was a cool effect - Jiren contained the genki dama and imploded it, and Goku narrowly avoided it going off right in his face.

Me being a physics freak, was a bit disappointed they never adapted those fighters to such conditions, actually, i wouldve thought that the GP could push a "neutron star" rather then Katchi Katchin as a fighting scene/arena. Most of the fighters are capable of withstanding a lot of gravitational pull.

However, i think there was some "time dilation", something like the "Interstellar" visit on the planet near Gargantua, where they take 4 hours on the planet, and 23 years pass to the dude waiting for them.
Goku may have been trapped there for a few hours, as it took him quite some time to reappear, or, jump back .
Goku says he does not really know what happened when asked by Vegeta, and even surprises him with vanishing off from the scene, could be IT, could be something he learned (maybe someone helped him jump?).

On the other hand, i dont think Goku just fall on the "hole", he may have done it intentionally, seeing something through, he was the one nearest to it anyway.

[Lord Beerus]

It certainly looked like a black hole in first inspection. Given Whis' comments of how Goku fought against the power of Genki Dama consuming it, it would what happened is that the immense pressure for Jiren and SSJB Kaioken Goku pushing the Genki Dama back and forth, lead it sphere itself collapsing and turning itself inside out. Revealing the void or passageway into the realm of the energy that the Genki Dama consisted off and where it collects and stores its energy.

[Polyphase Avatron]

The crater was already there, but there was a massive eruption of energy when Goku rose in the center of it.

That's what I was basing it on. I'm guessing he was just like a meter or so below the bottom of it. Probably the force of the explosion smashed him into the ground, or it's how he evaded it.

There would have been another crater/more damage if he came from the ground with the eruption of energy though.

I don't think we saw the bottom of the crater after he emerged, did we?

[Arugela]

We know he wasn't there before he reemerged. He went somewhere. So a black hole is a good bet. I think he went to another dimension then got back somehow. Possibly via IT. Or the black hole simply ran out of juice and reinverted itself and he popped back in.

If it wasn't a black hole or similar where was he? He was not in the ground. and he was flying before because the pressure was holding him up from them using the spirit bomb at each other. Then he fell into the, "black hole." then he wasn't seen and reapeard with great white light.

Zeno would not have tried to eliminate goku if he was just in the ground. He would still be in bounds and in the tournament regardless of being incapacitated. he could only eliminate him if he wasn't anywhere to be found. So he must have vanished.

I just rewatched it. It clearly shows the spirit bomb go all white then turn into a smaller black object. It then starts making the rays of light go inwards indicating it's sucking things in. then as goku falls and is pulled in a little it goes white again and shows only the spirit bomb. I think that is when he was in/past the event horizon. That is when he started doing his ape face. It actually shows him crossing the event horizon. It shows the edge of the circle before it goes to white. Which is then it exploding in his face. Or not something similar.

They say he hasn't appeared here which means he possibly wasn't knocked off the stage but they coudn't find his energy. Nvm, I forgot about the idea of him being vaporized. That is why he was going to push the button to eliminate. I'm not sure anymore. It shows jiren in a crator but not necessarily the big one goku came out of. it's still odd, he looks like he just reappears with all of that energy coming out of him... Hard to say.

BTW, I think the, "He's coming." Statement by beerus is saying who the Saiyan was he saw. Or his view on it atm. Oddly enough that would mean whis has some knowledge on it or understands the potential significance and may have in the past.

Just got to the end where whis explains it again. I think he's saying it was triggered by goku absorbing the entire spirit bomb and the energy tearing him apart internally against his own power is what triggered the change. So, it may still be from absorption. that extra energy helped him activate the change and his ape face was his body struggling against the massive influx of energy. still can't figure out what the duel screaming is supposed to be. When he's in the form he's screaming with his voice and somebody/something elses. It doesn't sound like zamasu or ape. It sounds like young roshi or roshi's old master or something different. Maybe he has a being inside him and that is the new creature. Maybe he pulled something from another dimension back with him like in event horizon the movie!! ><

Did he dimension fuse with Mr. Satan?!

[Bardo117]

They should've used as a Big Band type of event. So much energy was imploded in that one spot that an entire new universe spawned.

[Pluto]

It certainly looked like a black hole in first inspection. Given Whis' comments of how Goku fought against the power of Genki Dama consuming it, it would what happened is that the immense pressure for Jiren and SSJB Kaioken Goku pushing the Genki Dama back and forth, lead it sphere itself collapsing and turning itself inside out. Revealing the void or passageway into the realm of the energy that the Genki Dama consisted off and where it collects and stores its energy.

It shrank considerably, massive black-holes are suspected to be smaller then our planet size, if not less.

If Jiren is strong enough to withstand the pull, and on the other hand Goku not, then the whole arena should've collapsed in no time sucking all the weaklings. Kinda hints to just a reference to have something "real" to compare to the powers, it may just be a reference after all, a lousy one though for us physics geeks.