"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[HeroR]

I honestly don't see Goku having any interest in Sadala. I never had any interest in Saiyans before, he barely talked to Cabba.

Well maybe so but they won’t leave Goku out so he will have to come along. Any DB arc is going to include Goku.

Depends if there is someone strong for Goku to fight.

[Li'l Lemmy]

Bite your tongue. Goten and Trunks are sons of the main characters, and in EoZ. The U6 trio is nowhere to be seen.

If those saiyans "replace" characters from the original cast, then I'll want nothing to do with this series.

EOZ was just one moment we got to see just so we can see Goku leave with Uub. Saying because the U6 Saiyans are not in EOZ means they won't be important or even replaced certain characters is flawed. Doesn't help that Goten in EOZ wasn't training outside his dad forcing him since he discovered girls.

If they can have Kuririn go from giving up martial arts to getting his groove back to deciding to step aside to being pushed into participating in the ToP, basically resetting his character over and over, or if they can shaft Gohan for almost all of DBS up until his sudden inclusion in the current arc as a top tier fighter, I don't think Goten is suddenly impossible to use or make relevant just because he had a date once upon a time.

[HeroR]

If they can have Kuririn go from giving up martial arts to getting his groove back to deciding to step aside to being pushed into participating in the ToP, basically resetting his character over and over, or if they can shaft Gohan for almost all of DBS up until his sudden inclusion in the current arc as a top tier fighter, I don't think Goten is suddenly impossible to use or make relevant just because he had a date once upon a time.

Not sure how they reset Krillin's character over and over again, and Gohan was once the MC to the entire series. In other words, Gohan is in a different league than Goten and Gohan is barely treated as a top tier fighter.

And it's Goten own fault. He's the one who had to be taken to the tournament kicking and screaming. He doesn't even have the excuse of having a family like Gohan. He and Trunks just like chasing tail.

[Noah]

Not sure how they reset Krillin's character over and over again...

In the events of BoG it seems he retired from martial arts, but in RoF he was back again in the scene, then he retired again and Goku had to motivate him, he joined the team in ToP and in EoZ we see he got old and probably retired for good.

[Totamo]

After this arc I bet they'll be 10 slice of life fillers like before.

Then I fully expect EOZ. Trunks, Goten, Uub and to a lesser extent Pan will get tons of focus. Out with the old, in with the new.

As much I hate to say this, I'm starting to feel Cauli/Kale/Cabba are slowly being built up to replace Trunks and Goten

Bite your tongue. Goten and Trunks are sons of the main characters, and in EoZ. The U6 trio is nowhere to be seen.

If those saiyans "replace" characters from the original cast, then I'll want nothing to do with this series.

You should probably drop your hopes now and the show. I'm not going to lie here. They ain't doing nothing.


There is virtually no reason Goten and Trunks need to do anything in Super. Any reason for their existence have been destroyed. The pilaf gang are the cute kid characters doing shenanigans , fusions is no longer useful against anyone with real power, heck the copy and paste arc even showed that base vegeta is stronger than Gotenks before the future trunks arc even happened. If we need Goku's son and Vegeta's son, we still have Gohan and Future Trunks to use who have shown to be useful.


Then there is the whole mentor thing, well thats were these 3 saiyans come in because all 3 of them have surpassed Goten and Trunks, if Goku and Vegeta get a desire to train someone, it might be the people who have blown pass the 2 and maybe 3 forms of super saiyan.
'

If these 2 female saiyans are marketable, you will probably never see a full 5 minutes of Goten and Trunks ever again and anyone saying differently has not been watching super.

[perucho1990]

You should probably drop your hopes now and the show. I'm not going to lie here. They ain't doing nothing.


There is virtually no reason Goten and Trunks need to do anything in Super. Any reason for their existence have been destroyed. The pilaf gang are the cute kid characters doing shenanigans , fusions is no longer useful against anyone with real power, heck the copy and paste arc even showed that base vegeta is stronger than Gotenks before the future trunks arc even happened. If we need Goku's son and Vegeta's son, we still have Gohan and Future Trunks to use who have shown to be useful.


Then there is the whole mentor thing, well thats were these 3 saiyans come in because all 3 of them have surpassed Goten and Trunks, if Goku and Vegeta get a desire to train someone, it might be the people who have blown pass the 2 and maybe 3 forms of super saiyan.
'

If these 2 female saiyans are marketable, you will probably never see a full 5 minutes of Goten and Trunks ever again and anyone saying differently has not been watching super.

Thats true, if the girls are really selling merchandise like hotcakes then Toei will push them hard due to being the new moneymakers.

[SansrivaaL]

You're not answering the question. Why would Goku 'preserved stamina' to the point of letting Kale walked through his freaking attack and grabbed him? You're telling me that Goku couldn't raised his power to the point of at least pushing Kale back? This makes no sense other than trying to downplay Kale into the dirt.

An "because Kale was nothing more than an out of control little girl who he needed to be careful with or else he could accidentally kill her as she was pushing herself too much", who grabbed him and used Goku as a club. Plus, Goku doesn't think like this.

I did answer it despite me not needing to. If you didnt understand my answer then here
My answer is: he knows theres a bigger threat, Goku made it a point that he'll only raise his ki up by a little, that certain line was said for a reason, like it or not he only raised his ki by a little, as for his reasoning as to why he would do that then I gave you an answer already, 2 of them actually, one is him being careful or him preserving stamina, its not like Kale actually damaged him nor was any of the GoDs in awe with her. You're overhyping Kale far too much.

He was being careful, Kale wasnt a fighter at that time, she was an out of control little girl and thats a fact, as a martial artist ofc Goku would be careful, she was burning herself up, notice how on ep 101 Goku asked if she was fine being in her berserk state rather than being worried if she would attack him or go on a rampage again, he woulda been in a fighting pose if that were the case.

[Li'l Lemmy]

There is virtually no reason Goten and Trunks need to do anything in Super. Any reason for their existence have been destroyed. The pilaf gang are the cute kid characters doing shenanigans , fusions is no longer useful against anyone with real power, heck the copy and paste arc even showed that base vegeta is stronger than Gotenks before the future trunks arc even happened. If we need Goku's son and Vegeta's son, we still have Gohan and Future Trunks to use who have shown to be useful.

Powerscaling in Super is too inconsistent to be credible. I don't buy that anyone intentionally thought up with proper deliberation that Vegeta's base form should completely outclass a Super Saiyan 3 fusion, if only because there's just too much that contradicts it. So I personally do not sit here and say that if somehow Goten and Trunks are never useful, it is somehow related to one singular instance of contradictory evidence in an arc that Toriyama probably had nothing to do with.

But hey, that's just me.

Then there is the whole mentor thing, well thats were these 3 saiyans come in because all 3 of them have surpassed Goten and Trunks, if Goku and Vegeta get a desire to train someone, it might be the people who have blown pass the 2 and maybe 3 forms of super saiyan.

The U6 trio comes from another universe. I may be wrong on this, but I don't think either Goku or Vegeta will want to waste too much time making other universes overwhemingly stronger when if anything U6 is proof of reason to strengthen their own universe instead. Vegeta especially, who made such a big deal about not having a weak son during the previous arc, doesn't seem like the sort to just give up on his own blood for shiny new multiverse toys. I don't expect either of them to become a sensei anyway; Goku will have Oob in a few years and Vegeta doesn't seem to focus much outside of his own family. Yeah, he definitely has a thing with Cabba, and what seems to be a sincere desire to see him succeed, but he's not going to pull a Goku and leave to live in Universe 6 to train him when he already has Trunks and now also Bra to worry about.

If these 2 female saiyans are marketable, you will probably never see a full 5 minutes of Goten and Trunks ever again and anyone saying differently has not been watching super.

What are we really gonna do, switch the focus entirely to Universe 6? The girls have been around for a matter of months; it's not as though we suddenly need to rewrite DragonBall around them. I think it's just as possible that these saiyans disappear into their universe after the ToP and only occasionally appear after that. DragonBall is not the story of Universe 6, and it doesn't need to be. At least I certainly hope that this isn't what it becomes.

Yeah, things have been bad for Goten and Trunks lately- like, really bad in terms of purpose- but they still get plugged now and then, by Toei in particular. I don't think they're going to be just outright eliminated from everything to come based on shallow marketing, which doesn't really give us concrete evidence of what's going on with Caulifla and Kale anyway (yet). I'm not sure that Toriyama bothers to write his story to fit expectations like those, or even based on fan response. EoZ by itself seems to indicate that Goten and Trunks still have some kind of future. Hell, even from a marketing standpoint there's all the more reason to remake and reuse the boys as they get older; their mixed blood potential is still pretty deep, and I'm sure adult Gotenks would still be a thing worth making figures and shit out of.

But hey, I could be wrong. Horribly wrong. Personally, I'll probably take some major cues from the next big arc, whatever it happens to be. If Goten and Trunks get shafted again with no end in sight then my endurance to keep up with DBS will probably take too drastic a hit to recover. I have hope, but maybe not enough after 100+ episodes of basically nothing in terms of using or developing them gives way to what looks like another 100 that will do the same.

[Whatever]

After this arc I bet they'll be 10 slice of life fillers like before.

Then I fully expect EOZ. Trunks, Goten, Uub and to a lesser extent Pan will get tons of focus. Out with the old, in with the new.

As much I hate to say this, I'm starting to feel Cauli/Kale/Cabba are slowly being built up to replace Trunks and Goten

Bite your tongue. Goten and Trunks are sons of the main characters, and in EoZ. The U6 trio is nowhere to be seen.

If those saiyans "replace" characters from the original cast, then I'll want nothing to do with this series.

Funny thing you say that when Goten and Trunks were replacing the original cast before Toriyama decided to bring Goku back.
And they were replacing good characters as well during that point,at the least if Cauli/Kale/Cabba were to replace Trunks and Goten,they would be replacing someone with a little character and someone with almost no character.So nothing of value would be lost.

[Li'l Lemmy]

As much I hate to say this, I'm starting to feel Cauli/Kale/Cabba are slowly being built up to replace Trunks and Goten

Bite your tongue. Goten and Trunks are sons of the main characters, and in EoZ. The U6 trio is nowhere to be seen.

If those saiyans "replace" characters from the original cast, then I'll want nothing to do with this series.

Funny thing you say that when Goten and Trunks were replacing the original cast before Toriyama decided to bring Goku back.
And they were replacing good characters as well during that point,at the least if Cauli/Kale/Cabba were to replace Trunks and Goten,they would be replacing someone with a little character and someone with almost no character.So nothing of value would be lost.

There's a big difference for me in a natural progression of passing the torch from father to son and arbitrary replacement of characrers by others from an entirely different universe.

And while you are certainly entitled to your opinion, it is still subjective. I happen to think they have character worth developing and that something of value would indeed be lost if they were simply written over by the next new thing.

[Michsi]

Bite your tongue. Goten and Trunks are sons of the main characters, and in EoZ. The U6 trio is nowhere to be seen.

If those saiyans "replace" characters from the original cast, then I'll want nothing to do with this series.

Funny thing you say that when Goten and Trunks were replacing the original cast before Toriyama decided to bring Goku back.
And they were replacing good characters as well during that point,at the least if Cauli/Kale/Cabba were to replace Trunks and Goten,they would be replacing someone with a little character and someone with almost no character.So nothing of value would be lost.

There's a big difference for me in a natural progression of passing the torch from father to son and arbitrary replacement of characrers by others from an entirely different universe.

And while you are certainly entitled to your opinion, it is still subjective. I happen to think they have character worth developing and that something of value would indeed be lost if they were simply written over by the next new thing.

We keep mentioning EOZ, but I think people are forgetting one pretty important notion that the last chapter introduced, one that might throw a wrench into this whole next gen idea, especially where Goten and Trunks were concerned. Those two as teenagers have lost interest in fighting. Vegeta and Goku (and Piccolo I guess) are pretty much the only real fighters left and everyone else is either retired or disinterested in training. I believe that was the bittersweetness it was going for. Pan and Uub are a presented as the new hope because they are really, really young.

[Whatever]

There's a big difference for me in a natural progression of passing the torch from father to son and arbitrary replacement of characrers by others from an entirely different universe.

And while you are certainly entitled to your opinion, it is still subjective. I happen to think they have character worth developing and that something of value would indeed be lost if they were simply written over by the next new thing.

The natural progression of passing the torch was already done by Goku to Gohan in the cell saga already.
The kids being the only hope came out of nowhere and was forced pretty blatanly,it was worse for Goten because he came out of nowhere to begin with,at the least with Gohan and present Trunks we knew they existed since the Cell saga.
Heck we got Piccolo reduced to a babysitter(and later Gotenk's straightman) and Vegeta killed early in the saga to make room for them,the way Goten and Trunks took the spotlight was not natural at all.

I mean if we see things objectively,Trunks has a little character and Goten has almost none at all(then again hero told you already what needed to be told),even Nappa and Nail had more character than Goten.
If you accepted those 2 being forced into the spotlight(and in expence of better characters)i don't see whats the big deal when the U6 have more character than those 2 already.

[SirTorra]

I hope that when the inevitable planet salada saga comes along, that we are introduced to new female saiyans. I would prefer a more mature design for a female sayain/s. Here's hoping that caulifla was just a way to gauge how people reacted to a female saiyan. I mean toei has to realize that she was a mistake right? But hey, a person can dream can't they?

[Ziegander]

Why do so many of the posters here feel like they have to shit on other posters' favorite character(s) in order to validate their own favorite characters? It's not necessary to tell a Piccolo fan that Piccolo is a pathetic weakling in order to make a point that Caulifla and Kale are good characters. It's not necessary to say that saiyans are wankjob mary sue/gary stu that steal the spotlight from more interesting characters in order to make a point that Android 17 is a boss. It's not necessary to say that Tien is an idiot just because you support Krillin as strongest earthling.

This has been a public service announcement.

[Hawk9211]

Why do so many of the posters here feel like they have to shit on other posters' favorite character(s) in order to validate their own favorite characters? It's not necessary to tell a Piccolo fan that Piccolo is a pathetic weakling in order to make a point that Caulifla and Kale are good characters. It's not necessary to say that saiyans are wankjob mary sue/gary stu that steal the spotlight from more interesting characters in order to make a point that Android 17 is a boss. It's not necessary to say that Tien is an idiot just because you support Krillin as strongest earthling.

This has been a public service announcement.

^^^
On topic,I don’t like the tingly saiyans because I think we have already seen more than enough of the saiyans already.It would be much better if we spent time on other universes and other non saiyan characters.

[Cursemark505]

Because you were obviously trying to throw shade at her critics with the implication being that people don't know that Trunks and Goten got their forms off-screen, and that they haven't read the manga. So that makes her "okay".

If you’re big criticism of any character is that they transformations too fast and therefore make them less special, that’s a lousy and petty argument for any character for the reasons I named. Doubly so if you don’t know the source material.

If don’t like a character because of their personality, that’s a different matter.

Arguing with these posters is pointless. They'll continue being illogical no matter what you say.

[Li'l Lemmy]

Funny thing you say that when Goten and Trunks were replacing the original cast before Toriyama decided to bring Goku back.
And they were replacing good characters as well during that point,at the least if Cauli/Kale/Cabba were to replace Trunks and Goten,they would be replacing someone with a little character and someone with almost no character.So nothing of value would be lost.

There's a big difference for me in a natural progression of passing the torch from father to son and arbitrary replacement of characrers by others from an entirely different universe.

And while you are certainly entitled to your opinion, it is still subjective. I happen to think they have character worth developing and that something of value would indeed be lost if they were simply written over by the next new thing.

We keep mentioning EOZ, but I think people are forgetting one pretty important notion that the last chapter introduced, one that might throw a wrench into this whole next gen idea, especially where Goten and Trunks were concerned. Those two as teenagers have lost interest in fighting. Vegeta and Goku (and Piccolo I guess) are pretty much the only real fighters left and everyone else is either retired or disinterested in training. I believe that was the bittersweetness it was going for. Pan and Uub are a presented as the new hope because they are really, really young.

Sure, they're disinterested. They're fickle teenagers who we look in on for less than a day in total. But just like how Gohan keeps wanting to be a scholar and Kuririn keeps wanting to retire from martial arts, though, there's no reason why "disinterested in fighting" automatically equates to "they're done as characters" when we have plenty of prior instances of similarly disinterested characters stepping back into the spotlight.

[Michsi]

Sure, they're disinterested. They're fickle teenagers who we look in on for less than a day in total. But just like how Gohan keeps wanting to be a scholar and Kuririn keeps wanting to retire from martial arts, though, there's no reason why "disinterested in fighting" automatically equates to "they're done as characters" when we have plenty of prior instances of similarly disinterested characters stepping back into the spotlight.

Yeah, you can write around it. Not a fan of limitations because of previously established themes, especially in a story like Dragon Ball, where nothing is really set in stone and they have no problem with retconning when they feel like it. It's just something to keep in mind. EOZ is no guarantee they'll make Goten and Trunks more relevant. (would be nice though, Goten looks best with EOZ hair)
Besides, wouldn't EOZ technically signal the end of DBS? I know some fans like to think they'll disregard the finality of it, but that just goes against what they promised in the beginning.

[HeroR]

Sure, they're disinterested. They're fickle teenagers who we look in on for less than a day in total. But just like how Gohan keeps wanting to be a scholar and Kuririn keeps wanting to retire from martial arts, though, there's no reason why "disinterested in fighting" automatically equates to "they're done as characters" when we have plenty of prior instances of similarly disinterested characters stepping back into the spotlight.

Gohan is still a scholar and Krillin may retired again because of old age. So those are not the best arguments to make.

[Kinokima]

Why do so many of the posters here feel like they have to shit on other posters' favorite character(s) in order to validate their own favorite characters? It's not necessary to tell a Piccolo fan that Piccolo is a pathetic weakling in order to make a point that Caulifla and Kale are good characters. It's not necessary to say that saiyans are wankjob mary sue/gary stu that steal the spotlight from more interesting characters in order to make a point that Android 17 is a boss. It's not necessary to say that Tien is an idiot just because you support Krillin as strongest earthling.

This has been a public service announcement.

I couldn’t agree more with this!