Tournament of Power is a major let down

[Whatever]

Piccolo losing and arm is not good treatment. The sniper should have been ended by Piccolo and Gohan while Tien should have been saved for something else.

You have a very low bar for is considered good treatment.

Not really a low bar, just that mine is in a reality aspect on what to expect while yours is at a fanfic level.

While you are right on that,i don't see how you can call having a 15sec fight and being Gohan's meatshield 'good treatment'.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

My point is that is not good enough. Toriyama should not be randomly choosing who gets to look good when there was 70 fighters in the tournament so everyone should have got something good.

Roshi getting something does not stop the Goku and Vegeta thing and the characters that Toriyama shits on are the ones that don't deserve it at all.

There is no excuse for Toriyama to not give every single member of team Universe 7 in a tournament like this good moments. Unless Krillin and Tien get reinstated then Toriyama has failed to use his characters once again.

You're expecting too much if you think they'll all be handled to whats considered "good" for you, Krillin while not on the same level as Roshi, was still treated good to the point of Frost who's supposed to be on a higher playing field than him had to catch him off guard and ring him out, he even got some outs before he himself got benched.
Piccolo already showed some skills when taking down the red pig, and has saved Gohan from getting blasted and lost an arm, his treatment has already been better than Tien.

Tien has been the only one on U7 that got handled poorly.

Right. The cast is already getting more than expected and more than they should to be honest. We should have had more than 3 ring outs by now, it is just a case of fans having unreal expectations again, just cuz Goku chose them for the ToP doesn't mean anything other than they got chosen.

[Michsi]

The thing about returning characters is just annoying. It is like the order is

Goku
Vegeta
New and returning characters
Piccolo
Everyone else.

Seems like it. If they're going to focus on him being a smart fighter rather than a power based fighter than at least let get ahead using those smarts.

The Namekians not being mentioned in the summaries is not a bad thing. The people who think it is bad are the ones assuming that the Universe being destroyed in episode 118 is going to end up being Universe 6.

There is legitimate reason to think it might be U6, though. If Kefla is out, and if the namekians are the only ones left after her defeat, then once they lose it's over for U6 and that could all happen in 119. The episode title focusing more on the erasure of U6 rather than the namekian battle would make sense since it this involves the only other universe we've come to know so well.

[namekiansaiyan]

My point is that is not good enough. Toriyama should not be randomly choosing who gets to look good when there was 70 fighters in the tournament so everyone should have got something good.

Roshi getting something does not stop the Goku and Vegeta thing and the characters that Toriyama shits on are the ones that don't deserve it at all.

There is no excuse for Toriyama to not give every single member of team Universe 7 in a tournament like this good moments. Unless Krillin and Tien get reinstated then Toriyama has failed to use his characters once again.

You're expecting too much if you think they'll all be handled to whats considered "good" for you, Krillin while not on the same level as Roshi, was still treated good to the point of Frost who's supposed to be on a higher playing field than him had to catch him off guard and ring him out, he even got some outs before he himself got benched.
Piccolo already showed some skills when taking down the red pig, and has saved Gohan from getting blasted and lost an arm, his treatment has already been better than Tien.

Tien has been the only one on U7 that got handled poorly.

Right. The cast is already getting more than expected and more than they should to be honest. We should have had more than 3 ring outs by now, it is just a case of fans having unreal expectations again, just cuz Goku chose them for the ToP doesn't mean anything other than they got chosen.

This is the worst comment on the subject so far.

'The cast is already more than expected and more than they should to be honest' is completely not true. Tell me how Tien and Piccolo have got more than they deserve? The only person who has got more than they deserve is your favourite character.

The only reason we have had only 3 knockouts is because Goku steals all the screen time available.

The thing about returning characters is just annoying. It is like the order is

Goku
Vegeta
New and returning characters
Piccolo
Everyone else.

Seems like it. If they're going to focus on him being a smart fighter rather than a power based fighter than at least let get ahead using those smarts.

The Namekians not being mentioned in the summaries is not a bad thing. The people who think it is bad are the ones assuming that the Universe being destroyed in episode 118 is going to end up being Universe 6.

There is legitimate reason to think it might be U6, though. If Kefla is out, and if the namekians are the only ones left after her defeat, than once they lose it's over for U6 and that could all happen in 119. The episode title focusing more on the erasure of U6 rather than the namekian battle would make sense since it this involves the only other universe we've come to know so well.

Those battle smarts still need to be put into a good fight though. Since there are not really any characters that can return now maybe Piccolo might finally get a power up.

You are assuming that in episode 117 that Universe 2 has been dealt with or been scared away. It won't go into the background as once a fight is the focus it will continue being the focus until finished. What you are trying to say is that you think the Namekians are going in episode 118 and Piccolo is going out easily in episode 119 and Gohan is going to get a good moment in beating the bugs.

[Michsi]

Those battle smarts still need to be put into a good fight though. Since there are not really any characters that can return now maybe Piccolo might finally get a power up.

Cell. There is always Cell. People are asking for Cell, possibly even more so than they asked for 17. Also don't forget we still have Buu, who technically should still be above Piccolo in power. And Buu has been shafted twice now. He's bound to make a comeback at some point.

You are assuming that in episode 117 that Universe 2 has been dealt with or been scared away. It won't go into the background as once a fight is the focus it will continue being the focus until finished.

I'm leaning more towards U2 myself, but they also have more fighters left than U6.

[namekiansaiyan]

Those battle smarts still need to be put into a good fight though. Since there are not really any characters that can return now maybe Piccolo might finally get a power up.

Cell. There is always Cell. People are asking for Cell, possibly even more so than they asked for 17. Also don't forget we still have Buu, who technically should still be above Piccolo in power. And Buu has been shafted twice now. He's bound to make a comeback at some point.

You are assuming that in episode 117 that Universe 2 has been dealt with or been scared away. It won't go into the background as once a fight is the focus it will continue being the focus until finished.

I'm leaning more towards U2 myself, but they also have more fighters left than U6.

Buu, Piccolo and Tien are the characters that are allowed to be constantly messed around and I would like Cell as I like him way more than, 17, Frieza and Future Trunks but I don't how can could happen.

It is Universe 2 so I want to see 2 episodes in a row of Ribrianne and all her crap.

[JazzMazz]

Those battle smarts still need to be put into a good fight though. Since there are not really any characters that can return now maybe Piccolo might finally get a power up.

Cell. There is always Cell. People are asking for Cell, possibly even more so than they asked for 17. Also don't forget we still have Buu, who technically should still be above Piccolo in power. And Buu has been shafted twice now. He's bound to make a comeback at some point.

You are assuming that in episode 117 that Universe 2 has been dealt with or been scared away. It won't go into the background as once a fight is the focus it will continue being the focus until finished.

I'm leaning more towards U2 myself, but they also have more fighters left than U6.

Buu, Piccolo and Tien are the characters that are allowed to be constantly messed around and I would like Cell as I like him way more than, 17, Frieza and Future Trunks but I don't how can could happen.

It is Universe 2 so I want to see 2 episodes in a row of Ribrianne and all her crap.

Freeza coming back is bad enough, much less bringing back Cell, whose basically a discount version of Freeza with more plot holes and contrivances associated with him.

[Kinokima]

Cell. There is always Cell. People are asking for Cell, possibly even more so than they asked for 17. Also don't forget we still have Buu, who technically should still be above Piccolo in power. And Buu has been shafted twice now. He's bound to make a comeback at some point.



I'm leaning more towards U2 myself, but they also have more fighters left than U6.

Buu, Piccolo and Tien are the characters that are allowed to be constantly messed around and I would like Cell as I like him way more than, 17, Frieza and Future Trunks but I don't how can could happen.

It is Universe 2 so I want to see 2 episodes in a row of Ribrianne and all her crap.

Freeza coming back is bad enough, much less bringing back Cell, whose basically a discount version of Freeza with more plot holes and contrivances associated with him.

Yes god please do not let them bring back Cell. Let them come up with new villains.

Goku Black and Zamasu were fantastic I want more in that vein. Bringing back the same villains just cheapens them. I want a new challenge. And personally I want a villain that doesn't just rely on power/strength for the next arc. But now I think I am asking too much.

[AnimeNation101]

I like this arc so far

[IGhostUlt]

I totally agree with namekiansaiyan. The only thing I hate about this arc is that Goku is hogging all the spotlight. That is not OK. Especially in this type of arc. And what's even worse is that even though he is tired, he is STILL having all the episodes centered on him which is ridiculous!

[Asura]

So many people complaining about the returning characters not being used enough. So many people complaining about Goku being in every episode.

Did you just start watching Super from this arc forward? Have you conveniently forgotten every single other arc where Goku is in every single episode? Or maybe forgot every single other arc where the "returning cast" isn't even present, unless you count the travesty that was RoF.

So yeah, they could definitely be handling the cast a lot better, no argument there, but to whine about it and then go on about how other arcs were so much greater in this regard is just so contradictory and hypocritical it hurts.

[Hawk9211]

The tournament does not feel as a multiversal tournament.The amount of memorable characters and abilities is extremely low.

[Kinokima]

So many people complaining about the returning characters not being used enough. So many people complaining about Goku being in every episode.

Did you just start watching Super from this arc forward? Have you conveniently forgotten every single other arc where Goku is in every single episode? Or maybe forgot every single other arc where the "returning cast" isn't even present, unless you count the travesty that was RoF.

So yeah, they could definitely be handling the cast a lot better, no argument there, but to whine about it and then go on about how other arcs were so much greater in this regard is just so contradictory and hypocritical it hurts.

But the difference is this arc SHOULD be given opportunities for the extended cast to do more but doesn't.

The Future Trunks arc was better because it had a small cast and was tighter (it was actually a well paced arc until the disappointing ending) I don't think adding more characters would have been good for that arc. In most arcs you only have a few villains so even thought it can still be disappointing at least it makes a bit more sense that Goku would do the most.

In this arc you have many many different fighters and yet the extended cast is still is being wasted. That is what is the most unfortunate thing about this arc. It's a wasted opportunity.

[Asura]

So many people complaining about the returning characters not being used enough. So many people complaining about Goku being in every episode.

Did you just start watching Super from this arc forward? Have you conveniently forgotten every single other arc where Goku is in every single episode? Or maybe forgot every single other arc where the "returning cast" isn't even present, unless you count the travesty that was RoF.

So yeah, they could definitely be handling the cast a lot better, no argument there, but to whine about it and then go on about how other arcs were so much greater in this regard is just so contradictory and hypocritical it hurts.

But the difference is this arc SHOULD be given opportunities for the extended cast to do more but doesn't.

The Future Trunks arc was better because it had a small cast and was tighter (it was actually a well paced arc until the disappointing ending) I don't think adding more characters would have been good for that arc. In most arcs you only have a few villains so even thought it can still be disappointing at least it makes a bit more sense that Goku would do the most.

In this arc you have many many different fighters and yet the extended cast is still is being wasted. That is what is the most unfortunate thing about this arc. It's a wasted opportunity.

The Future Trunks arc had great pacing? I think you should go rewatch it because the pacing of that arc was horrible. Go to the future, get ass kicked, go back to the past, do nothing to get better, go to the future, get ass kicked, go back to the past. Do some actual training this time, go to the future, proceed to get ass kicked again, entire universe explodes, everyone dies, go back to the past, send Trunks to the future, The End.

Yes, the cast here isn't being made use of as much as they can and should be, there's no denying that. There's no denying that Goku is still in the spotlight too much. My point is, no one complained about these things when the other arcs were airing which goes back to a point I made a long time ago...

People had way too much expectations and way too much hype for this arc and thus, they end up disappointed. Super has never been a very good show compared to Z and DB. Most people know this, but forgot about it before entering this arc. After all these episodes you guys should know Super by now and know what it's capable of and know how things were going to go down. Does that mean you can't be disappointed? Does that mean you can't ask for more quality? No, it doesn't. Just people shouldn't go around saying this is the worst arc in the existence of the franchise (even worse than Super 17? Like c'mon now) when it has many of the exact same faults of the previous arcs (which are highly praised sometimes despite these very glaring faults that are often times on worse display than in this one) but still manages to do things greater than those old arcs.

This arc is not the worst thing to ever happen to Dragon Ball, it's just people who are upset and angry that they expected way too much out of a mediocre-at-best show.

[emperior]

I feel what's throwing me out of this arc is the fighting overdose, more than the inconsistent power scaling.

We're in the 20th episode in a row of just fighting. For example in the previous major arc, and it was like 50 episodes ago already (Future Trunks arc).
Back than, we had like only 3 or 4 episodes filled of fighting out of 20 episodes, so every battle felt special & unique.

They had layers to it, beacause of the stakes (but should be the same, if not more in the TOP), beacause of the developed carachters involved, beacause of an actual storyline.

That's my problem with tournaments that goes on for that long.
You get tired with it.
U6 tournament is acceptable beacause it last like 12 episodes. But this arc is set to reach 40-50 episodes lenght and will go on till march, entire months of just fighting dull carachters.

Barring a possible plot twist with an Evil Grand Priest or similar, this arc is going to end up in a borefest.

I agree with everything you wrote.
While having this large amount of episodes makes it possible for Toei to improve the schedule, and give us better art and animation, I feel like the pacing is very slow and I would have preferred to see the tournament go like:
97 - U9 Erased + some elimination here and there
98 - U10 Erased + some elimination here and there
99 - 7 Pride Troopers eliminated
100 - Episode 108
101 - Goku vs Jiren (ep109) + some other eliminations
102 - Episode 110 + Jiren vs Hit
103 - Cabba out. Goku vs Saiyan girls, ends with Kefla

I'm quite sure all the episodes we got so far could have been condensed into less episodes. Maybe not so few like I listed, but definitely fewer than what we got.
Anyways, this pacing doesn't worry me. It's quite boring because we only get one episode a week and we have fighting overdose as you said. I'm sure that this arc will be fine once it will come to countries that air one new episode every day, and it will be fine on rewatch except for a few episodes. Still, this arc is much more enjoyable than DBZ, pacing wise. The episodes aren't boring and there's usually something interesting going on.

[Ripper 30]

Yes, i just want it to end Because it sucks. The pacing is garbage, there is no sense of seriousness or any tension. The Characterization is bad. It doesn't even feel like a battle royal but some 1on 1 fight and They are dedicating complete episodes for single fights, the most of the newycharacters aren't even much interesting and act like fucking weak ass morons to be a punching bag for Universe 7 Except a few. I don't know how They will drag this Boring as hell arc till March as They are already running out of ideas and there doesn't seem to be any planning. The ToP did feature some cool fights and Soundtracks but that's it, it doesn't really seem to be as Good as the fans were hyping, i found Gokū Black Arc Atleast engaging cinosfed to this trash.

[Kinokima]

So many people complaining about the returning characters not being used enough. So many people complaining about Goku being in every episode.

Did you just start watching Super from this arc forward? Have you conveniently forgotten every single other arc where Goku is in every single episode? Or maybe forgot every single other arc where the "returning cast" isn't even present, unless you count the travesty that was RoF.

So yeah, they could definitely be handling the cast a lot better, no argument there, but to whine about it and then go on about how other arcs were so much greater in this regard is just so contradictory and hypocritical it hurts.

But the difference is this arc SHOULD be given opportunities for the extended cast to do more but doesn't.

The Future Trunks arc was better because it had a small cast and was tighter (it was actually a well paced arc until the disappointing ending) I don't think adding more characters would have been good for that arc. In most arcs you only have a few villains so even thought it can still be disappointing at least it makes a bit more sense that Goku would do the most.

In this arc you have many many different fighters and yet the extended cast is still is being wasted. That is what is the most unfortunate thing about this arc. It's a wasted opportunity.

The Future Trunks arc had great pacing? I think you should go rewatch it because the pacing of that arc was horrible. Go to the future, get ass kicked, go back to the past, do nothing to get better, go to the future, get ass kicked, go back to the past. Do some actual training this time, go to the future, proceed to get ass kicked again, entire universe explodes, everyone dies, go back to the past, send Trunks to the future, The End.

Yes, the cast here isn't being made use of as much as they can and should be, there's no denying that. There's no denying that Goku is still in the spotlight too much. My point is, no one complained about these things when the other arcs were airing which goes back to a point I made a long time ago...

People had way too much expectations and way too much hype for this arc and thus, they end up disappointed. Super has never been a very good show compared to Z and DB. Most people know this, but forgot about it before entering this arc. After all these episodes you guys should know Super by now and know what it's capable of and know how things were going to go down. Does that mean you can't be disappointed? Does that mean you can't ask for more quality? No, it doesn't. Just people shouldn't go around saying this is the worst arc in the existence of the franchise (even worse than Super 17? Like c'mon now) when it has many of the exact same faults of the previous arcs (which are highly praised sometimes despite these very glaring faults that are often times on worse display than in this one) but still manages to do things greater than those old arcs.

This arc is not the worst thing to ever happen to Dragon Ball, it's just people who are upset and angry that they expected way too much out of a mediocre-at-best show.

I am not saying this is the worst arc ever nor do I agree that it is garbage as some would say. That would mean it has no redeeming qualities and I don't think that. On an episode to episode basis it may even be enjoyable it's just also ultimately a disappointment because it can easily be so much more than it is.

And yes I do think the Future Trunks arc was much better paced and written with great atmosphere. If it wasn't for the extremely disappointing ending (and overly confusing time lines) I would have said that it was best arc of Super. Unfortunately the ending brings it down a lot.

Who knows maybe this will be the opposite and this arc will have an excellent ending which will wash away some of the disappointment.

[Asura]

Who knows maybe this will be the opposite and this arc will have an excellent ending which will wash away some of the disappointment.

Yes, I think this will be an arc that gets better as it comes further and further towards the end. We already saw this starting from 104 and on where the episodes just got better and better, with the exception of a few like 106. I think this will be an arc that is known for a disappointing first half and a satisfactory, hopefully great second half. The second half ofcourse is from the Jiren fight and onwards, so Goku vs Jiren, Hit vs Jiren, Cabba vs Freeza, Gohan and Piccolo vs Daily and Dose, Vegeta vs Toppo, Goku vs Caulifla and Kale, and Goku vs Kafla. Not all of these fights have been explored yet, but they will be and while it might seem horrible now to have Goku vs U6 Saiyan girls for 3 episodes in a row, when you're binge watching the arc after it ends you'll realize it's nice to have a 3 episode long fight because you can just go right to the next episode after that fight ends. IMO fights lasting more than an episode is what Super is desperately lacking.

All of these match-ups are much more interesting than the fodder in the first half, and I think the quality in animation and art has mostly been improving every episode.

So yeah, hopefully as we go forward it won't be as disappointing.

[Doctor.]

I guess this is one of those instances where even visual consistency cannot save it.

When does that ever happen?

[Saturnine]

Holy shit, I had no idea this arc was so hated