"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[Michsi]

It really isn’t to make 17 cool. That’s his personality. He doesn’t care if he wins or loses which is why he has an aura of indifferent. And given his power, most people are fodder to him.

No, he has been written differently. He was an extremely cocky and arrogant person back in Z who showcased much more emotion when he fought. I prefer this #17 but, just like Freeza, there's been a change in his personality.

They didn’t change his personally. He matured. He’s no longer a rebel without a cause.

Freeza is also the same, but he’s much wiser now.

That's what it's supposed to be, yet I still can't help but feel that this is practically #16 in #17's body. I was hoping for that easy-going fun loving kid character, instead I got a dispassionate do-gooder that somehow also doesn't care if his family gets erased.

Freeza is an interesting case, because I'll have to see until the end just how much he "matured." He's always been this smug and smarmy when he thought he had the upper hand, it's when things don't go his way that all his composure breaks down. The new thing here is that he now casually accepts the fact that there are other beings stronger than him instead of throwing a tantrum.

[precita]

Freeza will go back to his sadistic ways when he has the upper hand.

[HeroR]

No, he has been written differently. He was an extremely cocky and arrogant person back in Z who showcased much more emotion when he fought. I prefer this #17 but, just like Freeza, there's been a change in his personality.

They didn’t change his personally. He matured. He’s no longer a rebel without a cause.

Freeza is also the same, but he’s much wiser now.

That's what it's supposed to be, yet I still can't help but feel that this is practically #16 in #17's body. I was hoping for that easy-going fun loving kid character, instead I got a dispassionate do-gooder that somehow also doesn't care if his family gets erased.

Freeza is an interesting case, because I'll have to see until the end just how much he "matured." He's always been this smug and smarmy when he thought he had the upper hand, it's when things don't go his way that all his composure breaks down. The new thing here is that he now casually accepts the fact that there are other beings stronger than him instead of throwing a tantrum.

17 doesn’t really act like 16. 16 would have fought for life, while 17 is most indifferent. And 17 is almost twenty years from the Cell Saga with a job and family. Why would he be a ‘fun loving kid character’?

[The_Destroyer]

I hope 17 goes out to Aniraza. To me, he's boring and overrated as hell. They write him so that all his opponents are complete fodder, while he looks completely bored in every fight in barely fights, just so he looks "cool". Well, it's not cool, it's forced as hell. It's time they have 17 actually sturggle against someone for once, Aniraza better deliver.

It really isn’t to make 17 cool. That’s his personality. He doesn’t care if he wins or loses which is why he has an aura of indifferent. And given his power, most people are fodder to him.

No offense, but why do you feel need to put out a defense for every single criticism for Super? Like everytime in this thread when someone criticizes super, a few posts later I see you making excuses for it.

The entire point of him getting this new personality was to make him cool. Maybe it's just me, but I don't find it very him entertaining. I find Tien, someone who many people consider to be boring, to be more interesting than him, but maybe that's because he's weak enough to where there's tension in his fights. Meanwhile all 17 has done is just shit on fodder. He gets these fights because the writers want to jam in our heads that "17 is a total badass! He always wins and doesnt afraids of anythig!!1!". Maybe I'd like the character more if he actually got a fight where he sturggles and I'm hoping Aniraza does. And judging by the NEP he does.

[Michsi]

They didn’t change his personally. He matured. He’s no longer a rebel without a cause.

Freeza is also the same, but he’s much wiser now.

That's what it's supposed to be, yet I still can't help but feel that this is practically #16 in #17's body. I was hoping for that easy-going fun loving kid character, instead I got a dispassionate do-gooder that somehow also doesn't care if his family gets erased.

Freeza is an interesting case, because I'll have to see until the end just how much he "matured." He's always been this smug and smarmy when he thought he had the upper hand, it's when things don't go his way that all his composure breaks down. The new thing here is that he now casually accepts the fact that there are other beings stronger than him instead of throwing a tantrum.

17 doesn’t really act like 16. 16 would have fought for life, while 17 is most indifferent. And 17 is almost twenty years from the Cell Saga with a job and family. Why would he be a ‘fun loving kid character’?

You'd think anyone would've fought for life, but this level of come-what-may calmness in the face of annihilation feels more like something you'd see in 16 rather than 17.
As for him still being a fun-loving kid- as far as I can tell the androids don't age, so they could've very well went in that direction instead of "married with three kids". One thing in particular that made me think he might still be a bit on the juvenile side was that one panel with him in the Buu Saga. He was clearly holding a riffle there when he very obviously doesn't need any weapon. We saw in the Cell Saga that he likes guns and cars, so I took that as a sign of him still having that side.

[HeroR]

No offense, but why do you feel need to put out a defense for every single criticism for Super? Like everytime in this thread when someone criticizes super, a few posts later I see you making excuses for it.

The entire point of him getting this new personality was to make him cool. Maybe it's just me, but I don't find it very him entertaining. I find Tien, someone who many people consider to be boring, to be more interesting than him, but maybe that's because he's weak enough to where there's tension in his fights. Meanwhile all 17 has done is just shit on fodder. He gets these fights because the writers want to jam in our heads that "17 is a total badass! He always wins and doesnt afraids of anythig!!1!". Maybe I'd like the character more if he actually got a fight where he sturggles and I'm hoping Aniraza does. And judging by the NEP he does.

Calling what comments as ‘making excuses for it’ comes off as not addressing the issue. Especially in this case I simply disagree with the whole ‘they change 17 to make him cool’ instead of natural character development.

And most of your post comes off as personal issues with the character then anything I can argued objectively. 17 to me isn’t trying to act cool. He’s just disinterested in most things, while still having a sense of humor like his interaction with U2, something we would never get out of someone like Tien. To me, ‘force coolness’ would be something like TFS Tien.

And most of U7 have shat on fodder, so why 17 a issue?

You'd think anyone would've fought for life, but this level of come-what-may calmness in the face of annihilation feels more like something you'd see in 16 rather than 17.
As for him still being a fun-loving kid- as far as I can tell the androids don't age, so they could've very well went in that direction instead of "married with three kids". One thing in particular that made me think he might still be a bit on the juvenile side was that one panel with him in the Buu Saga. He was clearly holding a riffle there when he very obviously doesn't need any weapon. We saw in the Cell Saga that he likes guns and cars, so I took that as a sign of him still having that side.

17 still has a playful side as seen with U2 and telling Maron that he’s 17 years old. It just isn’t his dominated personality anymore. Not aging also doesn’t mean keeping the same personality you had ten years ago. He also drives a Jeep despite being able to fly, so that part of him remains.

16 would have joined the U7 team right aware to protect life, no have a ‘so be it’ calmness.

[The Monkey King]

Just a little random thing, but remeber when people were theorising that the other Hakaishin would look like other Neko Majin:



Can't lie I'm glad that wasn't the case

But it makes me wonder though, why is it that Hakaishin is a role that mortals can be "promoted" into while Gods of creation and Angels are born as one?

Why not have Hakaishin be there own species as well?

[omaro34]

So far behind. Been so busy the last few days haven't had time to check what's been going on.

Not surprised about the new film coming a year from now. I don't know the specifics on how the animators work, but I hope since this movie is in production it wouldn't affect the quality of Super. Can someone let me know if it's a legitimate concern or not? I'm no expert in this matter.

The Saiyan theme doesn't surprise me. The show revolves around them, although I feel I already know enough about the Saiyans to last Kami's lifetime. Maybe we will learn more about why they get Zen kai boosts, and their history before Freeza conquering them. But I'm willing to give it a chance. Looking forward to seeing new characters.

[Totamo]

I hope 17 goes out to Aniraza. To me, he's boring and overrated as hell. They write him so that all his opponents are complete fodder, while he looks completely bored in every fight in barely fights, just so he looks "cool". Well, it's not cool, it's forced as hell. It's time they have 17 actually sturggle against someone for once, Aniraza better deliver.

It really isn’t to make 17 cool. That’s his personality. He doesn’t care if he wins or loses which is why he has an aura of indifferent. And given his power, most people are fodder to him.

No offense, but why do you feel need to put out a defense for every single criticism for Super? Like everytime in this thread when someone criticizes super, a few posts later I see you making excuses for it.

The entire point of him getting this new personality was to make him cool. Maybe it's just me, but I don't find it very him entertaining. I find Tien, someone who many people consider to be boring, to be more interesting than him, but maybe that's because he's weak enough to where there's tension in his fights. Meanwhile all 17 has done is just shit on fodder. He gets these fights because the writers want to jam in our heads that "17 is a total badass! He always wins and doesnt afraids of anythig!!1!". Maybe I'd like the character more if he actually got a fight where he sturggles and I'm hoping Aniraza does. And judging by the NEP he does.

This is like me saying if Yamcha got 3 good fights in this show, the entire point would be to make him useful when I still would just be laughing at him because they know these are fodder being beaten by the king fodder himself. Its a baseless assumption that only comes off as someone who has a gripe with a character.


17 getting a new personality wasn't to show he was cool, it was to show he isn't the same as he was before and he grew in the timeskip. They do this with everyone in the show.

[omaro34]

It really isn’t to make 17 cool. That’s his personality. He doesn’t care if he wins or loses which is why he has an aura of indifferent. And given his power, most people are fodder to him.

No offense, but why do you feel need to put out a defense for every single criticism for Super? Like everytime in this thread when someone criticizes super, a few posts later I see you making excuses for it.

The entire point of him getting this new personality was to make him cool. Maybe it's just me, but I don't find it very him entertaining. I find Tien, someone who many people consider to be boring, to be more interesting than him, but maybe that's because he's weak enough to where there's tension in his fights. Meanwhile all 17 has done is just shit on fodder. He gets these fights because the writers want to jam in our heads that "17 is a total badass! He always wins and doesnt afraids of anythig!!1!". Maybe I'd like the character more if he actually got a fight where he sturggles and I'm hoping Aniraza does. And judging by the NEP he does.

This is like me saying if Yamcha got 3 good fights in this show, the entire point would be to make him useful when I still would just be laughing at him because they know these are fodder being beaten by the king fodder himself. Its a baseless assumption that only comes off as someone who has a gripe with a character.


17 getting a new personality wasn't to show he was cool, it was to show he isn't the same as he was before and he grew in the timeskip. They do this with everyone in the show.

I actually like 17 in this arc. And that's saying a lot coming from me.

I absolutely hated 17 for years. Not the one we know, but the 17 from future Trunks' timeline. Those bastards were heartless monsters, and seeing Future Gohan die valiantly when they ganged up on him when he had one arm made me hate them both more, that was one of the most emotional scenes in the entire franchise, canon or not. I'm referring to the movie.

That's why I loved when Trunks killed them both. It's one thing to have a motive to do evil things, it's another to do it for fun, and that's exactly what those androids were doing, killing for fun.

I unfairly categorized that monster to the main timeline 17, but since we haven't seen him till this arc that didn't matter.

Anyway my point is that 17 in this arc made me forgot about how much of a douchebag his evil future counterpart was, and that's a testament to how well they have handled his character.

[Noah]

So, do you guys think Aniraza eliminates both Androids, or only 18? I love 17, but it would be great to see them both go out at once rather than seperately.

Not only the androids but I would like him to eliminate Gohan too, he overstayed his welcome. Let the top dogs of U7 battle the hotshots from U11:

Vegeta vs. Jiren
Freeza vs. Toppo
Goku vs. Dyspo

No, he has been written differently. He was an extremely cocky and arrogant person back in Z who showcased much more emotion when he fought. I prefer this #17 but, just like Freeza, there's been a change in his personality.

And you think that's bad..?

[BlueVegerot]

Why do people want to see goku vs dyspo?

[precita]

Why do people want to see goku vs dyspo?

Who said that? I barely see anyone mention that.

[Noah]

Why do people want to see goku vs dyspo?

Well, Dyspo gave him a hard time on their previous match, Hit was the one who got the upperhand, sure Goku is more interested on Jiren, but it would be good for him to settle the score before the "main dish".

[Dbzfan94]

Why do people want to see goku vs dyspo?

Who said that? I barely see anyone mention that.

The person 2 posts above yours.

[Doctor.]

And you think that's bad..?

I literally said I prefer this #17.

[Jigurashi]

Goku fighting any of the remaining Pride Troopers would be a rematch lol.

[Noah]

I literally said I prefer this #17.

I meant about Freeza too, you think the writers changing their personalities could be called 'character progression'?

[ArchedThunder]

Not surprised about the new film coming a year from now. I don't know the specifics on how the animators work, but I hope since this movie is in production it wouldn't affect the quality of Super. Can someone let me know if it's a legitimate concern or not? I'm no expert in this matter.

As long as the next arc isn't as action packed as the ToP and they plan it well enough there shouldn't be a noticeable drop in quality for the show, though we could lose a few regulars here and there for a bit and we might go without people like Shida and Otsuka for awhile again.

[The_Destroyer]

No offense, but why do you feel need to put out a defense for every single criticism for Super? Like everytime in this thread when someone criticizes super, a few posts later I see you making excuses for it.

The entire point of him getting this new personality was to make him cool. Maybe it's just me, but I don't find it very him entertaining. I find Tien, someone who many people consider to be boring, to be more interesting than him, but maybe that's because he's weak enough to where there's tension in his fights. Meanwhile all 17 has done is just shit on fodder. He gets these fights because the writers want to jam in our heads that "17 is a total badass! He always wins and doesnt afraids of anythig!!1!". Maybe I'd like the character more if he actually got a fight where he sturggles and I'm hoping Aniraza does. And judging by the NEP he does.

Calling what comments as ‘making excuses for it’ comes off as not addressing the issue. Especially in this case I simply disagree with the whole ‘they change 17 to make him cool’ instead of natural character development.

And most of your post comes off as personal issues with the character then anything I can argued objectively. 17 to me isn’t trying to act cool. He’s just disinterested in most things, while still having a sense of humor like his interaction with U2, something we would never get out of someone like Tien. To me, ‘force coolness’ would be something like TFS Tien.

And most of U7 have shat on fodder, so why 17 a issue?

Okay fine, I concede that this new personality was to show how much 17 has changed over years, I get that. But that doesn't change the fact that to me, his fights are boring. He just fights fodder, and barely struggles at all. Everyone else(bar Frieza) has had their fair share of struggles, but yet 17 comes in taking up screentime with his boring ass fights. Maybe it was wrong of me to say they are there just to make him look cool, and tbh they do sometimes, but at this point I'm like we get it, 17's cool, now stop with wasting screentime with the fodder stomps and actually let him struggle for once.

It really isn’t to make 17 cool. That’s his personality. He doesn’t care if he wins or loses which is why he has an aura of indifferent. And given his power, most people are fodder to him.

No offense, but why do you feel need to put out a defense for every single criticism for Super? Like everytime in this thread when someone criticizes super, a few posts later I see you making excuses for it.

The entire point of him getting this new personality was to make him cool. Maybe it's just me, but I don't find it very him entertaining. I find Tien, someone who many people consider to be boring, to be more interesting than him, but maybe that's because he's weak enough to where there's tension in his fights. Meanwhile all 17 has done is just shit on fodder. He gets these fights because the writers want to jam in our heads that "17 is a total badass! He always wins and doesnt afraids of anythig!!1!". Maybe I'd like the character more if he actually got a fight where he sturggles and I'm hoping Aniraza does. And judging by the NEP he does.

This is like me saying if Yamcha got 3 good fights in this show, the entire point would be to make him useful when I still would just be laughing at him because they know these are fodder being beaten by the king fodder himself. Its a baseless assumption that only comes off as someone who has a gripe with a character.


17 getting a new personality wasn't to show he was cool, it was to show he isn't the same as he was before and he grew in the timeskip. They do this with everyone in the show.

Read what I said above.