"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[Hawk9211]

I wonder how Toyotaro will handle Hit vs Jiren. The manga version of Hit was far inferior to SSB Goku /Vegeta in power and his time skip not only didn’t improve to 0.5 seconds but it also can only be used a limited amount of times when he’s at full power + it doesn’t work at all on stronger foes. I’m very curious to see how Hit traps Jiren if he does at all

I think hit will get a big boost.

I wonder what new techniques and/or forms, Toyotaro might introduce for Team 7. Future Trunks had the Taiyoken and Healing, Vegeta the SSG form and Gamma Burst Flash, Goku the Hakai move and Android 17 displayed an Supernova-like energy ball attack. He also introduced the Mastered SSB concept for Goku and Vegeta. Here's some of the things I would like to see for some characters.

Android 18, the Kamehameha, she's been married to Krillin for years, so her knowing it wouldn't be impossible. The Tri-Beam figured it out after watching Tien perform against Semi-Perfect Cell.
Piccolo, the Kaioken, if it was to be introduced into the manga, Piccolo is the likeliest candidate to have learned it off screen, maybe after his performance in the U6 tournament was a wake up call, also bring back the Light Grenade.
Tien, the Dodon Ray seriously when was the last time he used this, the Taiyoken lets have the inventor of the technique use it for crying out loud, the Four-Arms form another technique Toriyama didn't bother with after Dragonball, also have him use Ki attacks while in his Four-Arms form cause we've never seen him do that.
Android 17, the Hell Flash, after watching Android 16 perform it against Imperfect Cell, 17 figured out how to mimic it.
(Ultimate)Gohan, the Special Beam Cannon, he was trained by Piccolo so him knowing it isn't impossible.
Krillin, the Spirit Ball as a tribute to Yamcha.
Master Roshi(MAX), the Wolf Fang Fist as another tribute to Yamcha.

I would prefer new techniques and abilities instead of shuffling and variations.

[OLKv3]

Hit wasn't far inferior to SSB in the manga. He was weaker sure, but he looked pretty ok after dodging Goku's full powered Kamehameha. He looked like he could continue fighting and even Goku picked up on it

[OLKv3]

People think Toyotaro's not a good storyteller? Aside from the fact that his arcs have all been much tighter, funnier, and more coherent than the anime counterparts.

That's your opinion only as I think the anime explores more the plot than the manga that relies too much on exposition dump and homages to the original work.

The anime is just as guilty with the "homages" though

[buutenks]

I wonder how Toyotaro will handle Hit vs Jiren. The manga version of Hit was far inferior to SSB Goku /Vegeta in power and his time skip not only didn’t improve to 0.5 seconds but it also can only be used a limited amount of times when he’s at full power + it doesn’t work at all on stronger foes. I’m very curious to see how Hit traps Jiren if he does at all

He wasnt far weaker than ssj blue. Since he was able to dodge the kameha. I am sure Hit got stronger, so he will do decently and then get stomped like in the anime.

Edit: I cant wait for ToP manga to also finish, so i can just start the manga from chapter 1 and have a nice read.

[ToshioWrites]

I wonder how Toyotaro will handle Hit vs Jiren. The manga version of Hit was far inferior to SSB Goku /Vegeta in power and his time skip not only didn’t improve to 0.5 seconds but it also can only be used a limited amount of times when he’s at full power + it doesn’t work at all on stronger foes. I’m very curious to see how Hit traps Jiren if he does at all

He wasnt far weaker than ssj blue. Since he was able to dodge the kameha. I am sure Hit got stronger, so he will do decently and then get stomped like in the anime.

Edit: I cant wait for ToP manga to also finish, so i can just start the manga from chapter 1 and have a nice read.

Dodging one kamehameha doesn't mean his raw power was close to ssb. Even if he gets stronger, Jiren is stronger than gods of destruction so the gap between Hit vs Jiren will be much bigger than Hit vs Goku and that fight in the manga wasn't very interesting

[buutenks]

Dodging one kamehameha doesn't mean his raw power was close to ssb. Even if he gets stronger, Jiren is stronger than gods of destruction so the gap between Hit vs Jiren will be much bigger than Hit vs Goku and that fight in the manga wasn't very interesting

Jiren will obviously be suppressed, or maybe he will downright stomp Hit from the get go.

The fight was interesting to me tho, so i enjoyed it.

[Noah]

The anime is just as guilty with the "homages" though

They drop it after the Champa arc IIRC, Toyotaro still does these often.

[prince212]

Talking about homepages , cover of volume 3 is amazing !!! I realize with vol.3 Japanese book in my hands that under the dust jacket there’s an illustration in the back of all the Japanese volumes that usually its kind of same style of main cover but with different characters , vol 1 has Vegeta and porunga instead of Goku and sheuron , vol 2 is an analogy too and vol 3 covers are amazing , Toriyama loves covers with cars and Toyo made it to the next level both in the front and the back ....
I think that this idea of playing with the front and back cover is great , don’t know if Toriyama made it before , if it was jump comics or Toyotaro,s idea , but I love it , too bad that viz is not giving us those back under covers , we are missing some art goodies from Toyotarō in the English manga physical books

[Spider-Man]

They drop it after the Champa arc IIRC, Toyotaro still does these often.

No they still use homage,is not fair to berate the manga for this while the Anime does this in some of the new episode,hell kale is a literally broly homage and the whole fight of Goku vs Jiren was a rethread of Namek and don't tell me Aniraza is original with the portal or design.Now I'm gonna post some of the homages that no one noticed[spoiler] [/spoiler] There's more out there like how UI Goku dodging Kefla first attack is a nod to Goku vs reccome but I couldn't find them in images.

[Noah]

The whole fight of Goku vs Jiren was a rethread of Namek and...

It was not really a rethread of the Namek battle as Goku didn't unlocked his transformation by rage and he didn't stomp Jiren afterwards.

Now I'm gonna post some of the homages that no one noticed[spoiler] [/spoiler] There's more out there like how UI Goku dodging Kefla first attack is a nod to Goku vs reccome but I couldn't find them in images.

Sorry but from all these, I think Hell Fighter #17 and Black is a little bit forced. Also these are in a few episodes, we don't get homages in every episode like Toyotaro does in every chapter.

[prince212]

The whole fight of Goku vs Jiren was a rethread of Namek and...

It was not really a rethread of the Namek battle as Goku didn't unlocked his transformation by rage and he didn't stomp Jiren afterwards.

Now I'm gonna post some of the homages that no one noticed[spoiler] [/spoiler] There's more out there like how UI Goku dodging Kefla first attack is a nod to Goku vs reccome but I couldn't find them in images.

Sorry but from all these, I think Hell Fighter #17 and Black is a little bit forced. Also these are in a few episodes, we don't get homages in every episode like Toyotaro does in every chapter.

I would like to see some of these homeages for example in the last two chapters , most of the ones that people point are also forced , there is fans or haters of the manga just looking for a single coincidence ... clouds or similar attack positions ... and sincerely I don’t want a big change in poses , capoeria or different artial marts .
Anyways homeage or similarities are necessary in my opinion , both anime -manga ...to keep the essence of dragon ball brand , always open to new things of course .
But ehh , I respect all opinions

[kemuri07]

The anime is just as guilty with the "homages" though

They drop it after the Champa arc IIRC, Toyotaro still does these often.

So we're gonna forget there's an entire character based on Broly, huh?

Sure.

[batistabus]

"Homage" really isn't even the right word for what Toyotaro does. He openly admits that he has the original manga handy whenever he draws Super, and he does this so it will feel familiar to fans. It's not because he can't come up with poses, and it's not because he necessarily even wants to pay respect to a certain panel (which is what "homage" actually means). He does it so you'll look at what he's drawing and your brain will feel like it's the Dragon Ball you're familiar with. It's a subtle and effective trick, and it's not a matter of laziness or lack of talent. If you feel this is distracting or unnecessary, fine, but I feel like there is a large misconception around his utilization of this technique.

[JulianStyles]

Whos ready for the Tenshinhan recruitment and see how Toriyama intended things to go? Hope he still has his dojo but without the Yurin and possesed Roshi bullshit. It would be nice if Gohan & Piccolo vs Goku & Tenshinhan is Toriyamas idea. I'm sure Toyotaro would do it better and not make it a Gohan vs Goku fest and give us what we imagined. An actual team up battle.

[Whatever]

Whos ready for the Tenshinhan recruitment and see how Toriyama intended things to go? Hope he still has his dojo but without the Yurin and possesed Roshi bullshit. It would be nice if Gohan & Piccolo vs Goku & Tenshinhan is Toriyamas idea. I'm sure Toyotaro would do it better and not make it a Gohan vs Goku fest and give us what we imagined. An actual team up battle.

I assume you must have access to Toriyama's outline to make that claim.
Tien getting owned in the manga version of this battle as well won't change anything.

[emperior]

"Homage" really isn't even the right word for what Toyotaro does. He openly admits that he has the original manga handy whenever he draws Super, and he does this so it will feel familiar to fans. It's not because he can't come up with poses, and it's not because he necessarily even wants to pay respect to a certain panel (which is what "homage" actually means). He does it so you'll look at what he's drawing and your brain will feel like it's the Dragon Ball you're familiar with. It's a subtle and effective trick, and it's not a matter of laziness or lack of talent. If you feel this is distracting or unnecessary, fine, but I feel like there is a large misconception around his utilization of this technique.

To be honest most people wouldn't even notice homages. I myself don't notice most of those until people point them out. An homage here and there won't do much harm, I guess. And if they are effective into tricking fans that they are indeed reading Dragon Ball's continuation, then it's an effective method.

[STH]

There is no logic in the DBS series of power scale. I hope this series is considered an alternative continuing story in the future.

But you can consider as that. Dragon Ball has two continuities: anime and manga, the latter being the original work, which should be regarded as the only canon. Super has no connection with anything there.

But is not the Super Series considered to be the continuation of the original manga series?

Toyotaro says so here;
https://youtu.be/Ti89i2EZjWE
0.03-0.10

So are you evaluating the Super series as a non-canon?

[STH]

I hope this series is considered an alternative continuing story in the future.

These new stories aren't just what brought the franchise back but they're also from the original author so the chances of them just being forgotten or set aside for a "new" Z sequel are slim to none. Super and whatever future Toriyama stories are as important to everyone involved with the franchise as the original manga is.

Modern DB has produced a lot of fan favorite material like Beerus and Black (he was taken from us too soon. ) so it would make 0 sense to remove them from "canon".

It's true that it came from the original author but you know, Akira-san only gives a story-draft to Toyotaro and Toei.

https://youtu.be/Ti89i2EZjWE
5.16-5.41

"I receive the whole story, but it's only a narrative outline. There is no dialogue, for instance. So I have to complete the story and sometimes divert its course while keeping the main storyline."

Those who receive the draft are adding their own ideas to the story as well.
I think DB Online's story is more canon than DB Super's story.

[sintzu]

I hope this series is considered an alternative continuing story in the future.

These new stories aren't just what brought the franchise back but they're also from the original author so the chances of them just being forgotten or set aside for a "new" Z sequel are slim to none. Super and whatever future Toriyama stories are as important to everyone involved with the franchise as the original manga is.

Modern DB has produced a lot of fan favorite material like Beerus and Black (he was taken from us too soon. ) so it would make 0 sense to remove them from "canon".

It's true that it came from the original author but you know, Akira-san only gives a story-draft to Toyotaro and Toei.

https://youtu.be/Ti89i2EZjWE
5.16-5.41

"I receive the whole story, but it's only a narrative outline. There is no dialogue, for instance. So I have to complete the story and sometimes divert its course while keeping the main storyline."

Those who receive the draft are adding their own ideas to the story as well.
I think DB Online's story is more canon than DB Super's story.

If we're going to talk about "canon" then the manga is the most canon story as it's the main source material and was solely written and drawn by Toriyama but Super comes right after in both "canon" and importance due to Toriyama's involvement AND massive success.

[Noah]

So are you evaluating the Super series as a non-canon?

Always, as there's no such thing as Dragon Ball Vol. 43.

...but Super comes right after in both "canon" and importance due to Toriyama's involvement AND massive success.

So Heroes also has "massive sucess" if had Toriyama's involvement it also would be canon?