Dragon Ball Z - Episodes 76-80 - Discussion Thread [Rewatch - Week 16]

[Ajay]

Welcome! For details on this rewatch, click here!

Now that Super's over, I imagine some of you are looking to get your Dragon Ball fix each week. Feel free to hop in and out of this rewatch at any time!

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Funimation (North America)
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This week we're covering:

[spoiler]神様も生き返った！超神龍でピッコロが復活
Kami-sama mo Ikikaetta! Sūpā Shenron de Pikkoro ga Fukkatsu
God Also Returns to Life! Piccolo is Resurrected by Super Shenlong

Super Shenlong can grant three wishes, but can only restore people to life one at a time. As Gohan and the others are confused as to what they should do, Piccolo calls out to them. If they revive Piccolo, then God and the Earth’s Dragon Balls will also be revived. Then with the next wish, Piccolo is warped to Planet Namek. At that moment Vegeta appeared. The only way to win against Freeza is to make Vegeta immortal… However the Dragon Balls then become stone! The Eldest has passed away. What’s more, Freeza appears before Gohan and the others.

最強戦士の誕生か！？ネイルとピッコロが合体
Saikyō Senshi no Tanjō ka!? Neiru to Pikkoro ga Gattai
Birth of the Mightiest Warrior?! Nail and Piccolo Merge

Unable to have his own wish granted, Freeza goes wild with rage. His ki is so tremendously powerful that none of the enemies up until now can compare with it. As he hurries to the battlefield, Piccolo discovers Nail. On the verge of death, Nail proposes that they merge in order to defeat Freeza. Piccolo merges with Nail and obtains ultimate power. Meanwhile, Vegeta presses Freeza to transform, thinking that he can somehow win if he fights together with Gohan and Kuririn. Freeza commences his first transformation.

悪夢の超変身！！戦闘力１００万のフリーザ
Akumu no Chō-Henshin!! Sentō-ryoku Hyaku-Man no Furīza
A Nightmare Super Transformation!! Freeza’s Battle Power Reaches One Million

Freeza’s power swells up, breaking the battle jacket he was wearing to pieces. Vegeta laughs, asking if Freeza has merely gotten more agile by taking off his clothes, but the transformation is not yet finished. He talks about Vegeta’s father, King Vegeta, who couldn’t even defeat the un-transformed Freeza. Freeza’s transformation is complete. His entire body has become gigantic, and his ki is many times what it was before. Freeza charges at super speed and impales Kuririn in the stomach with his horn.

ここまでか！？凶悪超絶パワーが悟飯を襲う
Koko made ka!? Kyōaku Chōzetsu Pawā ga Gohan o Osō
Is This the End?! A Brutally Transcendent Power Attacks Gohan

Freeza flings the impaled Kuririn away. Gohan goes to save him, but Freeza interrupts his rescue attempt. An angry Gohan launches a terrific kick at Freeza. Punching him repeatedly, he attacks with a full-power energy bullet. A giant explosion occurs, and Freeza is buried in the rubble. However, he is completely undamaged. Raising his battle power, Freeza counterattacks Gohan. Gohan’s life is a candle in the wind…

一気に形勢逆転！！遅れてきた戦士・ピッコロ
Ikki ni Keisei Gyakuten!! Okurete Kita Senshi · Pikkoro
The Tide Suddenly Turns!! Piccolo, the Warrior Who Came Late

Seeing the ferocity of the attack that hits Gohan, Vegeta is frozen in terror. As Freeza is about to finish Gohan off, a Kienzan slices his tail off! Kuririn has been revived through Dende’s special ability, and he hassles Freeza. Dende takes this opportunity to revive Gohan. Gohan’s battle power has increased even more, but he’s still no match for Freeza. At that moment, Piccolo finally arrives.[/spoiler]


Suggested Format & Weekly Questions

Language: For the sake of context, let us know which language you're watching the series in (and what score, if required).
General Thoughts: Your thoughts on the episode, possibly linked to the suggested questions if need be. Cover the plot, the tone, the character interactions, and characterisation.
Entertainment Factor: How was the pacing? Did the episode keep you entertained throughout, or what could have been done better?
Animation: Did you like the action sequences, or the way characters emoted? Did things move in a satisfying way, or was it mostly style over substance?
Questions: Not necessary, but if you're curious about opinions on a specific point that hasn't been touched on, go ahead and ask! It's a nice way to spur the topic onward.

- How do you feel about the incidental filler that stretches out the length of this arc? Would you rather have had more original filler along the lines of the flashback scenes from the Bardock special, or are the extensions of 'canon' scenes preferable?

[gaberparadiso]

Episode 76

General thoughts: what's taking Freezer so long to arrive? As expected, this episode is just an appetizer before the main fight, where Piccolo displays a quite clever plan to be resurrected, along with Kami (Popo chasing a butterfly is stupid, just saiyan). Not before Kaio gets mad at him for disobeying his orders to stay away from Freezer, and also Yamcha having an argument with Tenshinhan about who's going to be resurrected first. Of course, Vegeta is quite vexed due to being fooled by Krillin and Gohan, and not only doesn't manage to get his wish, but has to deal with an even more vexed Freezer. So... content-wise, this episode is just what you would expect from a prologue of the main showdown.

Entertainment factor: despite this, it's still pretty fun, thanks to Orime's really solid direction.

Animation: easily the best aspect, as this episode is mostly remembered for turning heads dramatically. Not before mentioning Orime's storyboarding, which works really well, especially when Vegeta is pissed at Gohan and Krillin, animated by Takeuchi. Art-wise, it looks clearly great, thanks to Shimanuki's amazing supervision, as his art/corrections are definitely appealing. His corrections are strong but not everywhere, since there are instances in which we can spot the diverse artists, such as Hisada, Takeuchi and Misumi. Shimanuki himself also provides some uncredited key animation, with some dramatic head rotations, which look a bit bitter considering his current animations. As for Hisada, he animates a quite neat character acting during the quarrel between Yamcha and Tenshinhan, not to mention Porunga's "death". https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 7215123457 https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 0998389761 Lastly, Naoki Tate deals with the final parts, granting us a further head rotation. This is probably the 1st time in the series, in which Tate's presence is actually certain. https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 3311995904

Music: solid placement overall. J6, a.k.a. Shenron's original theme, is back during Porunga's summoning, and I love the usage of M501, M510 and M1008 here.

Overall: 8/10. Really enjoyable, so why not rewarding it?

Episode 77

General thoughts: this episode exists only because it goes on with the plot. Content-wise, I barely have any issues, since Piccolo fuses with a nearly dead Nail and Freezer's scouter says 'bye bye'. I mean, Vegeta tells Freezer to transform, because it's his bad habit, so I guess I shouldn't complain that much. And I know Zarbon should've told him in ep. 53 about this ability, but this bit happened in the manga exclusively, but again, not a big complaint, either. My REAL complaint, though, is everything else, because this episode has a really bad direction and looks kinda rushed. In fact...

Entertainment factor: Okazaki's direction is BAD and LACKLUSTER. And the fact it's his last episode as a director makes it even worse. Okazaki was the director of the original Dr. Slump series, he directed the very 1st DB episode, and many others, including ep. 121, Piccolo Daimao's death. His directions were solid in DB, but for some reason his work in DBZ has been either mediocre/boring or plain bad. I don't know what occurred, I don't like his output in DBZ, because it feels so forgettable and lame. Maybe ep. 69 is the least bad among his DBZ experience, but isn't enough, by any means. Freezer is an awesome character and an amazing villain, but there's barely any tension here, due to a poor direction.

Animation: not to mention his storyboarding, which is again tame and dull. No cool prospectives, just stock and boring angles. And unfortunately, this isn't even a great episode, art-wise, as I do believe this represents the time when Maeda's staff jumped the shark. Satou's art still manages to produce well https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 9323205632, but the remaining animators look quite rushed, including Ide and Nakatsuru. And Maeda's corrections aren't even that effective, either. (for some reason, I quite like Ide's unscathed art, whereas Nakatsuru's expression on Dende looks incredibly boring and uninspired) https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 8532177920 https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 1919461376 As for the other animators, they aren't that good, as we also get the possibly worst lip sync from the series during Piccolo's conversation with Nail. https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 8190793729 Likewise, the overall animation isn't that memorable: Krillin and Gohan dodge Freezer's beams during Satou's scene, but it's definitely not a very good work. https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 4026856448 Nakatsuru animates Freezer's power up in the 1st half after Piccolo's cutaway, and the power struggle in the 2nd, but once again, they're not anything special. I'm underwhelmed by this episode, because Studio Junio's episodes used to be the best-looking in DB, with the likes of Satou, Ide, Nakatsuru and Eguchi, but after the latter's departure, I don't feel the same harmony as before.

Music: I guess the BGM placement is okay here: M816 and M1002 work well, but even though I like M420, it's not included in a fitting concept.

Overall: 6,5/10. Ep. 76 was a symphony, whereas this one is a cacophony.

[gaberparadiso]

Episode 78

General thoughts: wow, they definitely risked it by adding a King Vegeta flashback and by reusing the destruction of planet Vegeta from the TV special. But, surprisingly, what could've turned out to be frustrating is actually kinda okay. Even though King Vegeta is one of the blandest and dullest characters, for his inability as a king, as a father and as a fighter (his son already surpassed him as a kid), this flashback is not badly portrayed. For a moment, when Freezer and King Vegeta talked, I was wondering who the actual villain was between the two. Needless to say, Freezer kills him with just one uppercut, which proves how WEAK and DULL King Vegeta is. There's also a Bulma cutaway, but who cares. This is the only episode in which our Lord Nakao's voice is low-pitched when Freezer is in his second form, which sounds a bit weird, but kinda makes sense in hindsight, since in this form he's far more brutal and less composed than his 1st. The direction also does a great job at creating tension before Freezer impales Krillin. BTW, I don't know if his power level reached one million, and quite honestly, who cares?

Entertainment factor: this is how ep. 73 should've been from the start. THIS is a really well-directed episode from Ueda, which manages not to be distracting despite two flashback sequences. Without a doubt the best aspect here.

Animation: likewise, Ueda's storyboarding is definitely the most unique aspect of this episode. Shindo is not a good supervisor, and his corrections are all over the place as usual, but his artistic choices sure do make up for this lack: the use of black during Freezer's Death Storm is brilliant https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 8841377793, just like the use of 'The Darkest Hour' before he dashes towards Krillin to pierce him with his horns. Masterful. https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 9851437056 Animation-wise, Yamamuro animates Freezer killing Vegeta and part of his transformation, but as expected, the rest is either mediocre or decent, like Shibata's rotations during King Vegeta's fight vs Freezer's soldiers. https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 3416129537 Of course, Eguchi's (?) sequence from the TV special has been recycled, but this time I don't mind it.

Music: very good overall: the usage of the instrumental version of M424 (M424B) fits really well, just like M1009, M817, The Darkest Hour and M261. Yamcha Demands Capsules is also used for the 1st time several years later, and it's nice to hear old-fashioned boing sfx. So much better than Kikuchi's whistles.

Overall: 7,5/10. With better animation my rating would be higher.

Episode 79

General thoughts: this episode only has a few flaws, such as Bulma's cutscene (of course) and Kaio repeating the same things over and over again. These things aside, it's a great entry. From Freezer piercing a hole in Krillin's chest, to Gohan's rampage. Everything is in the right place and at the right time. Although, Vegeta gives up really quickly.

Entertainment factor: quite good and solid pacing. Orime's direction is pretty solid. Too bad this is already his second-to-last episode in the series.

Animation: the driving force of this episode is without a doubt Tai'ichiro Ohara, who animates 75-80% of the entire episode, including Freezer impaling Krillin, Yamcha and Bulma's cutscenes, Freezer attacking Gohan, Vegeta's Galick Gun and the entire ending segment in the 2nd half. https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 0845573120 His Freezer looks pretty unique. His traits look feminine and intimidating at the same time. As for the remaining animators, Shida animates Gohan's rampage, which shows some really cool movements when Gohan throws his Masendan, despite not being among his absolute best output, https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 1064788992 while Uchiyama handles the following scenes, and I actually like the use of red during Gohan's attacks, which tends to hide his lack of complex shading. His art is not bad, either. https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 7169942529

Music: another solid placement: M424B is an excellent and solemn track, which fits Krillin's agony perfectly, whilst being an instrumental version.

Overall: 8,5/10. Nothing much to say.

[Taisa732]

Language: Japanese

Episode 76:
General Thoughts: One of my favourite episodes!
I will always remember the first time I saw it, me and my brother were shouting at the TV hoping the characters could hear us. There isn't any other show that can get me this emotional.
To this day I still watch it on the edge of my seat feeling the tension of every second, even if I've seen it a hundred times (although I may be cheering for Vegeta now).
Between Freeza getting closer and closer, Krillin, Gohan and Dende trying to make decisions, Piccolo's plan and Vegeta waking up and realize he got played. And if all of this wasn't enough the ending is the cherry on the cake. Vegeta's reaction when he sees Freeza is a wild remainder that doom has arrived.

Animation: Head turn, head turn, head turn. Everybody turns his head with a dramatic overacting and it's beautiful! Can't get enough of it.
I also like the effects on Porunga when he starts to vanish, and the little fight at the beginning on Kaio's planet.
The entire episode is spectacular.

Episode 77:
General Thoughts: This one is a bit less intense. I like the concept of the fusion between namekians, especially because it evolves Piccolo's power and it hints at what it could be if united with Kami.
Other that that it's one of those “standing around waiting for someone to power-up” kinda episodes.

Animation: Nothing much to say here. It's a very well done one, but like I said it's mostly standing around.

Episode 78:
General Thoughts: I... kinda like this episode. It may be the fact that I like anything I can get of the saiyans before they blow up into smithereens. Or may be it's that I consider it somewhat of a mirror or an addition to the TV special. Whatever it is I do appreciate that they told the story of King Vegeta's death. He was the King after all (and Vegeta's father) so it makes sense that his tale has been told.

Animation: First of all, what is up with Vegeta's battle suit? Wrong colours, wrong boots, wrong armour entirely. It's really distracting! I get that they are trying to mimic Toriyama, but do they have to copy his mistakes as well? (yes, he messes up a couple of times as well).
With that said, I liked some of the effects on Freeza's transformation and during the explosion near the end. I also find kinda interesting King Vegeta's death, nothing to spectacular though.
Finally the very last cut with the silhouettes against the sunset, and I'm willing to let slide that Namek shouldn't have sunsets! Whatever, artistic licensing I guess.

Episode 79:
General Thoughts: Freeza impaling Krillin with his horn is probably one of the more brutal scenes of the entire show, and that is saying something. I also think that it's the thing that stands out the most.

Animation: I think that the cut I liked the most is Freezza's impact with the ground during Gohan's fury (although he lands on his back, but when he gets up he's lying face down). I always enjoy timing like that.
The only other thing that stood out to me were the various colour schemes throughout the episode.

Episode 80:
General Thoughts: A bit of a “nothing episode”, not much happens a side from the obvious. What I like is the revelation of Dende's powers. You don't expect Krillin coming back at full health after Freeza's attack, so it makes for a nice surprise when you see the namekian kid healing Gohan. Also, nice little dialogue between Krillin and Vegeta that is enough to explain why Goku didn't have the same treatment.

Animation: Very bad first part. To much reuse on-top of a boring script, if I'd say it's boring I'd be doing it a favour.
Piccolo's arrival is nice though, and that's about it.

- How do you feel about the incidental filler that stretches out the length of this arc? Would you rather have had more original filler along the lines of the flashback scenes from the Bardock special, or are the extensions of 'canon' scenes preferable?

Fillers are very tricky and no matter what type of filler it is it has to be interesting in different possible ways. They can be e a separate side story or “canon” but it all comes down to the way they are told (in any possible storytelling way). More than that there is also the time spent on them, to much is always a problem.
What could you have as a “canon” filler in these episodes? Nothing much to be fair, seeing that we are in the middle of a battle and almost all the characters are standing in the same place. Filler that add to this scenario are what for me ruins the final battle between Goku and Freeza.
On the other hand flashbacks risk become redundant very quickly. Bardock's story has already been told in a different setting, so what we have from King Vegeta point of view is just enough to not become repetitive. We don't need multiple flashbacks to tell us the same story at this point so I'd say that what we've got is somewhat of acceptable.
And with that I don't mean that I like all of them. Like I was saying at the beginning it depends on how the are being told. Some of them are successful others aren't even close.

[TrunksTrevelyan0064]

Episodes covered: Dragon Ball Z 76-80 ("Dragon Ball 229-233")


EPISODE 76
* I always found it a bit strange that nobody besides Piccolo thought it through that reviving him first would bring back Earth's Dragon Balls. That's the reason why y'all went to Planet Namek in the first place!
* Love that "wish-granting" sound as the dragon's eyes light up.
* Piccolo's story unfortunately doesn't really go anywhere in the Namek arc, but it's still great to see him on his home planet. Had that not happened, we would forever have considered it a missed opportunity.
* The "Tree of Might" score working really well here once again.

EPISODE 77
* It's difficult to say how much Nail actually influences Piccolo's personality. It might've developed the exact same way regardless, at least up until his merger with Kami, which clearly changes him. I want to say Piccolo grows less selfish/prideful because of Nail, but at the same time he's still very keen on becoming stronger for his own sake, not just Gohan's.
* Given how much damage Kuririn and Gohan end up dealing to Freeza in his second form, I believe they and Vegeta could actually defeat Freeza in his first form.

EPISODE 78
* Say about filler what you want, but I don't mind this Saiyan flashback. It's cool to get a feel for what King Vegeta was like.
* Interesting decision to get rid of the colors as Freeza begins to show his power. Certainly gives off the impression that it's significant and scary.

EPISODE 79
* Poor Kuririn This scene is still hard to watch. Definitely prefer the manga version of it. I'm glad Kuririn survives this, at least.
* Whoa, look at you, Yamcha! Great to see him painted in a good light, for a change. The way he acts here feels completely in-character, too.
* Geez, they really want us to believe Kuririn is dying here. Damn this is disturbing. On the plus side, it really makes you empathize with Gohan's anger. GO GET 'M, KID!!
* Freeza is really intimidating this episode. It truly feels like he's going to kill Gohan & co. and there's nothing they can do about it.

EPISODE 80
* I love, love, love that the focus is on Goku and/or Piccolo to come save Gohan's life but then it's KURIRIN who does the job! Oh, and Dende. Dende deserves credit too.
* Now, of course, would've been the perfect time to combine the Taiyôken with the Kienzan, but alas, the story can't allow Freeza to die yet. I still give Kuririn props for taking on an enemy far, far, FAR beyond his league one on one.
* Sorry, but that triple ki blast barrage animation is hilarious (and not in a very good way).
* The glorious, glorious return of Piccolo's theme. Followed by great banter between Piccolo and Vegeta.
* It's fun to think about what it would be like to "watch" Dragon Ball by ki-sensing alone (as Goku is doing right now). Random revivals and power boosts all around!


- How do you feel about the incidental filler that stretches out the length of this arc? Would you rather have had more original filler along the lines of the flashback scenes from the Bardock special, or are the extensions of 'canon' scenes preferable?
Hmmm. I don't really have a preference one way or another. Either option can be dull or provide interesting new info or flesh out characters. I'm not too concerned with "canon"; I can simply dismiss/ignore scenes I don't care for and keep my focus on what I do like instead. The only time that becomes problematic is when you get scenes of two characters staring at each other for a full minute, but even then I barely notice it. I guess I automatically accept this stuff the way it is because in the end it's just a silly cartoon (albeit one that I love beyond words) that is not worth getting seriously upset about.


Favorite character: I'll go with Piccolo, as I always greatly enjoy seeing him return to the fold, accompanied by his awesome theme and voice. He got close to getting a spot on this list multiple times in the Saiyan arc, so it's been a long time coming. Shoutouts to Freeza for being intimidating as hell, to Kuririn and Gohan for doing the best they could against him, and to Dende for his immaculate job as a support character.
Previous favorites: Raditz, Gohan, the Saber Tiger, Kaiô, Tenshinhan, Vegeta(1), Kuririn(1), Bulma, Vegeta(2), Kuririn(2), the Grand Elder, Vegeta(3), Recoom, Captain Ginyu, Freeza.

[gaberparadiso]

Episode 80

General thoughts: after a great previous episode, this one is undoubtedly a backward step: first, Vegeta doesn't care if Gohan dies, but then he's almost proud of his Zenkai boost after being healed by Dende. I guess he's always been an inconsistent character. Second, the 1st half is incredibly SLOW, with tons of flashbacks from the Saiyan arc, and an unneedly dragged out segment with Krillin escaping from Freezer. In fact, this is the main problem of this episode: it's way too SLOW and visually LIMITED. Piccolo's "big" entrance sounds nice on paper, but the execution is far from memorable. It's definitely a missed opportunity, as it could've been much better than this. It's a pretty tame entry.

Entertainment factor: really slow and inconsistent pacing. Inconsistent is indeed the key word here: Fujise's direction is pretty much hit and miss. Sometimes it works (when Vegeta sees Gohan's agony), sometimes it blows (excessive use of flashbacks and terribly slow pacing).

Animation: likewise, Fujise's storyboarding is pretty tame and boring. And Ebisawa's art and corrections are a big downside: his Freezer may look passable, but his other characters look worse than usual. His Vegeta is a "honorable mention". Quite honestly, Piccolo's entrance is ruined by his art, which makes this theoretically memorable scene much less memorable. https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 0231619584 Besides, his corrections kinda ruin Iida and Kan'no's more decent outputs, which is a waste in this case. Animation-wise, it's not bad, but it's not that good, either. Ebisawa's movements are not as choppy as Kitano's, but his questionable art overwhelms everything else, thus we pay less attention to his actual animation. https://twitter.com/DBanimators/status/ ... 7733885953

Music: Piccolo In His Prime is a downright perfect BGM for Piccolo's arrival, and so is Piccolo's Overwhelming Confidence at the end. Overall, it's been a quite solid placement.

Overall: 6/10. The music placement kinda saved this episode, IMO.