Fan Service Tipping Point in DBS

[Waluigiman]

Probably confused about the definition of fan service but the closest thing to me could be the following:
1. When Frieza killed piccolo, it was un-needed and it was just a reference to his death to Nappa.
2. The Copy Vegeta vs Goku: I didn't wanted it because I prefered a new Goten and Trunks adventure than something that tried to be a Goku and Vegeta "rematch".
3. Maybe all those recolored transformations with the exception of Super Saiyan Rose because only Goku Black had it, and Super Saiyan God because it didn't look like a super Saiyan.

[emperior]

- Piccolo sacrificing himself to shield Gohan another time.
- Vegeta using his Final Explosion yet again.
- Goku and Vegeta spamming their signature ki attacks way too much like in the ToP.
- Cell being brought back.
- A bunch of callbacks each arc. Just stop with them.

These are the things I absolutely do not want to see. I wouldn’t stop watching the show if they happened, but I probably wouldn’t be too pleased, especially if they were to be handled badly, like in the case of an eventual return of Cell.

[Lord Beerus]

Nothing really has been a "tipping point" for me when it comes to fanservice. But there are several occasions in which I let out an exasperated sigh of contempt at the shameless pandering to certain characters. Those occasions were:

- GinyuFrog coming back and switching bodies with Tagoma... just to have Vegeta kill him
- Piccolo sacrificing himself to prevent Freeza from killing Gohan
- Vegetto returning
- Future Trunks' Sword Of Hope in Episode 66
- Everything about Kale's appearance in Episode 93 and 100
- Vegeta's Final Explosion in Episode 126

It must be stressed that fanservice, callbacks and homages are not an inherently bad thing. You can have those in the plot as cute little easter eggs (the best example of this was in Episode 94) or even have them serve as the basis for later character development (like what they did with Kale). But when a scene exists just to serve as a nostalgia trip, it comes as across as not only insincere to what you're paying homage to, but it also comes across as a waste of time.

Don't do that.

If you want to have fanservice in your story that's fine. But just have some kind of substance behind it, and have it lead to something important later in the story. Don't have moments like that exist solely so the fans can go "Oh, hey. I remember that! That's cool!", and then never remember the moments after that. Don't treat it as a moment written in a vacuum.

[Shinsa]

Fan service i don't like that most in Super were...

SSJG
SSJB
Ultra instinct.

These transformations I consider fan service because Toei seems to think this is the foundation of Dragonball now. They all don't feel well acheived, designed and seem to be in the show as an excuse to say it's a different series and sell merchandise. The worst offender is that it messes muddys up Saiyan lore

I don't know maybe I'm wrong, is this what fans want? New transformations that never have limits?

[Green_Goblin]

Ginyu's revival was extremely disappointing, it seemed to me back when it aired that they've only brought him back so the trivia section on the Dragon Ball Wikia would say that Vegeta had killed all members of the Ginyu Force. If it was up to me, Tagoma would've got an episode to shine (also a better explanation of how he became as powerful as he was, rather than just have Frieza shoot holes through him 24/7 for 4 months) and get his body stolen at the very last minute of that episode and then Ginyu would get his own episode and would be killed off by Gohan.

Master Roshi's inclusions in fights in the entirety of Dragon Ball Super was surely a tipping point for me, the guy got a power up whack out of nowere! Also his semi-sexual assault scene against Yurin annoyed me A LOT.

Piccolo's death to First Form Frieza was utterly disappointing and needless, it was just trying to rehash his dramatic/heroic death scene to Nappa. Pointless. Did the staff ate Member-Berries all the way? Could be.

Frost being a Frieza 2.0 WAS DISAPOINTING, it's like they can't even think that in our universe or in other universe there CAN'T be a good member of the Frieza Race. Look at the Universe 6 Saiyans you've just wrote! They're all good! Not a single ruthless and violent for nothing space pirate around! Unlike the Universe 7 ones, these guys are total saints, so why can't there be a "good Frieza"?

The entire Goku Black idea wasn't original, it felt like a cross-breed of Toyotaro's Xicor from Dragon Ball AF and some other fan-fiction they've saw & read on Tumblr or DeviantArt. But with it's own twisting around itself mystery - it was indeed the best arc of Dragon Ball Super.

The Copy-Vegeta was just a cheap way of giving us a rematch of Goku vs. Vegeta in DBS, it could've been such a good mini-arc if it was only revolving around Trunks and Goten facing some ancient alien monster made of the Super Human Water instead of nerfing SSJ3 Gotenks to BASE Vegeta of that era. Makes the ENTIRE BUU CONFLICT/HIGHPOINT OF Z POWER LEVELS SEEM LIKE A JOKE! It's not even clear whether Super is taking place [starting from] 4 years after Kid Buu's death or just some months after the 6 months anniversary of his death.

The rehashing of Broly with the character of Kale, especially the identical move set and lines from DBZ Movie 8 WERE AWFUL AND UNNEEDED! Anilaza getting his moves from Janemba and Hirudegarn was lame/lazy to my taste.

ALSO: Android 17 being pushed THAT HIGH from being a wildlife protector IS THE MOST BIZZARE AND STUPID IDEA THEY COULD COME UP WITH! If he was THAT (if Goku & Vegeta are X at any given time he was 0.75X) strong in comparsion to the main cast all this time, why didn't he showed up to face Majin Buu or Frieza's Revenge? Huh? It was just done to make Japanese fans happy because he's popular over there for some reason, FTR the emo-days are over a decade gone by now.
And the Cell Juniors he tamed - why the heck are they even around? Gohan had killed them off for good once he turned Super Saiyan 2.

The inclusion of meaningless/unexplained members of the Tsufurian and Yardrat races to Universe 2 was also quite disappointing and annoying, how did they've reached there? Wasn't the issue of races being exclusive only to pairing/twin universes already established? If so back to my first question here, but if not - then why didn't they at least got some backstory or cool ability/technique?

[Pokesamus217]

I don’t think most of you guys know what fan service actually is. Anyways, my answer is gonna be the first two times Kale transforms, and just shamelessly starts quoting Broly.

[obiwan23s]

For me, it came around the end of the Future Trunks arc.

I hate the end of that arc too, but I think it could have been saved without too much rewriting by just having Goku and Vegeta make Trunks a Super Saiyan God at the beginning of the arc and then have Vegeta spend some time teaching him Super Saiyan Blue to bring him to their level. Would have upped the drama at the beginning of the next arc too because another SSB warrior in the Tournament of Power would have made the U7 team stronger, but they wouldn't have been able to use Trunks since he went back.

People would have still said giving Future Trunks SSB is an asspull power up but he doesn't have any Saiyans to do the Super Saiyan God ritual in his timeline, and was already established as being able to keep up with Goku and Vegeta's training in the Cell arc. It would have worked fine.

[TheOne]

Tipping point for me was Roshi somehow being able to hang with everyone in this tournament in the anime.

Today I jumped off a cliff after finding out Roshi dodged punches from Jiren in the manga...

[Kaiosama]

Tipping point for me was Roshi somehow being able to hang with everyone in this tournament in the anime.

Today I jumped off a cliff after finding out Roshi dodged punches from Jiren in the manga...

Ditto... Let's take the weakest character BY FAR in the ToP and give him the most OP technique ever that even Gods struggle to obtain.

[PFM18]

Tipping point for me was Roshi somehow being able to hang with everyone in this tournament in the anime.

Today I jumped off a cliff after finding out Roshi dodged punches from Jiren in the manga...

Roshi didn't show any signs of being strong in the anime really. He most certainly did not "hang with everyone in the tournament." He briefly caught Frost off guard and then he beat some fodder characters that were super weak. But in the anime he isn't really regarded as being especially strong.

The manga portrays him dramatically differently but that I mean that is just Toyotaro doing his thing.

[TheOne]

Tipping point for me was Roshi somehow being able to hang with everyone in this tournament in the anime.

Today I jumped off a cliff after finding out Roshi dodged punches from Jiren in the manga...

Roshi didn't show any signs of being strong in the anime really. He most certainly did not "hang with everyone in the tournament." He briefly caught Frost off guard and then he beat some fodder characters that were super weak. But in the anime he isn't really regarded as being especially strong.

The manga portrays him dramatically differently but that I mean that is just Toyotaro doing his thing.

That’s the thing. The strength of Roshis punches shouldn’t even effect Frost. How many times in the series have the Z fighters punched someone and had zero effect on them? The speed of Roshis punches shouldn’t catch anyone off guard, let alone Frost. If you watched the videos of Frost vs Piccolo and Roshi vs Piccolo, you’d think that Roshi was on par with Piccolo.

Nerfing other universes to make Roshi relevant was just stupid. I’d much rather have Trunks and Goten take on Kefla or whatever.

[OLKv3]

The Trunks arc is full of fanservice and the ToP is pretty much nothing but fanservice. And then we have Broly

[Kataphrut]

Tipping point for me was Roshi somehow being able to hang with everyone in this tournament in the anime.

Today I jumped off a cliff after finding out Roshi dodged punches from Jiren in the manga...

Roshi didn't show any signs of being strong in the anime really. He most certainly did not "hang with everyone in the tournament." He briefly caught Frost off guard and then he beat some fodder characters that were super weak. But in the anime he isn't really regarded as being especially strong.

The manga portrays him dramatically differently but that I mean that is just Toyotaro doing his thing.

That’s the thing. The strength of Roshis punches shouldn’t even effect Frost. How many times in the series have the Z fighters punched someone and had zero effect on them? The speed of Roshis punches shouldn’t catch anyone off guard, let alone Frost. If you watched the videos of Frost vs Piccolo and Roshi vs Piccolo, you’d think that Roshi was on par with Piccolo.

Nerfing other universes to make Roshi relevant was just stupid. I’d much rather have Trunks and Goten take on Kefla or whatever.

Modern Dragon Ball altered the rules slightly. Resurrection F established a strong character can be taken down by a far weaker character if caught off guard. That was written by Toriyama.

Roshi caught Frost off guard briefly, but Frost turned the tables in no time at all and had him dead to rights soon after. I'd call that fair. Certainly moreso than the extremes Toyotaro took when trying to adapt the same idea with Roshi v Jiren.

[Nickolaidas]

Roshi didn't show any signs of being strong in the anime really. He most certainly did not "hang with everyone in the tournament." He briefly caught Frost off guard and then he beat some fodder characters that were super weak. But in the anime he isn't really regarded as being especially strong.

The manga portrays him dramatically differently but that I mean that is just Toyotaro doing his thing.

That’s the thing. The strength of Roshis punches shouldn’t even effect Frost. How many times in the series have the Z fighters punched someone and had zero effect on them? The speed of Roshis punches shouldn’t catch anyone off guard, let alone Frost. If you watched the videos of Frost vs Piccolo and Roshi vs Piccolo, you’d think that Roshi was on par with Piccolo.

Nerfing other universes to make Roshi relevant was just stupid. I’d much rather have Trunks and Goten take on Kefla or whatever.

Modern Dragon Ball altered the rules slightly. Resurrection F established a strong character can be taken down by a far weaker character if caught off guard. That was written by Toriyama.

Roshi caught Frost off guard briefly, but Frost turned the tables in no time at all and had him dead to rights soon after. I'd call that fair. Certainly moreso than the extremes Toyotaro took when trying to adapt the same idea with Roshi v Jiren.

Also, in the anime at least, Frost isn't portrayed in our minds as someone mind-bogglingly strong. Even Piccolo would've beaten him if it wasn't for the alien's dirty tricks. So Roshi catching him off guard for five seconds isn't that much of a stretch.

Jiren, however, is immediately established as a powerhouse, in both mediums. It kills one's suspension of disbelief when he attacks Roshi and the old man dodges his attacks. Especially when in the manga Jiren is shown not to d*&k around and immediately goes to work, one-shotting fodder characters left and right. If he KOs characters left and right, why 'test the waters' with Roshi? It makes no sense, and I'm pretty sure the manga won't explain it sufficiently in the slightest.

One thing's for sure - the leak did its job. All the fandom is talking about this and the issue's sales will skyrocket.

[Torturephile]

The return of Freeza. Since then, it's an odd mix of some original ideas and varying levels of fan service.

[TheOne]

The return of Freeza. Since then, it's an odd mix of some original ideas and varying levels of fan service.

Is that a tipping point or something that you’re just not a fan of?

I think they’ve handled his return pretty well so far. The only reason he cooperated was because it was in his best interest. Now that he’s learned how effective “teamwork” is, we might have a good story on our hands in the Broly movie.

I still would’ve preferred Cell though.

[theTUN]

That’s the thing. The strength of Roshis punches shouldn’t even effect Frost. How many times in the series have the Z fighters punched someone and had zero effect on them? The speed of Roshis punches shouldn’t catch anyone off guard, let alone Frost. If you watched the videos of Frost vs Piccolo and Roshi vs Piccolo, you’d think that Roshi was on par with Piccolo.

Nerfing other universes to make Roshi relevant was just stupid. I’d much rather have Trunks and Goten take on Kefla or whatever.

Modern Dragon Ball altered the rules slightly. Resurrection F established a strong character can be taken down by a far weaker character if caught off guard. That was written by Toriyama.

Roshi caught Frost off guard briefly, but Frost turned the tables in no time at all and had him dead to rights soon after. I'd call that fair. Certainly moreso than the extremes Toyotaro took when trying to adapt the same idea with Roshi v Jiren.

Also, in the anime at least, Frost isn't portrayed in our minds as someone mind-bogglingly strong. Even Piccolo would've beaten him if it wasn't for the alien's dirty tricks. So Roshi catching him off guard for five seconds isn't that much of a stretch.

Jiren, however, is immediately established as a powerhouse, in both mediums. It kills one's suspension of disbelief when he attacks Roshi and the old man dodges his attacks. Especially when in the manga Jiren is shown not to d*&k around and immediately goes to work, one-shotting fodder characters left and right. If he KOs characters left and right, why 'test the waters' with Roshi? It makes no sense, and I'm pretty sure the manga won't explain it sufficiently in the slightest.

One thing's for sure - the leak did its job. All the fandom is talking about this and the issue's sales will skyrocket.

I doubt Western internet drama will have that much of an effect on a Japanese manga's sales.

[Torturephile]

The return of Freeza. Since then, it's an odd mix of some original ideas and varying levels of fan service.

Is that a tipping point or something that you’re just not a fan of? I think they’ve handled his return pretty well so far. The only reason he cooperated was because it was in his best interest. Now that he’s learned how effective “teamwork” is, we might have a good story on our hands in the Broly movie.

I still would’ve preferred Cell though.

Perhaps both. I found Freeza's return to be unnecessary since his story was done with long ago, and once they brought him back, they didn't do enough with him in Resurrection of F other than giving him a powerup. I will admit Resurrection of F seems better in hindsight because they did something more interesting with Freeza in a later arc, the Tournament of Power, such as giving him some development in personality and doing mental training to reduce his golden form strain, having him scheme in overthrowing the gods (sadly, a dropped plot point in the anime), and team up with the man that he hates the most, and this is coming from someone who hated that Freeza would be brought up again in the tournament instead of Majin Buu.

[BanterTheGreat]

The biggest thing that annoys me is the characters just using their signature attacks left and right. There are even moments like in the Goku Black arc where the 3 protaganist use their signature attack (kamehameha, final flash, galic gun) at the same time against wallpaper zamasu. There is also the whole unfused final kamehameha thing.

[theTUN]

The return of Freeza. Since then, it's an odd mix of some original ideas and varying levels of fan service.

Is that a tipping point or something that you’re just not a fan of? I think they’ve handled his return pretty well so far. The only reason he cooperated was because it was in his best interest. Now that he’s learned how effective “teamwork” is, we might have a good story on our hands in the Broly movie.

I still would’ve preferred Cell though.

Perhaps both. I found Freeza's return to be unnecessary since his story was done with long ago, and once they brought him back, they didn't do enough with him in Resurrection of F other than giving him a powerup. I will admit Resurrection of F seems better in hindsight because they did something more interesting with Freeza in a later arc, the Tournament of Power, such as giving him some development in personality and doing mental training to reduce his golden form strain, having him scheme in overthrowing the gods (sadly, a dropped plot point in the anime), and team up with the man that he hates the most, and this is coming from someone who hated that Freeza would be brought up again in the tournament instead of Majin Buu.

You can't say it's a dropped plot point when Frieza still clearly has a large role to play in the movie.