The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[ricky84]

Fat Boo vs Super Boo

Super Boo finger clicks and you know it, Ahill.

Proof, mayn?

Super Buu is basically a Kid Buu x Fat Buu fusion. So he clearly wins.

[ahill1]

Super Boo finger clicks and you know it, Ahill.

Proof, mayn?

Super Buu is basically a Kid Buu x Fat Buu fusion. So he clearly wins.

Proof Super > Fat?

[ricky84]

Proof, mayn?

Super Buu is basically a Kid Buu x Fat Buu fusion. So he clearly wins.

Proof Super > Fat?

Logically Super Buu is WAY beyond Fat Buu.

Because Fat Buu < SSJ3 Goku = Kid Buu < SSJ3 Gotenks = Super Buu.

[ahill1]

Super Buu is basically a Kid Buu x Fat Buu fusion. So he clearly wins.

Proof Super > Fat?

Logically Super Buu is WAY beyond Fat Buu.

Because Fat Buu < SSJ3 Goku = Kid Buu < SSJ3 Gotenks = Super Buu.

Statement on fat < super?

[ZombieVito]

1. Where or when was this ever shown or stated in the anime? Golden Freeza was shown to be at best equal to normal SSB Goku at the start of the ToP, yet normal SSB Vegeta since ep.122 was shown/implied to be stronger than KKx20 Goku from the hour special based on his superior performance against Jiren and the Final Flash feat. Also, Normal SSB Vegeta was shown to be equal to base Toppo (who Goku needed Blue Kaioken times ?? to match in the preliminaries). So the idea of Golden Freeza being stronger than regular SSB Vegeta (and A17 for that matter but that's another topic) at all is ridiculous. He has zero feats & statements in the anime that suggest that. Hell, you could even argue that Gohan in the anime ToP surpassed Golden Freeza at some point due to his fights with the triple robot fusion before Aniraza and his better fight against Dsypo.

2. Piccolo is obviously weaker than A18, especially after the Ribranne fight. Ribranne was shown to be on par with a serious base Goku & and a suppressed SSJ1 Vegeta. In her giant form she should be at least around serious SSJ1 levels. And A18 beat her down, breaking her limits in the process. Piccolo on the other arguably isn't even as strong as the base forms of the full blooded saiyans in the ToP.

Previews from the arc said Goku and Freeza are tied to #1 spot of U7 and no, Vegeta is not stronger than KKx20 Goku.

Goku never used Kaioken against Toppo and Freeza does have feats, he's equal to Blue Goku so by default he's stronger than Gohan, Vegeta and 17.

Ribrianne's actual power couldn't even beat an exhausted base Goku in E118 (Zirloin got all of her power). Super Saiyan Vegeta was just toying with her and left the battle before going serious. Goku only got serious against her Super Ribrianne form. E119 also proves Piccolo is way out of 18's league thanks to Gamisaras and E90 proves he's stronger than base Goku since he beat SS2 Gohan in E88.

[RandomGuy96]

Statement on fat < super?

From the manga:

Chapter: 486 (DBZ 292), P2.2-6
Context: after Boo transforms into evil Boo
Piccolo: “…Have you noticed? …This change in Majin Boo’s ki…[ ] …He’s changed…All due to some idiotic Earthlings…

Chapter: 488 (DBZ 294), P5.5-6
Trunks: “Huh!? That’s Majin Boo!?”
Goten: “He-he really has changed…”
Piccolo: “It’s not just his appearance…Everything about him is definitely greater than before…”

From Daizenshuu 2:

"Majin Buu briefly became gentle through Satan's persuasion, but because of wicked people he achieved a super power-up."

[ricky84]

SSBE Vegito (Post-ToP) vs MUI Goku
SSJ1 Kefla vs Merged Zamasu (Halo)
SSJ4 Goku (Namek arc) vs 1st Form Cell
SSG Vegeta (ToP) vs SSB Goku (Champa arc)
Majin Dabura vs Super Perfect Cell
Bojack vs SSJ1 Goku (Buu arc)
Base Vegito (Post-ToP) vs SSJ1 Kefla
Enraged Vegeta (BoG) vs Buuhan

[ricky84]

1. Where or when was this ever shown or stated in the anime? Golden Freeza was shown to be at best equal to normal SSB Goku at the start of the ToP, yet normal SSB Vegeta since ep.122 was shown/implied to be stronger than KKx20 Goku from the hour special based on his superior performance against Jiren and the Final Flash feat. Also, Normal SSB Vegeta was shown to be equal to base Toppo (who Goku needed Blue Kaioken times ?? to match in the preliminaries). So the idea of Golden Freeza being stronger than regular SSB Vegeta (and A17 for that matter but that's another topic) at all is ridiculous. He has zero feats & statements in the anime that suggest that. Hell, you could even argue that Gohan in the anime ToP surpassed Golden Freeza at some point due to his fights with the triple robot fusion before Aniraza and his better fight against Dsypo.

2. Piccolo is obviously weaker than A18, especially after the Ribranne fight. Ribranne was shown to be on par with a serious base Goku & and a suppressed SSJ1 Vegeta. In her giant form she should be at least around serious SSJ1 levels. And A18 beat her down, breaking her limits in the process. Piccolo on the other arguably isn't even as strong as the base forms of the full blooded saiyans in the ToP.

Previews from the arc said Goku and Freeza are tied to #1 spot of U7 and no, Vegeta is not stronger than KKx20 Goku.

Goku never used Kaioken against Toppo and Freeza does have feats, he's equal to Blue Goku so by default he's stronger than Gohan, Vegeta and 17.

Ribrianne's actual power couldn't even beat an exhausted base Goku in E118 (Zirloin got all of her power). Super Saiyan Vegeta was just toying with her and left the battle before going serious. Goku only got serious against her Super Ribrianne form. E119 also proves Piccolo is way out of 18's league thanks to Gamisaras and E90 proves he's stronger than base Goku since he beat SS2 Gohan in E88.

1. Here's Goku using SSBKK against base Toppo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSkcaRmZmQc. Remember, normal SSB Vegeta matched that. The same base Toppo that took on Gohan, 17 & Golden Freeza all at once. Also, SSB Vegeta in ep.122 was able to put up a way better fight against Jiren than both KKx20 Goku from the hour special and Hit (not to say he's stronger than current KKx20 Goku). Plus, he was able to create a Final Flash that was more powerful than the U7 Spirit Bomb (which itself was stronger than KKx20 Goku from the hour special).

2. Virutally nothing in the show itself says Golden Freeza is stronger than normal SSB Vegeta or A17. Freeza has no feats that put him above those two, and both SSB Goku and SSB Vegeta were shown to be equals in the end of the series. Everytime Freeza fought someone that's SSB level or above he would get beat down or struggle (Dyspo, the U3 Robots, Kale in the manga, etc).

3. You can even argue that Gohan surpassed Golden Freeza halfway into the ToP. Since Golden Freeza and Full-Speed Dsypo were evenly matched in strengh, yet Ultimate Gohan was stated and shown to have more raw power than Dsypo. Meaning he would be stronger than Freeza was well.

So there is no way Golden Freeza and SSB Goku could be tied for #1 based on what was actually said and shown in the anime itself, especially since all of the saiyans were stated and shown to have got stronger as the ToP went on even without gaining new transformations.

[dragon boss z]

1. Where or when was this ever shown or stated in the anime? Golden Freeza was shown to be at best equal to normal SSB Goku at the start of the ToP, yet normal SSB Vegeta since ep.122 was shown/implied to be stronger than KKx20 Goku from the hour special based on his superior performance against Jiren and the Final Flash feat. Also, Normal SSB Vegeta was shown to be equal to base Toppo (who Goku needed Blue Kaioken times ?? to match in the preliminaries). So the idea of Golden Freeza being stronger than regular SSB Vegeta (and A17 for that matter but that's another topic) at all is ridiculous. He has zero feats & statements in the anime that suggest that. Hell, you could even argue that Gohan in the anime ToP surpassed Golden Freeza at some point due to his fights with the triple robot fusion before Aniraza and his better fight against Dsypo.

2. Piccolo is obviously weaker than A18, especially after the Ribranne fight. Ribranne was shown to be on par with a serious base Goku & and a suppressed SSJ1 Vegeta. In her giant form she should be at least around serious SSJ1 levels. And A18 beat her down, breaking her limits in the process. Piccolo on the other arguably isn't even as strong as the base forms of the full blooded saiyans in the ToP.

Previews from the arc said Goku and Freeza are tied to #1 spot of U7 and no, Vegeta is not stronger than KKx20 Goku.

Goku never used Kaioken against Toppo and Freeza does have feats, he's equal to Blue Goku so by default he's stronger than Gohan, Vegeta and 17.

Ribrianne's actual power couldn't even beat an exhausted base Goku in E118 (Zirloin got all of her power). Super Saiyan Vegeta was just toying with her and left the battle before going serious. Goku only got serious against her Super Ribrianne form. E119 also proves Piccolo is way out of 18's league thanks to Gamisaras and E90 proves he's stronger than base Goku since he beat SS2 Gohan in E88.

1. Here's Goku using SSBKK against base Toppo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSkcaRmZmQc. Remember, normal SSB Vegeta matched that. The same base Toppo that took on Gohan, 17 & Golden Freeza all at once. Also, SSB Vegeta in ep.122 was able to put up a way better fight against Jiren than both KKx20 Goku from the hour special and Hit (not to say he's stronger than current KKx20 Goku). Plus, he was able to create a Final Flash that was more powerful than the U7 Spirit Bomb (which itself was stronger than KKx20 Goku from the hour special).

2. Virutally nothing in the show itself says Golden Freeza is stronger than normal SSB Vegeta or A17. Freeza has no feats that put him above those two, and both SSB Goku and SSB Vegeta were shown to be equals in the end of the series. Everytime Freeza fought someone that's SSB level or above he would get beat down or struggle (Dyspo, the U3 Robots, Kale in the manga, etc).

3. You can even argue that Gohan surpassed Golden Freeza halfway into the ToP. Since Golden Freeza and Full-Speed Dsypo were evenly matched in strengh, yet Ultimate Gohan was stated and shown to have more raw power than Dsypo. Meaning he would be stronger than Freeza was well.

So there is no way Golden Freeza and SSB Goku could be tied for #1 based on what was actually said and shown in the anime itself, especially since all of the saiyans were stated and shown to have got stronger as the ToP went on even without gaining new transformations.

1. Goku activated kaioken, but never used it in combat against Toppo.

2. Pretty much agree with you here.

3. Dyspo was never even with Golden Frieza in strength. If Dyspo and Frieza were trapped together in a small area Frieza would body him just like Gohan did.

But ya, Golden Frieza is only SSB level, any version of kaioken would stomp him.

SSBE Vegito (Post-ToP) vs MUI Goku
SSJ1 Kefla vs Merged Zamasu (Halo)
SSJ4 Goku (Namek arc) vs 1st Form Cell
SSG Vegeta (ToP) vs SSB Goku (Champa arc)
Majin Dabura vs Super Perfect Cell
Bojack vs SSJ1 Goku (Buu arc)
Base Vegito (Post-ToP) vs SSJ1 Kefla
Enraged Vegeta (BoG) vs Buuhan

-Vegito
-Zamasu
-Goku stomps badly. He would even beat super perfect Cell imo.
-Goku
-If Dabura lands his spit he wins, if not Cell wins due to regeneration.
-pass
-Kefla with difficulty
-Vegeta beats on Buuhan but doesn't kill him. If he can keep his power up I think Vegeta could maybe win.

[ahill1]

Statement on fat < super?

Chapter: 488 (DBZ 294), P5.5-6
Trunks: “Huh!? That’s Majin Boo!?”
Goten: “He-he really has changed…”
Piccolo: “It’s not just his appearance…Everything about him is definitely greater than before…”

"Everything is greater" isn't definitive enough, unless you think he became better at making spaghetti too!?

[dragon boss z]

Statement on fat < super?

Chapter: 488 (DBZ 294), P5.5-6
Trunks: “Huh!? That’s Majin Boo!?”
Goten: “He-he really has changed…”
Piccolo: “It’s not just his appearance…Everything about him is definitely greater than before…”

"Everything is greater" isn't definitive enough, unless you think he became better at making spaghetti too!?

Dude, you know what it means. Goku said he could beat Fat Buu, but not Super Buu. At the very least Super Buu is the same strength as fat Buu, but can sense ki, is smarter, more ruthless, and has longer arms and legs. He wins no matter how you look at it.

[ZombieVito]

1. Here's Goku using SSBKK against base Toppo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSkcaRmZmQc. Remember, normal SSB Vegeta matched that. The same base Toppo that took on Gohan, 17 & Golden Freeza all at once. Also, SSB Vegeta in ep.122 was able to put up a way better fight against Jiren than both KKx20 Goku from the hour special and Hit (not to say he's stronger than current KKx20 Goku). Plus, he was able to create a Final Flash that was more powerful than the U7 Spirit Bomb (which itself was stronger than KKx20 Goku from the hour special).

2. Virutally nothing in the show itself says Golden Freeza is stronger than normal SSB Vegeta or A17. Freeza has no feats that put him above those two, and both SSB Goku and SSB Vegeta were shown to be equals in the end of the series. Everytime Freeza fought someone that's SSB level or above he would get beat down or struggle (Dyspo, the U3 Robots, Kale in the manga, etc).

3. You can even argue that Gohan surpassed Golden Freeza halfway into the ToP. Since Golden Freeza and Full-Speed Dsypo were evenly matched in strengh, yet Ultimate Gohan was stated and shown to have more raw power than Dsypo. Meaning he would be stronger than Freeza was well.

So there is no way Golden Freeza and SSB Goku could be tied for #1 based on what was actually said and shown in the anime itself, especially since all of the saiyans were stated and shown to have got stronger as the ToP went on even without gaining new transformations.

1.- Goku never used it on him.... Vegeta's performance was explained in the episode and the Final Flash was not stronger than the Genkidama.

2.- Whis said Golden Freeza and Blue Goku were equals in E95... Gohan, Vegeta and 17 aren't stronger than Goku so by default they all are weaker than Freeza.

3.- Dyspo is a weakling when it comes to strength. He was never equal to Freeza or Gohan. When Freeza finally caught him, he trashed him in just his Final form which is base tier.

[RandomGuy96]

Statement on fat < super?

Chapter: 488 (DBZ 294), P5.5-6
Trunks: “Huh!? That’s Majin Boo!?”
Goten: “He-he really has changed…”
Piccolo: “It’s not just his appearance…Everything about him is definitely greater than before…”

"Everything is greater" isn't definitive enough, unless you think he became better at making spaghetti too!?

Did you just straight up ignore the direct reference to ki or the guidebook excerpt directly stating that he got a lot more powerful?

[ahill1]

Chapter: 488 (DBZ 294), P5.5-6
Trunks: “Huh!? That’s Majin Boo!?”
Goten: “He-he really has changed…”
Piccolo: “It’s not just his appearance…Everything about him is definitely greater than before…”

"Everything is greater" isn't definitive enough, unless you think he became better at making spaghetti too!?

Did you just straight up ignore the direct reference to ki or the guidebook excerpt directly stating that he got a lot more powerful?

His waist was greater as a fat Boo, so greater in every way is clearly a hyperbole!!!

[GT_Goten10]

Kid Buu vs Goku Base(Black Star Arc)
Oob(Baby Arc) Vs Gotenks SSJ(Buu Arc)
Goku Base(Buu Arc) Vs Perfect Cell
Cabba Base(U6) Vs Tarble
Trunks SSJ(Baby Arc) Vs Ultimate Gohan(Buu Arc)
Gogeta SSJ(Movie 12) Vs Vegito SSJ(Buu Arc)
Hit(U6) Vs Omega Shenron

[sunsetshimmer]

Kid Buu vs Goku Base(Black Star Arc)
Oob(Baby Arc) Vs Gotenks SSJ(Buu Arc)
Goku Base(Buu Arc) Vs Perfect Cell
Cabba Base(U6) Vs Tarble
Trunks SSJ(Baby Arc) Vs Ultimate Gohan(Buu Arc)
Gogeta SSJ(Movie 12) Vs Vegito SSJ(Buu Arc)
Hit(U6) Vs Omega Shenron

-Base Goku
-Uub
-Perfect Cell
-Cabba
-Ultimate Gohan
-Gogeta
-Omega one shots

[Puaru]

In light of what Gohan accomplished in the manga, I would like to ask:

ToP Gohan vs 17.

Top Gohan vs Golden Freeza.

ToP Gohan vs SSB Goku (no kaioken).

ToP Gohan vs SSR Trunks (minus spirit sword).

[ricky84]

1. Here's Goku using SSBKK against base Toppo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSkcaRmZmQc. Remember, normal SSB Vegeta matched that. The same base Toppo that took on Gohan, 17 & Golden Freeza all at once. Also, SSB Vegeta in ep.122 was able to put up a way better fight against Jiren than both KKx20 Goku from the hour special and Hit (not to say he's stronger than current KKx20 Goku). Plus, he was able to create a Final Flash that was more powerful than the U7 Spirit Bomb (which itself was stronger than KKx20 Goku from the hour special).

2. Virutally nothing in the show itself says Golden Freeza is stronger than normal SSB Vegeta or A17. Freeza has no feats that put him above those two, and both SSB Goku and SSB Vegeta were shown to be equals in the end of the series. Everytime Freeza fought someone that's SSB level or above he would get beat down or struggle (Dyspo, the U3 Robots, Kale in the manga, etc).

3. You can even argue that Gohan surpassed Golden Freeza halfway into the ToP. Since Golden Freeza and Full-Speed Dsypo were evenly matched in strengh, yet Ultimate Gohan was stated and shown to have more raw power than Dsypo. Meaning he would be stronger than Freeza was well.

So there is no way Golden Freeza and SSB Goku could be tied for #1 based on what was actually said and shown in the anime itself, especially since all of the saiyans were stated and shown to have got stronger as the ToP went on even without gaining new transformations.

1.- Goku never used it on him.... Vegeta's performance was explained in the episode and the Final Flash was not stronger than the Genkidama.

2.- Whis said Golden Freeza and Blue Goku were equals in E95... Gohan, Vegeta and 17 aren't stronger than Goku so by default they all are weaker than Freeza.

3.- Dyspo is a weakling when it comes to strength. He was never equal to Freeza or Gohan. When Freeza finally caught him, he trashed him in just his Final form which is base tier.

1. SSBKK Goku was portrayed as equal to Base Toppo in that fight. Vegeta's performance wouldn't have been possible if he wasn't stronger (that's how DB works). Other characters commented mainly on the strength of Vegeta during ep.122. And the Final Flash was obviously stronger than the Spirit Bomb, since Jiren merely glared at the SB to deflect it and immediately reflected it with no effort when he used his hands and called it rubbish, while with the FF he felt the need to seriously block it at the last second, was knocked to the ground and complimented the attack afterward. All of this points to Final Flash>Spirit Bomb and SSB Vegeta > SSB Goku at the time.

2. Golden Freeza and SSB Goku being equals at the start of the ToP actually goes against the idea of either them being the strongest of the team, since both SSB Vegeta and A17 are beyond them in feats. There is not a single feat nor statement in the show itself that puts G.Freeza above SSB Vegeta or A17, nor was it ever said in the anime that SSB Goku>SSB Vegeta at any point. In fact, Goku himself said in e.94 or e.95 that if Freeza acts up, him or Vegeta would just kill him again, suggesting SSB Vegeta > Golden Freeza.

3. Dyspo even in base is not weak at all. He was able to tank and trade hits with SSG Goku and Hit without much issue in just his base, and in his Light Speed Mode was able to tank & trade hits with Golden Freeza and Gohan simultaneously. He wasn't overpowered when throwing hands with Golden Freeza, but was with fighting Gohan, suggesting that Gohan>Dsypo=Freeza by that point. And don't even get me started on Freeza vs Kale in the manga.

If Freeza was really all that compared to the rest of U7, then you would expect that he'd get a better showing than what he got in the ToP. There is not a single instance of him dominating or even matching a fighter that's SSG level or above all by himself in the ToP.

[ricky84]

Kid Buu vs Goku Base(Black Star Arc)
Oob(Baby Arc) Vs Gotenks SSJ(Buu Arc)
Goku Base(Buu Arc) Vs Perfect Cell
Cabba Base(U6) Vs Tarble
Trunks SSJ(Baby Arc) Vs Ultimate Gohan(Buu Arc)
Gogeta SSJ(Movie 12) Vs Vegito SSJ(Buu Arc)
Hit(U6) Vs Omega Shenron

1. Goku stomps
2. Uub one shots
3. Perfect Cell one shots
4. Cabba one shots
5. Gohan one shots
6. Gogeta stomps (movies have different scaling from the main story)
7. Hit one shots.

[PFM18]

In light of what Gohan accomplished in the manga, I would like to ask:

ToP Gohan vs 17.

Top Gohan vs Golden Freeza.

ToP Gohan vs SSB Goku (no kaioken).

ToP Gohan vs SSR Trunks (minus spirit sword).

You must be very happy with that manga chapter

Given what we saw with Gohan in the manga, his manga iteration should be able to win all of those with utmost ease. But of course, the scaling in the manga is extremely hard to make sense of so there's really no way for anything like that to realistically be concluded in a definitive way.

Anime Gohan would lose all of them though.

Kid Buu vs Goku Base(Black Star Arc)
Oob(Baby Arc) Vs Gotenks SSJ(Buu Arc)
Goku Base(Buu Arc) Vs Perfect Cell
Cabba Base(U6) Vs Tarble
Trunks SSJ(Baby Arc) Vs Ultimate Gohan(Buu Arc)
Gogeta SSJ(Movie 12) Vs Vegito SSJ(Buu Arc)
Hit(U6) Vs Omega Shenron

Goku
Oob
lol
Gohan
Vegetto
Hit