Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

Moderators: Kanzenshuu Staff, General Help

User avatar
Miracles
I Live Here
Posts: 3107
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:31 am

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Miracles » Sat Feb 23, 2019 12:10 am

Scsigs wrote:Ok, I've finally rewatched the first Broly movie after a few days of being home from vacation. Not only that, but I visited the 7th circle of Hell & subjected myself to the first sequel as well, because it was written & directed by the same 2 people as the first; Takao Koyama & Shigeyasu Yamauchi respectively & the sequel informs the first film in a way that the first only threw in your face as gently as a frying pan would be, but it's fair to give what I'm analyzing here the benefit of the doubt.
Now, if no one knows what I'm talking about, over a week ago, I promised someone in this thread that I'd rewatch the first Broly movie after there was an argument. I decided to throw in the second as well, so I'll give thoughts both positive & negative, then give my thoughts on if Broly's anger is completely directed at Goku or if he's a blood knight like some people here seem to think he is. I've also read the TV Tropes pages of these films to try to understand this mentality better.
Here's what I'm working with. I have the steelbook DVDs from 2009. I watched the English dubs with the Japanese soundtrack with the subtitles turned on for the sub. These are the official subs by Steve Simmons. I do this for all anime I watch & it's just to see if the dubs added in any text that wasn't there in the original Japanese. It's also to mainly catch the important dialogue for my assessment.

Now, Broly: The Legendary Super Saiyan:
Positives first:
The animation of this movie is excellent. The character models, the backgrounds, the shading. It's all good stuff. I particularly like a lot of the effects work used to portray the energy manipulation that comes with Ki control. One thing in particular that stands out in these movies specifically is Broly's green ki blast attack. The entire picture going from one color then to normal when he uses it is a good choice & makes for a good spectacle.
The English dub is one that I feel is a proto-dub that would later be perfected for Kai, Super, & the last 3 movies. It's accurate, yet playful, which is how I like my dubs. It's only really hampered by SOME of the lines that were changed being rather stupid alterations, a "my gosh!" by Goku being thrown in (which, no matter how you slice it, is narmy even by kid's show dub standards), which PLAGUED the Buu Saga of Z, & the voice acting, while not being as bad as Z's, isn't really up to snuff with the cast's current level of quality. This dub was done in 2002 or 3, so I understand why this is. Still, it's better than nothing & at least I don't feel embarrassed to be watching it.
The start of this movie is decently done. Building the mystery of the destruction of South Galaxy & who this Legendary Super Saiyan person is. Paragus coming to get Vegeta to rule over a new Planet Vegeta as an act of revenge for his father not considering using Broly as a soldier & attempting to kill them, I think, is actually genuinely good. It's certainly more involved than the majority of the villains in the Z movies get.

Middle of the road:
Sean Schemmel's performance is one people who watch Super dubbed will be familiar with. This is an early example of his more "happy go lucky" Goku as opposed to the more serious Goku he was hired to play. It's not overplayed because the movie's not written like Super would later be, but it DOES have seeds of overplaying Goku's happy go lucky nature for comedic relief. Thankfully, it's kept to the first half & doesn't lead to jarring moments like Super sometimes has done by trying to make you laugh during more serious moments, leading to mood whiplash. And even when there's a slightly comedic line, it's not there for long & it's not too jarring. So, Sean does what's needed for the role. Whether you like him attempting to do the more comedic moments or not is what's gonna inform your opinion here.
In terms of timeline placement, this movie is one of the few with the least problems of most of the Z movies, since you COULD slot it in the 10-day wait for the Cell Games. However, due to when it was most likely written, Cell doesn't appear in a cameo or mention by any of the cast. This is where I feel the Abridged version adds for the better on the original. Also, for some reason, Gohan & Goku are in their normal states when they're supposed to be Super Saiyans due to their training. Makes no sense is what I'm saying, though THAT'S not really important in the grand scheme of things.
Vegeta being in 'awe' at Broly's power. While it's stupid, is actually based on his interactions with Cell when he achieves his Perfect Form & Vegeta can't phase him. It's dumb, but at least I can say I get where they were coming from with this stupidity.

Now for the negatives:
Unfortunately, the master used, even though this is the same master used for FUNi's US Blu-Rays, I feel is kinda half-assed in the remastering. Now, it's not their Z Blu-Rays level of bad, but the master is a bit flat & the 480p-ness is definitely felt when watching it. If I could get a copy of the Japanese remaster used for Toei's recent Blu-Rays, I feel this film would really shine. Even rewatching TFS' abridged version, the animation is better from the Dragon Box master than this remaster.
The plot of this movie is nothing new for the Z movies. We previously had Turles as a previous Saiyan who somehow survived Planet Vegeta's destruction at the hands of Frieza & no one knowing about him in the head count. Once Goku shows up halfway through, the movie's pacing gets REALLY bogged down, slowly having Broly lose his sanity after seeing him again after 20+ years until finally Broly snaps, breaks free of his constraints his father put in place, & starts beating the ever-loving shit out of Goku, Gohan, Trunks, Piccolo, & Vegeta. The movie then basically becomes torture porn until Goku finally kills Broly...or so you'd think. The Abridged version definitely put it right when one of the Shamoshians says, "We're not gonna miss sadism like THIS!"
Broly has very little to NO discernible personality whatsoever. When he's in his base form, all he does is get bossed around by Vegeta & looks, as Trunks puts it in the dub, like a toothpick. When he's transformed, he's nothing but the Hulk without the "gentle giant, only in a world that hates him" trait. His one defining trait, which is only amplified with the Abridged version, is his hatred of Goku. Some people on here have argued, as TV Tropes has it, Broly being a sadistic Blood Knight (someone who relishes fighting no matter what). However, that's NOT how the movie portrays him. He never states that he wants to kill Goku, no, nor does he actually state it was Goku crying next to him as a baby is why he hates him, but this movie, & the next one, doesn't really portray it any other way. Paragus DOES state that he AND Broly wanted revenge on Vegeta, yes, but this is more so what Paragus wanted. Broly's selective memory from when he was a baby doesn't help matters. Apparently, as presented by Paragus, Broly was perfectly fine with helping him get revenge on Vegeta. Paragus even lets him destroy a LOT of South Galaxy to be able to lure Vegeta into their clutches. The one wild card they didn't take into account is Goku knowing King Kai (which, I can understand why they wouldn't), which gets him involved directly in the plot.
The only place where I can see Broly being a Blood Knight is the one scene where he's apparently destroying things in space before his father restrains his power with the device he has. However, the movie never allows itself to explore these elements because it's forgotten just as quickly as it's brought up & it's replaced with...Broly being mad at Goku because he cried when they were babies in the Saiyan nursery & the Saiyans watching over them made fun of Broly for joining in on the crying even though they were BABIES. Now, THIS is the point I was arguing the most. For one, Broly shouldn't remember that. They weren't even that old when it happened. Yes, I know Goku suffered a blow to the head when he was a toddler & that's why he is how he is. However, that more so seemed to me as something that was more of an attitude adjustment as it was portrayed & Goku wasn't more than a few years old, as portrayed in Minus & the new Broly movie (&, even then, in the original Z anime & Kai, due to them animating it at the time before this info was known, & I doubt even Toriyama thought of those details, Goku wasn't more than a year or so old when that happened) & it was his healing factor that kept him from being fully mentally handicapped & allowed his brain to heal, but with his current personality as a result.

I'm laughing at the absurdity that this was literally stated as what happened.

However, it's only ever been stated that the differences biologically between pure-blooded Saiyans & humans is that Saiyans grow tails, have the ability to go Super Saiyan, & are savage warriors by nature. Nothing else. Broly was a baby when that happened &, as such, his brain was still developing. Think about when your first memory was. Odds are it's not until you're around 3-5 years old. Babies don't remember anything that happens to them. Why would Broly remember it? There's my logic problem with it. Next, it makes Broly look INSANELY petty. He's REALLY gonna take vengeance on a guy who made him cry when they were both babies? Yeah, nice villain there. Next, it'd make MORE sense for Broly to go after Vegeta. Paragus DID state that they wanted to have revenge on him, but the movie makes it seem that Broly's not really interested in that, even though he has MORE of a reason to hate Vegeta since his father tried to have him killed, but, NOPE! Broly HAS to fight Goku. And, for some reason, Broly HAS to have a connection to Goku.
For those who're gonna argue against this, the FILM never portrays it this way that Broly wanted revenge on anyone but Goku, or is at least confused on how to properly portray it. The sequel makes this worse with one crucial addition I'll get to in a bit. For one, we get NO look inside Broly's mind with any internal monologue. You know what we DO get? Paragus giving us a flashback to them in the nursery & what looks like Broly focusing heavily on it. We get NO further details, so the only conclusion as to what the hell is happening is that Broly hates Goku for what happened. If it's a misunderstanding, then it's one THE FILM causes with its poor structuring.
The thing I can compare it to is Batman V Superman. The poor structuring of the way that film's plot was told made the way Batman comes back from being intent on killing Superman laughable (realizing his mom & Superman's adoptive mom's names were Martha), which could've been a clever realization, but the film was poorly told & made it a meme over night. There's a reason why TFS altered the way the story's told to make Broly have a split personality that only comes out when he hears "Kakarot" & removes some of the fluff. It doesn't solve all the problems, but it makes it more concise & clear on why he is how he is. He's given the blood knight traits, the reasons to take vengeance on Vegeta, & the means, as well as his father manipulating him into doing his bidding, but for some reason goes after Goku, with the only reason seemingly being that Goku made him cry & the Saiyans made fun of him for it. Even in the Japanese version, that seems to be the only reason. The sequel adds to this in a significant way.

Next, Broly: The Second Coming:
Positives:
The animation is still decent, but lesser than the first.
At the very least, the pacing is improved by not being bogged down with unnecessary slowness after the first quarter.
The Family Kamehameha is nice, since it's a call-back to the Father-Son Kamehameha from Gohan's fight with Cell.

Middle of the road:
The dub is decent. Decently accurate, but not as much as the first. The dub also adds a slight plothole. Goten's cries when wanting an apple are what stir Broly to wake from his comatose state. In the Japanese, this made slightly more sense because Goten's voice by Masako Nozawa too & his cries would sound more like Goku's, unlike the dub where his dub voice sounds NOTHING like Goku's from when he was a kid. Neither of them. In English, it's a bit forced. Also, god, do these earlier dubs highlight why I prefer the later dubs on an acting level. Goten's voice is WAY too gruff here. Videl's voice is also a bit too rough-sounding. Kara Edwards' later portrayals of them in Kai, Super, & Battle of Gods, with her softer-sounding & more relaxed recordings are WAY less grating on the ears. Same with Laura Bailey's kid Trunks.

Negatives:
This movie is BORING! It trods along for the first quarter with that village tripe, then, when Broly shows up, it just becomes more torture porn. Even when Gohan shows up, it doesn't get any better. There's even a plot hole where Shenron doesn't show up when Goten tries to call him, but somehow hears his thoughts & brings Goku back. I'm assuming that this takes place AFTER Goku goes back to Otherworld, otherwise Goten wouldn't even know who he is, which COULD explain it, since the others used the Dragon Balls to bring back Vegeta's victims. Plus, Vegeta doesn't show up. But if THAT'S the case, where's BUU? Where's Piccolo? Why are Goten, Trunks, & Videl looking for the Dragon Balls at this point in time? Why are they going to make SELFISH wishes? Why is Gohan still on Earth when he was training with Supreme Kai & Kibito? Why don't Goten & Trunks use fusion? God, too many continuity snarls & questions to forgive here ON TOP of Broly getting to Earth making NO sense since Goku BLEW HIM UP with his One Punch Man punch & Broly getting rid of the only pod on the planet. I know Goku getting away from Namek, & Frieza surviving the explosion, were a stretches, but THIS takes it to a whole new level.
The plot is also nonexistent, as this movie doesn't even have a proper reason to exist other than it's another Broly film.
Now, this movie basically confirms the thought that Broly's rampage on Goku was caused by him crying when they were babies by Broly being awoken by Goten crying & Broly having a flashback to the animation from the first movie of Goku doing the same thing. THAT'S the only confirmation most people need that that's why Broly hates Goku. Again, brought up the leap in logic of why he'd remember that, so I'll just say that it only confirms something in the first movie that could be argued against, since at least it gave Broly a few more things, even IF they were base & he didn't have anything else to his character. He also has a seething hatred towards Goten, since he looks, & in the Japanese SOUNDS, exactly like Goku. THIS is probably the reason they put that flashback in here, since, otherwise, it wouldn't make any sense, but it ultimately defeats any argument anyone could make for Broly being just a Blood Knight.
This movie was also written & directed by the same 2 people as the first & it was released only a year after the first, so this makes this even more in the favor of detractors.

Ultimately, the character of Broly is a contrivance fueled by nothing but a bloodlust seemingly fueled by the need for vengeance not against Vegeta, which would make sense, but Goku for making him cry, which he shouldn't remember. He survived a stabbing because he has a better healing factor than Goku did at 2-3 at only a few days to weeks old even though Goku only had a head injury & HE was stabbed in the chest (there's a reason TFS altered that scene to make his skin impenetrable by a dagger, since it makes sense with his larger power as established with how Ki works in this series, the 2 aren't comparable). He's the only other villain than Cooler to get a sequel (2, in fact) to his original movie &, like Cooler before him, the sequels only serve to devalue him as he originally was, such as he was, & are of a lower quality than his original movie. The third movie isn't even worth talking about in this context because it's a CLONE of him & not the original, so he's not fueled by the same things as the original. All in all, I'm glad Toriyama rebooted the character. Given another chance in a more competent writer's hands, Broly HAS potential. And with a better told story, could even be great. From the word of mouth I've heard, that's what they did & I can't wait to watch this movie when it comes to home video.
Glad you re watched it...Not glad you looked at the dub...You are still mixed up...
As you can see...Broly is a sadistic blood knight, fighting machine, who's motive was not a baby crying but was destruction and was fated to be defeated by Kakarot who made him cry before.

User avatar
God Gogeta
Newbie
Posts: 31
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:01 am

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by God Gogeta » Sat Feb 23, 2019 12:38 am

Galan007 wrote:To me it was clear that Gogeta looked so superior to Broly because he was a much better fighter, with a lot more tricks in his bag -- not necessarily because he was massively more powerful.

Think about it: among many others, Goku and Vegeta have trained with f*cking WHIS, whereas Broly's only 'teacher' was Paragus(lol) -- they should absolutely be FAR superior fighters. That said, Broly was still powerful enough to soak EVERYTHING Gogeta dished out, and continued getting exponentially stronger/evolving the entire time. The fact that Gogeta not only went from SSJ all the way to SSB, but also felt that a 'full force' Kamehameha was required to put Broly down, speaks volumes about Broly's power.

Don't get me wrong, I'm sure Gogeta was more powerful, but I don't think the difference between their powers was nearly as vast as some believe. As mentioned, I think the difference in fighting skill made the gap in power appear larger than it actually was. /shrug
Correction, difference of power was there initially but later Broly catches up. Like gogeta using suppressed perfected SSB initially but later when Broly reached perfected full powered state( perfected as his initial lssj state could do nothing against SSB gogeta) he somehow blocked two kicks of Gogeta. Forcing Gogeta to use full power and continuously pummeling him with attacks one after another without giving him any chance to power up.
God Gogeta

User avatar
Scsigs
I Live Here
Posts: 2835
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2016 3:55 am
Location: NY, USA
Contact:

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Scsigs » Sat Feb 23, 2019 2:25 am

Miracles wrote:Glad you re watched it...Not glad you looked at the dub...You are still mixed up...
As you can see...Broly is a sadistic blood knight, fighting machine, who's motive was not a baby crying but was destruction and was fated to be defeated by Kakarot who made him cry before.
I said this early in my evaluation of the films, but I didn't just watch the dub. I watched the dub with the subtitles for the JP dub to make sure the dub didn't add much in the way of colorful alterations to the original script. Now, it DID, but not in this respect outside of a few lines I considered questionable as to why they added them in, like Broly & Goku being born on the same day, but none of the added dub text in the script is off enough to be enough of a complete change in personality like the DB dubs were prone to doing back then. It's just its own way of basically doing the same thing as the Japanese script in another language, which is why essentially I said it felt like a blueprint that Kai, Super, & the last 3 movie dubs would perfect.

Next, I think you skipped over some of the sentences in my analysis. I didn't say Broly wasn't a blood knight. That was clearly meant to be part of his character, since he was used by Paragus to destroy the South Galaxy & he clearly has those lines that show him wanting to fight Goku & being sadistic in his speech. HOWEVER, that doesn't erase the way the movie is told, or the sequel. The movie shows the flashback, which you included handy screenshots of, thank you, of the Saiyans making fun of Broly for crying even though he has a higher power level than Goku even though he's a baby, since babies cry all the time as a form of communication if nothing else. This then fades into Broly being mentally disturbed by Goku's presence & we're not given any other catalyst for why Broly wants to fight Goku. He looks at Goku with enough of an unrelenting fury that he's pissed at him for SOME reason. Combine that with how the movie is animated & plays out & his fighting Goku is presented, unintentionally, as a means to get revenge on him for crying when they're babies. There's really not a lot of wiggle room in how it plays out.

THEN there's the sequel. The second movie has Broly devolved into what he is after a point in the first movie. If YOU don't wanna take the first sequel into account & wanna analyze him based on his first movie, that's your prerogative. However, the sequel literally has Broly hear Goten's cries to Videl & he remembers Goku crying in the nursery. He then wakes up & starts trying to kick the shit out of Goten & Trunks, all while screaming "Kakarot!" while doing so. Granted, it makes more sense in the JP dub, since Goten sounds exactly like Goku due to having the same VA, but it adds in a detail that you could argue wasn't intended in the first movie, where it's flat-out confirmed that Broly remembers that. This movie was written & directed by the same 2 guys & only made a year later, so it's not an alternate character interpretation by someone else Toei hired to write the script & direct it. This is a part of Broly's character & to blatantly ignore it is ignoring how even Broly's creator sees him.
Only dubs that matter are DB, Kai, & Super. Nothing else.
Vic Mignogna: Good actor & singer, but a MAJOR douchebag & idiot.
https://www.youtube.com/user/Scsigs
https://twitter.com/Scsigs

User avatar
Miracles
I Live Here
Posts: 3107
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:31 am

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Miracles » Sat Feb 23, 2019 3:47 am

Scsigs wrote:
Miracles wrote:Glad you re watched it...Not glad you looked at the dub...You are still mixed up...
As you can see...Broly is a sadistic blood knight, fighting machine, who's motive was not a baby crying but was destruction and was fated to be defeated by Kakarot who made him cry before.
I said this early in my evaluation of the films, but I didn't just watch the dub. I watched the dub with the subtitles for the JP dub to make sure the dub didn't add much in the way of colorful alterations to the original script. Now, it DID, but not in this respect outside of a few lines I considered questionable as to why they added them in, like Broly & Goku being born on the same day, but none of the added dub text in the script is off enough to be enough of a complete change in personality like the DB dubs were prone to doing back then. It's just its own way of basically doing the same thing as the Japanese script in another language, which is why essentially I said it felt like a blueprint that Kai, Super, & the last 3 movie dubs would perfect.

Next, I think you skipped over some of the sentences in my analysis. I didn't say Broly wasn't a blood knight. That was clearly meant to be part of his character, since he was used by Paragus to destroy the South Galaxy & he clearly has those lines that show him wanting to fight Goku & being sadistic in his speech. HOWEVER, that doesn't erase the way the movie is told, or the sequel. The movie shows the flashback, which you included handy screenshots of, thank you, of the Saiyans making fun of Broly for crying even though he has a higher power level than Goku even though he's a baby, since babies cry all the time as a form of communication if nothing else. This then fades into Broly being mentally disturbed by Goku's presence & we're not given any other catalyst for why Broly wants to fight Goku. He looks at Goku with enough of an unrelenting fury that he's pissed at him for SOME reason. Combine that with how the movie is animated & plays out & his fighting Goku is presented, unintentionally, as a means to get revenge on him for crying when they're babies. There's really not a lot of wiggle room in how it plays out.

THEN there's the sequel. The second movie has Broly devolved into what he is after a point in the first movie. If YOU don't wanna take the first sequel into account & wanna analyze him based on his first movie, that's your prerogative. However, the sequel literally has Broly hear Goten's cries to Videl & he remembers Goku crying in the nursery. He then wakes up & starts trying to kick the shit out of Goten & Trunks, all while screaming "Kakarot!" while doing so. Granted, it makes more sense in the JP dub, since Goten sounds exactly like Goku due to having the same VA, but it adds in a detail that you could argue wasn't intended in the first movie, where it's flat-out confirmed that Broly remembers that. This movie was written & directed by the same 2 guys & only made a year later, so it's not an alternate character interpretation by someone else Toei hired to write the script & direct it. This is a part of Broly's character & to blatantly ignore it is ignoring how even Broly's creator sees him.
First, there was no specific reason for broly to fight Goku cause the movie explicitly stated [in the scenes I showed you] that Goku's power just AWAKENED Broly's Legendary Super Saiyan. That's all. Despite Paragus finally gaining control over Broly, Goku's powerful presence stirred Broly's instincts. The story didn't set up Broly to have reasons other than the blood lust of the Legendary Super Saiyan. His purpose was to just seek and destroy everyone and everything. The connection was the crying which was instrumental to Broly's defeat. Broly's destiny being a two time loser to Goku as a baby and an adult.

Our debate was concerning Movie 8 Broly. The sequel isn't relevant here.

User avatar
Scsigs
I Live Here
Posts: 2835
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2016 3:55 am
Location: NY, USA
Contact:

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Scsigs » Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:12 am

Miracles wrote:First, there was no reason to fight Goku cause the movie explicitly stated [in the scenes I showed you] that Goku's power just AWAKENED Broly's Legendary Super Saiyan. That's all. Despite Paragus finally gaining control over Broly, Goku's powerful presence stirred Broly's instincts. The story didn't set up Broly to fight Goku with a reason, that's the point, his purpose was to just seek and destroy everyone and everything. The crying was to demonstrate Broly's destiny being a loser to Goku twice.

Our debate was concerning Movie 8 Broly. The sequel isn't relevant here.
In what way is Goku's power the catalyst that triggers Broly to want to fight him? It's never stated in either dub that that's the reason either. I think you're stretching a bit. The only scenes showing that even suggest that's the reason, I always took as something else because of how vague they're played, like the scene showing their energies next to each other. There's nothing to suggest Broly only wanted to fight Goku either. Yes, he's a weapon of mass destruction, but his trigger is Goku. As a baby. There's no other real explanation. Yes, he seeks to destroy the things, but his trigger with Goku is that thing from their infancy. The 2 aren't exclusive when it comes to Goku. That's my point here.

And, I knew you were going to say that. My rebuttle is that sequels often inform attributes of characters in ways that the first installments didn't, sometimes in bad ways, so, no, it's entirely relevant, especially since the same guy wrote both, so it's a completely relevant thing, which you're blatantly ignoring to bolster your point, which is why I called you out on it & justified my point with it. If this weren't a perfectly legitimate thing to do, I wouldn't do it. And if this weren't how you were supposed to judge the character, Koyama wouldn't have written that into the second movie. Sorry. I understand you wanna talk about the first movie as if the sequels didn't exist. I gave you that benefit & talked about Broly from that perspective, since the bulk of his characterization is in his first movie, but the sequel deflates the argument that he's just a blood knight. There's a reason he wants to fight Goku & it's that he cried next to him in the nursery. There's really no wiggle room here once all the factors are taken into account.
Only dubs that matter are DB, Kai, & Super. Nothing else.
Vic Mignogna: Good actor & singer, but a MAJOR douchebag & idiot.
https://www.youtube.com/user/Scsigs
https://twitter.com/Scsigs

User avatar
Potara-Warrior96
Newbie
Posts: 38
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2016 11:55 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Potara-Warrior96 » Sat Feb 23, 2019 2:59 pm

Scsigs wrote:
Miracles wrote:There's a reason he wants to fight Goku & it's that he cried next to him in the nursery. There's really no wiggle room here once all the factors are taken into account.
I'm sorry but why does everyone forgets about him being stabbed as an infant and left on a dying planet? Like I'd agree if in his backstory it only showed Gokus crying upsetting him and then a quick jump back to the present but that isn't what was shown in the flashback. We get a new born Broly who's first minutes into world were met by discomfort by Gokus crying then extreme amounts of pain then followed up with a planet literally blowing in his face(plus all that happening in the span of just being born is enough to mentally fuck someone up). Because of this Broly subconsciously associates Goku upsetting him and his near death experience as one in the same. You're probably thinking "Even if that was true how was Broly able to remember Goku All the way from 30 years ago" to which I would bring up the fact that Broly even as an infant was apparently aware enough to realise that he was in danger when planet Vegeta exploded.

Also if the Z movies are following anime Canon and filler their was a filler episode where it was revealed siayan pods play a recording of what's their mission is once they landed. So we can at least presume that siayan infants in the anime are somewhat aware enough to understand certain sounds. On top of that the fact that in the show characters are able to tell who is who by sensing said persons ki which if we go by the Broly first interaction with Goku it seems that Broly was recognising his ki.

User avatar
Scsigs
I Live Here
Posts: 2835
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2016 3:55 am
Location: NY, USA
Contact:

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Scsigs » Sat Feb 23, 2019 3:59 pm

Potara-Warrior96 wrote:
Scsigs wrote:
Miracles wrote:There's a reason he wants to fight Goku & it's that he cried next to him in the nursery. There's really no wiggle room here once all the factors are taken into account.
I'm sorry but why does everyone forgets about him being stabbed as an infant and left on a dying planet? Like I'd agree if in his backstory it only showed Goku's crying upsetting him and then a quick jump back to the present but that isn't what was shown in the flashback. We get a new born Broly who's first minutes into world were met by discomfort by Goku's crying then extreme amounts of pain then followed up with a planet literally blowing in his face (plus all that happening in the span of just being born is enough to mentally fuck someone up). Because of this Broly subconsciously associates Goku upsetting him and his near death experience as one in the same. You're probably thinking "Even if that was true how was Broly able to remember Goku All the way from 30 years ago" to which I would bring up the fact that Broly even as an infant was apparently aware enough to realise that he was in danger when planet Vegeta exploded.

Also if the Z movies are following anime Canon and filler there was a filler episode where it was revealed Saiyan pods play a recording of what's their mission is once they landed. So we can at least presume that Saiyan infants in the anime are somewhat aware enough to understand certain sounds. On top of that the fact that in the show characters are able to tell who is who by sensing said persons ki which if we go by the Broly first interaction with Goku it seems that Broly was recognising his ki.
Why would Broly being stabbed have him being mad at Goku? If anything, he'd be pissed at Vegeta like Paragus is. Like, the film is full of stupidity, plot holes, & stupid plot holes & that's one of them. I think TFS put this best when Vegeta questioned Paragus about it. Broly being stabbed fucking him up is NOT a replacement for him being pissed at Goku for crying when they were babies. If anything, it adds to that stupidity by explaining WHY he'd be so hung up on Goku; he's mentally unhinged. Broly apologists are really stretching if they're going by your logic, dude.
Only dubs that matter are DB, Kai, & Super. Nothing else.
Vic Mignogna: Good actor & singer, but a MAJOR douchebag & idiot.
https://www.youtube.com/user/Scsigs
https://twitter.com/Scsigs

User avatar
Miracles
I Live Here
Posts: 3107
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:31 am

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Miracles » Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:00 pm

Scsigs wrote:
Miracles wrote:First, there was no reason to fight Goku cause the movie explicitly stated [in the scenes I showed you] that Goku's power just AWAKENED Broly's Legendary Super Saiyan. That's all. Despite Paragus finally gaining control over Broly, Goku's powerful presence stirred Broly's instincts. The story didn't set up Broly to fight Goku with a reason, that's the point, his purpose was to just seek and destroy everyone and everything. The crying was to demonstrate Broly's destiny being a loser to Goku twice.

Our debate was concerning Movie 8 Broly. The sequel isn't relevant here.
In what way is Goku's power the catalyst that triggers Broly to want to fight him? It's never stated in either dub that that's the reason either. I think you're stretching a bit. The only scenes showing that even suggest that's the reason, I always took as something else because of how vague they're played, like the scene showing their energies next to each other. There's nothing to suggest Broly only wanted to fight Goku either. Yes, he's a weapon of mass destruction, but his trigger is Goku. As a baby. There's no other real explanation. Yes, he seeks to destroy the things, but his trigger with Goku is that thing from their infancy. The 2 aren't exclusive when it comes to Goku. That's my point here.

And, I knew you were going to say that. My rebuttle is that sequels often inform attributes of characters in ways that the first installments didn't, sometimes in bad ways, so, no, it's entirely relevant, especially since the same guy wrote both, so it's a completely relevant thing, which you're blatantly ignoring to bolster your point, which is why I called you out on it & justified my point with it. If this weren't a perfectly legitimate thing to do, I wouldn't do it. And if this weren't how you were supposed to judge the character, Koyama wouldn't have written that into the second movie. Sorry. I understand you wanna talk about the first movie as if the sequels didn't exist. I gave you that benefit & talked about Broly from that perspective, since the bulk of his characterization is in his first movie, but the sequel deflates the argument that he's just a blood knight. There's a reason he wants to fight Goku & it's that he cried next to him in the nursery. There's really no wiggle room here once all the factors are taken into account.
Who said Goku's power made Broly want to fight him? It is stated that Goku's power only awakened Broly's Legendary power. Then Broly wanted EVERYONE to fight him cause of his destructive nature. Stop trying to give Broly a direct reason to fight Goku when the story did not. Broly never mentioned the crying nor did Paragus as the reason to fight Goku. The fandom has been wrongfully doing that for years. Broly was a maniac WAY before Goku came on the scene. Paragus was the only one who tied both Goku and Broly being born on the same day as a destined meeting. That crying scene said that despite Goku's weak power level compared to broly's he still made him cry. This was signified again when Goku defeated Broly in movie 8. I'm not stretching anything when it's right there in Japanese subs. Again, it is the fandom trying to rewrite narration.

The sequel is something I have to look at again. However you shouldn't even go on to the sequel when you can't even get the first movie narration correct.

User avatar
Shineman
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 172
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2009 6:34 pm
Location: World of Information
Contact:

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Shineman » Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:30 pm

Scsigs wrote:
Miracles wrote:First, there was no reason to fight Goku cause the movie explicitly stated [in the scenes I showed you] that Goku's power just AWAKENED Broly's Legendary Super Saiyan. That's all. Despite Paragus finally gaining control over Broly, Goku's powerful presence stirred Broly's instincts. The story didn't set up Broly to fight Goku with a reason, that's the point, his purpose was to just seek and destroy everyone and everything. The crying was to demonstrate Broly's destiny being a loser to Goku twice.

Our debate was concerning Movie 8 Broly. The sequel isn't relevant here.
In what way is Goku's power the catalyst that triggers Broly to want to fight him? It's never stated in either dub that that's the reason either. I think you're stretching a bit. The only scenes showing that even suggest that's the reason, I always took as something else because of how vague they're played, like the scene showing their energies next to each other. There's nothing to suggest Broly only wanted to fight Goku either. Yes, he's a weapon of mass destruction, but his trigger is Goku. As a baby. There's no other real explanation. Yes, he seeks to destroy the things, but his trigger with Goku is that thing from their infancy. The 2 aren't exclusive when it comes to Goku. That's my point here.
Paragus went to the scientist regarding something off about his device. The scientist stated that the device was working perfectly, which Paragus wonders what else could it be. In the screenshots that Miracles provided, Paragus clearly explains in detail on what triggers Broly to react, to the point that his device is no longer working like it should.

Paragus: "Could it be Kakarot? Does this mean that Broly's instincts as a Saiyan have been awakened by Kakarot's power and he is starting to overcome the limits of my control?" Later, Paragus talks about how the twist of destiny about their meeting; nothing in this line (nor the rest of the movie, anyways) suggested that Broly was anyway affected by crying as his motivation for attacking Goku.

Paragus: "Broly and Kakarot were born on the same day, one right after the other. If it is Kakarot...", "Damn, the threads of destiny have once again intertwined here, have they? The two infants, born on the same day and laid down in adjoining beds..."

It's nothing more than saying "Damn, of all the things that cause Broly to break away my control, its the guy born on the same day as him."

Paragus, once again, explains the history of Broly; he was already an rampaging manic in the past, which prompt him to use the device to suppressed his power (and personality) in the first place. Throughout the film, Broly never hated Goku, remembers him or have anything against him. Instead, it is presented that Broly we seen in the beginning is not the actual Broly, but someone held captive by the device. Once he broke free from it, in which Paragus addresses to Vegeta, is what he's truly like:

"Broly was the very model of a saiyan. As he began to develop, the extraordinary battle power he was born with increased and turned savage as I, his father, felt terror towards him".

The flashback of the them in beds was nothing more than hint/foreshadow to the end: Just as Goku, an weakling, managed to disturb Broly despite the huge gap, once again occurs in their final showdown. As the scientists said (their statements hold weight in this part), Goku has a lot of guts.

You're adding things that were never hinted nor stated, other than superficial "focus" on the flashback, that was meant to foreshadow the ending.

---

As for the second film, this is the only time where the idea of Broly hating Goku actually have some weight (and Broly might even remembered him this time around). This does not contradict the previously film. Instead, it bring light to Broly "briefly" remembering him now when he was in the coma, being awaken by Goten's cry. With that said, it's clear that the crying thing was not his motivation, considering that not only the flashback show the bed scene, it also show the final moments of the film, which showcase his actual, visible anger towards him. The moment he wakes up, he pretty much screams Goku's name to get him to come out and challenge him once again.

As Krillin explained it clear: "For that Broly guy to follow us all the way back to Earth, he must be really been upset when he lost to Goku, huh?"
"You, your family, everyone, will die. Over and over. Mountains of broken bodies, beneath the wheel." - Lich (Crossover, Adventure Time Season 7, episode 23)

I run a general discussion site: https://boogaloocrews.com/index.php

User avatar
Miracles
I Live Here
Posts: 3107
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:31 am

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Miracles » Sat Feb 23, 2019 6:13 pm

Shineman wrote:
Scsigs wrote:
Miracles wrote:First, there was no reason to fight Goku cause the movie explicitly stated [in the scenes I showed you] that Goku's power just AWAKENED Broly's Legendary Super Saiyan. That's all. Despite Paragus finally gaining control over Broly, Goku's powerful presence stirred Broly's instincts. The story didn't set up Broly to fight Goku with a reason, that's the point, his purpose was to just seek and destroy everyone and everything. The crying was to demonstrate Broly's destiny being a loser to Goku twice.

Our debate was concerning Movie 8 Broly. The sequel isn't relevant here.
In what way is Goku's power the catalyst that triggers Broly to want to fight him? It's never stated in either dub that that's the reason either. I think you're stretching a bit. The only scenes showing that even suggest that's the reason, I always took as something else because of how vague they're played, like the scene showing their energies next to each other. There's nothing to suggest Broly only wanted to fight Goku either. Yes, he's a weapon of mass destruction, but his trigger is Goku. As a baby. There's no other real explanation. Yes, he seeks to destroy the things, but his trigger with Goku is that thing from their infancy. The 2 aren't exclusive when it comes to Goku. That's my point here.
Paragus went to the scientist regarding something off about his device. The scientist stated that the device was working perfectly, which Paragus wonders what else could it be. In the screenshots that Miracles provided, Paragus clearly explains in detail on what triggers Broly to react, to the point that his device is no longer working like it should.

Paragus: "Could it be Kakarot? Does this mean that Broly's instincts as a Saiyan have been awakened by Kakarot's power and he is starting to overcome the limits of my control?" Later, Paragus talks about how the twist of destiny about their meeting; nothing in this line (nor the rest of the movie, anyways) suggested that Broly was anyway affected by crying as his motivation for attacking Goku.

Paragus: "Broly and Kakarot were born on the same day, one right after the other. If it is Kakarot...", "Damn, the threads of destiny have once again intertwined here, have they? The two infants, born on the same day and laid down in adjoining beds..."

It's nothing more than saying "Damn, of all the things that cause Broly to break away my control, its the guy born on the same day as him."

Paragus, once again, explains the history of Broly; he was already an rampaging manic in the past, which prompt him to use the device to suppressed his power (and personality) in the first place. Throughout the film, Broly never hated Goku, remembers him or have anything against him. Instead, it is presented that Broly we seen in the beginning is not the actual Broly, but someone held captive by the device. Once he broke free from it, in which Paragus addresses to Vegeta, is what he's truly like:

"Broly was the very model of a saiyan. As he began to develop, the extraordinary battle power he was born with increased and turned savage as I, his father, felt terror towards him".

The flashback of the them in beds was nothing more than hint/foreshadow to the end: Just as Goku, an weakling, managed to disturb Broly despite the huge gap, once again occurs in their final showdown. As the scientists said (their statements hold weight in this part), Goku has a lot of guts.

You're adding things that were never hinted nor stated, other than superficial "focus" on the flashback, that was meant to foreshadow the ending.

---

As for the second film, this is the only time where the idea of Broly hating Goku actually have some weight (and Broly might even remembered him this time around). This does not contradict the previously film. Instead, it bring light to Broly "briefly" remembering him now when he was in the coma, being awaken by Goten's cry. With that said, it's clear that the crying thing was not his motivation, considering that not only the flashback show the bed scene, it also show the final moments of the film, which showcase his actual, visible anger towards him. The moment he wakes up, he pretty much screams Goku's name to get him to come out and challenge him once again.

As Krillin explained it clear: "For that Broly guy to follow us all the way back to Earth, he must be really been upset when he lost to Goku, huh?"
Thank you for the clear and well explained objectivity. You mapped it out way better than I did.

Melkaniator
Not-So-Newbie
Posts: 96
Joined: Mon Jun 25, 2018 4:15 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Melkaniator » Sun Feb 24, 2019 11:40 am

Miracles wrote: Who said Goku's power made Broly want to fight him? It is stated that Goku's power only awakened Broly's Legendary power. Then Broly wanted EVERYONE to fight him cause of his destructive nature.
I don't think it's a stretch to say that once Goku's immense power awakened Broly's, the Legendary Super Saiya-jin got a special interest in him.

Goku was by far the strongest there, no reason to be that interested in Vegeta since he was gonna die anyway without giving Broly any challenge.
DBS anime is a fan service series that delivers irrelevant dialogue, inconsistent writing, and lazy designs.

The DB manga never had so many mistakes, nor those were this constant.

User avatar
Miracles
I Live Here
Posts: 3107
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:31 am

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Miracles » Sun Feb 24, 2019 5:53 pm

Melkaniator wrote:
Miracles wrote: Who said Goku's power made Broly want to fight him? It is stated that Goku's power only awakened Broly's Legendary power. Then Broly wanted EVERYONE to fight him cause of his destructive nature.
I don't think it's a stretch to say that once Goku's immense power awakened Broly's, the Legendary Super Saiya-jin got a special interest in him.

Goku was by far the strongest there, no reason to be that interested in Vegeta since he was gonna die anyway without giving Broly any challenge.
I understand that but the show didn't express Broly to have a special interest in just Goku. The guy threatened everyone to fight him or he would waste the planet. He was even attacking the slaves for the lol's. The movie was very consistent with Paragus narration of Broly being a destructive Looney Toon before Goku's appearance and during his battle with the Z senshi.

User avatar
Scsigs
I Live Here
Posts: 2835
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2016 3:55 am
Location: NY, USA
Contact:

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Scsigs » Sun Feb 24, 2019 9:26 pm

Miracles wrote:
Melkaniator wrote:
Miracles wrote: Who said Goku's power made Broly want to fight him? It is stated that Goku's power only awakened Broly's Legendary power. Then Broly wanted EVERYONE to fight him cause of his destructive nature.
I don't think it's a stretch to say that once Goku's immense power awakened Broly's, the Legendary Super Saiya-jin got a special interest in him.

Goku was by far the strongest there, no reason to be that interested in Vegeta since he was gonna die anyway without giving Broly any challenge.
I understand that but the show didn't express Broly to have a special interest in just Goku. The guy threatened everyone to fight him or he would waste the planet. He was even attacking the slaves for the lol's. The movie was very consistent with Paragus narration of Broly being a destructive Looney Toon before Goku's appearance and during his battle with the Z senshi.
I agree to an extent. Until Goku gets to New Vegeta, Broly is very calm & passive. He doesn't even really talk that much. Hell, I think even TFS gave Broly more lines pre-transformation than the film, or at least they're more memorable. However, after Goku gets to New Vegeta, Broly starts freaking out & wanting to fight him. However, outside of some narration Paragus gives (which is more of his speculation as opposed to outright fact), there's no matter-of-fact stated reason either way. In the flashbacks, it appears Broly's born mentally unhinged given he somehow gets really pissed as a baby, which allows him to save both of them from Vegeta's destruction by Frieza. Paragus has to make a device to control his power to keep him from going on rampages all the time when he's older for God's sake.
Then, when Goku triggers Broly, he just goes off the charts. With the way the flashback plays, it seriously looks as if Broly's also thinking about it. Add to this the sequel showing him waking up to Goten's cries, which remind him of Goku's, & what is anyone to think other than he's a mentally unhinged, slight, blood knight who wants to fight Goku because he cried? A lot. As a baby. For, like, 3 hours. I've given credence to the blood knight interpretation, as there's enough to see Broly as that, but that's not the end of it, as there's enough to believe what I'm saying too to add on to it.

"The legendary Super Saiyan is motivated by a crying infant. He is literally a giant fucking baby!" indeed.
Only dubs that matter are DB, Kai, & Super. Nothing else.
Vic Mignogna: Good actor & singer, but a MAJOR douchebag & idiot.
https://www.youtube.com/user/Scsigs
https://twitter.com/Scsigs

User avatar
Baggie_Saiyan
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 10275
Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2013 5:22 pm
Location: Atlantis.

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Mon Feb 25, 2019 9:49 am

It says a lot about how well this film portrayed Broly that his Full Power form managed to out-popularise even Gogeta and Gogeta Blue at that too!

It's been over 2 months now and Broly's FP form is still so popular it's crazy. Having seen the film no way I would have predicted that would still be the case!

User avatar
GodVegetto91
I Live Here
Posts: 2194
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2015 12:49 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by GodVegetto91 » Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:49 am

Baggie_Saiyan wrote:It says a lot about how well this film portrayed Broly that his Full Power form managed to out-popularise even Gogeta and Gogeta Blue at that too!

It's been over 2 months now and Broly's FP form is still so popular it's crazy. Having seen the film no way I would have predicted that would still be the case!
Ofcourse, Gogeta sucks! I’d much rather have Vegito or MUI Goku take his place! Gogeta was nothing more than a cheap cash grab. For people who will eat anything up. It makes no sense for them to do a Fusion Dance while Goku could have just IT’d to the Kaioshin Realm and get some Potara’s and last an hour.
“The fool looks to God outside him. The wise understands that God is within him.”

User avatar
Mnich
Beyond-the-Beyond Newbie
Posts: 386
Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2015 11:22 am
Location: Poland

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Mnich » Mon Feb 25, 2019 11:49 am

GodVegetto91 wrote:Ofcourse, Gogeta sucks! I’d much rather have Vegito or MUI Goku take his place! Gogeta was nothing more than a cheap cash grab. For people who will eat anything up. It makes no sense for them to do a Fusion Dance while Goku could have just IT’d to the Kaioshin Realm and get some Potara’s and last an hour.
Why should they use the inferior fusion? Gogeta has proved (not only here but also in Fusion Reborn) that he can do the job right and not defuse in the critical moment. :lol:

User avatar
Baggie_Saiyan
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 10275
Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2013 5:22 pm
Location: Atlantis.

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Mon Feb 25, 2019 2:12 pm

Mnich wrote:
GodVegetto91 wrote:Ofcourse, Gogeta sucks! I’d much rather have Vegito or MUI Goku take his place! Gogeta was nothing more than a cheap cash grab. For people who will eat anything up. It makes no sense for them to do a Fusion Dance while Goku could have just IT’d to the Kaioshin Realm and get some Potara’s and last an hour.
Why should they use the inferior fusion? Gogeta has proved (not only here but also in Fusion Reborn) that he can do the job right and not defuse in the critical moment. :lol:
In verse that's exactly why. Vegetto's other big defect was defusing when exerting high energy. Made sense to try Fusion Dance.

User avatar
Scsigs
I Live Here
Posts: 2835
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2016 3:55 am
Location: NY, USA
Contact:

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Scsigs » Mon Feb 25, 2019 3:45 pm

Baggie_Saiyan wrote:
Mnich wrote:
GodVegetto91 wrote:Ofcourse, Gogeta sucks! I’d much rather have Vegito or MUI Goku take his place! Gogeta was nothing more than a cheap cash grab. For people who will eat anything up. It makes no sense for them to do a Fusion Dance while Goku could have just IT’d to the Kaioshin Realm and get some Potara’s and last an hour.
Why should they use the inferior fusion? Gogeta has proved (not only here but also in Fusion Reborn) that he can do the job right and not defuse in the critical moment. :lol:
In verse that's exactly why. Vegetto's other big defect was defusing when exerting high energy. Made sense to try Fusion Dance.
But the Fusion Dance was the first to have the high energy usage as its weakness before Super retconned that into being a thing for the potara too.
Only dubs that matter are DB, Kai, & Super. Nothing else.
Vic Mignogna: Good actor & singer, but a MAJOR douchebag & idiot.
https://www.youtube.com/user/Scsigs
https://twitter.com/Scsigs

User avatar
Miracles
I Live Here
Posts: 3107
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:31 am

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Miracles » Mon Feb 25, 2019 3:59 pm

Scsigs wrote:
Miracles wrote:
Melkaniator wrote: I don't think it's a stretch to say that once Goku's immense power awakened Broly's, the Legendary Super Saiya-jin got a special interest in him.

Goku was by far the strongest there, no reason to be that interested in Vegeta since he was gonna die anyway without giving Broly any challenge.
I understand that but the show didn't express Broly to have a special interest in just Goku. The guy threatened everyone to fight him or he would waste the planet. He was even attacking the slaves for the lol's. The movie was very consistent with Paragus narration of Broly being a destructive Looney Toon before Goku's appearance and during his battle with the Z senshi.
I agree to an extent. Until Goku gets to New Vegeta, Broly is very calm & passive. He doesn't even really talk that much. Hell, I think even TFS gave Broly more lines pre-transformation than the film, or at least they're more memorable. However, after Goku gets to New Vegeta, Broly starts freaking out & wanting to fight him. However, outside of some narration Paragus gives (which is more of his speculation as opposed to outright fact), there's no matter-of-fact stated reason either way. In the flashbacks, it appears Broly's born mentally unhinged given he somehow gets really pissed as a baby, which allows him to save both of them from Vegeta's destruction by Frieza. Paragus has to make a device to control his power to keep him from going on rampages all the time when he's older for God's sake.
Then, when Goku triggers Broly, he just goes off the charts. With the way the flashback plays, it seriously looks as if Broly's also thinking about it. Add to this the sequel showing him waking up to Goten's cries, which remind him of Goku's, & what is anyone to think other than he's a mentally unhinged, slight, blood knight who wants to fight Goku because he cried? A lot. As a baby. For, like, 3 hours. I've given credence to the blood knight interpretation, as there's enough to see Broly as that, but that's not the end of it, as there's enough to believe what I'm saying too to add on to it.

"The legendary Super Saiyan is motivated by a crying infant. He is literally a giant fucking baby!" indeed.
Well that's flat out wrong. After Goku got to new Vegeta there was no direct reason for Broly to relate to Goku other than the proven fact of Paragus words that the strings of destiny fated both of them to meet again. Anything else is just headcanon.

User avatar
Scsigs
I Live Here
Posts: 2835
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2016 3:55 am
Location: NY, USA
Contact:

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Scsigs » Tue Feb 26, 2019 4:47 am

Miracles wrote:Well that's flat out wrong. After Goku got to new Vegeta there was no direct reason for Broly to relate to Goku other than the proven fact of Paragus words that the strings of destiny fated both of them to meet again. Anything else is just headcanon.
Well, you're not wrong. However, the way the movie's then told & the sequel give you more to put together whether or not it was intended. Thus, headcanon becomes actual canon in this case.
Only dubs that matter are DB, Kai, & Super. Nothing else.
Vic Mignogna: Good actor & singer, but a MAJOR douchebag & idiot.
https://www.youtube.com/user/Scsigs
https://twitter.com/Scsigs

Post Reply