Actually, that's exactly why he SHOULD keep having this discussion.obiwan23s wrote: Sun Jun 30, 2019 1:23 pm Sorry dude but you're way too emotionally invested in this Vic situation to keep having this discussion with.
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".
And you know, that's a generally a good thing. I've tried to keep my thoughts focused on the outcomes of Phoenix either gets the autograph or doesn't, and how that might make him feel later on. He might not get another opportunity. People think of things selfishly because they are human. In the end you can completely devote your mind, body and soul to righteousness and still end up resentful over something like passing up an opportunity you never got again. You've probably got bigger problems if not capitalizing on the opportunity of getting a voice actor autograph makes you resentful, but just as Shaddy believes individual people not getting Vic's autograph will add up to something that makes a tangible difference, so can regrets. I believe that if you can get what you want without doing any harm, then there's not a problem. And there's no real harm being done by Phoenix getting Vic's autograph. The people who don't support Vic and the people who do support him will still be able to continue their discussions regarding his situation, but there will also be a happy Broly fan somewhere in the world smiling at his autographed toy (or DVD jacket once I find it). That's an outcome I support.Fionordequester wrote: Sun Jun 30, 2019 1:27 pm Actually, that's exactly why he SHOULD keep having this discussion.
Lack of care = Lack of effort. Lack of effort means less knowledge and more ignorance.
You WANT people who actually care about what they're talking about!
Please don't put words in my mouth. I didn't say this.obiwan23s wrote: Sun Jun 30, 2019 2:36 pmShaddy believes individual people not getting Vic's autograph will add up to something that makes a tangible difference
You're thinking too narrowly, then. You removing his guilt give him temporarily relief, but also contributes to the long-term empowerment of a serial abuser. That trade off is not worth it.obiwan23s wrote: Sun Jun 30, 2019 2:36 pmAnd you know, that's a generally a good thing. I've tried to keep my thoughts focused on the outcomes of Phoenix either gets the autograph or doesn't, and how that might make him feel later on. He might not get another opportunity.
On the flip side, you can indulge in every vice your heart desires, and you still won't find lasting happiness.obiwan23s wrote: Sun Jun 30, 2019 2:36 pmPeople think of things selfishly because they are human. In the end you can completely devote your mind, body and soul to righteousness and still end up resentful over something like passing up an opportunity you never got again.
Regret is also a part of life. You cannot gain anything without sacrifice, one way or the other. Thinking selfishly won't take your regrets away... It will only add to them.obiwan23s wrote: Sun Jun 30, 2019 2:36 pmYou've probably got bigger problems if not capitalizing on the opportunity of getting a voice actor autograph makes you resentful, but just as Shaddy believes individual people not getting Vic's autograph will add up to something that makes a tangible difference, so can regrets.
Just because you can't see or hear the people being harmed doesn't mean you aren't doing harm.obiwan23s wrote: Sun Jun 30, 2019 2:36 pmI believe that if you can get what you want without doing any harm, then there's not a problem. And there's no real harm being done by Phoenix getting Vic's autograph.
And a serial abuser will be given yet another reason to not change. His ego will be boosted, and he'll walk out of that convention feeling like the coolest thing in town.obiwan23s wrote: Sun Jun 30, 2019 2:36 pmThe people who don't support Vic and the people who do support him will still be able to continue their discussions regarding his situation, but there will also be a happy Broly fan somewhere in the world smiling at his autographed toy (or DVD jacket once I find it). That's an outcome I support.
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".
Yes, you did.Shaddy wrote: Sun Jun 30, 2019 6:47 am After all, I don't believe it does make a huge difference, but I think refusing interaction with him on a larger scale would be beneficial, and that always starts with individuals.
I get where you're coming from but I don't agree that I'm thinking about it narrowly. I think it's actually fairly healthy for adults to put some amount of emotional separation between themselves and issues they talk about. For instance, I've said I sympathize with sexual abuse victims already in this thread. However, I unfortunately can't really do anything to help this situation other than not contribute acts of sexual abuse into the world myself. In the grand scheme of things, I'm a relatively anonymous person and even some people in this thread are already not listening to me or considering my point of view. I certainly want to put effort into making the world a better place, but I believe in the sphere of influence. You take care of those in your circle and if you're in theirs, they should do the same. If that happened, it would rid the world of quite a lot of suffering in my opinion.Fionordequester wrote: Sun Jun 30, 2019 3:56 pm You're thinking too narrowly, then. You removing his guilt give him temporarily relief, but also contributes to the long-term empowerment of a serial abuser. That trade off is not worth it.
And a serial abuser will be given yet another reason to not change. His ego will be boosted, and he'll walk out of that convention feeling like the coolest thing in town.
That is an outcome I do NOT support.
Funny how that literally doesn't say the thing you're pretending it says.
Ironic coming from you, who falsely paraphrased my comments into "Don't listen to them, listen to me" when I didn't literally say that. How's that shoe feel on the other foot?Shaddy wrote: Mon Jul 01, 2019 3:52 am Funny how that literally doesn't say the thing you're pretending it says.
I mean, is it not over? There's no new points being made. I made a few posts in response to Fionordequester. You just keep coming back trying to get the last laugh or something. I dunno. To answer your question, uh, I guess two? Maybe three? I might have to reply to you again.Shaddy wrote: Mon Jul 01, 2019 3:52 am Also, how many times are you going to declare the discussion over before you actually stick to that?
Still, because the person you’re replying to would have no idea you’re talking to them. I’ve seen some people reply but take out the other persons name so they don’t get a notifcation. Like why? That’s just silly and it makes it harder for responses. I found his response by complete accident when checking the thread for any new posts.Soppa Saia People wrote: Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:58 amnot to mention, i always thought that like quoting a post right above yours was generally viewed as like bad on forums ? i suppose it's one of those things that's so minor it doesn't matter, but i dunno i've gotten that vibe from a bunch of forums i've been on lol.Fionordequester wrote: Fri Jun 28, 2019 12:39 pmI've done that on occasion, too; generally when I wanted to make a larger point, and I only wanted my response to make up a small part of my post... Or when I just felt like it.Dbzfan94 wrote: Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:33 amAlso I’d appreciate if you replied to my post if you’re responding to me.
I wouldn't worry about it. I doubt Shaddy meant to snub you in any way.
that latter part is more understandable. when you're responding to multiple posts in one post or just trying to respond to a portion of one post, it's a lot easier to just copy those parts, and paste them in the [ quote][/ quote] command, which won't have a username attached too it.Dbzfan94 wrote: Mon Jul 01, 2019 8:34 amStill, because the person you’re replying to would have no idea you’re talking to them. I’ve seen some people reply but take out the other persons name so they don’t get a notifcation. Like why? That’s just silly and it makes it harder for responses. I found his response by complete accident when checking the thread for any new posts.Soppa Saia People wrote: Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:58 am
not to mention, i always thought that like quoting a post right above yours was generally viewed as like bad on forums ? i suppose it's one of those things that's so minor it doesn't matter, but i dunno i've gotten that vibe from a bunch of forums i've been on lol.
Well, your posts actually did say that. They literally start with "you don't have to listen to anyone else", then tell OP what you think he should do anyway. It doesn't literally say that, but that is the message that is sent regardless.obiwan23s wrote: Mon Jul 01, 2019 4:53 am Ironic coming from you, who falsely paraphrased my comments into "Don't listen to them, listen to me" when I didn't literally say that. How's that shoe feel on the other foot?
Well no, because I never agreed to that in the first place, you seem to think everything you say is accompanied by a door slam or a mic drop, but you keep leaving the door partway open with bait and false statements, and are now trying to blame me for opening that door that only you wanted to close. I can do this for weeks, don't think I won't. If you want a discussion to actually be over, you need to stop participating in it. If anything gives off a "last laugh" impression here it's you lying about what I was saying, then making a ridiculous false equivalency between that and me telling you what the things you said before meant.obiwan23s wrote: Mon Jul 01, 2019 4:53 am I mean, is it not over? There's no new points being made. I made a few posts in response to Fionordequester. You just keep coming back trying to get the last laugh or something. I dunno. To answer your question, uh, I guess two? Maybe three? I might have to reply to you again.
Made a few snips to shorten the length of the post a bit.PhoenixEX wrote: Thu Jun 27, 2019 6:53 am You guys are right though, having his autograph would essentially be a reminder of the stuff he did but I guess to me, like I said, it's more about separating the man from the art.
(...)
Also, just to be clear, I believe the man is guilty.
(...)
So stop saying things.obiwan23s wrote: Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:19 pm Shaddy, if it's not clear to you yet that no matter how many times you explain your point that I'm not going to agree with it, then I dont know what else I can say.
No, what he means is stop posting.
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".
Thanks for clarifying, I figured that but I did wonder lol. You've been nothing but civil to me in this thread, even though we didn't agree and I really appreciate that. So I will go ahead and do that now.Fionordequester wrote: Mon Jul 01, 2019 11:47 pm
No, what he means is stop posting.
EDIT: That is, stop posting in THIS specific forum thread. Sorry if that was unclear before. I'm actually ON the autism spectrum, so I can see how that would be confusing.
My pleasure.obiwan23s wrote: Mon Jul 01, 2019 11:58 pmThanks for clarifying, I figured that but I did wonder lol. You've been nothing but civil to me in this thread, even though we didn't agree and I really appreciate that. So I will go ahead and do that now.
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".
