Z or Original Dragon Ball? Which do you prefer and why?

[sunsetshimmer]

DB:
-More original arcs not following generic scheme DBZ went with everyone transforming and villains having 20 forms
-Better humour
-Better fights
-Better music
-Kid Goku is better than adult Goku
-It has adventures
-Death matters

DBZ:
-Better drawings (that should be obvious so not sure if that even counts because the same way GT had better drawings than Z)
-More fighting protagonists that were more useful
-Less focus on tournaments
-It has Videl

So overall i'd say DB is better series, but DBZ has some cool things as well. Most of things i didn't like in Z were fixed in GT though.

[Robo4900]

For those talking about DB all being one story, valid point, but I do think it can be worthwhile to separate the two when talking about issues like this because there are big differences in the story from the early years and the later years. Early DB is terrestrial, whereas DBZ becomes intergalactic, just as Super is more cosmic. It's like comparing Cheers during the Diane years against the Rebecca years, or the Coach years compared to the Woody years. All one series, but still a big difference.

There are differences from the early years to the later years, sure.
But aside from surface-level stuff like the Saiyan arc taking us into space, there's no point where we transition from "the early years" to "the late years", really.
I don't care what mental gymnastics you can think of, the Saiyan arc is only as much of a progression on the Piccolo arc as any other two consecutive storylines.

If you really wanted me to pick a point where it becomes "the late years", I'd call the cutoff point the beginning of the 22nd Tenkaichi arc. Largely an arbitrary split, but to me, it was during the Red Ribbon arc that Dragon Ball stopped being a gag manga/anime. It still maintained its comedy roots all the way to the end (and into the modern day), but for me, it was in the Red Ribbon arc that it really stopps being a gag manga/anime, and I'd argue that's the crux of the "early years" vs "later years" "style".
And from that perspective, I'd probably put the early vs later years on much more even footing, but I think if nostalgia wasn't such a strong factor, then with the 22nd Tenkaichi as the starting point of "the later years", I would consider "the later years" to be the superior era.
Though if we're breaking it up as early as the 22nd Tenkaichi, I'd rather split it up into three periods, perhaps putting the third era starting at the Androids/Cell arc. In such a case, I'd still consider the middle era (22nd Tenkaichi, Piccolo/23rd Tenkaichi, Saiyan, Namek) to be the strongest, and naturally, the last era to be the weakest, by a very wide margin.

[ABED]

Another reason I like DB so much is because of the tournaments, specifically Goku's quest for the championship. It provides a very relatable and understandable motivation for Goku that spans the series. It also provides a clear demarcation between DB and DBZ. At the end of the 23rd TB, Goku has achieved his greatest goal that concretizes his aim to be the best. All the other characters have also reached the end of their respective arcs with the exception of Piccolo but there's little indication that was ever the goal, so it feels like a logical end for the story. It provides the most satisfying conclusion for the characters and DB as a whole. Obviously it's not the end, but I do think it's important to the discussion. It's also my favorite of all the endings.

[Broly深蓝]

As others have said before, I just see Dragonball as one continuous story, from the moment Goku lands on Earth to Majin Buu’s demise.

[Matches Malone]

For those talking about DB all being one story, valid point, but I do think it can be worthwhile to separate the two when talking about issues like this because there are big differences in the story from the early years and the later years. Early DB is terrestrial, whereas DBZ becomes intergalactic, just as Super is more cosmic.

Any long running story can be split up into multiple parts based on how the story develops, I just don't think it makes sense to go as far as turning said parts into their own shows like how Z became. I understand why GT was its own show as it wasn't based on a manga and Super was a 20 year old sequel, but Z ? Apart from marketing, there's no reason to split up the original manga.

[ABED]

For those talking about DB all being one story, valid point, but I do think it can be worthwhile to separate the two when talking about issues like this because there are big differences in the story from the early years and the later years. Early DB is terrestrial, whereas DBZ becomes intergalactic, just as Super is more cosmic.

Any long running story can be split up into multiple parts based on how the story develops, I just don't think it makes sense to go as far as turning said parts into their own shows like how Z became. I understand why GT was its own show as it wasn't based on a manga and Super was a 20 year old sequel, but Z ? Apart from marketing, there's no reason to split up the original manga.

Apparently the anime wasn't doing well, so rebranding it and marketing it better made a big difference. If you could make your story more popular with the equivalent of a paint job, wouldn't you?

I'm aware they are one story, but that doesn't mean we can't prefer one part of the story over another, so I find this answer mostly useless. I know that comes off as a little arrogant and aggressive, but I have no other words for how I feel. It feels like that response is an answer to a different question.

I tend to prefer the early years/seasons of a show because there's a freshness to the world and the characters, and there's magic in a bottle. I think most shows shouldn't go past 5 years.

[SSJmole]

I love both but I prefer original Dragonball. The story feels more important where as Z after awhile felt like it was just "who can blast bigger" and enemies kind of felt more like they followed a format of 3 or more transformations + heroes get new super Saiyan form.


I still love Z but but goiing through enemies like king piccolo , pilaf , red ribbon army ect... Felt different and was more engaging.

Though vegeta's journey is the best overall story imo orginal wins for me.

[MasenkoHA]

[Apparently the anime wasn't doing well, so rebranding it and marketing it better made a big difference. If you could make your story more popular with the equivalent of a paint job, wouldn't you?

Going off the ratings reported by Kanzenshuu Dragon Ball Z didn’t do any better than Dragon Ball. If anything Dragon Ball did slightly better in the ratings but that could be by the time Z started the series was 3 years old. Maybe the rebranding was to entice new viewers? Give the illusion it’s a new show? Kids can be fickle with entertainment so I imagine by 1989 the kids watching Dragon Ball were getting bored.

I'm aware they are one story, but that doesn't mean we can't prefer one part of the story over another, so I find this answer mostly useless.

I agree, it’s no different than asking someone if they prefer the earlier or later years of any series.

I

. I think most shows shouldn't go past 5 years.

Five years for Dragon Ball covers up to the end of Namek and since (best as I can tell) the Cell and Boo stuff were less popular with the fandom I feel like that gives credence to Dragon Ball being another example of the 3-5 year rule.

Not that the post-Namek stuff doesn’t have merit.

[Matches Malone]

I'm aware they are one story, but that doesn't mean we can't prefer one part of the story over another, so I find this answer mostly useless.

You misunderstood me (or my wording isn't very clear), I'm not saying you can't prefer one part over another, I just don't think the question should be limited to either DB or Z as both are part of one story that shouldn't have been split to begin with, so you can prefer a combination of both.

[ABED]

I'm aware they are one story, but that doesn't mean we can't prefer one part of the story over another, so I find this answer mostly useless.

You misunderstood me (or my wording isn't very clear), I'm not saying you can't prefer one part over another, I just don't think the question should be limited to either DB or Z as both are part of one story that shouldn't have been split to begin with, so you can prefer a combination of both.

I did actually understand your point. My point is that it being one story is an answer to an entirely different question.

[MasenkoHA]

I'm aware they are one story, but that doesn't mean we can't prefer one part of the story over another, so I find this answer mostly useless.

You misunderstood me (or my wording isn't very clear), I'm not saying you can't prefer one part over another, I just don't think the question should be limited to either DB or Z as both are part of one story that shouldn't have been split to begin with, so you can prefer a combination of both.

The question is essentially asking “Do you prefer Dragon Ball before Raditz arrives and Goku isn’t perceived as an alien or after?”

No different than asking “Do you prefer the Star Wars prequels or sequels or original trilogy?” Maybe your top 3 films from that franchise are 1. Empire Strikes Back 2. Revenge of the Sith 3. The Last Jedi. You can still prefer one era overall from the other.

Maybe your favorite era is Red Ribbon-Namek, it’s still possible to say which portion of the series had overall better material from your subjective point of view

[MyVisionity]

Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z are two different anime series. Unless I'm mistaken, that is what the OP was referring to. The complete story itself is another subject entirely. I also wouldn't call the split between the two series "arbitrary" or anything like that.

[ABED]

Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z are two different anime series. Unless I'm mistaken, that is what the OP was referring to. The complete story itself is another subject entirely. I also wouldn't call the split between the two series "arbitrary" or anything like that.

Care to expand on this?

[MyVisionity]

I also wouldn't call the split between the two series "arbitrary" or anything like that.

Care to expand on this?

Like you said earlier Goku at the end of DB finally becomes champion and that aspect of the story reaches a conclusion. Goku has saved the entire world and the writing implies that it is the end of an era. Goku leaves to start a new life with Chichi.

Then DBZ starts and Goku is living in peace with his wife and son. It's the beginning of a new era. Gohan's character being pushed into the spotlight is evidence of this. As well as the revelation that Goku is from outer space and everything that unfolds from there.

These are big shifts in the narrative that I think support the decision to rebrand the anime as Z when it did.

[KBABZ]

Goku has saved the entire world and the writing implies that it is the end of an era.

Except he literally lets his opponent live at the end so the world is still at great risk; the only thing Goku accomplished was winning the tournament and fending off the villain. And the story shatters the "climactic" feeling by having Roshi point out directly to the reader that it isn't the end, "not by a long shot!". And the manga continued the next week same as before, as did the anime when it got to that point.

The thing about the break between DB and Z is that it's really arbitrary and not even in the correct place. Looking back on it now, it would have made WAY more sense to make the split be between Kid and Adult Goku. Nearly every arc in Dragon Ball has some kind of timeskip break involved, and a lot of them introduce new protagonists as well (Tien, Piccolo Jr/New Chi-Chi, Gohan, Trunks, Goten/Trunks/Videl). There are MANY points in the story where you could use these same reasons to give the show a rebrand, particularly the Daimao, Android and Buu arcs.

[MyVisionity]

Except he literally lets his opponent live at the end so the world is still at great risk; the only thing Goku accomplished was winning the tournament and fending off the villain.

The world has been saved. After defeating Daimao and then Ma Junior, the threat is effectively terminated. Little things like Piccolo's life being spared are ultimately insignificant.

There are MANY points in the story where you could use these same reasons to give the show a rebrand, particularly the Daimao, Android and Buu arcs.

Not really. Most of the other endings don't compare. They lack that significant shift to the status quo. The only other one that I think might have worked was Cell to Boo, because of the climax's shake up followed by the "new era" feel.

[MasenkoHA]

Goku has saved the entire world and the writing implies that it is the end of an era.

Except he literally lets his opponent live at the end so the world is still at great risk; the only thing Goku accomplished was winning the tournament and fending off the villain. And the story shatters the "climactic" feeling by having Roshi point out directly to the reader that it isn't the end, "not by a long shot!". And the manga continued the next week same as before, as did the anime when it got to that point.

The thing about the break between DB and Z is that it's really arbitrary and not even in the correct place. Looking back on it now, it would have made WAY more sense to make the split be between Kid and Adult Goku. Nearly every arc in Dragon Ball has some kind of timeskip break involved, and a lot of them introduce new protagonists as well (Tien, Piccolo Jr/New Chi-Chi, Gohan, Trunks, Goten/Trunks/Videl). There are MANY points in the story where you could use these same reasons to give the show a rebrand, particularly the Daimao, Android and Buu arcs.

I don’t know if I would call it arbitrary and not in the correct place. Dragon Ball ends with Goku being declared strongest under the heavens and getting married. Z begins with him now being a father and the revelation that he’s an alien and was sent to conquer earth. I’m a big advocate for just calling everything Dragon Ball (who knows if Toei had done that maybe a certain clueless company wouldn’t have skipped 140 episodes worth of content to get to “the marketable stuff” and we wouldn’t have legions of the fandom acting like everything before Raditz arrives is “unimportant”). But hey, if you’re gonna rebrand the series Raditz arrival and the reveal of Goku’s origins makes the most sense.

There is something about the 23rd Budokai that just works as a series finale. Sure Piccolo Jr is left alive but this is out of pragmatism if he dies God dies too and the implication is that Goku will make sure he’s kept in check while benefitting from being challenged with an archenemy. The 23rd Budokai ending is more suited as ending than what came before .

[KBABZ]

The world has been saved.

The world was also saved when Goku defeated the Red Ribbon Army and Oolong stole Pilaf's wish.

[MyVisionity]

The world has been saved.

The world was also saved when Goku defeated the Red Ribbon Army and Oolong stole Pilaf's wish.

Red Ribbon and especially Pilaf don't compare. Piccolo was looking to turn the Earth into Hell itself and wipe out the entire human race. That's why Goku defeating him was such a huge deal. That's why it was prophesied.

[MasenkoHA]

Also neither of those arcs ended with a satisfying conclusion.

Ending on the first arc- Oh okay Goku’s some weird weremonkey thing that accidentally killed his grandpa oh well Bulma and Yamucha don’t need dragon balls anymore and Goku’s going to train with his grandpa’s master and Bulma gave him her radar so he can look for his grandpa’s dragon ball next year. Yay I guess?

Red Ribbon/Baba arc- Goku’s going off to train for the next budokai. Cool?


The ending of the 23rd offers the first mostly satisfying conclusion with Piccolo being left free to terrorize the planet the only loose thread (and even then its justified since they can’t kill him without killing God and Goku wants someone to keep him on his toes).