"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[Grand Marshal 1]

Whis is a teacher. His training of Goku and Vegeta has been ongoing since RoF. He permits them to be put at risk, but he does little things to nudge them in the right direction (the Redo, distracting Broly while they practice fusion, secretly teaching them to fight as a team). He is also a teacher of Beerus, which is partially why he keeps Goku and Vegeta around - to inspire Beerus. If Beerus is indeed going to earth, Merus is likely to tag along, and I'm guessing it's a test .

Whis knows Merus is willing to put himself at risk for humans, and if he is to be an angel, he must put his feelings aside for the sake of their duty. Will Whis allow Merus to fail? It's been a while since RoF...what if Whis gave him a Redo? Would Merus make the same mistake twice?

Damn, crazy thought. Imagine if they do actually get involved and Merus dies.

But after that Whis sighs and is like "oh little brother, when will you learn" rewinding time to bring him back, teach him a lesson and let things progress without him dying (with Whis breaking his promise to the Grand Priest).

I don't rly want for this to happen, but if it led to it that's how I would probably want to see it.

[Mister_Popo]

For some reason i would like more for the story to end that way.
The Daikaioshins powers restored (after a wish?), and he again seals away Moro.
The circle is rounded that way. It's not about Merus or the angels getting involved, it's about U7's own battle against an ancient evil.

Exactly. Beerus spared U7 back in BOG, Whis saved it in RF, and Zeno saved it from Zamasu. Do we really want it to happen a 4th time ? Have Buu come back with his powers restored with Vegeta holding Moro off as Buu charges whatever it is and seals him up. While that's going on, Goku and the Z fighters fight and take down 7-3.

I still think it would be kinda cool if the Moro vs Beerus fight takes place, be it short. It would feel refreshing.
Only for a severely weakened Moro to flee into space after the fight, where the Daikaioshin finds him, to seal the deal.

[Psajdak]

I disagree with people who think that for Beerus Earth is only important because of tasty food.
I mean, at first, yeah, that was probably his main reason, but at this point I believe he really likes Goku, Vegeta, and others.

Ever since he first met Goku, slowly, but surely Beerus' opinion changed about everyone, most likely because they were, as far as we know, the first mortals who had guts to go against him.

I mean, by the time of DBS: Broly movie, Bulma doesn't mind him watching over her own daughter...

Don't get me wrong, Beerus still loves food, but it is probably situation similar to Pokemon anime where Kasumi only used her destroyed bicycle as an excuse to keep traveling with her friends.

---

That all being said, while anything can happen in the future, I really think that Beerus' five minutes of fame passed when he finished his fight with SSG Goku, and no matter how strong he still is, or that he has UI; I doubt there will be a second big fight for him.

I wouldn't go so far to say that he is another of former antagonists that don't matter anymore, but he is getting there.

[Mister_Popo]

I disagree with people who think that for Beerus Earth is only important because of tasty food.
I mean, at first, yeah, that was probably his main reason, but at this point I believe he really likes Goku, Vegeta, and others.

At first it may sound a bit ridiculous. But ...
It's Dragon Ball, a little fun and gag makes part of the show.
The thing with Beerus: wouldn't the writers change his status of 'a character that does not really care' (what he has always been) too much, by giving him a more substantial reason to get involved?

Even if he may have a deeper reason like Moro is becoming too powerful and / or having a deeper appreciation for Goku and the gang, will the writers show that off right in our faces, and thereby change a typical character trait quite openly?

[batistabus]

I disagree with people who think that for Beerus Earth is only important because of tasty food.
I mean, at first, yeah, that was probably his main reason, but at this point I believe he really likes Goku, Vegeta, and others.

I do think Beerus has gotten much friendlier with the main cast, but who knows how much he'd extend himself for their sake. He spared Earth (from his own hand) and babysat Bra, anyway.

Even if he doesn't do it for the sake of Goku & friends, Beerus still has reason to at least give Moro a "talking to". When Freeza and King Vegeta went on rampages and started conquering planets, he didn't tell them to stop, but he made sure they know who was the boss. When Zamasu meddled in matters of the Gods, Beerus put a stop to it. It may not be so easy with Moro....

[Matches Malone]

When it comes to the result of Vegeta's fight, a lot of fans on social media are expecting him to outright kill Moro, but it's worth noting that no final fight in Super ended that easily.

Goku lost to Beerus.
Vegeta got blown up by Freeza only for Whis to rewind time.
Goku gave up his fight against Hit.
Zeno had to erase Zamasu after Trunks sliced him in half.
Freeza and 17 had to help Goku knock Jiren out of the ring.
Broly was saved last minute from Gogeta.

Just so no one's disappointed, keep the above results in mind when going into the next 2 chapters, as we'll probably get something very similar. I think Vegeta is going to come out of this looking better than Goku, as he'll without a doubt beat Moro in their 1 on 1 fight, but things will change once 7-3 gets involved. My ideal conclusion will be for Buu and Vegeta to team up against Moro, while Goku and the rest take on 7-3.

[Femme Fatale Kikaza]

I disagree with people who think that for Beerus Earth is only important because of tasty food.
I mean, at first, yeah, that was probably his main reason, but at this point I believe he really likes Goku, Vegeta, and others.

I do think Beerus has gotten much friendlier with the main cast, but who knows how much he'd extend himself for their sake. He spared Earth (from his own hand) and babysat Bra, anyway.

Even if he doesn't do it for the sake of Goku & friends, Beerus still has reason to at least give Moro a "talking to". When Freeza and King Vegeta went on rampages and started conquering planets, he didn't tell them to stop, but he made sure they know who was the boss. When Zamasu meddled in matters of the Gods, Beerus put a stop to it. It may not be so easy with Moro....

And given Moro's connection with the kais, who knows if Moro plans on going to their realm and pulling a Buu by killing everyone? Beerus doesn't like people threatening his weaker life link and if Moro expressed plans to kill Shin or go near him, the 'talk' will turn end with 'hakai' if Beerus chooses make his move to Earth and confront Moro(Which I hope doesn't happen) but oh well.

[Matches Malone]

If Moro expressed plans to kill Shin or go near him, the 'talk' will turn end with 'hakai' if Beerus chooses make his move to Earth and confront Moro.

I think it would be funny if after UI Goku loses, Vegeta loses, everyone teams up and still loses, Beerus just casually shows up and takes him out with one move. The master reminding the world (and the fans) why he's the master.

[Psajdak]

I don't know, no matter how simple, and predictable that may be, personally I just would wish if this arc simply ended with Vegeta defeating Moro by himself, and even if Seven-Three got involved, that Vegeta shows how much he improved by beating him as well.

Complications, plot twists, and all that crap can be fun, but once in a while I just wanna see Goku, and probably even more Vegeta to defeat their opponents, and move on.

[Matches Malone]

I don't know, no matter how simple, and predictable that may be, personally I just would wish if this arc simply ended with Vegeta defeating Moro by himself, and even if Seven-Three got involved, that Vegeta shows how much he improved by beating him as well.

Complications, plot twists, and all that crap can be fun, but once in a while I just wanna see Goku, and probably even more Vegeta to defeat their opponents, and move on.

I agree with your last part, but it's clear that modern DB is taking a different approach to its finals by having more than one on one fights be the road to victory.

I think Vegeta will win his one on one fight with Moro, but after that it's up in the air. I still think despite not completely finishing off Moro on his own, he'll play a key role in it as he's the only one capable of fending off his powers.

[Grimlock]

But to be honest, Vegeta finally getting his first major kill would also bring some unfortunate implications:

Why would he be the one to kill Moro? What is his connection with him? Vegeta gets to kill Moro but couldn't finish Freeza off in Movie 15, why? Shouldn't Majin Buu be the one to be on the spotlight on this one?

Even when it would seem Vegeta would finally get his moment and his fans would be overwhelmed by joy, it wouldn't be without some annoying set up. Which is kind of bad.


Speaking of Majin Buu, I'll ask again: Where. The Hell. Is. Majin Buu!?

[Grand Marshal 1]

Speaking of Majin Buu, I'll ask again: Where. The Hell. Is. Majin Buu!?

Didn't he like, get asleep again?

Also, I was kinda dissapointed from the early days of the Arc the Daikaioshin was not actually separated entirely from Buu, although that would probably be an issue ig.

But now I think to myself "wait, what about this new Angel? Isn't that a big thing?"

[Femme Fatale Kikaza]

But to be honest, Vegeta finally getting his first major kill would also bring some unfortunate implications:

Why would he be the one to kill Moro? What is his connection with him? Vegeta gets to kill Moro but couldn't finish Freeza off in Movie 15, why? Shouldn't Majin Buu be the one to be on the spotlight on this one?

Even when it would seem Vegeta would finally get his moment and his fans would be overwhelmed by joy, it wouldn't be without some annoying set up. Which is kind of bad.


Speaking of Majin Buu, I'll ask again: Where. The Hell. Is. Majin Buu!?

People just want Vegeta to kill off he main villain because he hasn't had the chance, but I still believe the kill should be a team effort from multiple parties instead of just Goku or Vegeta finishing the fight.

He's sleeping again...The Galactic Patrol brought him back to Earth, he's just asleep....very convenient isn't it? Maybe he'll wake up...eventually.

[Miracles]

And what's the deal with Goku? he can go all angry in Omen like it's another form that can be stressed to the max and adds blue-ish to it?

UI was fading...Goku powered up and Blue came out because he was at his limit with UI.

[Psajdak]

Buu simply isn't interesting anymore, him being childish, yet dangerous was a thing in 90s, nowadays he can provide some meh comic relief moment, but that's about it.
That's why they brought back Freeza for ToP; because he has much more potential as character.

As for Daikaioshin, I actually forgot what happened with him.

[Matches Malone]

Why would he be the one to kill Moro?

What is his connection with him?

Speaking of Majin Buu, I'll ask again: Where. The Hell. Is. Majin Buu!?

He's not going to kill him. I think he'll beat him, but his death will be a lot harder than a one on one fight.

He killed Namakians, something vegeta said he would get him back for. Apart from that, he's clearly been the focus of the arc through his training and build up. He may not kill him outright, but this is clearly a Vegeta centric arc.

He's sleeping, although I think he's the key to getting rid of Moro by sealing him up.

[Torturephile]

Vegeta's failed attempt to teleport to Earth and instead ending in the trashcan behind him got a good laugh out of me.

[Mister_Popo]

And what's the deal with Goku? he can go all angry in Omen like it's another form that can be stressed to the max and adds blue-ish to it?

You must of missed where Merus stated that Goku can not keep UI if he uses brute power like that.

I think he means it does not make sense in the first place.
If it's a condition to reach Omen the user may not be stressed, why should one be able to stress it (even if it does not work)?
It doesn't work backwards, he should have lost Omen right away and immediately reverted back to base.

[LoganForkHands73]

I think Daikaioshin just went dormant inside Buu again. And so far that's just it.

In a perfect world, it would be amazing to see all the Chekhov's Guns to come into play in some fashion in the end, even though that's far from a reasonable expectation, lol. Merus, Daikaioshin, Esca (!?), Vegeta, Beerus, Ultra Instinct, the lot. Hell, even Chaozu's legendary insult skills (he can finally be the new Saiyan Saga Yajirobe). I know it's not necessarily bad writing to not have Chekhov's gun fire, but so much has been set up that I doubt it's all gonna pay off in a satisfying way. The start of this arc set up some interesting things but it's been so schizophrenic. As much as I liked seeing the Z-Fighters in action again, I think taking the action to Earth was when this arc started to go off the rails. I preferred when this arc's stakes were more manageable; just an evil old wizard who's gotta be stopped, with only a handful of allies there to help Goku and Vegeta.

Like it's honestly quite insane how much has been stuffed into this arc. I think we all expected this to be a fairly small-scale arc, not a mini-Endgame for Dragon Ball. Let's do a headcount: Goku, Vegeta, Moro, Majin Buu/Daikaioshin, Esca & Namekians, Jaco, Merus, Whis, Beerus, Piccolo, Gohan, Krillin, Roshi, Yamcha, Tenshinhan, Chaozu, the Androids, two sets of Yardrats, a whole army of Prisoners... The Universe Survival arc was bigger in some ways but we knew that going in.

[Mister_Popo]

I think Daikaioshin just went dormant inside Buu again. And so far that's just it.

In a perfect world, it would be amazing to see all the Chekhov's Guns to come into play in some fashion in the end, even though that's far from a reasonable expectation, lol. Merus, Daikaioshin, Esca (!?), Vegeta, Beerus, Ultra Instinct, the lot. Hell, even Chaozu's legendary insult skills (he can finally be the new Saiyan Saga Yajirobe). I know it's not necessarily bad writing to not have Chekhov's gun fire, but so much has been set up that I doubt it's all gonna pay off in a satisfying way. The start of this arc set up some interesting things but it's been so schizophrenic. As much as I liked seeing the Z-Fighters in action again, I think taking the action to Earth was when this arc started to go off the rails. I preferred when this arc's stakes were more manageable; just an evil old wizard who's gotta be stopped, with only a handful of allies there to help Goku and Vegeta.

Like it's honestly quite insane how much has been stuffed into this arc. I think we all expected this to be a fairly small-scale arc, not a mini-Endgame for Dragon Ball. Let's do a headcount: Goku, Vegeta, Moro, Majin Buu/Daikaioshin, Esca & Namekians, Jaco, Merus, Whis, Beerus, Piccolo, Gohan, Krillin, Roshi, Yamcha, Tenshinhan, Chaozu, the Androids, two sets of Yardrats, a whole army of Prisoners... The Universe Survival arc was bigger in some ways but we knew that going in.

You are right about that. There are way too many characters participating, every one needs to have his or hers screentime.
It's more difficult to go in depth that way.