Why Watch In English/Japanese...?

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 8:24 am

NeptuneKai wrote:Anything I say will be full of nerd rage so I'll just say I hate the voice actors/voice acting. Anything I say can not sum up my feelings of the dub better then this comparison of two scenes.

Japanese:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkksoQ435Iw

English:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZUX5hzb ... re=related

The funny thing is I see more hate towards such dubs as 4kids take on OP but it is worlds more accurate then anything Funi ever cranked out in their scripts if you look past a pun or two. Although this isn't an OP fourm and I won't debate that here.

I find the two scenes to be equally dramatic.

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 8:30 am

SSJ2bardock wrote:
I find the two scenes to be equally dramatic.

It's obviously a matter of opinion so I can't really debate you there weather I think you are wrong or not. All I can say is a lot of people would disagree seeing as how there is constant jabbering questionable every-day dub music over such an important scene (They could have at least used “Ginyu's transformation” for that scene, the one piece of music that is actually dramatic.) Not to mention just the general bad delivery of all the voice actors and lack of emotion in general. I'm looking pretty hard at Android 16 in that scene.

Then again I could put up as many points as humanly possible and it still wouldn’t sway your opinion but those are just my reasons for not liking that scene in the dub. Or the dub or general.

Kendamu · Post by **Kendamu** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 8:36 am

SSJ2bardock wrote:
NeptuneKai wrote:Anything I say will be full of nerd rage so I'll just say I hate the voice actors/voice acting. Anything I say can not sum up my feelings of the dub better then this comparison of two scenes.

Japanese:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkksoQ435Iw

English:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZUX5hzb ... re=related

The funny thing is I see more hate towards such dubs as 4kids take on OP but it is worlds more accurate then anything Funi ever cranked out in their scripts if you look past a pun or two. Although this isn't an OP fourm and I won't debate that here.
I find the two scenes to be equally dramatic.

I don't see equality there. The only thing that seems to be the same is the overall plot and the animation used. Two different monsters with two different types of drama.

Post by **VegettoEX** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 8:48 am

Needless to say, I'm watching this thread closely. I always end up having to lock these threads (typically because of the dub fans; go figure). The only reason it's even still open is because it managed to get to three pages while I was asleep

.

Carry on, but tread carefully.

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:08 am

NeptuneKai wrote:
SSJ2bardock wrote:
I find the two scenes to be equally dramatic.
It's obviously a matter of opinion so I can't really debate you there weather I think you are wrong or not. All I can say is a lot of people would disagree seeing as how there is constant jabbering questionable every-day dub music over such an important scene (They could have at least used “Ginyu's transformation” for that scene, the one piece of music that is actually dramatic.) Not to mention just the general bad delivery of all the voice actors and lack of emotion in general. I'm looking pretty hard at Android 16 in that scene.

Then again I could put up as many points as humanly possible and it still wouldn’t sway your opinion but those are just my reasons for not liking that scene in the dub. Or the dub or general.

You say that 16 doesn't show emotion. In the English dub he is a completely robotic being so they make him sound like a monotonous robot with no emotion. They're simply voicing the character the same way they had up to that point, so why change his voice now?

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:10 am

VegettoEX wrote:Needless to say, I'm watching this thread closely. I always end up having to lock these threads (typically because of the dub fans; go figure). The only reason it's even still open is because it managed to get to three pages while I was asleep .

Carry on, but tread carefully.

Sorry about the sticky subject, but I found close to nothing on this site that even remotely enjoys the Funi dub so I just decided I should speak up and say I like it instead of cowering in fear from the haters.

Kid Trunks · Post by **Kid Trunks** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:13 am

NeptuneKai wrote:Anything I say will be full of nerd rage so I'll just say I hate the voice actors/voice acting. Anything I say can not sum up my feelings of the dub better then this comparison of two scenes.

Japanese:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkksoQ435Iw

English:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZUX5hzb ... re=related

The funny thing is I see more hate towards such dubs as 4kids take on OP but it is worlds more accurate then anything Funi ever cranked out in their scripts if you look past a pun or two. Although this isn't an OP fourm and I won't debate that here.

I definitely agree that the Japanese version of that scene is much more dramatic. Although a "dubbie", I love Kageyama's songs.

Vegeta Jr · Post by **Vegeta Jr** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:15 am

I find that the dub music carries the action a lot further as it tends to have a faster rhythm, however the Japanese music just conveys that sense of emotion and the suspension of a particular scene much better.

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:18 am

Vegeta Jr wrote:I find that the dub music carries the action a lot further as it tends to have a faster rhythm, however the Japanese music just conveys that sense of emotion and the suspension of a particular scene much better.

Excellent point, at some points I find the Japanese music to not be fitting or exciting enough for a scene, but then the Faulconer music can be a bit overwhelming at times.

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:24 am

SSJ2bardock wrote:
NeptuneKai wrote:
SSJ2bardock wrote:
I find the two scenes to be equally dramatic.
It's obviously a matter of opinion so I can't really debate you there weather I think you are wrong or not. All I can say is a lot of people would disagree seeing as how there is constant jabbering questionable every-day dub music over such an important scene (They could have at least used “Ginyu's transformation” for that scene, the one piece of music that is actually dramatic.) Not to mention just the general bad delivery of all the voice actors and lack of emotion in general. I'm looking pretty hard at Android 16 in that scene.

Then again I could put up as many points as humanly possible and it still wouldn’t sway your opinion but those are just my reasons for not liking that scene in the dub. Or the dub or general.

You say that 16 doesn't show emotion. In the English dub he is a completely robotic being so they make him sound like a monotonous robot with no emotion. They're simply voicing the character the same way they had up to that point, so why change his voice now?

That's exactly the problem, which is why I added "voices" along with "voice acting" to why I hate the dub. They give all the characters sterotypical voices. Kaio-sama, oh he's a blue pudgy alien, let's make him sound like Cartman mixed with Droopy. Android 16, let's give him the most robotic voice possible. An alien that hovers around in a wheelchair looking hovercraft and wears purple lipstick, let's make him sound like a grandmother. A big oaf who had a patch of orange hair let’s make him sound mentally retarded.

Despite all that if they had even a little bit of foresight to what the saga contained or if Funi bothered to watch the key points in the saga before picking and choosing how they wanted to voice the characters they would have obviously stumbled upon the climax and they would have seen the SSJ2 Gohan scene and realized that a robotic voice would be awful for the key moment of the saga.

But even ignoring all of that no matter what voice a VA picks they should be able to have a vast array of emotion in it even if it was intended to be robotic. I mean the Japanese Android 16 wasn't exactly a peppy high voiced "let's all sing and dance" kind of guy either but he managed to show a very deep and caring tone in his speech to Gohan. Something I feel he lacks completely in the dub. It doesn't help either that we have this monotonous music over this monotonous voice.

Vekurotto · Post by **Vekurotto** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:28 am

I've got a lot to say about this but I honestly don't have the time right now. But right now I can say that I do agree with Adamant about how the English dubs and American adaptations have a more powerful effect than most people think. Because right now off the top of my head, The Mexican version of Sailor Moon had to use dub names instead of the original names for the first two seasons because DiC owned the rights to North America, Mexican One Piece is based off of the 4kids version and not the original, Non-English Pokemon is based off the US version and not the original, and all of the DBZ video games are based off of Funi's version. And while the video games are translated better than the horrible attempt at the TV series, they still have inaccuracies and stupidity that simply does not need to be there.

Again I don't have time to talk more in-depth about this right now topic. But whenever I get the chance I will.

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:29 am

He isn't exactly "the most robotic voice ever" but he could show more emotion and the music was pretty dramatic in my opinoin.

Vegeta Jr · Post by **Vegeta Jr** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:29 am

To be honest I find 16 to be a pretty unbelievable character in the original, it maybe stereotypical but he is pure machine not like 17 and 18 where they were originally human and are actually capable of emotion.

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:36 am

Vegeta Jr wrote:To be honest I find 16 to be a pretty unbelievable character in the original, it maybe stereotypical but he is pure machine not like 17 and 18 where they were originally human and are actually capable of emotion.

Well that is really beside the point, it in no way justifies the dub's take on his voice because they left in the whole speech about him loving nature n' such.

SSJ2bardock wrote:He isn't exactly "the most robotic voice ever" but he could show more emotion and the music was pretty dramatic in my opinoin.

Yeah music is a complicated matter, check out Mr.EX’s topic in the music section of the forum for a very interesting in depth post about the whole "the sub music is dated" controversy.

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:39 am

I think that is what makes 16 such a special character. On the outside he may seem cold and robotic, but on the inside he is truly a gentle person who loves the earth and nature.

Vegeta Jr · Post by **Vegeta Jr** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:41 am

SSJ2bardock wrote:I think that is what makes 16 such a special character. On the outside he may seem cold and robotic, but on the inside he is truly a gentle person who loves the earth and nature.

That's why I find him unbelievable, not just in the original but in the dub aswell. It may be cliche'd but I was expecting 16 when i first saw him to be a Terminator like character.

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:44 am

Vegeta Jr wrote:
SSJ2bardock wrote:I think that is what makes 16 such a special character. On the outside he may seem cold and robotic, but on the inside he is truly a gentle person who loves the earth and nature.
That's why I find him unbelievable, not just in the original but in the dub aswell. It may be cliche'd but I was expecting 16 when i first saw him to be a Terminator like character.

Which is the aspect that makes him so dynamic. It plays on the old cliches "Looks can be deceiving" and "Don't judge a book by it's cover".

Post by **VegettoEX** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:44 am

Vegeta Jr wrote:That's why I find him unbelievable, not just in the original but in the dub aswell. It may be cliche'd but I was expecting 16 when i first saw him to be a Terminator like character.

Well, that's the whole irony of the character.

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:47 am

Exactly, I think the dub was just trying to capitolize on something that the original could have made more intriguing. Sorry if I commited blasphemy by saying the dub may have actually done something better than the original.

Vegeta Jr · Post by **Vegeta Jr** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:50 am

SSJ2bardock wrote:Exactly, I think the dub was just trying to capitolize on something that the original could have made more intriguing. Sorry if I commited blasphemy by saying the dub may have actually done something better than the original.

Blasphemy....Nah I actually agree, I prefer 16 in the dub even though his voice tends to annoy me it is just more believeable.

I don't mind the irony of his character but he is too soft spoken in the original, way out of character.