Is Kaioshin a liar?

[mallaard]

This is a totally pointless question and probably can't be answered based on any existing materials, but it's something that popped into my head while mowing the lawn the other day.

At the beginning of the Boo saga when Kaioshin (east Kaioshin?) first appears, he claims that he's stronger than Frieza was when he was still alive (if I'm remembering correctly). However in Resurrection F, Frieza says that King Cold told him the only legitimate threats in the universe to him were Majin Boo and Beerus. It seems a little odd to me that Cold would know of Beerus but not of Kaioshin, but I guess it's possible. So my question is, did the Frieza clan simply not know of Kaioshin's existence, or was Kaioshin full of crap when he claimed to be stronger than Frieza?

I could kinda see either situation being true. I don't think we've ever seen any real evidence of Kaioshin's fighting ability, other than Goku saying that Zamasu was much stronger than him, and Kaioshin seems kind of naive so it's possible he simply didn't gauge Frieza accurately. I don't know, maybe there's an official guide somewhere that can clear it up, just wondering if you guys have any thoughts?

[SupremeKai25]

Kaioshin was stronger than Frieza and could have easily killed him, however he was not a threat because Supreme Kai laws forbid them to interfere with mortal affairs, which means that Kaioshin would have never actually threatened Frieza and his forces. Meanwhile Beerus' job is to destroy dangerous mortals, while Buu was just a rabid monster. So it fits that Cold would not see Kaioshin as a threat, even though he was stronger.

[mallaard]

That answer works for me!

I'd really like to see Toyotaro or someone really delve into the Frieza clan backstory a little. I find it fascinating that there would be a clan/race of lizard folk out in the universe that was powerful enough to conquer most of it and have at least some knowledge of its divinities, and who were powerful enough to elicit the attention of said divinities.

[LoganForkHands73]

I think it's more likely that nobody from the lower realms, including Cold and Freeza, even know about the Kaioshin Realm or higher planes. It's a whole other level of reality above the rest of Universe 7 (though I guess it's a little underwhelming that it looks like any other planet). The Kaioshin are meant to be highly discreet in their activities, only ever journeying to the mortal realm for specific purposes such as to create new life, then disappear. Shin himself is North Kaio's boss, but even they never physically met. Shin and Kibito going to Earth to hunt Babidi was a seriously unusual event.

Beerus's activities are substantially less clandestine, he goes around blowing up planets every few hundred years before going back into hibernation on his planet, which is actually in the mortal realm. It makes sense that he's seen as a legendary figure. Plus, he actually knew King Cold and Freeza personally.

How King Cold knew of Majin Buu makes much less sense. The only way is if Babidi was spreading rumours across the universe that eventually reached his ears, but I can't imagine Cold would take it seriously when there was no evidence of Buu's existence. It seems that it was just an ill-thought-out attempt by Toriyama to keep continuity and make the DB universe look more interconnected.

[Koitsukai]

I agree with the posters above.

The Kaioshin aren't that well-known, a former god like Piccolo had no clue who he was, Shin even corrects his wrong guess. Not even Kaio met one before, so yeah, King Cold not knowing about them makes sense.

Also, we've seen the kaioshin dynamics with Gowasu and Zamasu. They are not allowed to interfere, that's the other side of the coin's job (hakaishin). So even if Cold knew about them, he would've known they don't mess with ningen unless you take the battle to their doorstep like Buu did, something they could not do because their Realm isn't accessible.

[mallaard]

to LoganForkHands73

Yeah, I wondered how Cold knew about Buu as well, that's another reason I'd like to see a more thorough exploration of that clan's history and how they know so much.

to Koitsukai

That would have been my original guess, that Kaioshin was just a lot more discreet than Beerus and therefore King Cold would never have heard of him. But since Cold knew about Beerus AND Buu I kind of assumed he must have known about everybody, but that wouldn't necessarily be true.

[LoganForkHands73]

to LoganForkHands73

Yeah, I wondered how Cold knew about Buu as well, that's another reason I'd like to see a more thorough exploration of that clan's history and how they know so much.

to Koitsukai

That would have been my original guess, that Kaioshin was just a lot more discreet than Beerus and therefore King Cold would never have heard of him. But since Cold knew about Beerus AND Buu I kind of assumed he must have known about everybody, but that wouldn't necessarily be true.

Maybe Buu's original rampage was just that devastating and notorious that people were still talking about it millions of years later. Or maybe Cold's a bit of a scholar in his spare time? He's clearly been spending his retirement years well, lol.

[mallaard]

to LoganForkHands73

Yeah, I wondered how Cold knew about Buu as well, that's another reason I'd like to see a more thorough exploration of that clan's history and how they know so much.

to Koitsukai

That would have been my original guess, that Kaioshin was just a lot more discreet than Beerus and therefore King Cold would never have heard of him. But since Cold knew about Beerus AND Buu I kind of assumed he must have known about everybody, but that wouldn't necessarily be true.

Maybe Buu's original rampage was just that devastating and notorious that people were still talking about it millions of years later. Or maybe Cold's a bit of a scholar in his spare time? He's clearly been spending his retirement years well, lol.

It would have been kind of neat if Freeza had treated the Buu story as an age-old myth and not as a hard fact, something like, "You mean Majin Buu was real?" But yeah, King Cold must have been pretty well read to know as much as he supposedly did. It would have been interesting if Freeza's clan actually worshipped Beerus, at least that would help explain how/why Beerus apparently ordered Freeza to destory planet Vegeta in a dream, or whatever that situation was.

[theherodjl]

Well, Shin put up something of a fight against Fat Boo and managed to get out of the encounter alive so evidently, he had to be stronger than pre-ROF Freeza to achieve even that. If we include the battle against Buff Boo, Shin could also survive getting pummeled by such a powerhouse while Freeza most certainly would've been smashed to a bloody pulp. Shin might have a poor track record as a fighter but he is sturdy enough to not outright die against opponents that are dozens of times stronger than Freeza at minimum.

[SupremeKai25]

Shin actually managed to injure Buu a few times, so he should have more than enough power to oneshot Frieza. Not many characters in Z would be able to scratch Buu.