Losing the Satanic Touch

Kodoshin · Post by **Kodoshin** » Sun Jun 27, 2004 5:31 pm

Eesh, Viz keeps screwing things up left and right, the Saint Seiya manga and now this, oy.

But yeah, I agree that the magazine is pretty much a lost cause at this point, since if they are editing Dragon Ball like this just to appeal to the mass market I would not be suprised to see them start bending over backwards to edit their other series.

At this rate the "Shonen Jump Graphic Novel" label might become a warning sign.

Caracal · Post by **Caracal** » Sun Jun 27, 2004 6:11 pm

Dayspring wrote:
the graphic novels are left unchanged

it's just the SJ magazine
That's all I care about. Still a bitch though.

That's also how I feel, mainly because I can't get SJ over here. But if what they say about previous changes also appearing in the Manga, then there's little hope. I've always hated the name Hercule, partly because I prefere the real name and partly because I think it's a crap name.

I mean honestly, is it so hard to put some like:
"The contents of this comic may not be suitable for younger audience. We hold no responcability for parents letting their children view unsitable material."
in the comic?

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Sun Jun 27, 2004 7:48 pm

Why did the word "Jesusify" just pop into my head?

Post by **VegettoEX** » Sun Jun 27, 2004 8:08 pm

Caracal wrote:I mean honestly, is it so hard to put some like:
"The contents of this comic may not be suitable for younger audience. We hold no responcability for parents letting their children view unsitable material."
in the comic?

But if they put that, then parents KNOW that there's material in there not suitable for their kids, and then know not to buy it in the first place. If there's no warning, and no unsuitable material inside they can bitch about... it's a cash cow.

Monthly Jump is selling so well, they want to cover their asses and make sure it continues to sell well. I totally see where they're coming from. Don't get me wrong, I still dislike it... but I get it.

Post by **SaiyaJedi** » Sun Jun 27, 2004 8:34 pm

PsyLiam wrote:I was actually more annoyed by:

I mean, Bulma? Sure, I can handle that. Yamcha? Only one letter.
I bet he writed Bejiita too...

Yeah, I was wondering about that myself. I mean, "Bulma" and "Yamcha" are both Toriyama's own spellings (and in the case of the latter, it's also legitimate Cantonese). I'd hate to think that those are suddenly "not good enough" to be used.

PsyLiam · Post by **PsyLiam** » Sun Jun 27, 2004 9:13 pm

I knew that Yamcha was legitimate Cantonese, but I never knew it was Toriyama's own spelling. I guess that's why Viz went with it. And that person is just another one who thinks that any spelling FUNi uses MUST BE WRONG BECAUSE THEY ARE EVIL AND HAVE RAPED TORIYAMA'S MASTERPIECE!!!

Have we got a list of Toriyama's "official" English spellings? I guess he probably changed his mind a bit, didn't care in other cases, and spelled Goku as "Gokuh", but it'd be interesting.

The S · Post by **The S** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 12:04 am

How do they know? I haven't seen Hell nor high water of the newest SJ, neither in my mailbox nor the stores...

But dudes, just relax. If you don't like it, cram it with walnuts and don't buy any SJ. Which brings me to an interesting point... $40 for a subscription now? Dammit, I got my first year for $20... I thought when it went up to $30, it was too expensive... Man, if it goes up any more, they better change it to Weekly Jump...

SpaceKappa · Post by **SpaceKappa** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 1:49 am

I've trained myself to censor words anyway. I always read "Saiyan" as "Saiyajin" and stuff like that. I'm a dork.

I buy SJ mostly for Naruto and One Piece anyway.

Izlude · Post by **Izlude** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 4:03 am

VegettoEX wrote:
Jerseymilk wrote:Yes it's EX's little trick. There are certain spellings of certain names that he just feels are completely wrong and doesn't want them used this forum. So if you type in one of these particular ones like He rcule or Fr ieza, they automatically go to what is considered the more accurate spelling or name: Mr. Satan and Freeza.
Yep. Just me being an amusing asshole ^^.

FURIZA!!! F U R I Z A!!! EAT THAT!! TYRANT!! lol... j/k

On this whole case of editing and name-changing, I don't really care much, hell all I care for is -

1. Storyline, long as its intact, I am just dandy!
2. Characters, long as their personalities/traits are the same, I'm dandy!

Who honestly cares about a lil bit of censorship? Everything commercially sold in this world is pretty much censored! This kind of censorship dwarfs what we see on tv or in the newstands! Oh sure, we got our free speech rights and all, but people like those angry mobs of parents are ALWAYS after someone else to violate their rights!

Besides, do you want the soccer moms coming in and making things worse? Accept the facts - DragonBall Z is a kids show, One Piece is a kids show, and Naruto is a kids show! They are all for kids in Japan, they arent adult, or very mature, oh sure they can be at times, but really, the that charm in them comes from their story and the personality of the characters, not from silly names like "Mr.Satan" or "Gai", or "awesome" moves like "Bunshin No Jutsu" or books called "Come Come Paradise" (Whats wrong with Make-Out Paradise? The idea behind it is the same, its a naughty book!)

I mean, if you look at it in someways, namely in translation, its just another way of translating things, like Inferno Blasters, okay, we got Hell, its fiery, its hot, okay Inferno does just fine, because an Inferno would be like Hell! Then we got flash, hey its bright, its fast, and its coming right at you, okay! Blaster will do just fine, and to top it off, the big guy is a Cyborg, comon, every robot dood needs a blaster of some kind.

Same thing in Naruto, okay we got "Sexy No Jutsu", so we call it "Ninja Centerfold" because a centerfold is a hot sexy p0rno babe and its a ninja technique! Dopplegangers you say? Just a Shadow Clone consensed into a single word, same meaning! So its no big friggin deal!

Pathetically small changes like these which Viz probably had no control of (Comon we know damn well this is the fault of parents complaints, just like with the censorship of the DB manga several years ago) and bitching about them isnt going to change anything, the mentially of this country and the adults is stupid, they think -

Comic Books = Kids
Animation = Kids

If that mentality could be changed, all would be dandy, but parents are so obsessed with protecting their young kids, its only natural Viz has to follow through with the parents demands, it beats losing money. I mean think about it, its a business, they gotta meet their demands or else parents wont ever think highly of them.

You also got to remember, Shonen Jump, unlike Raijin Comics, Animerica, or any other magazine out there that covers anime/manga is displayed at stores like Wal-Mart,K-Mart,Big name Grocery stores, and even Toy's R Us. They are displayed at stores where kids can easily get them! Look at Raijin Comic's situation right now, it didnt do so hot because you could only find it at like a FYE,Borders, Barnes and Noble or some store like that, but Shonen Jump is easily accesable because a large variety of chains carry it! Thats what makes it so successful, however if parents are deeming SJ's content un-suitable for kids, changes will have to be made, or else it'll get pulled off the shelf, much like Raijin Comics.

But going as far has saying to just stick with scanlations is stupid, you wanna support the original creators dont you? If you dont want Viz's version, then import the original japanese version or some other foreign version, I mean really, its absurd, not buying something just because of a change that couldnt be avoided? Comon... why do you people here read/watch manga/anime? For the blood, sex, and all that stuff, because its cool? Hah... what happened to ENJOYING it for the story? Isnt that what got people hooked? Or... are the fans just as shallow has their own parents?

You be the judge of that, SJ might have started out a wonderful thing, and then got into a bit of censorship, but its still great, enjoyable, and most important of all, a fun manga experience.

Caracal · Post by **Caracal** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 5:37 am

Thing is, I bought the Manga books because I thought they were going to be uncut and I wanted to see the kind of stuff Ocean and FUNi cut out of DBZ. FUNi aren't allowed to release their DVDs over here. I could import them but I would need a new TV and DVD player. Manga was the cheeper option to see DBZ in it's uncut form and now they're taking that away.

VegettoEX wrote:
Caracal wrote:I mean honestly, is it so hard to put some like:
"The contents of this comic may not be suitable for younger audience. We hold no responcability for parents letting their children view unsitable material."
in the comic?
But if they put that, then parents KNOW that there's material in there not suitable for their kids, and then know not to buy it in the first place. If there's no warning, and no unsuitable material inside they can bitch about... it's a cash cow.

I supose.

But lets assume for a minute that they called him Her.cule because fans only know that name and SJ didn't want to confuse people. In Shaman King they have different names to the Anime, and they state that in the character's bio. Would it have been so hard to put something like "Her cule is the censored name for Mr. Satan." at the end of the bio?

Izlude · Post by **Izlude** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 6:07 am

Even if you get the manga GN's as its released now, 99.7%(No idea if tha figure is correct lol) of its content is still uncut. So you got Hercule now, Inferno Blast, and some middle fingers on a cover page.

Ask yourself this - is that enough to stop you from enjoying one of the greatest manga saga's of all time? I wouldnt think so

omae no kaasan · Post by **omae no kaasan** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 12:29 pm

FURIZA!!! F U R I Z A!!! EAT THAT!! TYRANT!! lol... j/k

You forgot to elongate the i

PsyLiam · Post by **PsyLiam** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 1:45 pm

Mizugi wrote:I've trained myself to censor words anyway. I always read "Saiyan" as "Saiyajin" and stuff like that. I'm a dork.

Yeeeeees. You do know that "Saiyan" is an accurate translation of "Saiya-jin", don't you?

Caracal wrote:FUNi aren't allowed to release their DVDs over here. I could import them but I would need a new TV and DVD player.

You sure? 99% of TV sets made in the past 8 years are NTSC compatible, and even if they aren't it doesn't matter, because DVD players automatically convert NTSC DVDs to a PAL display signal (and vice versa on US DVD players). All you need is to see if your player has a multi-region hack. What make and model number is it?

Regardless, as has been pointed out the manga is still about 90% uncensored. Changing Mr Satan to Her-cule is, relatively speaking, a pretty minor change.

SpaceKappa · Post by **SpaceKappa** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 2:24 pm

PsyLiam wrote:
Mizugi wrote:I've trained myself to censor words anyway. I always read "Saiyan" as "Saiyajin" and stuff like that. I'm a dork.
Yeeeeees. You do know that "Saiyan" is an accurate translation of "Saiya-jin", don't you?

Very aware of that. I've had Super Battle Collection figures that say "Saiyan" on them since before I saw the dub. I just don't like how "Saiyan" sounds is all.

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 2:40 pm

So do you say "Huma-jin" instead of Human? I'm not getting this.

PsyLiam · Post by **PsyLiam** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:11 pm

Would it be Huma-jin, or Earthling-jin?

Y'know, I bet there's a fairly large number of people who say "Saiya-jin" while also saying "Namekian".

Izlude · Post by **Izlude** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:29 pm

I just don't like how "Saiyan" sounds is all

How about if we pronounced it "Sai" (like the weapon)-yen

Sai-yen....sounds cool to me, doesnt like like sayin... WHAT ARE YOU SAYIN!?

I'm A EARTHLING, NOT A SAIYAN!!!

PsyLiam · Post by **PsyLiam** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:43 pm

Isn't that (almost) how it should be pronounced anyway? "Sai-yan"? Rather than "Say-un".

SpaceKappa · Post by **SpaceKappa** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:56 pm

It's just personal preference for me. I just prefer to say "Saiyajin" rather than "Saiyan." To me it just sounds like someone saying the word "sayin'," y'know what I'm sayin'? :p I know technically both are correct, it's just preference.

They left "Majin" alone though. Many jokes were made by my friends before Buu showed up about how he would be called "Mayan Buu."

Izlude · Post by **Izlude** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 4:30 pm

PsyLiam wrote:Isn't that (almost) how it should be pronounced anyway? "Sai-yan"? Rather than "Say-un".

In the fandubs I watched, they always called it Sai-Yan too

Kanzenshuu

Losing the Satanic Touch

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