Is Mystic Gohan a temporary boost?

USSJed · Post by **USSJed** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 7:23 am

My friend showed me a scanlated Manga page where Elder Kai tells Gohan his mystic powerup lasts for only 20 hours, is this true?

In my opinion his FULL power was unleashed for only 20 hours, but after that he was still stronger than before the ceremony. Does that sound about right?

The only evidence I can find is that manga page, as well as the fact that "Mystic" Gohan gets owned by Broly in "Broly, the Second Coming" and is weaker than SSJ3 Goku in "Wrath of the Dragon"

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:00 am

No.

The old Kai did say something about it taking around a day to bring out Gohan's powers, though. So it sounds to me like that scanslation got it backwards. Also, both movie points are incorrect. Second Coming occurs before the Buu Saga, before Gohan's powers are awoken. And he's not weaker than Goku in movie 13, Goku just god mods by whipping out the Super Dragon Fist.

Casual Matt · Post by **Casual Matt** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:03 am

In Movie 10, Son Gohan didn't have his "Ultimate" power up from Rou Dai Kaioshin yet. The movie seems to take place before the 25th Tenkaichi Budokai. Not to mention Gohan goes Super Saiyajin in it.

As for Movie 13, most suspect that when Goku defeated Hildegarn, he was at the talked about "Full Power Super Saiyajin 3" that was talked about in the show, but wasn't able to reach during the pure Majin Boo fight because of his living body.

Don't forget that when he was dead, Goku's Super Saiyajin 3 form knocked the fat Boo around with little trouble, and that Boo was about the same strength as the evil Boo that Ultimate Gohan practically annihilated

As for the 20 hours thing in general, I've never heard that. Movie 13 was Anime Canon, too, so the fact that Gohan appears quite Ultimate near the end of it pretty much goes against it since it's obviously been more than 20 hours since the ritual. Of course, your theory sounds plausible assuming it wasn't just a misscanslation.

Daizensushi-x · Post by **Daizensushi-x** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:51 am

I assume if the 20 hour thing was actually true in some bizarre twist, than it would clear up some plotholes in GT...

Vegeta Jr · Post by **Vegeta Jr** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:54 am

Casual Matt wrote:In Movie 10, Son Gohan didn't have his "Ultimate" power up from Rou Dai Kaioshin yet. The movie seems to take place before the 25th Tenkaichi Budokai. Not to mention Gohan goes Super Saiyajin in it.

As for Movie 13, most suspect that when Goku defeated Hildegarn, he was at the talked about "Full Power Super Saiyajin 3" that was talked about in the show, but wasn't able to reach during the pure Majin Boo fight because of his living body.

Don't forget that when he was dead, Goku's Super Saiyajin 3 form knocked the fat Boo around with little trouble, and that Boo was about the same strength as the evil Boo that Ultimate Gohan practically annihilated

As for the 20 hours thing in general, I've never heard that. Movie 13 was Anime Canon, too, so the fact that Gohan appears quite Ultimate near the end of it pretty much goes against it since it's obviously been more than 20 hours since the ritual. Of course, your theory sounds plausible assuming it wasn't just a misscanslation.

How is movie 13 anime canon? Didn't Toei mess up on the 'how Trunks got his sword'.

Deep Thought · Post by **Deep Thought** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:56 am

I highly doubt it, however, there isn't any real way of telling, since it wasn't stated that it was or wasn't temporary. I'm surprised that people are automatically assuming that it was permanent, but every can have their own opinion, I suppose.

Post by **TripleRach** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 10:00 am

That scanslation is poorly worded. I once thought the same thing because of the very same translation. But when I acquired and looked at the actual Japanese book, it was much clearer.

Gokuu: な...なあ...あの...
Gokuu: それって...どれぐらいかかるんだ？
Old Kaioushin: 儀式に5時間!!パワーアップに20時間だっ!!

Meaning:

Gokuu: H...Hey... Uh...
Gokuu: About...how long'll that take?
Old Kaioushin: 5 hours for the ritual!! 20 hours for the power up!!

He's still talking about how long things will take in the second sentence, but he's referring to the second part of the overall process. The 5 hour ritual refers to the funky dancing and singing he does, and the 20 hours of powering up is when he's sitting in front of Gohan with his hands out.

BlueSky · Post by **Kaboom** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 10:08 am

Vegeta Jr wrote: How is movie 13 anime canon? Didn't Toei mess up on the 'how Trunks got his sword'.

Not necessarily. I always just chalked it up to being how he got the sword in THIS timeline. It's clearly meant to be the same sword, just a different Trunks. Probably Tapion showed up in Future Trunks' timeline in some way or another, but Hildegarn being released was avoided somehow (the Androids probably obliged Tapion in his request to be killed). And while the sword is apparently enchanted against Hildegarns or giant demonic monsters in general, it doesn't look like it's much of anything special against Androids.

But anyway, yeah, Gohan's "mystic" power up was meant to be permanent, and a replacement for his Super Saiyan levels. Everything we saw Gohan in thereafter shows he clearly still had it. He used it in movies 12 and 13, and you could visibly tell he still had it in Z' "10-years-later" epilogue. Toei just screwed it up in GT and gave him back Super Saiyan instead.

Vegeta Jr · Post by **Vegeta Jr** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 10:16 am

SSj Kaboom wrote:
Vegeta Jr wrote: How is movie 13 anime canon? Didn't Toei mess up on the 'how Trunks got his sword'.
Not necessarily. I always just chalked it up to being how he got the sword in THIS timeline. It's clearly meant to be the same sword, just a different Trunks. Probably Tapion showed up in Future Trunks' timeline in some way or another, but Hildegarn being released was avoided somehow (the Androids probably obliged Tapion in his request to be killed). And while the sword is apparently enchanted against Hildegarns or giant demonic monsters in general, it doesn't look like it's much of anything special against Androids.

But anyway, yeah, Gohan's "mystic" power up was meant to be permanent, and a replacement for his Super Saiyan levels. Everything we saw Gohan in thereafter shows he clearly still had it. He used it in movies 12 and 13, and you could visibly tell he still had it in Z' "10-years-later" epilogue. Toei just screwed it up in GT and gave him back Super Saiyan instead.

Didn't movie 12 happen BEFORE he got his Ultimate boost.

Conan the SSJ · Post by **Conan the SSJ** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 10:18 am

USSJed wrote:scanlated Manga page

Buy or borrow the Viz manga. Do not rely on scanlations. They're neither official, nor legit. Some censorship issues aside, Viz's translating is as good as it'll get.

Xyex wrote:And he's not weaker than Goku in movie 13, Goku just god mods by whipping out the Super Dragon Fist.

Plus Trunks did weaken Hildegarn by cutting off his tail with Tapion's sword. :p

BlueSky · Post by **Kaboom** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 10:53 am

Vegeta Jr wrote:Didn't movie 12 happen BEFORE he got his Ultimate boost.

Actually, when you line it up with the series (it can't ACTUALLY fit, though), it seems to be set right around when he would have fought Super Buu with it. Goku and Vegeta are both dead, Goten and Trunks can do Fusion and Gotenks has SSj3, and Gohan's got his power up. If you're thinking in terms of "What If," then 12 could have happened if Gotenks or Gohan had gotten rid of Buu.

Conan the SSJ · Post by **Conan the SSJ** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:33 am

SSj Kaboom wrote:Gotenks has SSj3

We never see Gotenks at SSJ3 in movie 12, just regular SSJ. That of which we already saw him at episodes prior in the series, when Goten and Trunks first fused as Super Saiyans. You may be confusing his appearance in Fusion Reborn with movie 13. I guess he'd be capable of transforming, but thought it'd be overkill on poor Dictator.

Casual Matt · Post by **Casual Matt** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:37 am

Vegeta Jr wrote:
Casual Matt wrote:In Movie 10, Son Gohan didn't have his "Ultimate" power up from Rou Dai Kaioshin yet. The movie seems to take place before the 25th Tenkaichi Budokai. Not to mention Gohan goes Super Saiyajin in it.

As for Movie 13, most suspect that when Goku defeated Hildegarn, he was at the talked about "Full Power Super Saiyajin 3" that was talked about in the show, but wasn't able to reach during the pure Majin Boo fight because of his living body.

Don't forget that when he was dead, Goku's Super Saiyajin 3 form knocked the fat Boo around with little trouble, and that Boo was about the same strength as the evil Boo that Ultimate Gohan practically annihilated

As for the 20 hours thing in general, I've never heard that. Movie 13 was Anime Canon, too, so the fact that Gohan appears quite Ultimate near the end of it pretty much goes against it since it's obviously been more than 20 hours since the ritual. Of course, your theory sounds plausible assuming it wasn't just a misscanslation.
How is movie 13 anime canon? Didn't Toei mess up on the 'how Trunks got his sword'.

The Ryuken technique, which made it's debut in Movie 13, was used in GT several times.

And I think Trunks has that sword in GT but I'm not sure if he uses it in the show. I know it shows him with it in the Opening and the intro to Final Bout.

SSj Kaboom wrote: If you're thinking in terms of "What If," then 12 could have happened if Gotenks or Gohan had gotten rid of Buu.

That's what I always thought.

USSJed · Post by **USSJed** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 1:10 am

and you could visibly tell he still had it in Z' "10-years-later" epilogue

What? Where? From what I remember all he does is watch people fight and wear dorky glasses! I don't remember anything that points in the still Mystic direction, or anything that points towards losing the Mystic boost. Care to elabourate?

USSJed wrote:
scanlated Manga page

Buy or borrow the Viz manga. Do not rely on scanlations. They're neither official, nor legit. Some censorship issues aside, Viz's translating is as good as it'll get

I'd love to, but every bookstore I have visited had about 10 books between them, mostly from the Frieza Saga. I hate having to read it on the computer...

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 2:40 am

USSJed wrote:
and you could visibly tell he still had it in Z' "10-years-later" epilogue
What? Where? From what I remember all he does is watch people fight and wear dorky glasses! I don't remember anything that points in the still Mystic direction, or anything that points towards losing the Mystic boost. Care to elabourate?

He's refering to the appearance changes. Hair, face, eyes. They're minor differences (made even more so in the anime) but they're noticable just the same. And you can tell they're retained in the 10-years later bit.

BlueSky · Post by **Kaboom** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 2:57 am

Conan the SSJ wrote:We never see Gotenks at SSJ3 in movie 12, just regular SSJ. That of which we already saw him at episodes prior in the series, when Goten and Trunks first fused as Super Saiyans. You may be confusing his appearance in Fusion Reborn with movie 13. I guess he'd be capable of transforming, but thought it'd be overkill on poor Dictator.

Ah, my bad. Yeah, I got his two movie appearances mixed up. But the fact that Gohan was "mystic" in that movie means that Gotenks most likely did have SSj3 available to him. Gohan's powerup ritual didn't end until Gotenks was well into his post-RoSaT fight with Buu. So whether the "What-If" for this movie was Gotenks beating Buu or Gohan, SSj3 probably still comes along with it.

Shenron · Post by **Shenron** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 7:14 am

but the fact that Gohan was "mystic" in that movie means that Gotenks most likely did have SSj3 available to him

You should watch Movie 12 again. Gohan is absolutely not Mystic.

Saiyavenger2941 · Post by **Saiyavenger2941** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 7:30 am

Shenron wrote:
but the fact that Gohan was "mystic" in that movie means that Gotenks most likely did have SSj3 available to him
You should watch Movie 12 again. Gohan is absolutely not Mystic.

Yeah. The only movie Mystic Gohan ever appears in is "Wrath of the Dragon", and that marks the only occurrence, to my vast amount of Gohan knowledge at least, that he goes Mystic in a uniform other than the orange "tribute" Gi as well. (When fighting Hildegarn's legs with Videl, in his Saiyaman outfit.)

Just some kinda cool trivia for ya, I guess.

BlueSky · Post by **Kaboom** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 9:34 am

... :/

Really? Been a while since I watched that one, but... Okay.

USSJed · Post by **USSJed** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 5:22 pm

He's refering to the appearance changes. Hair, face, eyes. They're minor differences (made even more so in the anime) but they're noticable just the same. And you can tell they're retained in the 10-years later bit

So the power unlocking ceremony thing, did it do things such as change the shape of the eyes and facial features also?

Kanzenshuu

Is Mystic Gohan a temporary boost?

Is Mystic Gohan a temporary boost?

Re: Is Mystic Gohan a temporary boost?