What Inconsistencies &/or Retcons You Wished Were Never Made In Dragon Ball Super?

[LoganForkHands73]

I sometimes think Zamasu's plan was simply too epic for that point in the series. I mean, it's certainly smart to kill all the other gods who would get in his way but it does ironically make the multiverse feel smaller when they managed to do so relatively easy. Realistically, there would be all out war across the multiverse against Zamasu and Black. Considering how close many other god pantheons are to their universe's mortals, it's ludicrous that Zamasu managed to get away with it without anyone noticing, not even Zeno or Daishinkan. I honestly don't remember the full extent of their rampage in the arc itself, I always thought they mainly concentrated on Universe 7 in the future timeline, and maybe Universe 10 since that's Zamasu's home universe, but I may be talking out of my ass on that one.

However, I'm more inclined to blame this on the Zamasu arc than on the Universe Survival arc because there was no need to make Black and Zamasu's plan that insanely grand in scale, especially since it was never intended to be an epic final arc or anything. They knew that the Tournament of Power was coming. Jiren's existence is perfectly in line with the themes of Super, that even mortals out there in the multiverse can rival Goku and the gods in power, simply through naturally earned strength. On that same token, in the Zamasu arc, it would've been perfectly in keeping with the series' themes for the gods to just ignore everything that goes on in Universe 7 and refuse to help because they view it as a dungheel of a universe.

TL;DR, the Zamasu arc was the one that messed up the worldbuilding most.

[Koitsukai]

But the same is true of Freeza. By the start of the ToP, he's already shifted from the pod-riding mafioso of the Namek arc to a martial artist who is willing to put in the mental and physical effort on top of his natural talent, from someone for whom defeat was unthinkable to someone who has come to accept and pragmatically react to the idea of no longer being on top. It is this Freeza alongside whom the characters ally in the ToP, and I don't find the way those interactions play out remotely hard to accept.

This is a really good point I never paid much attention to, or noticed even, to be fair.
Freeza in DBS started to demonstrate traits that would make Goku... umm... respect him? He trains, he improves, he discovers new things about himself, he is more like a fighter now, more in tune with Goku.

[Thani]

I sometimes think Zamasu's plan was simply too epic for that point in the series. I mean, it's certainly smart to kill all the other gods who would get in his way but it does ironically make the multiverse feel smaller when they managed to do so relatively easy. Realistically, there would be all out war across the multiverse against Zamasu and Black. Considering how close many other god pantheons are to their universe's mortals, it's ludicrous that Zamasu managed to get away with it without anyone noticing, not even Zeno or Daishinkan. I honestly don't remember the full extent of their rampage in the arc itself, I always thought they mainly concentrated on Universe 7 in the future timeline, and maybe Universe 10 since that's Zamasu's home universe, but I may be talking out of my ass on that one.

However, I'm more inclined to blame this on the Zamasu arc than on the Universe Survival arc because there was no need to make Black and Zamasu's plan that insanely grand in scale, especially since it was never intended to be an epic final arc or anything. They knew that the Tournament of Power was coming. Jiren's existence is perfectly in line with the themes of Super, that even mortals out there in the multiverse can rival Goku and the gods in power, simply through naturally earned strength. On that same token, in the Zamasu arc, it would've been perfectly in keeping with the series' themes for the gods to just ignore everything that goes on in Universe 7 and refuse to help because they view it as a dungheel of a universe.

TL;DR, the Zamasu arc was the one that messed up the worldbuilding most.

Perfectly said. Jiren, Toppo, hell, everyone in the ToP are fine as concepts. But if you're going to introduce a villain whose ambition is "the eradication of all mortal life everywhere", then you have to take them into consideration. Which they couldn't, because they didn't exist yet. But not even Toyotaro, who had the privilege of foresight by being behind the anime, took advantage of that. And he had plenty of opportunities.

[Magnificent Ponta]

On the subject of Zamas going to other parallel Universes with the Ring of Time to check them out, and not seeing/factoring in Jiren or Toppo:

This is speculative, naturally, but Zamas is from 17 years in the future, and the Ring of Time can't travel to 'the past' (I think we'd need to read that as the past of the user, as both Gowas and Shin are both from 'the past' in that sense). So, wouldn't Zamas be checking the parallel Universes from a standpoint of 17 years further on from the main timeline?

While it's perhaps a stretch to say that Jiren could be gone from all of them within 17 years of the present, Toppo should probably be the God of Destruction for Universe 11 (in the realities where he exists) by then, so his absence from that factoring could be due to the fact that Zamas doesn't regard most of the Gods of Destruction (except Beerus) as an obstacle, since he can just kill their Kaioshin to take them out of account.

[SupremeKai25]

I sometimes think Zamasu's plan was simply too epic for that point in the series. I mean, it's certainly smart to kill all the other gods who would get in his way but it does ironically make the multiverse feel smaller when they managed to do so relatively easy. Realistically, there would be all out war across the multiverse against Zamasu and Black. Considering how close many other god pantheons are to their universe's mortals, it's ludicrous that Zamasu managed to get away with it without anyone noticing, not even Zeno or Daishinkan. I honestly don't remember the full extent of their rampage in the arc itself, I always thought they mainly concentrated on Universe 7 in the future timeline, and maybe Universe 10 since that's Zamasu's home universe, but I may be talking out of my ass on that one.

However, I'm more inclined to blame this on the Zamasu arc than on the Universe Survival arc because there was no need to make Black and Zamasu's plan that insanely grand in scale, especially since it was never intended to be an epic final arc or anything. They knew that the Tournament of Power was coming. Jiren's existence is perfectly in line with the themes of Super, that even mortals out there in the multiverse can rival Goku and the gods in power, simply through naturally earned strength. On that same token, in the Zamasu arc, it would've been perfectly in keeping with the series' themes for the gods to just ignore everything that goes on in Universe 7 and refuse to help because they view it as a dungheel of a universe.

TL;DR, the Zamasu arc was the one that messed up the worldbuilding most.

Because the multiverse is small, or anyway small for someone who can instantly teleport wherever he wants (since he inherited Instant Transmission from Goku, and anyway has the Kai Kai teleportation techniques of all Kais). Nothing is outside his reach. Zamasu himself also says that he already annihilated countless mortal civilizations throughout the cosmos, meaning that all universes suffered and were attacked by him. It is very likely that only Earth was left, since he talked like Project Zero Mortals would finally end or reach its climax with the eradication of all earthlings (it also makes sense that he would leave the earthlings for last due to their sin of time travel).

So yes it is very likely that Zamasu already destroyed ALL mortals civilizations spread throughout ALL universes, and by the time the Future Trunks arc starts only the Earth is left.

As for the Grand Priest, he probably did try to intervene and got himself erased, or maybe he just didn't intervene because he is forbidden to do so by the Angel laws. Zeno really is a non-factor, he doesn't give a shit about the multiverse nor mortal lives and anyway it's explained Zamasu was doing his best to avoid being discovered by Zeno. Even if Zeno intervened, I'm sure Zamasu would've found a way to manipulate him. Zamasu is smart and conniving, he knows how to deceive people, especially naive people like Zeno, Goku, and Gowasu.

Also, as a side note, Zamasu's power became so vast that it wasn't limited to the Future multiverse alone. As Infinite Zamasu, his power was leaking into the Present timeline as well, which seriously worried both Beerus and Whis.

[LoganForkHands73]

I sometimes think Zamasu's plan was simply too epic for that point in the series. I mean, it's certainly smart to kill all the other gods who would get in his way but it does ironically make the multiverse feel smaller when they managed to do so relatively easy. Realistically, there would be all out war across the multiverse against Zamasu and Black. Considering how close many other god pantheons are to their universe's mortals, it's ludicrous that Zamasu managed to get away with it without anyone noticing, not even Zeno or Daishinkan. I honestly don't remember the full extent of their rampage in the arc itself, I always thought they mainly concentrated on Universe 7 in the future timeline, and maybe Universe 10 since that's Zamasu's home universe, but I may be talking out of my ass on that one.

However, I'm more inclined to blame this on the Zamasu arc than on the Universe Survival arc because there was no need to make Black and Zamasu's plan that insanely grand in scale, especially since it was never intended to be an epic final arc or anything. They knew that the Tournament of Power was coming. Jiren's existence is perfectly in line with the themes of Super, that even mortals out there in the multiverse can rival Goku and the gods in power, simply through naturally earned strength. On that same token, in the Zamasu arc, it would've been perfectly in keeping with the series' themes for the gods to just ignore everything that goes on in Universe 7 and refuse to help because they view it as a dungheel of a universe.

TL;DR, the Zamasu arc was the one that messed up the worldbuilding most.

Perfectly said. Jiren, Toppo, hell, everyone in the ToP are fine as concepts. But if you're going to introduce a villain whose ambition is "the eradication of all mortal life everywhere", then you have to take them into consideration. Which they couldn't, because they didn't exist yet. But not even Toyotaro, who had the privilege of foresight by being behind the anime, took advantage of that. And he had plenty of opportunities.

Thanks! It's just another indicator that a lot of developments in Super weren't given much foresight or even hindsight at all. At this point I just roll with it, lol.

[LoganForkHands73]

Because the multiverse is small, or anyway small for someone who can instantly teleport wherever he wants (since he inherited Instant Transmission from Goku, and anyway has the Kai Kai teleportation techniques of all Kais). Nothing is outside his reach. Zamasu himself also says that he already annihilated countless mortal civilizations throughout the cosmos, meaning that all universes suffered and were attacked by him. It is very likely that only Earth was left, since he talked like Project Zero Mortals would finally end or reach its climax with the eradication of all earthlings (it also makes sense that he would leave the earthlings for last due to their sin of time travel).

So yes it is very likely that Zamasu already destroyed ALL mortals civilizations spread throughout ALL universes, and by the time the Future Trunks arc starts only the Earth is left.

As for the Grand Priest, he probably did try to intervene and got himself erased, or maybe he just didn't intervene because he is forbidden to do so by the Angel laws. Zeno really is a non-factor, he doesn't give a shit about the multiverse nor mortal lives and anyway it's explained Zamasu was doing his best to avoid being discovered by Zeno. Even if Zeno intervened, I'm sure Zamasu would've found a way to manipulate him. Zamasu is smart and conniving, he knows how to deceive people, especially naive people like Zeno, Goku, and Gowasu.

Also, as a side note, Zamasu's power became so vast that it wasn't limited to the Future multiverse alone. As Infinite Zamasu, his power was leaking into the Present timeline as well, which seriously worried both Beerus and Whis.

I mean it feels like you're really highballing him here but I can't really be bothered to look back through the entire arc to prove you wrong so I'll just take your word for it lol.

In any case, I'd rather that not be the true intention because I find it hard to stomach that in all 12 whole universes, not a single group of mortals or gods would have put up a shred of resistance against Zamasu before he became Infinite. I'm begrudgingly willing to accept that they murdered all Kaioshin and by extension Hakaishin since they outright confess that they did but I don't think there's enough evidence to suggest that they exterminated all civilisations in the multiverse. I prefer to interpret that they mostly kept within Universe 7 because they wanted to punish it for breaking the laws of time.

[Thani]

The way I interpreted it, Zamasu's logic was as follow: "I want all mortals gone. They are all sinners and must die. The gods will be against me. I know it, because I tried to talk them to see reason. So they must go as well. I'll make new gods later, they'll get me. The Gods of Planets and the four Kaios won't be a problem, but the Gods of Destruction is more than I can handle. But wait! Gowasu taught me that their life is linked to the Kaioshin. I can use that!"

Now, there are hints in the anime that Earth was the final stage for the Zero Mortal Plan. In the manga, Zamasu went out of his way to find a timeline where an Universe was lacking a God of Destruction and, as luck would have it, it was the one where Beerus used to reign.

Then, he would go on to kill all the Kaioshins, killing the GoD's and nullifying their angels. The way I saw it, he then returned to Universe 7 and started there. In this case, the Zero Mortal Plan would be concluded in U7 after he was done with Earth. Which is when he would go on to rampage across the other universes.

[SupremeKai25]

Because the multiverse is small, or anyway small for someone who can instantly teleport wherever he wants (since he inherited Instant Transmission from Goku, and anyway has the Kai Kai teleportation techniques of all Kais). Nothing is outside his reach. Zamasu himself also says that he already annihilated countless mortal civilizations throughout the cosmos, meaning that all universes suffered and were attacked by him. It is very likely that only Earth was left, since he talked like Project Zero Mortals would finally end or reach its climax with the eradication of all earthlings (it also makes sense that he would leave the earthlings for last due to their sin of time travel).

So yes it is very likely that Zamasu already destroyed ALL mortals civilizations spread throughout ALL universes, and by the time the Future Trunks arc starts only the Earth is left.

As for the Grand Priest, he probably did try to intervene and got himself erased, or maybe he just didn't intervene because he is forbidden to do so by the Angel laws. Zeno really is a non-factor, he doesn't give a shit about the multiverse nor mortal lives and anyway it's explained Zamasu was doing his best to avoid being discovered by Zeno. Even if Zeno intervened, I'm sure Zamasu would've found a way to manipulate him. Zamasu is smart and conniving, he knows how to deceive people, especially naive people like Zeno, Goku, and Gowasu.

Also, as a side note, Zamasu's power became so vast that it wasn't limited to the Future multiverse alone. As Infinite Zamasu, his power was leaking into the Present timeline as well, which seriously worried both Beerus and Whis.

I mean it feels like you're really highballing him here but I can't really be bothered to look back through the entire arc to prove you wrong so I'll just take your word for it lol.

Not highballing, I base my arguments on several quotes:

From ep. 61: "We have already cleansed a great number of planets of their repulsive mortal blight. And now we will cleanse the Earth. Your filthy kind is worst of all. Because you are the ugliest, we are sentencing you to the heaviest punishment."

From ep. 63: "Once they are gone we can finish Project Zero Mortals much more quickly." (talking about Goku and Vegeta)

From ep. 65: "At long last, on this most glorious day, Project Zero Mortals will culminate with the eradication of all remaining life on this planet. And then the great utopia will rise from the ashes!" ("To culminate" literally means "to end")

Maybe Earth is not exactly the final planet left to cleanse, but very clearly Project Zero Mortals has already gone on for quite some time by the start of the Future Trunks arc. It seems Zamasu might have wanted to leave the earthlings for last, because they are the greatest sinners in his mind, and so their punishment would take the most time. As the saying goes, "leave the best for last." As well the fact that they are planning to FINISH (not start) their Project means that they are already well underway on killing all mortals everywhere.

In any case, I'd rather that not be the true intention because I find it hard to stomach that in all 12 whole universes, not a single group of mortals or gods would have put up a shred of resistance against Zamasu before he became Infinite. I'm begrudgingly willing to accept that they murdered all Kaioshin and by extension Hakaishin since they outright confess that they did but I don't think there's enough evidence to suggest that they exterminated all civilisations in the multiverse. I prefer to interpret that they mostly kept within Universe 7 because they wanted to punish it for breaking the laws of time.

But that does not make sense. Zamasu wants to remake the ENTIRE COSMOS, the entire multiverse, not just one or two universes.

Besides, which mortals could REALLY stand up against him? Let me make a list:

- Universe 1, we dont know any strong fighter from here.
- Universe 2, fodder.
- Universe 3, fodder.
- Universe 4, fodder.
- Universe 5, we dont know any strong fighter from here.
- Universe 6, Hit is the only threat but he would eventually be outlasted by Immortal Zamasu.
- Universe 7, Trunks (who had been fighting Black for about 1 year, but Black was basically toying with him).
- Universe 8, we dont know any strong fighter from here.
- Universe 9, fodder.
- Universe 10, fodder.
- Universe 11, Jiren and Toppo probably died (I explained earlier how that might have happened).
- Universe 12, we dont know any strong fighter from here.

So really its not a surprise if Zamasu was able to take on the entire multiverse all by himself. Ultimate Saiyan strength combined with Immortality is very op.

[ZombieVito]

Ask yourself this.

Has Jiren truly surpassed Zamasu if he can't kill him? Jiren would beat Fused Zamasu around easily of course but would be completely hopeless in return against Infinite Zamasu. Jiren can't win that fight and would die at the end.

To be fair, Jiren (in the manga anyhow) does have a device to seal away evil-doers, and could probably just use that on Fused Zamasu, much like the Mafuba. It worked on a creature we can assume is stronger than Fused Zamasu anyhow, based on the fact Toppo had trouble facing it.

Well, it's a good thing I was referring to the anime and not the awful manga.

But that does not make sense. Zamasu wants to remake the ENTIRE COSMOS, the entire multiverse, not just one or two universes.

Besides, which mortals could REALLY stand up against him? Let me make a list:

- Universe 1, we dont know any strong fighter from here.
- Universe 2, fodder.
- Universe 3, fodder.
- Universe 4, fodder.
- Universe 5, we dont know any strong fighter from here.
- Universe 6, Hit is the only threat but he would eventually be outlasted by Immortal Zamasu.
- Universe 7, Trunks (who had been fighting Black for about 1 year, but Black was basically toying with him).
- Universe 8, we dont know any strong fighter from here.
- Universe 9, fodder.
- Universe 10, fodder.
- Universe 11, Jiren and Toppo probably died (I explained earlier how that might have happened).
- Universe 12, we dont know any strong fighter from here.

So really its not a surprise if Zamasu was able to take on the entire multiverse all by himself. Ultimate Saiyan strength combined with Immortality is very op.

I agree. There's nothing that contradicts Zamasu killing everyone from the other universes. Future Zamasu can eventually kill Jiren and Toppo by outlasting them in battle. Or they can simply destroy the planet they are on quickly.

[SupremeKai25]

I agree. There's nothing that contradicts Zamasu killing everyone from the other universes. Future Zamasu can eventually kill Jiren and Toppo by outlasting them in battle. Or they can simply destroy the planet they are on quickly.

That's probably how Zamasu also got rid of the Galactic Patrol and Moro. He simply destroyed the place where they lived in. It's shown in the RoF arc that even if your opponent is weaker, he can still kill you if he destroys the place you are standing on. So even if Old Moro was stronger than Zamasu (very debatable), then Zamasu could've simply killed him by blowing up the prison he was kept in.

[Skar]

I sometimes think Zamasu's plan was simply too epic for that point in the series. I mean, it's certainly smart to kill all the other gods who would get in his way but it does ironically make the multiverse feel smaller when they managed to do so relatively easy. Realistically, there would be all out war across the multiverse against Zamasu and Black. Considering how close many other god pantheons are to their universe's mortals, it's ludicrous that Zamasu managed to get away with it without anyone noticing, not even Zeno or Daishinkan. I honestly don't remember the full extent of their rampage in the arc itself, I always thought they mainly concentrated on Universe 7 in the future timeline, and maybe Universe 10 since that's Zamasu's home universe, but I may be talking out of my ass on that one.

I think the arc makes more sense when you look at it from the perspective being a young apprentice and having limited knowledge of the universe when he rushed to enact his plan. In BoG, Whis offered Goku the position of GoD once Beerus retires (or dies I forgot) so it already established there could be powerful mortals out there training to replace their universe's GoD. Zamasu rushed to switch with Goku without considering he might not even be the strongest mortal at the time. If he was aware his own GoD was once a mortal and will be replaced one day, he might not have been as shocked by Goku's power.

Whether he ran into a more powerful mortal or not, his plan was doomed to fail once Zeno found out. To his limited knowledge, Zamasu might've assumed Zeno was an understanding ruler who would appreciate his efforts. If he had known that Zeno destroyed six universes over a minor annoyance in the past, Zamasu might've given up on his plan knowing Zeno could wipe out universes or multiverse at any moment without taking the time to figure out what was happening.

I think an analogy could be like a self-righteous kid who wants to "cleanse" the playground of unworthy students who don't take care of the equipment. He gets rid of the older kids and teachers in indirect ways like getting them expelled or fired but unaware there could be other stronger kids in his own grade that could stop him from kicking everyone off the playground. His biggest obstacle is the principal of the school who he hopes doesn't notice or get involved. It turns out the principal is a loose cannon who once shut down school activities because he was annoyed by some students. When he inevitably finds outs what was happening, he decides to cancel recess and bulldoze the entire playground. In his effort to preserve the equipment on the playground, the kid set in motion the chain of events leading to everything being destroyed and probably would've avoided his whole plan if he had known this was a possible outcome.

[SupremeKai25]

I sometimes think Zamasu's plan was simply too epic for that point in the series. I mean, it's certainly smart to kill all the other gods who would get in his way but it does ironically make the multiverse feel smaller when they managed to do so relatively easy. Realistically, there would be all out war across the multiverse against Zamasu and Black. Considering how close many other god pantheons are to their universe's mortals, it's ludicrous that Zamasu managed to get away with it without anyone noticing, not even Zeno or Daishinkan. I honestly don't remember the full extent of their rampage in the arc itself, I always thought they mainly concentrated on Universe 7 in the future timeline, and maybe Universe 10 since that's Zamasu's home universe, but I may be talking out of my ass on that one.

I think the arc makes more sense when you look at it from the perspective being a young apprentice and having limited knowledge of the universe when he rushed to enact his plan. In BoG, Whis offered Goku the position of GoD once Beerus retires (or dies I forgot) so it already established there could be powerful mortals out there training to replace their universe's GoD. Zamasu rushed to switch with Goku without considering he might not even be the strongest mortal at the time. If he was aware his own GoD was once a mortal and will be replaced one day, he might not have been as shocked by Goku's power.

Whether he ran into a more powerful mortal or not, his plan was doomed to fail once Zeno found out. To his limited knowledge, Zamasu might've assumed Zeno was an understanding ruler who would appreciate his efforts. If he had known that Zeno destroyed six universes over a minor annoyance in the past, Zamasu might've given up on his plan knowing Zeno could wipe out universes or multiverse at any moment without taking the time to figure out what was happening.

I think an analogy could be like a self-righteous kid who wants to "cleanse" the playground of unworthy students who don't take care of the equipment. He gets rid of the older kids and teachers in indirect ways like getting them expelled or fired but unaware there could be other stronger kids in his own grade that could stop him from kicking everyone off the playground. His biggest obstacle is the principal of the school who he hopes doesn't notice or get involved. It turns out the principal is a loose cannon who once shut down school activities because he was annoyed by some students. When he inevitably finds outs what was happening, he decides to cancel recess and bulldoze the entire playground. In his effort to preserve the equipment on the playground, the kid set in motion the chain of events leading to everything being destroyed and probably would've avoided his whole plan if he had known this was a possible outcome.

Well Zeno seemed to get along very well with Goku, because he looks so friendly and easy-going, so since Zamasu stole Goku's body I'm sure he would've easily manipulated Zeno. He is also more intelligent, polite, and well-spoken than the ignorant Goku, which means he could easily play Zeno like a fiddle.

The only reason why Zeno erased Zamasu is because, by the time he arrived on the battlefield, Zamasu had already lost his sanity and had devolved into a laughing maniac. Otherwise, I imagine Zamasu would have no trouble ingratiating Zeno.

[Skar]

Well Zeno seemed to get along very well with Goku, because he looks so friendly and easy-going, so since Zamasu stole Goku's body I'm sure he would've easily manipulated Zeno. He is also more intelligent, polite, and well-spoken than the ignorant Goku, which means he could easily play Zeno like a fiddle.

This is what I meant earlier in this thread that fans could explain anything away but it has to be acknowledged in the story if we're supposed to believe that's what Toriyama or the other writers were going for. All we know is that Zamasu was trying to avoid Zeno but he never explained what he would've done if Zeno showed up. If Zamasu really believed he could manipulate Zeno, he likely would've tried it at the beginning and not risk Zeno destroying the universe(s) when he found out on his own.

[SupremeKai25]

Well Zeno seemed to get along very well with Goku, because he looks so friendly and easy-going, so since Zamasu stole Goku's body I'm sure he would've easily manipulated Zeno. He is also more intelligent, polite, and well-spoken than the ignorant Goku, which means he could easily play Zeno like a fiddle.

This is what I meant earlier in this thread that fans could explain anything away but it has to be acknowledged in the story if we're supposed to believe that's what Toriyama or the other writers were going for. All we know is that Zamasu was trying to avoid Zeno but he never explained what he would've done if Zeno showed up. If Zamasu really believed he could manipulate Zeno, he likely would've tried it at the beginning and not risk Zeno destroying the universe(s) when he found out on his own.

It doesn't really have to be acknowledged in the story since we're all speculating in the first place. If someone's theories make sense in the context of the story, I don't see what the problem is.

Zamasu was trying to avoid being caught by Zeno, but he is a very methodical and careful person. He went to extreme lengths to make sure his plan would succeed, he must have had a backup plan in case he got caught by Zeno. This is who Zamasu is, a very intelligent person capable of devising layers upon layers of plans. His villainous plan was easily the most convoluted and though-out plan out of any villain.

[Skar]

It doesn't really have to be acknowledged in the story since we're all speculating in the first place. If someone's theories makes sense in the context of the story, I don't see what the problem is.

I'm saying it doesn't really make sense in this context because there's literally no hint that he had a backup plan for when Zeno showed up. If he really did take Zeno into consideration, they could've at least had a scene of him trying to get rid of Zeno with the Super Dragonballs and being told it wasn't within their power then coming up with a backup plan. It seemed the only obstacle he considered to his goal were few Saiyans on Earth especially since he boasted about becoming the most powerful god after the fusion.

[SupremeKai25]

It doesn't really have to be acknowledged in the story since we're all speculating in the first place. If someone's theories makes sense in the context of the story, I don't see what the problem is.

I'm saying it doesn't really make sense in this context because there's literally no hint that he had a backup plan for when Zeno showed up. If he really did take Zeno into consideration, they could've at least had a scene of him trying to get rid of Zeno with the Super Dragonballs and being told it wasn't within their power then coming up with a backup plan. It seemed the only obstacle he considered to his goal were few Saiyans on Earth especially since he boasted about becoming the most powerful god after the fusion.

It's not like he could've known anyway. The only reason why Zeno intervened was because Goku had a special plot button which instantly teleported Zeno to his location. Up to that point, Zamasu had wiped out countless civilizations across the cosmos, including his own fellow Gods, without Zeno raising a finger against him.

Even when Zamasu merged with the fabric of the cosmos (which was never part of his plan, he had already lost his sanity by that point) and wiped out everything and everyone, Zeno STILL did nothing until Goku used the button.

[Skar]

It's not like he could've known anyway. The only reason why Zeno intervened was because Goku had a special plot button which instantly teleported Zeno to his location. Up to that point, Zamasu had wiped out countless civilizations across the cosmos, including his own fellow Gods, without Zeno raising a finger against him.

First he had a backup plan but now he couldn't have known Zeno would ever show up . Zamasu watched the U6/U7 tournament on Godtube that had Zeno appear on his own so that proves he occasionally observes the universes. Just because he hasn't shown up yet doesn't mean Zamasu should believe he could wipe out all life in the multiverse and rule over it for eternity without Zeno ever noticing. It would be like if Vegeta wanted to rule over Freeza's empire by killing only the elites and hoped that Freeza and Cold never find out. In the Namek saga, he at least had a plan to deal with Freeza by becoming immortal so we didn't have to come up with our own theories because the story didn't explain it.

[SupremeKai25]

It's not like he could've known anyway. The only reason why Zeno intervened was because Goku had a special plot button which instantly teleported Zeno to his location. Up to that point, Zamasu had wiped out countless civilizations across the cosmos, including his own fellow Gods, without Zeno raising a finger against him.

First he had a backup plan but now he couldn't have known Zeno would ever show up . Zamasu watched the U6/U7 tournament on Godtube that had Zeno appear on his own so that proves he occasionally observes the universes. Just because he hasn't shown up yet doesn't mean Zamasu should believe he could wipe out all life in the multiverse and rule over it for eternity without Zeno ever noticing. It would be like if Vegeta wanted to rule over Freeza's empire by killing only the elites and hoped that Freeza and Cold never find out. In the Namek saga, he at least had a plan to deal with Freeza by becoming immortal so we didn't have to come up with our own theories because the story didn't explain it.

I mean, I mentioned that theory, but since you refuse to acknowledge theories there isn't much room for discussion here. So Yes, Zamasu couldn't have known Zeno would intervene, and so if he didn't have a backup plan it's not because he was stupid, it's because Goku has the main character status which grants him friendship with Zeno.

The reality of the situation is that Zamasu, by his own admission, wiped out countless civilizations as well as the entire God hierarchy, and Zeno never intervened. He never even had a clue about what was happening, because when he sees Infinite Zamasu he doesn't know who he is. So not only did Zeno NEVER intervene, he also had NO CLUE AT ALL that Project Zero Mortals was taking place.

[Skar]

I mean, I mentioned that theory, but since you refuse to acknowledge theories there isn't much room for discussion here. So Yes, Zamasu couldn't have known Zeno would intervene, and so if he didn't have a backup plan it's not because he was stupid, it's because Goku has the main character status which grants him friendship with Zeno.

If you always argue Zamasu had such a deep and thought out plan, the story should acknowledge what he was going to do with the biggest obstacle to his plan. There's nothing wrong with fan theories but it has to at least be hinted at in the story to believe it's what was intended. My theory was that he was a young apprentice who became too far gone and wanted to fulfill his vision so badly that what to do about Zeno didn't cross his mind. The argument that he might've intended to use Goku's appearance to manipulate Zeno isn't likely since he could've mentioned losing that opportunity once he fused and no longer looked like Goku.

I agree that Zeno should've noticed when all the gods were killed but it doesn't mean we should jump to the conclusion that he would never notice for the rest of eternity. That would require Zamasu to believe Zeno will never hold a meeting with all the gods or ever get bored and decide to see what's going on in the universes. The fact that almost all the gods present during the tournament he watched knew who Zeno was should indicate that it wasn't the first time they met him. He either summoned them before or showed up in their universes at some point.