What is the likelihood of them introducing a Super Saiyan version of Ultra Instinct in the future?

[Grimlock]

You need to understand the concept and beauty of minimalism.

UI is the new “Base”.. That’s a cool and simple concept.

Adding just one ultimate transformation on top of that (simple Super Saiyan) will give it a whoopin 50x multiplier!

It’s simply the all capable “Ultra Instinct” + a 50x “Super” Power-up!

That’s still simple and overseeable. It’s not ridiculous or filled with many different powerups.

It’s just “1” ultimate super powerup over Base MUI! That’s cool, simple, and clean!

Remember that MUI was originally supposed to be just a Base Goku with mastery of self movement, being supremely powerful by itself without the need for any additional Super Saiyan transformations.

Alright, being minimalist: Ultra Instinct is supposed to be just a technique "of self movement" as you yourself put it but for some "unknown" reason makes Goku to get yet another recolor (transformation). Only Goku, no one else.

Being a technique implies it can be stacked with any transformation, but for the sake of preservation, it's better to do that only for transformations that have minimum drawbacks.

Then enters what you said. And all that can be applied to Super Saiyan 2 as well. It's "adding just one ultimate transformation on top of that" and "will give it a whoopin 100x multiplier!".

It’s simply the all capable “Ultra Instinct” + a 100x “Super” Power-up!

That’s still simple and overseeable. It’s not ridiculous or filled with many different powerups.

It’s just “1” ultimate super powerup over Base MUI! That’s cool, simple, and clean!


If Ultra Instinct can be used along with Super Saiyan without being called "stupid", I don't see why Super Saiyan 2 couldn't too. Shouldn't be the other way around? Shouldn't I say that stacking it with Super Saiyan is a stupid idea when you can combine techniques with a stronger form that will cause no issues at all?

[GodVegetto91]

You need to understand the concept and beauty of minimalism.

UI is the new “Base”.. That’s a cool and simple concept.

Adding just one ultimate transformation on top of that (simple Super Saiyan) will give it a whoopin 50x multiplier!

It’s simply the all capable “Ultra Instinct” + a 50x “Super” Power-up!

That’s still simple and overseeable. It’s not ridiculous or filled with many different powerups.

It’s just “1” ultimate super powerup over Base MUI! That’s cool, simple, and clean!

Remember that MUI was originally supposed to be just a Base Goku with mastery of self movement, being supremely powerful by itself without the need for any additional Super Saiyan transformations.

Alright, being minimalist: Ultra Instinct is supposed to be just a technique "of self movement" as you yourself put it but for some "unknown" reason makes Goku to get yet another recolor (transformation). Only Goku, no one else.

Being a technique implies it can be stacked with any transformation, but for the sake of preservation, it's better to do that only for transformations that have minimum drawbacks.

Then enters what you said. And all that can be applied to Super Saiyan 2 as well. It's "adding just one ultimate transformation on top of that" and "will give it a whoopin 100x multiplier!".

It’s simply the all capable “Ultra Instinct” + a 100x “Super” Power-up!

That’s still simple and overseeable. It’s not ridiculous or filled with many different powerups.

It’s just “1” ultimate super powerup over Base MUI! That’s cool, simple, and clean!


If Ultra Instinct can be used along with Super Saiyan without being called "stupid", I don't see why Super Saiyan 2 couldn't too. Shouldn't be the other way around? Shouldn't I say that stacking it with Super Saiyan is a stupid idea when you can combine techniques with a stronger form that will cause no issues at all?

You don’t seem to realize that we NEED transformations = (Changes in appearance/forms.) Because Toei is incapable of sticking to the original concepts that they created. We’ve seen this all too well with “Base Saiyan Beyond God.” It was originally supposed to be the Ultimate state, an all powerful Base form that LITERALLY had the power of “SSJ God” (A power beyond even a hypothetical SSJ3 Vegito...!)

Yet they blew it the moment the Universe 6 tournament Arc began..

By introducing SSJ 1 to 3 again (and even SSJ God back again) proved they couldn’t stick to their own concepts that they had originally created, so the Base form’s power had been MASSIVELY degraded back again. Needless to say.

With UI (the ability or “technique” for the body to move and act on its own) should likewise come with a visual CHANGE in appearance.

Simply to let us know: “Hey look guys! Goku is now definitely using the ability where his body moves and acts on its own! There is no doubt about it this time! No cause for confusion!”

Instead of guessing work if it was just regular Base Goku using the technique.

Now that UI comes with a “transformation” it will be 100% reliable!

As for your arguments against me.. They are invalid since you still don’t seem to understand me or the concept of minimalism!

SSJ2 is a SECOND (hence unnecessary) transformation above Base!

[GodVegetto91]

If you’re going to combine it with SSJ2, then you might aswell just combine it with SSJ3 too! Since you’re already too late. You’ve already gone too far inside the world of the unnecessary and ridiculous adding of transformations.

The same argument does NOT apply to regular Super Saiyan... (SSJ1!)

[theherodjl]

SSJ is antithetical to UI's control over emotions but since transformations sell merchandise, anything is possible under that logic. However, I'm really not sure if stacking SSJ on top of UI would actually power it up as much as it might sound on paper. Goku has already attempted to forcefully power himself up while using UIO and Merus commented that such a method simply doesn't make the most of UI. SSJG combined with SSJ evidently doesn't multiply SSJG's power by 50 so its not likely to suddenly change purely for UI.
I imagine that SSJ UI would work akin to SSJG3. Goku might gain even greater raw power than what MUI grants but at the cost of UI's maneuverability.

[GodVegetto91]

SSJ is antithetical to UI's control over emotions but since transformations sell merchandise, anything is possible under that logic. However, I'm really not sure if stacking SSJ on top of UI would actually power it up as much as it might sound on paper. Goku has already attempted to forcefully power himself up while using UIO and Merus commented that such a method simply doesn't make the most of UI. SSJG combined with SSJ evidently doesn't multiply SSJG's power by 50 so its not likely to suddenly change purely for UI.
I imagine that SSJ UI would work akin to SSJG3. Goku might gain even greater raw power than what MUI grants but at the cost of UI's maneuverability.

Or, you know.. Simply introduce much stronger enemies than Moro 73 currently is... That would allow Goku to become the absolute strongest and best possible version of himself I am all for maximum improvement for BOTH parties! Not just the good guy/hero side. If he were to get 50 times stronger than regular UI, then the next enemies should probably be Angels.. (Low tier Angels are also allowed ofcourse.)

As for our “expectations” I would advice anyone on this forum and outside this forum, that is reading this, to consider just how “subverting of the expectations” the writers really are... This doesn’t just apply to Toriyama and Toyotaro, but the entire Animation staff aswell (the episode writers and directors I mean ofcourse.)

How many times has the story leaded us in a certain direction with a certain specific outcome, and how many times have they done the exact opposite of that??? More times than I can count!

So while it would make sense to assume that “UI and SSJ probably don’t mix well together based on Merus’ explanation of the two forms”.... It means NOTHING with Super’s constant retconning of its previously established concepts!

We thought Goku wouldn’t use SS2 and SS3 anymore... (We were wrong.)

We thought Merged Zamasu was going to get endless powerups and overpower Vegito... (The actual events were very dissapointing shall I say.)

We would have expected SSB KK x10 Blue Goku Vs Hit to have logically surpassed Beerus-sama..

We thought after Battle of Gods that Goku was either going to end up mastering SSJ God or his regular Super Saiyan 1 form as Toriyama stated in an interview..

But instead we got SSJ Blue all of a sudden out of nowhere!

And many more examples that I could list here! But I think you’ve gotten the point

[Grimlock]

You don’t seem to realize that we NEED transformations = (Changes in appearance/forms.) Because Toei is incapable of sticking to the original concepts that they created. We’ve seen this all too well with “Base Saiyan Beyond God.” It was originally supposed to be the Ultimate state, an all powerful Base form that LITERALLY had the power of “SSJ God” (A power beyond even a hypothetical SSJ3 Vegito...!)

Speak for yourself, I don't need it. And certainly the franchise would benefit more without at least half of those random Saiyans transformations.

Why are you blaming Toei? Surely this is everyone's fault, including the "all-mighty" Toriyama.

With UI should likewise come with a visual CHANGE in appearance. Simply to let us know: “Hey look guys! Goku is now definitely using the ability where his body moves and acts on its own! There is no doubt about it this time! No cause for confusion!”

Eh, not really. They put a lot of emphasis on visual effects and on Goku's behavior with Ultra Instinct (not to mention the absurdly dramatic soundtracks). Take away the recolor and you would still and easily be able to tell he was using it.

As for your arguments against me.. They are invalid since you still don’t seem to understand me or the concept of minimalism!

Yet, you haven't provided any solid argument that combining Super Saiyan 2 would be a stupid idea. Actually, you haven't provided any argument at all so far.

SSJ2 is a SECOND (hence unnecessary) transformation above Base!

Yes, a second transformation which provides a stronger power without major issues. Using with it instead of Super Saiyan is a far more reasonable decision that even any dumbass could make.

[BWri]

Not to be one of those people, but once that happens, that's when I legitimately move on from the franchise.

I don't think I could distance myself from the franchise in terms of keeping up with it, but I've stopped taking it seriously years ago. It's more or less become a parody of its former self.

I hear you! I've lowered my standards considerably since the end of the FT arc, which is why I can still find so much enjoyment in DBS these days.

I even enjoy the senseless DBSH spinoff because it blatantly throws all logic out the window for fanservice and merchandising, but always throws something funky or new into the mix to make it exciting. It's the ultimate "turn your brain off" show.

I just can't do more hair color changes that raise numbers. It's already been done to death.

[GodVegetto91]

You don’t seem to realize that we NEED transformations = (Changes in appearance/forms.) Because Toei is incapable of sticking to the original concepts that they created. We’ve seen this all too well with “Base Saiyan Beyond God.” It was originally supposed to be the Ultimate state, an all powerful Base form that LITERALLY had the power of “SSJ God” (A power beyond even a hypothetical SSJ3 Vegito...!)

Speak for yourself, I don't need it. And certainly the franchise would benefit more without at least half of those random Saiyans transformations.

Why are you blaming Toei? Surely this is everyone's fault, including the "all-mighty" Toriyama.

With UI should likewise come with a visual CHANGE in appearance. Simply to let us know: “Hey look guys! Goku is now definitely using the ability where his body moves and acts on its own! There is no doubt about it this time! No cause for confusion!”

Eh, not really. They put a lot of emphasis on visual effects and on Goku's behavior with Ultra Instinct (not to mention the absurdly dramatic soundtracks). Take away the recolor and you would still and easily be able to tell he was using it.

As for your arguments against me.. They are invalid since you still don’t seem to understand me or the concept of minimalism!

Yet, you haven't provided any solid argument that combining Super Saiyan 2 would be a stupid idea. Actually, you haven't provided any argument at all so far.

SSJ2 is a SECOND (hence unnecessary) transformation above Base!

Yes, a second transformation which provides a stronger power without major issues. Using with it instead of Super Saiyan is a far more reasonable decision that even any dumbass could make.

I’ve explained several times why I believe what I believe. You’re completely unwilling to understand it. At this point you are just trolling, and as such, I am done with you. Have a nice day!

[JewyB]

I only want to see one form stack with UI and its SSJ God. They seem like they're perfect to go together, giving a sleeker more godlike appearance. And the hair combination will conveniently be pink and look like the most divine of all saiyan forms.

Impossible. SSJ God doesn’t really exist, as it’s just the result of a BASE Saiyan using God ki = Perfect Ki control, by having none of the aura/ki leaking out of the body. SSJ God really is just Base Goku! Just like Ultra Instinct already is! It is itself! It already IS what you proposed! A Base God form..

Likewise, SSJ Blue is just Super Saiyan really, and nothing else. It is Super Saiyan WITH perfect ki control..

So the only transformations that can be “combined” with UI, are SSJ1, SSJ2, and SSJ3.

The latter two would be a really stupid idea, so that luckily won’t happen in the future hopefully.

But combining Ultra Instinct with Super Saiyan would automatically be a Godly, and Divine Super Saiyan form, because UI has God ki, just like SSJ Blue is a divine Super Saiyan form!

Only mortal transformations (because they’re the BASES) can be used to combine with the God forms = Perfect ki control.

Mortal Base + SSJ1 = Super Saiyan.

Godly Base (SSJ God) + SSJ1 = SSJ Blue.

Angelic Base (Ultra Instinct) + SSJ1 = Super Ultra Instinct.

As for our “expectations” I would advice anyone on this forum and outside this forum, that is reading this, to consider just how “subverting of the expectations” the writers really are... This doesn’t just apply to Toriyama and Toyotaro, but the entire Animation staff aswell (the episode writers and directors I mean ofcourse.)

How many times has the story leaded us in a certain direction with a certain specific outcome, and how many times have they done the exact opposite of that??? More times than I can count!

So while it would make sense to assume that “UI and SSJ probably don’t mix well together based on Merus’ explanation of the two forms”.... It means NOTHING with Super’s constant retconning of its previously established concepts!

We thought Goku wouldn’t use SS2 and SS3 anymore... (We were wrong.)

We thought Merged Zamasu was going to get endless powerups and overpower Vegito... (The actual events were very dissapointing shall I say.)

We would have expected SSB KK x10 Blue Goku Vs Hit to have logically surpassed Beerus-sama..

We thought after Battle of Gods that Goku was either going to end up mastering SSJ God or his regular Super Saiyan 1 form as Toriyama stated in an interview..

But instead we got SSJ Blue all of a sudden out of nowhere!

And many more examples that I could list here! But I think you’ve gotten the point

You answered yourself before i could get here so...

[Grimlock]

I’ve explained several times why I believe what I believe. You’re completely unwilling to understand it. At this point you are just trolling, and as such, I am done with you. Have a nice day!

No, you just stated one time in the last post from the previous page something that can be applied to Super Saiyan 2 (as I showed in a response to that post) without managing to provide any argument against it or explaining why combining it with Super Saiyan 2 is a "stupid idea", when it's actually the other way around.

It seems people who are incapable of maintaining a conversation love throwing around the word "trolling". Not long ago someone was banned because of it. If you post something expecting not to be challenged and just want people to agree with your nonsensical ideas, you should probably leave any forum you participate, in virtue of that going against the very nature of basic conversation.

[Hugo Boss]

I think combining Super Saiyan and Super Saiyan God is already quite redundant, but there isn’t a problem in them functioning together. Super Saiyan in another hand has a trigger that is incompatible with Ultra Instinct, so I don’t think it’s likely that we see them combined.

[GodVegetto91]

I think combining Super Saiyan and Super Saiyan God is already quite redundant, but there isn’t a problem in them functioning together. Super Saiyan in another hand has a trigger that is incompatible with Ultra Instinct, so I don’t think it’s likely that we see them combined.

What part of my explanation do you not understand? SSJ God ISN’T an actual thing. It’s a combination of 2 separate basis things, hence if you’re going to combine things, you combine the ground building blocks that, you know, actually exist..

SSJ God is Base + Perfect Ki Control... That’s exactly what Ultra Instinct already is. It is also Base Goku with perfect ki control! Only this time, it has an additional feature ability/technique known as “mastery of self movement”.

Why would he combine itself (what it already is) with itself? That’s literally impossible.

Ultra Instinct already IS Super Saiyan God! (Just with the mastery of self movement added to it!)

Like I stated earlier, only SSJ1, SSJ2, and SSJ3 can be combined with Base God Forms (= Perfect Ki Control and Mastery of Self Movement respectively.)

[Hugo Boss]

I think combining Super Saiyan and Super Saiyan God is already quite redundant, but there isn’t a problem in them functioning together. Super Saiyan in another hand has a trigger that is incompatible with Ultra Instinct, so I don’t think it’s likely that we see them combined.

What part of my explanation do you not understand? SSJ God ISN’T an actual thing. It’s a combination of 2 separate basis things, hence if you’re going to combine things, you combine the ground building blocks that, you know, actually exist..

SSJ God is Base + Perfect Ki Control... That’s exactly what Ultra Instinct already is. It is also Base Goku with perfect ki control! Only this time, it has an additional feature ability/technique known as “mastery of self movement”.

Why would he combine itself (what it already is) with itself? That’s literally impossible.

Ultra Instinct already IS Super Saiyan God! (Just with the mastery of self movement added to it!)

Like I stated earlier, only SSJ1, SSJ2, and SSJ3 can be combined with Base God Forms (= Perfect Ki Control and Mastery of Self Movement respectively.)

I don’t know what you’re talking about. SSGod is a Super Saiyan form that has god ki, SSBlue is just a step forward in that path. Ultra Instinct has a different path, it focus on self control, not on ki. When Goku tried to add ki on Ultra Instinct, it backfired. I don’t see anywhere in your explanation you addressing this.

[GodVegetto91]

I think combining Super Saiyan and Super Saiyan God is already quite redundant, but there isn’t a problem in them functioning together. Super Saiyan in another hand has a trigger that is incompatible with Ultra Instinct, so I don’t think it’s likely that we see them combined.

What part of my explanation do you not understand? SSJ God ISN’T an actual thing. It’s a combination of 2 separate basis things, hence if you’re going to combine things, you combine the ground building blocks that, you know, actually exist..

SSJ God is Base + Perfect Ki Control... That’s exactly what Ultra Instinct already is. It is also Base Goku with perfect ki control! Only this time, it has an additional feature ability/technique known as “mastery of self movement”.

Why would he combine itself (what it already is) with itself? That’s literally impossible.

Ultra Instinct already IS Super Saiyan God! (Just with the mastery of self movement added to it!)

Like I stated earlier, only SSJ1, SSJ2, and SSJ3 can be combined with Base God Forms (= Perfect Ki Control and Mastery of Self Movement respectively.)

I don’t know what you’re talking about. SSGod is a Super Saiyan form that has god ki, SSBlue is just a step forward in that path. Ultra Instinct has a different path, it focus on self control, not on ki. When Goku tried to add ki on Ultra Instinct, it backfired. I don’t see anywhere in your explanation you addressing this.

SSJ God is not a “Super Saiyan” form. It is a “Saiyan” form. That somehow has “Super Saiyan” in its name. It’s a Saiyan’s Base form with God ki = perfect ki control, where you have none of it leak out. “Super Saiyan Blue” (SSGSS) IS a Super Saiyan form... With God ki ofcourse. (= Perfect ki control).

[Hugo Boss]

First, are you implying Super Saiyan is not a Saiyan form? I’m confused. For the sake of simplicity, I think you could call all of these forms up to Super Saiyan Blue (Evolution) as Saiyan forms. Ultra Instinct is a different matter though.

Second, if there was a “perfect” ki control version of Super Saiyan, we wouldn’t be seeing forms with ki larger than Super Saiyan God, right, since it would boast the absolute peak of power usage, not requiring further evolutions. Also, I’m not following this thought that god ki implies perfect ki control either. See, Vegeta had to refine his ki/spirit with Yardratian training. It would be useless if he already had reached perfection in this aspect.

Third, Super Saiyan God is the next step after Super Saiyan 3 in the evolutionary line, followed by Super Saiyan Blue (or Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan...). This has become clear in the manga by Goku demonstrating it twice, against Future Trunks and Toppo. Ultra Instinct is not lumped together with Saiyan forms. Goku doesn’t go Ultra Instinct after he becomes a Super Saiyan. Has anyone seen it?

[GodVegetto91]

First, are you implying Super Saiyan is not a Saiyan form? I’m confused. For the sake of simplicity, I think you could call all of these forms up to Super Saiyan Blue (Evolution) as Saiyan forms. Ultra Instinct is a different matter though.

Second, if there was a “perfect” ki control version of Super Saiyan, we wouldn’t be seeing forms with ki larger than Super Saiyan God, right, since it would boast the absolute peak of power usage, not requiring further evolutions. Also, I’m not following this thought that god ki implies perfect ki control either. See, Vegeta had to refine his ki/spirit with Yardratian training. It would be useless if he already had reached perfection in this aspect.

Third, Super Saiyan God is the next step after Super Saiyan 3 in the evolutionary line, followed by Super Saiyan Blue (or Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan...). This has become clear in the manga by Goku demonstrating it twice, against Future Trunks and Toppo. Ultra Instinct is not lumped together with Saiyan forms. Goku doesn’t go Ultra Instinct after he becomes a Super Saiyan. Has anyone seen it?

You seem to be a very confused person.. Even though I explained everything in great detail to you already, but here goes again.. “perfect ki control” is an act, you’re taking the ki that you already can access (your aura) and you hide it inside your body as deep as you can, after having done that, you power up, if you power up to your max in base, you’ll get SSJ God, if you power up by turning Super Saiyan, you’ll get SSJ Blue. It’s that simple. First you have to make sure that you have no ki leakage at all, by keeping your aura inside, after you’ve done that, you can “power up” (light the fire so to speak, by increasing your ki inside) depending on wether you stay in Base, or Super Saiyan will determine wether you become a SSJ God, or SSJ Blue. It’s an “act”. (Something that you do).

Spirit Control training is different. It’s a training of your mind/spirit to become more relaxed and calm, and thus become more “AWARE” of your inner energy that was previously unavailable or even unfindable to you! This naturally increases your overall power (kinda like a potential unlock of the likes of the elder Namek Guru, or Elder Kaioshin.) Because you’re actually able to bring it out! You thus, literally become more powerful overall (in all forms) because you’re able to awaken, unlock, access more of your hidden inner powers. You’re able to bring it out for use.

And thirdly, SSJ God is not the next transformation in line after SSJ3. It doesn’t even have anything to do with that form at all.

Any Saiyan could attain SSJ God who undergoes the ritual if they and all of the participants involved in it are good hearted Saiyans ofcourse. So SSJ3 is not requiered for that. It just so happens to be even stronger than SSJ3 because it’s a God form with God ki naturally. Alternatively, Saiyans could also achieve it if they train super hard and smart under the guidance of someone like Whis, who understands a great deal about the God forms.

I hope that helps

[JewyB]

You seem to be a very confused person.. Even though I explained everything in great detail to you already, but here goes again.. “perfect ki control” is an act, you’re taking the ki that you already can access (your aura) and you hide it inside your body as deep as you can, after having done that, you power up, if you power up to your max in base, you’ll get SSJ God, if you power up by turning Super Saiyan, you’ll get SSJ Blue. It’s that simple. First you have to make sure that you have no ki leakage at all, by keeping your aura inside, after you’ve done that, you can “power up” (light the fire so to speak, by increasing your ki inside) depending on wether you stay in Base, or Super Saiyan will determine wether you become a SSJ God, or SSJ Blue. It’s an “act”. (Something that you do).

Spirit Control training is different. It’s a training of your mind/spirit to become more relaxed and calm, and thus become more “AWARE” of your inner energy that was previously unavailable or even unfindable to you! This naturally increases your overall power (kinda like a potential unlock of the likes of the elder Namek Guru, or Elder Kaioshin.) Because you’re actually able to bring it out! You thus, literally become more powerful overall (in all forms) because you’re able to awaken, unlock, access more of your hidden inner powers. You’re able to bring it out for use.

And thirdly, SSJ God is not the next transformation in line after SSJ3. It doesn’t even have anything to do with that form at all.

Any Saiyan could attain SSJ God who undergoes the ritual if they and all of the participants involved in it are good hearted Saiyans ofcourse. So SSJ3 is not requiered for that. It just so happens to be even stronger than SSJ3 because it’s a God form with God ki naturally. Alternatively, Saiyans could also achieve it if they train super hard and smart under the guidance of someone like Whis, who understands a great deal about the God forms.

I hope that helps

Two thirds of this is headcanon and never stated in series, the only accurate part of it is your comments on SSJ God, which, if you have to train super hard to achieve it, and transform into it on several future occasions, it is a separate form than base form.

You seem highly defensive of your own ideas but instinctively dismiss other peoples ideas as inferior to yours and it just seems rude to be honest.

[Hugo Boss]

I’m not sure how switching between Super Saiyan God and Super Saiyan Blue implies something even remotely close to “perfect” ki control. I’m not seeing the correlation between SSGod and Base and SSBlue and SS1 you claim either. Seems like something you just made up.

You decently described how Yardratian training works, but I don’t see how it implies something different than a ki control training. If he manages to delve deeper in his ki reserves, isn’t he getting better at controlling all his ki, instead of just a superficial part of it? How is that not ki control?

I would appreciate some clarification on why you think SSGod has nothing to do with the other Saiyan forms and only with the Base, regular one. Despite Goku himself exhibiting that evolution line twice in the manga. Apart from having god ki, of course.

Also, if you can just avoid condescending and rude tone, that would be very helpful.

[GodVegetto91]

You seem to be a very confused person.. Even though I explained everything in great detail to you already, but here goes again.. “perfect ki control” is an act, you’re taking the ki that you already can access (your aura) and you hide it inside your body as deep as you can, after having done that, you power up, if you power up to your max in base, you’ll get SSJ God, if you power up by turning Super Saiyan, you’ll get SSJ Blue. It’s that simple. First you have to make sure that you have no ki leakage at all, by keeping your aura inside, after you’ve done that, you can “power up” (light the fire so to speak, by increasing your ki inside) depending on wether you stay in Base, or Super Saiyan will determine wether you become a SSJ God, or SSJ Blue. It’s an “act”. (Something that you do).

Spirit Control training is different. It’s a training of your mind/spirit to become more relaxed and calm, and thus become more “AWARE” of your inner energy that was previously unavailable or even unfindable to you! This naturally increases your overall power (kinda like a potential unlock of the likes of the elder Namek Guru, or Elder Kaioshin.) Because you’re actually able to bring it out! You thus, literally become more powerful overall (in all forms) because you’re able to awaken, unlock, access more of your hidden inner powers. You’re able to bring it out for use.

And thirdly, SSJ God is not the next transformation in line after SSJ3. It doesn’t even have anything to do with that form at all.

Any Saiyan could attain SSJ God who undergoes the ritual if they and all of the participants involved in it are good hearted Saiyans ofcourse. So SSJ3 is not requiered for that. It just so happens to be even stronger than SSJ3 because it’s a God form with God ki naturally. Alternatively, Saiyans could also achieve it if they train super hard and smart under the guidance of someone like Whis, who understands a great deal about the God forms.

I hope that helps

Two thirds of this is headcanon and never stated in series, the only accurate part of it is your comments on SSJ God, which, if you have to train super hard to achieve it, and transform into it on several future occasions, it is a separate form than base form.

You seem highly defensive of your own ideas but instinctively dismiss other peoples ideas as inferior to yours and it just seems rude to be honest.

What is headcanon about this scene?
https://youtu.be/Pv9986xgY5E

This is an actual scene from the Anime where Whis states that Goku and Vegeta need to control their ki, by keeping their aura’s hidden within their bodies and then powering up after that. After they did this, you could clearly see that the SSJ Blue’s energy was starting to emerge. There is no headcanon about this. It’s literally in the show itself!

Also, it’s a fact that Vegeta’s Spirit Control training revolved around “calming his spirit” through meditation in the manga.. THAT was clearly seen and stated by the elder Yardrat. What’s headcanon about that??

After his training was complete, he suddenly gained far more power.. Through what other mechanism was this able to occur other than a potential unlock?? The fact is, after Vegeta calmed his mind/spirit enough, he was able to awaken (bring out) more of his power, hence why he got more powerful.. Why was this?? How was he able to do this? It was because with this higher level of mental clarity, he had become “more AWARE” of his inner potential, and thus was able to bring it out. Again, I’m unable to see why this would be headcanon, since it’s literally citing all the facts involved. You seem to be obsessed with political correctness and being nice. But the truth is the truth. It’s literally all there.

[JewyB]

You seem to be a very confused person.. Even though I explained everything in great detail to you already, but here goes again.. “perfect ki control” is an act, you’re taking the ki that you already can access (your aura) and you hide it inside your body as deep as you can, after having done that, you power up, if you power up to your max in base, you’ll get SSJ God, if you power up by turning Super Saiyan, you’ll get SSJ Blue. It’s that simple. First you have to make sure that you have no ki leakage at all, by keeping your aura inside, after you’ve done that, you can “power up” (light the fire so to speak, by increasing your ki inside) depending on wether you stay in Base, or Super Saiyan will determine wether you become a SSJ God, or SSJ Blue. It’s an “act”. (Something that you do).

Spirit Control training is different. It’s a training of your mind/spirit to become more relaxed and calm, and thus become more “AWARE” of your inner energy that was previously unavailable or even unfindable to you! This naturally increases your overall power (kinda like a potential unlock of the likes of the elder Namek Guru, or Elder Kaioshin.) Because you’re actually able to bring it out! You thus, literally become more powerful overall (in all forms) because you’re able to awaken, unlock, access more of your hidden inner powers. You’re able to bring it out for use.

And thirdly, SSJ God is not the next transformation in line after SSJ3. It doesn’t even have anything to do with that form at all.

Any Saiyan could attain SSJ God who undergoes the ritual if they and all of the participants involved in it are good hearted Saiyans ofcourse. So SSJ3 is not requiered for that. It just so happens to be even stronger than SSJ3 because it’s a God form with God ki naturally. Alternatively, Saiyans could also achieve it if they train super hard and smart under the guidance of someone like Whis, who understands a great deal about the God forms.

I hope that helps

Two thirds of this is headcanon and never stated in series, the only accurate part of it is your comments on SSJ God, which, if you have to train super hard to achieve it, and transform into it on several future occasions, it is a separate form than base form.

You seem highly defensive of your own ideas but instinctively dismiss other peoples ideas as inferior to yours and it just seems rude to be honest.

What is headcanon about this scene?
https://youtu.be/Pv9986xgY5E

This is an actual scene from the Anime where Whis states that Goku and Vegeta need to control their ki, by keeping their aura’s hidden within their bodies and then powering up after that. After they did this, you could clearly see that the SSJ Blue’s energy was starting to emerge. There is no headcanon about this. It’s literally in the show itself!

Also, it’s a fact that Vegeta’s Spirit Control training revolved around “calming his spirit” through meditation in the manga.. THAT was clearly seen and stated by the elder Yardrat. What’s headcanon about that??

After his training was complete, he suddenly gained far more power.. Through what other mechanism was this able to occur other than a potential unlock?? The fact is, after Vegeta calmed his mind/spirit enough, he was able to awaken (bring out) more of his power, hence why he got more powerful.. Why was this?? How was he able to do this? It was because with this higher level of mental clarity, he had become “more AWARE” of his inner potential, and thus was able to bring it out. Again, I’m unable to see why this would be headcanon, since it’s literally citing all the facts involved. You seem to be obsessed with political correctness and being nice. But the truth is the truth. It’s literally all there.

Since you cherry picked before responding i'll do the same and reply to one specific part before moving on, the bolded part if it helps.

You seem to think i'm somebody else unless thinking UI + SSJG would look nice is anything other than subjective, but not only that somehow preaching political correctness. Unless it was me pointing out your attitude is anything but constructive, that isn't me worrying about political correctness, that is me pointing out that you're arguing in bad faith.

With that though, i'll be done here since you dont want others opinions and you seem to be unsure who you're even interacting with, so this topic seems kind of closed off to the potential to any form of discussion.

Buh-bye now.