Is Mystic Gohan a temporary boost?

BlueSky · Post by **Kaboom** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 5:58 pm

USSJed wrote: So the power unlocking ceremony thing, did it do things such as change the shape of the eyes and facial features also?

Not exactly. Those were just changes in Toriyama's method of drawing the character to reflect the power.

It's kind of a neat little recurring theme in how Toriyama draws his characters. The pure-hearted ones like Goku and his family usually have the "open," non-bordered style eyes. Characters like Vegeta, though, that are evil, or at least less "innocent" in their personalities, always have the more "closed," bordered, angular eyes. Going Super Saiyan switches from the "open" eyes to the "closed" ones, reflecting the more intense, serious attitude that comes with it. The same thing with Gohan's "mystic" powerup.

Another detail to note is that most, if not all of the women have closed, bordered, "evil" eyes. >_>

Saiyavenger2941 · Post by **Saiyavenger2941** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 8:55 pm

SSj Kaboom wrote:... :/

Really? Been a while since I watched that one, but... Okay.

Just watch it. While fighting the legs, he rolls over (breaking his glasses) and does a powerup that looks like it takes out half a city block. You can tell his change in personality as well. The clip is on Youtube, so see for yourself.

It happens at about 2:50.

BlueSky · Post by **Kaboom** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 9:12 pm

Eh, I worded it wrong. I meant it's been a while since I watched Fusion Reborn. I know fo' shiz' that Gohan's "mystic" in Movie 13. His fighting Hildegarn was one of the first DBZ clips I ever had on my old computer.

Saiyavenger2941 · Post by **Saiyavenger2941** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 10:33 pm

SSj Kaboom wrote:Eh, I worded it wrong. I meant it's been a while since I watched Fusion Reborn. I know fo' shiz' that Gohan's "mystic" in Movie 13. His fighting Hildegarn was one of the first DBZ clips I ever had on my old computer. :)

Ah, ok!

Yeah, he wasn't Mystic in that movie. You can tell by his demeanor towards Freezy-Pop. If he were Mystic in that one, he would've just took him down. But he did the pose and speech before he attacked him.

That, and theres also the fact that he was wearing his purple gi before he left with Videl, an outfit he seemingly "retired" after getting his father's gi.

Kid Trunks · Post by **Kid Trunks** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 8:48 pm

Vegeta Jr wrote:How is movie 13 anime canon? Didn't Toei mess up on the 'how Trunks got his sword'.

Movie 13 isn't really trying to explain the origin of Future Trunks' sword. No. Its just supposed to be like a cool little coincidence. Your just supposed to think "oh, its kinda like a telling of how Trunks gets his sword...but not really though".

finnishjuoppo · Post by **finnishjuoppo** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:25 am

Kid Trunks wrote:
Vegeta Jr wrote:How is movie 13 anime canon? Didn't Toei mess up on the 'how Trunks got his sword'.
Movie 13 isn't really trying to explain the origin of Future Trunks' sword. No. Its just supposed to be like a cool little coincidence. Your just supposed to think "oh, its kinda like a telling of how Trunks gets his sword...but not really though".

Now I'm one big asshole as usual, but in shin budokai future Trunks told that he got his sword from his master.

Saiyavenger2941 · Post by **Saiyavenger2941** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:27 am

finnishjuoppo wrote:
Kid Trunks wrote:
Vegeta Jr wrote:How is movie 13 anime canon? Didn't Toei mess up on the 'how Trunks got his sword'.
Movie 13 isn't really trying to explain the origin of Future Trunks' sword. No. Its just supposed to be like a cool little coincidence. Your just supposed to think "oh, its kinda like a telling of how Trunks gets his sword...but not really though".
Now I'm one big asshole as usual, but in shin budokai future Trunks told that he got his sword from his master.

Here's the thing, though. That's a game. Game-exclusive storylines aren't canon by any stretch of the imagination. That, and it's more than likely just a translation screw-up.

Kid Trunks · Post by **Kid Trunks** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:17 am

finnishjuoppo wrote:
Kid Trunks wrote:
Vegeta Jr wrote:How is movie 13 anime canon? Didn't Toei mess up on the 'how Trunks got his sword'.
Movie 13 isn't really trying to explain the origin of Future Trunks' sword. No. Its just supposed to be like a cool little coincidence. Your just supposed to think "oh, its kinda like a telling of how Trunks gets his sword...but not really though".
Now I'm one big asshole as usual, but in shin budokai future Trunks told that he got his sword from his master.

Even if that game was canon, it still wouldn't effect movie 13. They're two different Trunks, and how either of them obtained their swords has no bearing on each other.

Casual Matt · Post by **Casual Matt** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 1:46 pm

finnishjuoppo wrote:
Kid Trunks wrote:
Vegeta Jr wrote:How is movie 13 anime canon? Didn't Toei mess up on the 'how Trunks got his sword'.
Movie 13 isn't really trying to explain the origin of Future Trunks' sword. No. Its just supposed to be like a cool little coincidence. Your just supposed to think "oh, its kinda like a telling of how Trunks gets his sword...but not really though".
Now I'm one big asshole as usual, but in shin budokai future Trunks told that he got his sword from his master.

Problem: Trunks' master was Gohan.

In the anime, Gohan died before the first time we see Trunks with his sword. If Gohan gave it to him, you'd think he would have had it while Gohan was alive.

And it couldn't have been anybody else. Anyone strong enough to possibly be considered Trunks' master would already be dead.

Unless somehow his master was *gasp* Tapion? Okay, not likely, considering he probably would have helped Trunks fight the Jinzoningen when he did have his sword. Unless Tapion let Trunks kill him to prevent Hildegarn from being released. Which we know he would do. I'm getting way to deep into fanfiction territory for my own good, here.

Anyway, what was my point? Ah yes. Games are always even less canon than movies. At least when dealing with the anime and most games.

Conan the SSJ · Post by **Conan the SSJ** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:41 pm

Casual Matt wrote:Problem: Trunks' master was Gohan.

In the anime, Gohan died before the first time we see Trunks with his sword. If Gohan gave it to him, you'd think he would have had it while Gohan was alive.

Actually, in the anime, we had a flashback to one of Gohan and Trunks' battles with the Androids prior to him losing his arm (though the presence of his scar is unexplainable) and hence the "13 years later" start of the special. This was while Trunks was battling Perfect Cell, the flashback shows Trunks has his sword at this age. This confirms, at least with the anime universe where movie 13 is considered to be counted, Trunks received the sword before Gohan died.

Casual Matt · Post by **Casual Matt** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 4:35 pm

Conan the SSJ wrote:
Casual Matt wrote:Problem: Trunks' master was Gohan.

In the anime, Gohan died before the first time we see Trunks with his sword. If Gohan gave it to him, you'd think he would have had it while Gohan was alive.
Actually, in the anime, we had a flashback to one of Gohan and Trunks' battles with the Androids prior to him losing his arm (though the presence of his scar is unexplainable) and hence the "13 years later" start of the special. This was while Trunks was battling Perfect Cell, the flashback shows Trunks has his sword at this age. This confirms, at least with the anime universe where movie 13 is considered to be counted, Trunks received the sword before Gohan died.

Well, damn.

I was going on the special alone. Okay, carry on.

USSJed · Post by **USSJed** » Fri May 02, 2008 2:02 am

Another question about Mystic Gohan.

Did he LOSE the power to turn SSJ, or was it that argument that if he did transform the Earth would explode due to so much power?

Kid Trunks · Post by **Kid Trunks** » Thu May 15, 2008 5:42 pm

USSJed wrote:Another question about Mystic Gohan.

Did he LOSE the power to turn SSJ, or was it that argument that if he did transform the Earth would explode due to so much power?

I don't know for sure. He sort of did still have the ability to go Ssj. After the "power-up ritual thing", Elder Kai tells Gohan that to use his new power he just needs to go Ssj like usual. So the "open-eyed" Gohan tries going Ssj. His hair does't turn gold, but his eyes are now "closed", which is what used to happen to him when he went Ssj.

But then that should mean he can power down from Ssj, giving him the "opened eyes" again. Yet we see him still with the "closed eyes" 10 years later. (So in a weird way, Elder Kai kinda stole Gohans innocence, since the "opened eyes" are a trait of the innocence of Goku's family lol).

BlueSky · Post by **Kaboom** » Thu May 15, 2008 6:17 pm

Yeah, the "mystic" thing replaced his SSj power.

Cypher · Post by **Cypher** » Thu May 15, 2008 7:09 pm

So just to clarify....that clip that Saiyavenger linked above clearly shows Gohan 'transform' from 'normal' (pre-'Mystic') to 'Mystic' form, right? I know that the movies are generally considered to be outside the series timeline, but what are people's opinions on this; could Gohan 'power-down' to his non-'Mystic' form, (considering that it supplanted SSJ transformation, to all intents and purposes) but saw no point, or is it just something they added into the movie for coolness? I know he never reverts in the manga, as far as I know, but...?

Saiyavenger2941 · Post by **Saiyavenger2941** » Thu May 15, 2008 8:23 pm

Gohan didn't go Super again because he didn't need to. It'd just be a waste of energy, since his power was at its limits. It wouldn't be anything but just a taunt, and a costly one at that.

Anyways, about the powering down thing, The Elder Kai says something along the lines of "it's just like that Super Saiyan thing". This being noted, powering down could be done the same way as with the Super Saiyan transformation.

Kid Trunks · Post by **Kid Trunks** » Thu May 15, 2008 8:49 pm

Saiyavenger2941 wrote:Gohan didn't go Super again because he didn't need to. It'd just be a waste of energy, since his power was at its limits. It wouldn't be anything but just a taunt, and a costly one at that.

But he tried going Ssj. Its just that his hair didn't turn gold.

Saiyavenger2941 · Post by **Saiyavenger2941** » Thu May 15, 2008 8:52 pm

Kid Trunks wrote:
Saiyavenger2941 wrote:Gohan didn't go Super again because he didn't need to. It'd just be a waste of energy, since his power was at its limits. It wouldn't be anything but just a taunt, and a costly one at that.
But he tried going Ssj. Its just that his hair didn't turn gold.

I don't think he was really "trying" to go Super. He was just following instructions.

Kid Trunks · Post by **Kid Trunks** » Thu May 15, 2008 9:07 pm

Yeah. Instructions to go Ssj.

Saiyavenger2941 · Post by **Saiyavenger2941** » Thu May 15, 2008 9:39 pm

Kid Trunks wrote:Yeah. Instructions to go Ssj. :)

..............Touche. (Dammit!)

Either way, the original point still stands. Gohan probably could've turned blonde and all that, but it would've been a waste of time and energy. He'd just be taunting his opponent.