GT and misogyny

[SupremeKai25]

Frieza and Trunks are criticized (rightfully so) because they literally asspulled a new form.

Caulifla didn't do that. Super Saiyan was no longer relevant midway through Z and it's obviously not a new form.

In the same show, Cabba also asspull'd Super Saiyan in one episode during his first fight:



Did people have a problem with that? No, they didn't. I wonder why. It's probably not because Cabba is a man and submissive to Vegeta though. They liked him going Super Saiyan in 10 minutes (literally) for other reasons.

[Grimlock]

a manga chapter had Roshi trying to rape those girls in Moro's gang?

Did that happen? Thank Dende I don't follow the manga, just glance at it real quick, so fortunately I missed it. That's really sad to hear. We can only hope if Toei ever adapts it, they cut that shit out.

Well, that's (still) Dragon Ball for you. Not even delivering interesting and out-of-the-safe-zone sagas, just the same old nonsense, following the same old formula, doing the same old shit. If it weren't for the games, doubt I'd still be here.

[Matches Malone]

In the same show, Cabba also asspull'd Super Saiyan in one episode during his first fight. Did people have a problem with that? No, they didn't. They liked him going Super Saiyan in 10 minutes (literally) for other reasons.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I personally hated it. If you're going to build up this student-teacher relation between him and Vegeta, why not take the time to build up to him eventually reaching Ssj ?

[Koitsukai]

a manga chapter had Roshi trying to rape those girls in Moro's gang?

Did that happen? Thank Dende I don't follow the manga, just glance at it real quick, so fortunately I missed it. That's really sad to hear. We can only hope if Toei ever adapts it, they cut that shit out.

Well, that's (still) Dragon Ball for you. Not even delivering interesting and out-of-the-safe-zone sagas, just the same old nonsense, following the same old formula, doing the same old shit. If it weren't for the games, doubt I'd still be here.

Yes, after a scuffle, he laments the girls won't let him grab them, sorry, hit them (as he said) and one of the girls looks like she feels dirty inside and with a sick look on her face. Then he procedes to cover his eyes with a bandana so he can stop being a pervert. Then he takes it off when the girls fuse into one fat girl and he no longer finds her attractive.
It's also shocking because it was a "joke" written by a young man, one would "expect" this kind of humour from older people like Toriyama himself, and also DBS had little to 0 rape jokes until this one, so it sort of came out of nowhere.

[Planetnamek]

Some people do not deserve a chance, especially not if they have opinions that are flat out wrong(like COVID being a hoax, which is a dangerous myth to promote because it gets people killed, nobody like that deserves any kind of chance at all)

I've not seen Trunks got anywhere near the level of criticism that female fighters got in DBZ so i'm not buying it.

I don't see how disagreeing with the way some characters are written is the same as telling people not to worry about Covid. The whole purpose of the forums is to see the various view points fans have about things, so banning people because their opinions don't line up with the popular ones goes against the point of having a discussion. In regards to this particular topic, I agree that female characters haven't been handled the best in DB, but I wouldn't ban anyone who thinks otherwise.

Whether or not you buy it is irrelevant, fans have been complaining about Trunks and Freeza's power levels in Super for years.

I didn't say it was the same thing, but I can smell these alt-right trolls from light years away and this guy was definitely one of them. He had all the trademarks of one-complaining about "Hollywood" and "political propaganda" in Anime, saying that anyone that disagreed with him was "indoctrinated", saying that these opinions didn't exist years ago etc.

When you've seen as many of these trolls as I have, you get good at picking them out.

I'm not going to debate someone that makes baseless accusations about anime they don't like being "political propaganda"(which usually means "any anime with strong female and/or LGBTQ characters") as it's a complete and utter waste of my time and resources, these trolls just want to promote their ignorant viewpoints and don't actually want any kind of debate or discussion no matter what they claim.

The guy wasn't banned because his opinion didn't "line up" or whatever, he was banned for engaging in bad-faith trolling, big difference. There was no discussion to be had with anything that user was saying, they were just making baseless outlandish claims and taking any and all criticism of said claims as a personal attack.

You could easily get banned next if you aren't careful.

Complaining about power levels is one thing, arguing that female fighters are overpowered without much evidence to back that up it quite another.

[Matches Malone]

You could easily get banned next if you aren't careful.

Last time I checked you weren't a moderator here, so I doubt I have anything to worry about. For someone who's all about discussions and opinions, you seem very interested in seeing anyone who disagrees with you removed from the site.

Complaining about power levels is one thing, arguing that female fighters are overpowered without much evidence to back that up it quite another.

Female fighters ? everyone in Super is overpowered, be it male or female.

[Planetnamek]

You could easily get banned next if you aren't careful.

Last time I checked you weren't a moderator here, so I doubt I have anything to worry about. For someone who's all about discussions and opinions, you seem very interested in seeing anyone who disagrees with you removed from the site.

Complaining about power levels is one thing, arguing that female fighters are overpowered without much evidence to back that up it quite another.

Female fighters ? everyone in Super is overpowered, be it male or female.

Uh i never claimed I was one, but in the past i've seen you say some of the exact same things the guy who got banned said, so don't think you're immune to also getting banned.

Disagreement is one thing, bad-faith trolling is quite another and yes I would prefer it if every single person that engaged in that was banned from this site.

If everyone is overpowered in Super why are you hyperfocusing on the female characters then?

[Matches Malone]

I've seen you say some of the exact same things the guy who got banned said, so don't think you're immune to also getting banned.

If everyone is overpowered in Super why are you hyperfocusing on the female characters then?

As long as it doesn't go against the site's rules, I'll say what I want when I want. You need to stop obsessing over getting people banned for disagreeing with you.

Because that's what most of the topic is about, but they're by no means the only ones overpowered in Super. Gohan, Freeza, Trunks, #17, Krillin, Roshi, Cabba, the wolf trio, etc... are all overpowered.

[JulieYBM]

Who cares about power? Power is just the flavor of the text, it's has nothing to do whether or not the character arcs were good. The arcs were good, they could also be better and I want to see them better. Let's more clearly define Kale and Caulifla's relationship, let's take a look at what their long-term goals are, let's see them get stronger and closer together.

There's such potential there just waiting to be touched upon and I can't wait to see them in more material. I want to see them grow as they rage against Gokuu and the others! I want to see their tenaciousness challenged on two front--on the battlefield in off--and then grow from overcoming those challenges. I want to see them fuck!

[Matches Malone]

Who cares about power? Power is just the flavor of the text, it's has nothing to do whether or not the character arcs were good. The arcs were good, they could also be better and I want to see them better. Let's more clearly define Kale and Caulifla's relationship, let's take a look at what their long-term goals are, let's see them get stronger and closer together.

This is the problem with making characters too strong out of the gate, it limits what can be done with them in the future. Instead of giving them and Cabba Ssj in their introduction, why not wait a bit and let the 3 of them earn it ? It would've been far more rewarding to see them unlock it after properly training and going through some adventures with Goku and Vegeta instead of just handing it to them. This is an issue I have with Goten and Kid Trunks as well, they never got that journey we saw the 4 Saiyans before them went through to unlock it.

[JulieYBM]

But they...aren't too strong outside of the gate. Combined they couldn't defeat the main character! They have a foot in the door but they still have room to grow.

[UltraInstinctRorikon]

Honestly we could use less 'pretty' or 'sexy' female characters. U6 girls a lot of their popularity is from them being sexually appealing, and I mean sex sells and all that and they have that fan service tied in which adds to it more but I'd like to see less beautiful types and I don't mean a transformation like Ribrianne. Even unconventional beauty would be nice.

[KBABZ]

This is the problem with making characters too strong out of the gate, it limits what can be done with them in the future. Instead of giving them and Cabba Ssj in their introduction, why not wait a bit and let the 3 of them earn it ? It would've been far more rewarding to see them unlock it after properly training and going through some adventures with Goku and Vegeta instead of just handing it to them. This is an issue I have with Goten and Kid Trunks as well, they never got that journey we saw the 4 Saiyans before them went through to unlock it.

Yeah 'cause it's not like Goku, Vegeta and the villains get stronger throughout the story...

[Planetnamek]

I've seen you say some of the exact same things the guy who got banned said, so don't think you're immune to also getting banned.

If everyone is overpowered in Super why are you hyperfocusing on the female characters then?

As long as it doesn't go against the site's rules, I'll say what I want when I want. You need to stop obsessing over getting people banned for disagreeing with you.

Because that's what most of the topic is about, but they're by no means the only ones overpowered in Super. Gohan, Freeza, Trunks, #17, Krillin, Roshi, Cabba, the wolf trio, etc... are all overpowered.

The only person obsessing over anything here is you with your weird fixation on the totally non-existent cancel culture, not all opinions are worth debating. Also for the last time, the person was banned for engaging in bad-faith trolling, not for disagreeing with me, learn the difference and don't act like you know better than the mods.

You've broken the rules numerous times in the past but you've been lucky so far, somehow I don't see that luck continuing.

If they're all overpowered then why single out the female characters for bad writing then?

[Matches Malone]

But they...aren't too strong outside of the gate. Combined they couldn't defeat the main character!

They forced him to use UI, how is that not strong ? It would've been much more rewarding to see that happen over time. Introduce them in the tournament as 2 warriors with massive potential. Follow that up in a future arc where Goku takes in both of them and trains them to master that potential. Follow that up with another arc where they fight side by side with him as equals. Once all that is done, once the audience has truly connected with them, then you can have the grand fight with Goku where they put everything they've learned to the test. Imagine how much more impactful it would've been to see these students and teacher fight after everything they've been though ? Apply this to Cabba and Vegeta as well. Modern DB isn't going anywhere, so why not take the time to develop everything properly.

[Matches Malone]

You've broken the rules numerous times in the past...

Care to provide some examples of this ?

[UltraInstinctRorikon]

Let the mods moderate, no need for us to backseat moderate.

[VegettoEX]

Knock it off.

You are indeed barely still here.

[Majin Buu]

Yes about Pan, but Videl is not a fighter on the level of the main characters or even the B-listers. The story didn't go out of its way to keep her out of the fight.

Krillin and Piccolo are more or less just as helpless against Buu as Videl would have been. They at least could have let her be on the front lines. Hell, Mr.Satan is allowed to be on the front lines despite being completely outclassed by everyone else while Videl, who's stated to be stronger than him (and can manipulate Ki enough to achieve flight), is conveniently kept away from the fighting after a certain point.

Plus, the anime briefly let Videl go up against Broly in Movie 10 and she wasn't instantly killed (yes, Broly wasn't at full power, doesn't matter, going by this argument Broly should have insta-killed her with one blow).

[Planetnamek]

Yes about Pan, but Videl is not a fighter on the level of the main characters or even the B-listers. The story didn't go out of its way to keep her out of the fight.

Krillin and Piccolo are more or less just as helpless against Buu as Videl would have been. They at least could have let her be on the front lines. Hell, Mr.Satan is allowed to be on the front lines despite being completely outclassed by everyone else while Videl, who's stated to be stronger than him (and can manipulate Ki enough to achieve flight), is conveniently kept away from the fighting after a certain point.

Plus, the anime briefly let Videl go up against Broly in Movie 10 and she wasn't instantly killed (yes, Broly wasn't at full power, doesn't matter, going by this argument Broly should have insta-killed her with one blow).

Good points, it always did bother me that she was kept away from the front lines.