Dragon Ball 4K Remaster (16mm)

[Trachta10]

the blue is a little different in this cel

Spoiler:

[Lightningexpose]

the blue is a little different in this cel

Spoiler:

they were clearly going for a more kai look which does have more cyan-y blues, and isn't as bright as these promo shots (which are tampered with anyway when digitized).

[linkdude20002001]

Have you never seen those 4K-6K promo shot slides?

Spoiler:

Imagine seeing those and still unironically saying "bro its not a ghibli movie, no extra detail ever existed"

Whoa. That's beautiful! I wonder, tho... Is it really 16mm? I would think that it's possibly from high quality 32mm film for promotional purposes.

[derpytacos]

Whoa. That's beautiful! I wonder, tho... Is it really 16mm? I would think that it's possibly from high quality 32mm film for promotional purposes.

He has posted proof of it being 16mm on his twitter hasn't he? Plus its 35mm that comes after 16mm not 32mm.

[jjgp1112]

Have you never seen those 4K-6K promo shot slides?

Spoiler:

Imagine seeing those and still unironically saying "bro its not a ghibli movie, no extra detail ever existed"

Whoa. That's beautiful! I wonder, tho... Is it really 16mm? I would think that it's possibly from high quality 32mm film for promotional purposes.

It's not film at all, it's a Cel scan.

[Lightningexpose]

Have you never seen those 4K-6K promo shot slides?

Spoiler:

Imagine seeing those and still unironically saying "bro its not a ghibli movie, no extra detail ever existed"

Whoa. That's beautiful! I wonder, tho... Is it really 16mm? I would think that it's possibly from high quality 32mm film for promotional purposes.

It's not film at all, it's a Cel scan.

Nah these actually were shot to film. Kodak EPY film to be precise which is more for individual slides/photography and can come in 60mm+ but also 35mm--not sure what was used.

@linkdude20002001 so no these aren't 16mm. I'm just pointing out the fact that there is detail that hasn't been captured, making waffe's point "it's not a ghibli movie, there is no more detail to see" ridiculous

[linkdude20002001]

He has posted proof of it being 16mm on his twitter hasn't he? Plus its 35mm that comes after 16mm not 32mm.

Oh... Haha, yeah, I thot 32 seemed off, but nothing else seemed right at the time. And, I dunno, since I haven't been to his Twitter.

It's not film at all, it's a Cel scan.

It looks like it has film grain, tho. To me anyway. It just looks like some really nice quality 35mm film, that has very fine grain. Which is what I assume is what Toei would use for getting promotional shots...or something? I don't really know. The more I think about it, the less it makes sense to me. It's all just guesses on what Toei might have done. But regardless, it looks like film to me.

Nah these actually were shot to film. Kodak EPY film to be precise which is more for individual slides/photography and can come in 60mm+ but also 35mm--not sure what was used.

@linkdude20002001 so no these aren't 16mm. I'm just pointing out the fact that there is detail that hasn't been captured, making waffe's point "it's not a ghibli movie, there is no more detail to see" ridiculous

Ah, okay. That makes sense. That's what I was thinking. Tho, I still don't know about the ins and outs of this stuff. I'd love to know more about Toei's process in all this, and why it's done. I bet there are some documentaries out there...in Japanese.

[Trachta10]

Whoa. That's beautiful! I wonder, tho... Is it really 16mm? I would think that it's possibly from high quality 32mm film for promotional purposes.

It's not film at all, it's a Cel scan.

Nah these actually were shot to film. Kodak EPY film to be precise which is more for individual slides/photography and can come in 60mm+ but also 35mm--not sure what was used.

@linkdude20002001 so no these aren't 16mm. I'm just pointing out the fact that there is detail that hasn't been captured, making waffe's point "it's not a ghibli movie, there is no more detail to see" ridiculous

How do you know is not a cel scan??

[Ajay]

It's not film at all, it's a Cel scan.

Nah these actually were shot to film. Kodak EPY film to be precise which is more for individual slides/photography and can come in 60mm+ but also 35mm--not sure what was used.

@linkdude20002001 so no these aren't 16mm. I'm just pointing out the fact that there is detail that hasn't been captured, making waffe's point "it's not a ghibli movie, there is no more detail to see" ridiculous

How do you know is not a cel scan??

Cels don't have film grain.

[Lightningexpose]

It's not film at all, it's a Cel scan.

Nah these actually were shot to film. Kodak EPY film to be precise which is more for individual slides/photography and can come in 60mm+ but also 35mm--not sure what was used.

@linkdude20002001 so no these aren't 16mm. I'm just pointing out the fact that there is detail that hasn't been captured, making waffe's point "it's not a ghibli movie, there is no more detail to see" ridiculous

How do you know is not a cel scan??

Because I've seen these promo slides with the overscan of the film edges. That's how I know the film stock used. And as Ajay said, there's film grain. Scanner noise is a lot uglier

[Akirale Torimaki]

This is what Dragon Ball would look like with a 4K remaster, for those who think 16mm isn't worth 4K.



DBox:

Glad to see Toei are doing it right finally.

I think I’ve seen this before and I’m not 100% sure that’s from Toei...

[sangofe]

This is what Dragon Ball would look like with a 4K remaster, for those who think 16mm isn't worth 4K.



DBox:

Glad to see Toei are doing it right finally.

I think I’ve seen this before and I’m not 100% sure that’s from Toei...

I'm 100% sure it's not.

[Spadexxione]

Oh man I would love a release in this quality

[Vorige Waffe]

Eh your arguments are all over the place. I forgot to mention it previously, but you said something like "what's worse is this isn't even the negatives, that'd be sharper" as if you were contradicting our argument just to put a downer on people's excitement for this transfer...but all what you say there does is consolidate that 16mm would look good in 4K.

As for Justin Sevakis, eh I also think you're wrong there. Sevakis has called out other industry people, I remember him publicly criticising AnimEigo's desire to DNR one of their upcoming Blu-rays. For 30A, he wasn't even criticising Funimation one bit to be "pulling punches"--he was simply spouting wrong facts... One thing about Sevakis is, he's the kinda guy that likes to contradict internet fanboys (i do too ) a lot. He saw fanboys hating on funimation so his immediate thought was likely "these fanboys don't know as much as they think they do" and proceeded to attempt contradicting the fanboy consensus with wrong facts like "these film elements wouldn't look good on any blu-ray". We knew that was 100% wrong already since level sets were good, but now the femboyfilm transfers prove him even more wrong. He, but more so other Discotek guys, have even said Qtec do good stuff, which is again just another attempt to contradict the fanboy consensus that Qtec are shit, under the pretence that they "work in the industry" and so know more than the fanboys.

Also, you're wrong about the whole "bro this aint muh high budget high-detail ghibli movie, its muh low budget low-detail tv anime"...there is PLENTY of detail on the cels and background art that the film can't even begin to capture fully. You understand that what the film captured were physical objects in the real world, right? There's an infinite amount of detail...from the fine textures on BGs caused by paint brushes to the roughness of the xerox lines, to the roughness of shading edges...

Have you never seen those 4K-6K promo shot slides?

Spoiler:

Imagine seeing those and still unironically saying "bro its not a ghibli movie, no extra detail ever existed"

Pen strokes and sheen from the cels isn't detail, just like seeing seems on the bald cap of an actor in a live action movie isn't "detail". It's like getting excited at seeing how a magician *really* pulls off their tricks at the expense of letting the illusion speak for itself. And in regards to Sevakis, read my post again about professionals critiquing other competitor's work.

The reason I'm putting a downer on this is for people to be realistic about what they can expect. And also not to froth at the mouth so publicly that this entire project and preservation attempt is shunted. This community and many others has real problem with things like that.

[derpytacos]

The reason I'm putting a downer on this is for people to be realistic about what they can expect.

No, its not. Stop the lies and just admit your pewcious widdle ego can't handle being proven wrong. You came in here spouting blatantly untrue things because you didnt want to take the time to educate yourself. Now that you've been outed you are in damage control mode. pathetic.

[Vorige Waffe]

The reason I'm putting a downer on this is for people to be realistic about what they can expect.

No, its not. Stop the lies and just admit your pewcious widdle ego can't handle being proven wrong. You came in here spouting blatantly untrue things because you didnt want to take the time to educate yourself. Now that you've been outed you are in damage control mode. pathetic.

Please educate yourself on being less of a jerk. Here's a start: name-calling is not some sort of "gotcha" moment, or argument.

[Lightningexpose]

The reason I'm putting a downer on this is for people to be realistic about what they can expect. And also not to froth at the mouth so publicly that this entire project and preservation attempt is shunted. This community and many others has real problem with things like that.

I mean...when it comes to quality, everybody here is seeing the same thing you are? You're not a part of the group doing it to have any extra visual access to anything more than everybody here. So, what expectations? Everybody's seen the quality here and they love it--there are no expectations of the quality here.

And I'm not sure what authority you'd have to be putting a downer on people's judgment of the quality here, given every single thing you had ascertained about funi's home release quality of episode 1 was incorrect ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Pen strokes and sheen from the cels isn't detail, just like seeing seems on the bald cap of an actor in a live action movie isn't "detail". It's like getting excited at seeing how a magician *really* pulls off their tricks at the expense of letting the illusion speak for itself.

And what on earth are you on about? You're comparing line detail to magic tricks? Bro, there's a reason why DBS Broly and a bunch of modern digital anime try to emulate those rough cel lines...because it's a key artistic feature of the cel animation medium...so of course that is detail and viewers should be seeing more of it as resolution goes up.

Your analogy to "seems on the bald cap" is also dumb because no, seeing more texture of animation cels and background paintings is analogous to seeing more skin/hair texture and environment texture on things like buildings and trees in live action. ...Bruh.