Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Thread: "Super Hero"

[Mister_Popo]

Late to the party, some random thoughts about this trailer:

- The most interesting thing is that Gohan and Piccolo get center stage. I hope, for once, that the primary protagonists are Gohan, Piccolo and Pan in this film. Until the end, so without a final battle with Goku and Vegeta.
It's not because Gokus rise to more power is the overarching plot, that he should ALWAYS be the big protagonist in every arc, of every movie. That wasn't always the case in the original manga / anime / movies either.
The androids and the Red Riddon Army are a very realistic threat and opponent at EARTH level. While the Androids will certainly be Godtier, the thought of challenging Goku and Vegeta to their MUI and UE forms seems too far off the mark. So I hope this doesn't happen.

Maybe just show us a quick tease of MUI in a fight against Broly, that should be just fine for once. It wouldn't really make much sense to do another movie without actually showing it on the big screen?

- Curious that they are going to do exactly with Gohan. On the one hand, he shouldn't get an upgrade from me because it would be somewhat predictable and because it happens too often with the other protagonists. Then again, he can't stay forever behind in his original Ultimate form against UI and UE Vegera? It would only make sense that he finally gets an enhancement. If MUI can be improved, why would that certainly not be possible with Gohans Ultimate state?

- Intresting to see how Piccolo, Gohan and Pan will actually team up, and how big of a role Pan will get near the ending of the movie. I expect she does get an important role at the end. She won't be strong enough to actually beat the Gammas all by herself, but she might become strong enough to be relevant in the endgame. I prefer her to have it than Goku or Vegeta showing up to smoke the Androids.

- I want to see more about where Piccolo actually lives, his house, how he actually lives there ... That's what i actually call intriguing slice of life. We have never seen much about this more personal side of him.

- Gamma 1 and 2: being a bit goofy as 'main antagonists'. Maybe it's ok that for a change the opponents should not necessarily be taken too seriously. They have pretty cool beam weaponry though (producing beams that can split), something different than the usual Ki-attacks. But Toriyama, please don't add them to the army with good guys. And please don't let them merge into a new 'Cell-like-character'. Been there, done that.
I also hope that the Red Ribbon Army will stick to 1 return and that they will be 'rolled up' at the end.

- In terms of art and animation: for CGI it seems as 2D-cartoonish as possible, and the movements seem sufficiently dynamic and smooth at first sight. I would like to see a trailer with some more action shots, to see what dynamic camera angles are possible with the CGI. However, I hope, along with most, that this isn't the end of 2D animated Dragon Ball, and that they will at least pursue a more hybrid style after this movie. You can still put more 'soul' in your characters via 2D. However, I'm a little worried that they haven't rolled out this new technology for a one-shot experimental stunt.

[Grimlock]

Yeah, I think Toei also underestimate how big of a draw it is to see the lesser seen heroes in action with updated designs. All three previous Toriyama movies heavily promoted the antagonists, but plenty of people do care about Gohan, Piccolo, Pan, etc. Yet over the last decade, Toei have had no faith in putting these guys anywhere near front and centre of a major movie's marketing until now.

If Toei had put those characters front and centre, they would have had mislead their audience. In theory, you only give emphasis on a character (or some characters) if you intend for them to play a significant role. Or at least, that's how marketing should work anyway.

Gohan and Piccolo did nothing in Movie 14 and Movie 15, so Toei was right in not putting them front and centre. It is expected that they finally do something meaningful in this new movie, but if it turns out Goku is the one to do most of the things, this marketing will be a huge misleading and people will get mad (rightfully so, this time).

[Jinto]

What seemed strange to me was Gohan having a bang in his base form, maybe...MAYBE the one wearing Piccolo's outfit in the trailer is Goten ? Maybe...

[HeroR]

Completely different altogether. You're comparing movies from entirely different series against each other. You can't compare Frozen, a kid's movie, an original movie to Spider-Man which has a massive inbuilt audience who are going to be anticipating the trailers release ahead of time.

I'm not comparing Dragon Ball to Top Gun, Doctor Strange or Scream. I'm comparing it to itself. No Way Home made trailer view records, far surpassing Homecoming and Far From Home because it was far more hyped and so made far more money. Likewise Rise of Skywalker got far less views than Force Awakens because it was not as hyped and so made far less.

The same is happening with this movie. There is absolutely no denying that this movie has significantly less interest than Broly. It is not even close.

It's not at all surprising, Broly is hugely popular, his return and reimagining into the canon made for a lot of speculation and excitement leading up to it.

This movie has nothing like that. So far there has not been one unique worthwhile selling point for this movie. The closest thing would be the "CGI" animation which is working against the movie if anything.

"Spider-Man which has a massive inbuilt audience who are going to be anticipating the trailers release ahead of time."

Then how did Spider-Man sell less than Aquaman and Black Panther? They're all the same type of super hero movies except Spider-Man is a bigger name than Aquaman and Black Panther combined. It's funny you used Frozen and ignore the other examples I gave.

"No Way Home made trailer view records, far surpassing Homecoming and Far From Home because it was far more hyped and so made far more money. "

And it still lost to Black Panther, another MCU movie, which didn't get nearly as much hype. It tied with Captain Marvel, you know the movie that people wanted to boycott.

That and while Homecoming did well it wasn't a massive jumped from The Amazing Spider-Man 2.

Homecoming: $880.2 million
The Amazing Spider-Man 2: $709 million

Keep in mind, Homecoming came out after the massive buzzed of Spider-Man being in Civil War and being officially part of the MCU, while The Amazing Spider-Man 2 had more anti-hype than hype. So while we can praise Far From Home doing much better, it was still outperform by MCU movies with far less hype and big names, and even a DCE movie. What's even funnier, Captain Marvel came out the same year as Far From Home, so it's the most 1:1 comparison.

"the closest thing would be the "CGI" animation which is working against the movie if anything."

Only for fans on forums like these that who bitch about Broly coming back. Most reaction from casuals have been positive, including that jumping CGI Goku with that crappy frame rate and they were more than happy to see Gohan again. Who is again, the third most popular Dragon Ball character in the franchise.

The point is, using Youtube hype and Google is nonsense since Far From Home, despite all its hype and being the last movie to come off of Endgame did worse than other movies in the MCU that had less hype and even had some negative backlash. You also can't really compare Broly to Super Hero because Broly came out at the peak of Dragon Ball Super while Super Hero is the first major Dragon Ball project in over three years. Even if it was Return of Cooler or Broly vs Janemba, the movie would probably still do worse than Broly because of that.

[PurestEvil]

With all this talk about box office sales and "success", it should be mentioned that the pandemic must be taken into account. If things go septic in 2022 again--especially with this Omicron variant going around--then Super Hero will likely not see the same initial cash flow like the other films due to fewer people going outside (if the theaters are even open or the film doesn't get delayed).
Of course, we can't predict the future, but I do think it is something to be concerned about.

[Gt91]

Trunks, and almost Goten, confirmed

https://twitter.com/DbsHype/status/1474 ... 15/photo/1

[PurestEvil]

please look like teenagers please look like teenagers please look like teenagers please look like teenagers please look like teenagers please look like teenagers please look like teenagers

[SupremeKai25]

Nice, finally the Goten and Trunks fanboys can find peace in their hearts, I am happy for them.

[Jiren The Alpha]

please look like teenagers please look like teenagers please look like teenagers please look like teenagers please look like teenagers please look like teenagers please look like teenagers

They haven't gotten they growth spurt yet

[Chuquita]

Actual, grown-up Trunks and Goten would be a draw for me. They finally let them physically age to EoZ size and I'll be impressed.

[omaro34]

watch them still be kids lmao, will be the biggest troll of the decade

[SupremeKai25]

If they appeared only for a brief cameo or one scene, I doubt they'd create new designs for them. Most likely they'll remain toddlers if they only have one cameo.

[Lord Beerus]

I couldn't give a single fuck at this stage if Goten and Trunks aged up. They are so devoid of any interesting characterisation, especially at this point in the story, that the only way I could possibly care for their appearance now is if they were central characters of the movie. Only for the purpose of that, they could have more screentime to expand on their personality beyond being two halves of a gimmick in Dragon Ball that has been so overdone (Fusion).

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

TOEI keeps Goten and Trunks kid-sized because the primary target audience they gear Dragon Ball towards is kids and there needs to be at least one character that main demographic can relate to. This is likely a huge part of the reason Goku was turned back into a kid in GT. I'd hope that this time we will see elder designs for Goten and Trunks because this movie already has a kid character with Pan. I do fear TOEI would still shy away from having Pan be that character as they might prefer to have a male kid character or two, however redundant that idea must be in today's world.

[Gt91]

TOEI keeps Goten and Trunks kid-sized because the primary target audience they gear Dragon Ball towards is kids and there needs to be at least one character that main demographic can relate to. This is likely a huge part of the reason Goku was turned back into a kid in GT. I'd hope that this time we will see elder designs for Goten and Trunks because this movie already has a kid character with Pan. I do fear TOEI would still shy away from having Pan be that character as they might prefer to have a male kid character or two, however redundant that idea must be in today's world.

Right, and don't forget Bra. She could be in this movie as well. Maybe she'll be a fighter too, we'll see.
For now, i'm happy to see Trunks and Goten.

[Xeno Goku Black]

In any case I have a feeling after this disaster of a movie bombs Toei will hit the break in case of emergency glass and bring Cooler or Janemba back to save their reputation

Wouldn't surprise me, the strategy worked for the last few movies. Bringing back Dragon Ball in general, bringing back Frieza and bringing back Broly sold those movies.

They aren't doing that this time. You can't get excited about characters you don't even know.

Then how did Spider-Man sell less than Aquaman and Black Panther?

Because those movies were break out hits which happens. Even if they're still just superhero movies you still have X-Men movies that flop and Guardians of the Galaxy movies that are successful.

Of which speaking about X-Men, again Dark Phoenix had no selling point. There was a sheer lack of interest in it compared to previous movies and it failed.

Only for fans on forums like these that who bitch about Broly coming back. Most reaction from casuals have been positive, including that jumping CGI Goku with that crappy frame rate and they were more than happy to see Gohan again. Who is again, the third most popular Dragon Ball character in the franchise.

No I've seen the comments in the YouTube videos. There are far more negative comments about the animation than positive as I said I've seen plenty criticizing it for looking like a video game and of course people will be happy to see Gohan but he's no selling point.

The point is, using Youtube hype and Google is nonsense since Far From Home, despite all its hype and being the last movie to come off of Endgame did worse than other movies in the MCU that had less hype and even had some negative backlash.

It made $1.13 billion. More than any MCU movie except for the ones that starred Iron Man and Black Panther which again was a breakout success.

We are now currently having a Spider-Man movie that did make trailer view records and did have YouTube hype which is going to make Avengers type money.

Broly itself got a lot of interest for an anime movie, surprise surprise it ended up being one of the most successful anime movies outside of Japan.

Obviously Super Hero doesn't have Broly's hype, doesn't help that there's no series now but this doesn't even have Resurrection F's interest. That's because this is just more Dragon Ball and that's all it can sell itself on.

[The Monkey King]

TOEI keeps Goten and Trunks kid-sized because the primary target audience they gear Dragon Ball towards is kids and there needs to be at least one character that main demographic can relate to. This is likely a huge part of the reason Goku was turned back into a kid in GT. I'd hope that this time we will see elder designs for Goten and Trunks because this movie already has a kid character with Pan. I do fear TOEI would still shy away from having Pan be that character as they might prefer to have a male kid character or two, however redundant that idea must be in today's world.

I've always seen this excuse as thinly veiled bullshit to cover up Toriyama not being bothered to draw up redesigns for Goten and Trunks, it's a blatant insult to everyone's intelligence.

it makes no sense whatsoever, throughout all of Super Goten and Trunks don't even appear in most of the episodes and contribute nothing to the plot, how can children relate to characters who don't even appear in the show? Japanese children clearly don't need to "relate" to child characters to watch a show, they watch Dragon Ball for Goku.

I mean Goten and Trunks don't even rank in ANY popularity polls, but hey maybe it's not an excuse and Toei just has an insanely stupid company policy to satisfy.

[HeroR]

TOEI keeps Goten and Trunks kid-sized because the primary target audience they gear Dragon Ball towards is kids and there needs to be at least one character that main demographic can relate to. This is likely a huge part of the reason Goku was turned back into a kid in GT. I'd hope that this time we will see elder designs for Goten and Trunks because this movie already has a kid character with Pan. I do fear TOEI would still shy away from having Pan be that character as they might prefer to have a male kid character or two, however redundant that idea must be in today's world.

The problem with that is that Goten and Trunks barely show up. So how were they capturing the young audience?

Goku was turned into a kid in GT to nerf him and recapture the feel of OG Dragon Ball.

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

TOEI keeps Goten and Trunks kid-sized because the primary target audience they gear Dragon Ball towards is kids and there needs to be at least one character that main demographic can relate to. This is likely a huge part of the reason Goku was turned back into a kid in GT. I'd hope that this time we will see elder designs for Goten and Trunks because this movie already has a kid character with Pan. I do fear TOEI would still shy away from having Pan be that character as they might prefer to have a male kid character or two, however redundant that idea must be in today's world.

I've always seen this excuse as thinly veiled bullshit to cover up Toriyama not being bothered to draw up redesigns for Goten and Trunks, it's a blatant insult to everyone's intelligence.

it makes no sense whatsoever, throughout all of Super Goten and Trunks don't even appear in most of the episodes and contribute nothing to the plot, how can children relate to characters who don't even appear in the show? Japanese children clearly don't need to "relate" to child characters to watch a show, they watch Dragon Ball for Goku.

I agree, it's a poor excuse. I'd also add it wouldn't even take that much effort to whip up new designs. For Goten all Toriyama would have to do is recycle Teen Gohan's design but slap on Goten's hair (as it more closely resembles Gokus), and for Trunks just use his design from the History of Trunks TV special.

Goku was turned into a kid in GT to nerf him and recapture the feel of OG Dragon Ball.

I'm sure both were part of the reason, but Toriyama was also advised by his editors to never age up Goku, although he stood his ground and allowed him to grow up in the manga. GT was a chance for the camp who wanted Goku to be a kid to get that since Toriyama was no longer writing.

[Kataphrut]

TOEI keeps Goten and Trunks kid-sized because the primary target audience they gear Dragon Ball towards is kids and there needs to be at least one character that main demographic can relate to. This is likely a huge part of the reason Goku was turned back into a kid in GT. I'd hope that this time we will see elder designs for Goten and Trunks because this movie already has a kid character with Pan. I do fear TOEI would still shy away from having Pan be that character as they might prefer to have a male kid character or two, however redundant that idea must be in today's world.

I've always seen this excuse as thinly veiled bullshit to cover up Toriyama not being bothered to draw up redesigns for Goten and Trunks, it's a blatant insult to everyone's intelligence.

it makes no sense whatsoever, throughout all of Super Goten and Trunks don't even appear in most of the episodes and contribute nothing to the plot, how can children relate to characters who don't even appear in the show? Japanese children clearly don't need to "relate" to child characters to watch a show, they watch Dragon Ball for Goku.

I mean Goten and Trunks don't even rank in ANY popularity polls, but hey maybe it's not an excuse and Toei just has an insanely stupid company policy to satisfy.

Everyone says it's because of Toei, but remember they haven't had any meaningful creative input on Dragon Ball since they gave Broly a green-haired transformation. The Super anime is dead, but there's still an ongoing manga and movies with Toriyama character designs depicting Goten and Trunks as kids. Why haven't they aged them up?