DBZ Romance

Discussion regarding the entirety of the franchise in a general (meta) sense, including such aspects as: production, trends, merchandise, fan culture, and more.
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DBZ Romance

Post by Son ChiChi » Thu Jul 08, 2004 1:41 pm

What are your opinions on “romance” on DBZ? I know the show isn't about romance but when I stumble onto these fanfics, I can't help but think about it and the people who write them. Do you think some of these fan fiction writers go over the top with these romances? I think they do. Sure, we saw very little romance in the show and the fact that Akira Toriyama never talked about it in his manga left a lot to the imagination, I still think some of these people go overboard on it.

Bulma and Vegeta

The stories I read of them on fanfiction.net have Bulma and Vegeta in these tacky, over-the-top cliches and Vegeta acting sensitive, open on his emotions and a romantic. :lol: I have to laugh at it because it’s just not Vegeta. It’s funny to hear on DBZ the closest Vegeta admits he has feelings for Bulma is that he’s fond of her and then read stories where Vegeta is talking about his love for Bulma with lines you hear on soaps or read in romance novels. :lol: I really can’t see Vegeta singing a love song to Bulma without ROFLMAO. Bulma in these stories has all the brains, the best fashion sense and all the men drooling over her even Piccolo who’s asexual thinks she’s hot. LOL! :shock: :lol: She’s ALWAYS nice to her friends, not vain at all and helps everyone with their problems since they all go to her for advice as if she’s Dear Abby. LOL again! I like Bulma but she's just doesn't seem to be that way.

Then there’s the over exaggerated sex life. (I think most of these kids who write these stories never had sex in their life and that’s why they can exaggerate it.) They probably do have good sex; who knows, but I think it’s over the top for them to have sex while Vegeta is a Super Saiyan and Bulma screams so loud no one hears her and without Vegeta splitting Bulma’s body in two or three or four, a lot of pieces. :twisted: :lol: The only couple who could possibly have sex in that state is Goku and ChiChi and that’s only because Goku learned to control his power before the Cell Games and even then I would proceed with caution. :!: Then there’s Gohan, if he remembers how to control his power. If it’s even possible, I think Vegeta, Goku and Gohan need to transfer some of their ki to their wives before they try that.

Most of these people who write B/V stories always bash the other characters. Since when is Yamcha an alcoholic who beats up on Bulma and Vegeta comes in as the Knight in shining armor and saves Bulma from Yamcha? :?: :? Then there is Yamcha cheating on Bulma constantly and Bulma taking him back? Even though it was mention in the dubbed, I had doubts then that Yamcha cheated on Bulma when Bulma was the one with all the infatuations, and when I learned Akira Toriyama wanted to end DBZ with the Frieza and basically just made up Yamcha cheating on Bulma my doubts made sense. I like Yamcha but he was weak in that he never stood up to Bulma. He just let her run over him. Vegeta always did what he wanted and EVEN Goku got his way with ChiChi, hence Gohan’s training which is the only thing they had a disagreement about. Other than that, Goku did what ChiChi wanted.

Then some of these fan girls proclaimed Vegeta as the best husband and father because he stayed with Bulma. :roll: Are these fans completely ignoring the fact that Vegeta left Bulma and baby Trunks to die when they were caught up in that blast by Dr. Gero and if Mirai Trunks hadn’t save them, they would’ve been dead? I know he changed and I’m glad he did since he sacrificed himself in the Buu Saga but even then right before he died, he hugged Trunks for the first time and he was eight? No offense but the best father and husband would’ve save his wife and child from the blast and he would’ve hugged his son long before he was eight. I think the way Vegeta grew up and the environment he was in shaped the way he is and he’s not used to emotions or how to express himself. He only learned that from living on Earth. One fan girl, I think her name was Trina Monkey said Bulma and Vegeta’s love is like Beauty and the Beast. Uh….oh….kay.

I really have to disagree with these fan girls of Bulma and Vegeta having the most realistic relationship. There so many reasons on how they are wrong on that one.

Goku and ChiChi

I like this couple but I’ve seen some over-the-top stuff there too. One girl on fan fiction.net had a story of ChiChi reading this letter Goku wrote to ChiChi. He was declaring his love for her and saying all these sugarcoated lines that just wasn’t Goku. I know he can read and write because he learned some from Gohan Sr. and more from Master Roshi when he was living with him but for Goku to say that over romantic fluff? :lol: There were few stories where Goku or ChiChi cheated on each other and they are too pure hearted, faithful and naïve to do that. Goku couldn’t see Princess Snake coming on to him! How is he going to cheat on his wife? :? ChiChi’s one of those women who are faithful to their husbands. She stayed faithful to him in the times of his deaths and when he was off training. It’s not like her to cheat or be suicidal and leaving her sons to be with Goku in death.

Goku’s not perfect. No one is. He leaves his wife, but it’s for the right reasons. He doesn’t work and ChiChi has to depend on her father for the money, but really what kind of job could Goku do? :? No, really I’d like to know. I can’t picture him doing anything nine to five. Maybe construction or something. It’s hard to tell how Goku is as a husband in terms of affection to his wife since we rarely saw any moments of Goku with his wife and family in both the manga and anime. I think the only time I saw them together as a happy family in the manga was Goku and his family having a picnic together. Goku and Gohan were by the lake talking and ChiChi was setting up the picnic and she calls for them that lunch is ready and the scene skips to Goku and his family driving in the city. I read that Akira Toriyama is shy about romance or has trouble putting that in his manga and he likes to keep things like that to himself. If that’s true that would explain why we never saw anything. However, there are scenes in the anime that shows these two really love each other.

Sometimes these authors portray Goku as too smart or on the verge of stupidity when he is only a naïve man, and then over-the-top with ChiChi being a shrew and only talking in all caps. I guess those only watch the dubbed get the wrong idea, but even when I was just watching the dubbed, I never thought ChiChi was a shrew. She was hilarious to me. I thought the whole situation was funny. Even though Goku is the strongest in the universe, he still has to do what his wife wants (like getting his license in the subbed and dubbed) and she‘s not intimidated by his strength at all. In that sense, they are like a lot of married couples where the husband gives in to the wife. There are stories where ChiChi is written as weak and can‘t hold herself off against a guy who kidnaps her in a grocery store. That’s OOC since ChiChi was in the tournament and considered the strongest female around until 18. It would’ve been funny to see ChiChi beat up Marron. LOL!

Then there’s G/CC sex life. Yes, on his wedding night, Goku didn’t know what he was getting into and was the complete opposite of Casanova (I’m sure it was so funny!!) :lol: but I don’t think it’s fair to say that since he’s naïve, Goku doesn’t have an active life with his wife. We don’t know. I do know Gohan and Goten didn’t fall from the sky and Goku got ChiChi pregnant real quick with Gohan. They do live out in the middle of nowhere. You figure it out. It can be hard picturing Goku that way sometimes, but he’s more normal in the subbed than the dubbed.

There are some nice in character stories too, but are very few. I think Goku is more open with his feelings than Vegeta would and I think it has to do with the environments they grew up in. Goku’s still reserved and private in public about them, but when he‘s with his family, he‘s probably open to them. We just never see it. Just when it seems to be the right moment for it in the manga, the moment is skipped or ignores it all together.

The Saiyan bond in fanfics is odd, too. I don’t know about any of the other females but if a guy is biting on my neck so hard that I’m bleeding and he starts to suck my blood, :shock: I’m not going to like it and I’ll be trying to get the guy off me and get as far as way from him as I could.

Krillin and 18

They have what might be the most normal relationship of the three if your ignore 18 being a cyborg. I think they are a cute couple. Krillin’s more likely to be openly affectionate with his wife although 18 would prefer to be private about it. Is it true that Japanese don’t like open displays of affection? I haven’t read much fics of these two but I would have like to have seen more of them in the anime but sadly by the Buu Saga anyone other than a Saiyan was shoved in the background. Still the moments of Krillin and 18 were funny such as the dubbed where Goku and the others were going to follow Supreme Kai away from the tournament and Krillin said he had to tell his wife where he was going.

All these characters have faults. I wish the authors would put that in, instead of making them too perfect or too OOC.

Somehow I think I got off topic and I think I forgot to mention something else. I tend to do that. Any comments?

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Post by Dayspring » Thu Jul 08, 2004 1:58 pm

Not touching this w/a 50-foot poll. Girls think they can change men (hence Vegeta's sensitivity). That always confused me. They want the rebel, call good guys "mama's boys" and despise them as such, then try to change the rebel w/o a cause or clue into a good guy once they start dating them. :P
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Post by VegettoEX » Thu Jul 08, 2004 2:04 pm

With the exception of Kame-Sen'nin's and Oolong's slapstick-perverted antics, DragonBall is one of the most NON-sexual shows I can imagine.

And I extremely dislike it when people force those kinds of things into it.

As someone who fucks with stories in AMVs to create something "new" maybe it's a tad bit hypocritical of me, but I absolutely hate it when people try and make shows into something they're not via fanfics.

I hate that everything is ultimately turned into hentai, I hate how everything is ultimately written into lemons, I hate when people make up romances that don't exist between characters, blah blah blah...

Anyway, yeah. I don't like inserting "romance" into DBZ. At all. Whee!
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Post by Xyex » Thu Jul 08, 2004 3:26 pm

Well, it has to be there somewhere EX, obviously. Just, not shown. Though I do agree with ChiChi here. 95% of Fanfics involving any romance are tottaly............... something bad, there's just no word that describes it in any known language. There are a few that a good, somewhere, but not many.

That's one of the reasons I try to do very little romance in my FF's. I do include it where needed by stay away if I can. That and the fact I can't write romance to well anyway. And when I do I don't pair up non-cannon couples like so many FF's like to do. Sure, I'll give someone who ends up alone in the series a relationship with an OC (Yamcha and Tien both get a girl in my LotSSJ), but that's about it.

The only changing of cannon pairings I've ever done is in my on hold FF Black Dawn in which both Videl and Gohan pair up with two of my OC's as a plot device actually.

What I hate even more than the sappy oh-so-not-DB romance stories are the ones with beyond stupid pairings. Like one fic by Trunkzgirl (I think) who apparently hates Videl. So in her fic she has Gohan with Lime... LIME! She was only in what, one or two episodes? :?
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Post by Mochi » Thu Jul 08, 2004 6:29 pm

Xyex wrote: What I hate even more than the sappy oh-so-not-DB romance stories are the ones with beyond stupid pairings. Like one fic by Trunkzgirl (I think) who apparently hates Videl. So in her fic she has Gohan with Lime... LIME! She was only in what, one or two episodes? :?
........That person will suffer for that. THEY WILL DIE SLOWLY AND PAINFULLY! DIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIE!!!!! :evil: :D Yay!
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Post by Deus ex Machina » Thu Jul 08, 2004 7:38 pm

Oh boy, another can of worms has been opened. Well the topic seems to be pretty one-sided so far (against relationship fics) so I'm going to add my 2 cents for it.

DBZ is action/martial arts story, aimed at young boys, their's no denying this. Even though the story can appeal to just about anyone, of any age, male or female can enjoy it. However the story was always extremly lacking when it came to any form of romantic relationship, partly due to Toriyama's shyness, and probably even more so because a young boy would rather watch Goku beating the living tar out of Cell, than taking his wife out on a date.

But there is the beauty of the "fan-fic", that we can cast all our favourite characters in new and different situations than they faced in their own story, and even better if they can be thrown into a scenario that they would never have to face.

I think the only thing that really turns many of us away from reading a romance DB story, is that they are terribly written. The writter tries to idealize their character in a romantic situation, and ends up writting them completly out of character. The most common being Vegeta is really a mushy romantic at heart. This is as hilarious as it is sad, since the writter seems to be over-compensating for Vegeta's general lack of feeling throughout the series.

Having said all that; I have read many bad romantic fics, and then I have read real jewels, stories so good that they could've been canon. These are few and far in between, but just like the over abundance of DBZ AMV's, this doesn't mean that the idea should be abandoned.

But let's get one last thing straight; Goku is no longer naive by the Boo saga, in any way shape or form. Nor is he "innocent", not only does he have 2 sons, but he also didn't have any hesitation offering to sneak X-rated photographs to the Elderly Kaioshin in exchange for his help. (In his own words, it would have to be Bulma, because Chi-chi would kill him). I would be really suprised if he could even ride on Kintoun anymore. :roll:

Finally, I'll address one other thing specifically:
The Saiyan bond in fanfics is odd, too. I don’t know about any of the other females but if a guy is biting on my neck so hard that I’m bleeding and he starts to suck my blood, I’m not going to like it and I’ll be trying to get the guy off me and get as far as way from him as I could.
Again, this is one of those fic concepts that writers really like with Saiyan pairings, but it's become very over-used, and often not used properly. Although it's not specifically stated in the series, Bulma and Vegeta do seem to have some kind of special bond, as seen when Vegeta sacrifices his life and Bulma knew right away. So their is some kind of emotional/mental bonding going on (Unless you acredit that sene to Bulma's legendary Womans Intuition), the physical part (specifically the bite) seems to have been around in fics forever, I'd really like to know how that got started. It does have some basis in nature, since animals often bite their mates during sex, but of course their's no more evidence towards this "Saiyan bonding ritual" than the concept of a Saiyans tail being a pleasure zone...but that's a whole other thread altogether. :wink:

In conclusion; not all fics are bad, thus not all romance fics are bad either.

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Post by Sun_Wukong » Thu Jul 08, 2004 8:25 pm

One of the new DB guides, cant remeber if its Landmark or Forever, actually has a section on the couples of DB. I was actually quite suprised it was in there.

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Post by Magica » Thu Jul 08, 2004 8:42 pm

VegettoEX wrote:With the exception of Kame-Sen'nin's and Oolong's slapstick-perverted antics, DragonBall is one of the most NON-sexual shows I can imagine.

And I extremely dislike it when people force those kinds of things into it.
Especially when those rabid fangirls put them into yaoi situations. It's getting very much cliched. >_<

I don't read romance fanfiction anymore. All yhe ones that I did read where a few Vegeta/Bulma ones, and they were like you've said above.

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Post by Xyex » Thu Jul 08, 2004 11:00 pm

Yaoi is not my thing, but I've actually found one such story that was worth my time to read, and that's with skipping the, er, more graphic, Yaoi parts. The story is called Kingdom Come and is in my FF Favorite stories if you're interested.

But yeah, I've found a few gems too. One girl who has since removed her stuff from FF thanks to some Royal Jerk™. Anyway, she had several of them that all seemed like they were taken right from the manga/anime. One of Goku/Chi-Chi during the 5 years between shows, one of Bulma/Vegeta that covered a year and half during the 3 year training time, a third for Krillin/18 that covered, I think, 3 years during the 7 years between Cell and Buu. And, of course, one for Gohan/Videl set during the 10 years between Buu and the end of the series.
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Post by Izlude » Fri Jul 09, 2004 1:58 am

Well Gohan and Videl have some kind of romance...although we never see a kiss, or anything... it would of been NICE to actually see some of it. Videl coughing up her love for Gohan after his supposed death is just nuts

Although I liked Piccolo and Gohan much better, its a bonus because Piccolo doesnt even have a dick, so he can like dress up as a chick for Gohan

Also I remember a funny doujin that was drawn in Toriyama's style where its a few days before the Cell Game, and Goku is in a bath and Chi Chi comes in and Goku convinces her to jump in with him. Chi Chi gets in, and Goku stands up and starts playing grab ass with Chi Chi, when Chi Chi see's Goku's cawk is covered in an aura and Goku is like "Go ahead, touch it" :roll:

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Post by Zackarotto » Fri Jul 09, 2004 2:10 am

Thanks for sharing. I really expected to see that in a topic about romance.

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Post by SpaceKappa » Fri Jul 09, 2004 2:12 am

Nothing quite conveys the deep emotional and spiritual bond of love like the word cawk.

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Post by VegettoEX » Fri Jul 09, 2004 8:16 am

Mizugi wrote:Nothing quite conveys the deep emotional and spiritual bond of love like the word cawk.
Uhhh... let's not go in that direction. There's locking, yelling, banning, and all sorts of other bad things that way...
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Post by omae no kaasan » Fri Jul 09, 2004 8:17 pm

"Romance" was in DB so Toriyama could make more men.

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Post by Son ChiChi » Fri Jul 09, 2004 9:37 pm

Lime?! They put Gohan with Lime?! Oh, well. It’s not the wierdest pairing I’ve heard of.

I remember watching the subbed with Goku’s talk with Old Kai. That was hilarious. I always thought he made it Bulma because he didn’t want X-rated photos of his wife being seen by an old man so he chose Videl first and when Gohan refused that he chose Bulma. If I were in Goku’s shoes, I wouldn’t want anyone seeing X-rated photos of my wife, but ChiChi also would never agree to it. You really have to look for the good fanfics since they are very few.

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Post by SpiritBomb » Fri Jul 09, 2004 10:41 pm

If your gonna put Gohan with Lime, its pretty much this girl is an annoying fangirl wanted to make an invented character, portraying herself, but putting it as Lime so nobody bothers her with "Mary-Sue" remarks.

As for Vegeta and Bulma, I agree 100%. He loves her, but is not romantic. I mean, it just makes you wonder why these girls are watching DBZ in the first place. Its not a soap opera,people!

Goku and Chi-Chi are a cute couple but Goku doesent strike me as romantic. Not because he is like Vegeta, with his pride and all, but more like he doesent know how. I'm sure Goku can have his moments though...
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Post by Xyex » Fri Jul 09, 2004 11:19 pm

Son ChiChi wrote:Lime?! They put Gohan with Lime?! Oh, well. It’s not the wierdest pairing I’ve heard of.

I remember watching the subbed with Goku’s talk with Old Kai. That was hilarious. I always thought he made it Bulma because he didn’t want X-rated photos of his wife being seen by an old man so he chose Videl first and when Gohan refused that he chose Bulma. If I were in Goku’s shoes, I wouldn’t want anyone seeing X-rated photos of my wife, but ChiChi also would never agree to it. You really have to look for the good fanfics since they are very few.
I wouldn't want to be in Goku's shoes period. I mean, dealing with Vegeta or Gohan cause he got the old Kai x-rated photos of their mate would be one thing, dealing with said women is something completely different, and far more dangerous.
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Post by Izlude » Sat Jul 10, 2004 3:40 pm

Mr.Satan X Buu for life man! They are a happy couple now

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Post by oponok » Sat Jul 10, 2004 9:42 pm

I think one of the best parts of DBZ is that there is NO romance. It's totally focused on father/son type love.

There is one scene in which Goku and Chichi kiss, but only their legs are shown. I thought this was a really nice touch, especially since it probably would've wierded out most Dragonball fans watching it by being so out of place with the rest of the series.

Goku may or may not be romantic, but he loves his wife. He doesn't in GT, though. He generally ignores her, and when he knows he'll never see her again in the finale, he doesn't even say "goodbye." Hell, he doesn't even say anything to Gohan. He only makes time to talk to an old midget, demon spawn who kidnapped his son once, and a blood-thirsty space prince. Yes, GT Goku is a worthless, worthless bastard.

A MAN WHO USED TO KILL HIS ALLIES AND FEAST ON THE CORPSES OF HIS ENEMIES SHOULD NOT COME BEFORE YOUR LOYAL, PATIENT WIFE.

And no, Vegeta loves no one. He raped Bulma just to carry on his lineage. Then he just lost his will to live by GT and just hung around, spending her money and drinking heavily. Heavily enough to forget how to use SSJ2 or whatever else he should've been able to do by then, then think it would look cool to cut his hair, and grow a mustache. And then, after Goku leaves at the end of GT, he isn't even coherent enough to stop and ask, "what the funk just happened," "what have I been doing with my life," and "why is my son such a puss?"

Vegeta isn't soft on the inside. Are years of violent activity more than enough evidence he's a hard ass, or was he practicing his poetry writing while committing genocide on adorable and cuddly alien races?

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Post by Dai » Sat Jul 10, 2004 10:21 pm

I really do not like this topic.

I'll just say I agree with VegettoEX in every aspect and leave it at that. I do not wish to know why Izlude reads hentai DBZ manga.

Good lord, man.
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