How Many Times have You Seen DB All the Way Through?

[90sDBZ]

Actually plenty of shows like that. I'm currently about to give Breaking Bad another go and all sorts of folks are telling me to skip ahead to this or that episode when things really pick up.

I'd definitely recommend watching all of Breaking Bad from start to finish. It's a show with lots of attention to detail, and skipping anything would be detrimental to your experience. I actually only got round to watching it a year ago myself, and have already rewatched it all. It's the type of show were you pick up on new stuff when you rewatch.

[ABED]

I wanna go back to the earlier example of Family Guy. Yes, that first season or so, the animation wasn't the best, and it got noticably butter, but those first 3 or so original seasons are problably the best of the show. So I don't think I'm alone in saying this that the quality of the visual isn't the end all be all. It's not like the difference between DB and DBZ's visuals are night and day. I've found that most early seasons of any show are usually their best.

I plan to do a rewatch of DB next year from January to Goku Day. I plan on watching all of DB, DBZ, GT, and Super subbed. I will also watch Kai and the Ocean dub, well... dubbed.

[MasenkoHA]

I wanna go back to the earlier example of Family Guy. Yes, that first season or so, the animation wasn't the best, and it got noticably butter, but those first 3 or so original seasons are problably the best of the show. So I don't think I'm alone in saying this that the quality of the visual isn't the end all be all. It's not like the difference between DB and DBZ's visuals are night and day. I've found that most early seasons of any show are usually their best.

Indeed the first 3 seasons of Family Guy were the show at its best. Season 4-7 were okay. After that it went downhill fast.

And yeah most shows tend to be at their best for the first 3-5 years and Dragon Ball is no exception.

[MyVisionity]

The quality of the visuals isn't the end all be all, but for a lot of people if they don't like the visuals then they don't bother checking it out. So I can see why someone would be turned off by the early DB art style which can feel like Looney Tunes compared to the later stuff.

It's kind of like people who refuse to watch Black and White movies because Color=Good and B&W=Bad. Or me with books that are hardcover, because unless it's in paperback I can't get into it.

It's also similar to how people won't watch subbed because of Goku's voice or because of the Kikuchi score.

[Cure Dragon 255]

The quality of the visuals isn't the end all be all, but for a lot of people if they don't like the visuals then they don't bother checking it out. So I can see why someone would be turned off by the early DB art style which can feel like Looney Tunes compared to the later stuff.

It's kind of like people who refuse to watch Black and White movies because Color=Good and B&W=Bad. Or me with books that are hardcover, because unless it's in paperback I can't get into it.

It's also similar to how people won't watch subbed because of Goku's voice or because of the Kikuchi score.

I REALLY hate it when people use Looney Tunes as examples of BAD ANIMATION. They are actually better than most stuff you see in anime. ESPECIALLY from Dragon Ball.

[SuperSaiyaManZ94]

The quality of the visuals isn't the end all be all, but for a lot of people if they don't like the visuals then they don't bother checking it out. So I can see why someone would be turned off by the early DB art style which can feel like Looney Tunes compared to the later stuff.

It's kind of like people who refuse to watch Black and White movies because Color=Good and B&W=Bad. Or me with books that are hardcover, because unless it's in paperback I can't get into it.

It's also similar to how people won't watch subbed because of Goku's voice or because of the Kikuchi score.

I REALLY hate it when people use Looney Tunes as examples of BAD ANIMATION. They are actually better than most stuff you see in anime. ESPECIALLY from Dragon Ball.

Particularly the '40s/'50s era of shorts, which i also extend to Tom and Jerry. Each of those are some of THE best animation (from Warner Bros and MGM/H-B) of the era.

[MyVisionity]

Yes, the classic WB/MGM shorts have great animation. But the art style is very comical and difficult to take seriously. Which is why I made the DB comparison. While much of early DB is serious, it still carries the gag style more strongly than in the Z-era. A lot of people dislike slapstick shit.

[ABED]

Fine but lets keep in mind that this is a story where the main characters are named after food, things that are cold, the sound a frog makes, a Disney song, and a musical instrument. I don't think people have an issue with slapstick, I think there's a lack of perspective. DB is a world where the silly and the serious can coexist, even in DBZ.

[dva_raza]

Nobody’s forcing him to do anything. It’s just kind of weird being on a Dragon Ball forum and refusing to watch the first 3 years of the series.

Dragon Ball is the only series I know where fans won’t even bother with the first few years.


Imagine being on a Buffy forum and saying you’re a fan of Buffy but refuse to watch the high school seasons since you were introduced to the college/adult years and don’t feel the need to watch the first 3 seasons.

What is exactly weird about not being necessarily motivated by two different shows?

I don't know what those comparisons to someone not watching the first seasons of their show has to do with anything.

Z isn’t a different season, it’s literally another series. I know the story has no separation in the manga but it does in the anime. Why would they want to rebrand someting if it was exactly the same? Because it’s not the same series, it’s an adaptation with a whole new set of different characters and also different tone.
Since the characters create the tone and define the story, I can feel unmotivated by watching that story (yes, even if it’s part of the same story that I like), simply because it means following a version of Goku and a gang that I’m not that into.
So even if the anime had never been separated, I would’ve skipped through those arcs just the same, for the very same reasons.

I do read, but it's still possible to be mistaken about a point being made.

Well sure.. But it kinda feels like you keep asking the same question and making the same implications that I’ve already answered/debunked in every post though.
(I don't mind the reactions this by the way, I know the fandom here is more "hardcore" than I am and I understand, and I’ve actually liked this conversation lol, it was informative)

But so, let me clarify what seems unclear:

I can't imagine why someone would actively decide to not go back to the beginning of a show they know they enjoy.

I've opened up about this in detail already, but simply put:

I saw a glimpse of Z and I wanted to see more. I saw many glimpses of DB and never felt the interest to see more.

It feels like you want to believe that there is something in me actively choosing to be disinterested when it’s just the opposite, I can’t decide what sparks curiosity, whether it’s something about the story, something about the characters or just something about the style of it, it just happens, or it doesn’t.
I think the confusion here is that you really do see the Dragon Ball and Z anime as if they were the same when they’re not.

It's insane. It's like watching a movie 30 minutes into it, falling in love with it and saying "Nah, don't need to see the rest".

That's a little rude, to say it's "insane" and also..No. That’s not a thing that happens to me and it's not even remotely an accurate comparison. But actually, it brings me to a question.
This example would be closer to someone watching a series that declines overtime and the stopping it (never happened to me by the way, I know how to pick).
But so by that logic, that would be “insane” because they stopped watching a show they loved? Even if changed all the characters and tone?

my feeling is "why do you want it all to be the same?" Why don't you want to see the genesis of it? Why do you want the story to give you more of the same?

I don’t want anything to be the same, I wanted it to be interesting.
Super is not the same as Z, And I love it the same as I love Z. Cause I like the characters, I like the humor and I like the story.

And the whole of Z is different and nuanced as you mentioned yourself previously. It’s not the same, it just keeps being good (or better) with every arc.

I don't think I'm alone in saying this that the quality of the visual isn't the end all be all

Of course it’s not, I agree. Actually it’s not even an aspect that I usually care about. And I also agree it’s not a huge difference between the 2 shows, but it’s significant.
I didn’t mean to imply that it’s the most important aspect though, or the reason for which one watches a show, of course not. Only that that happend to be the first thing that I took notice of in that particular case, and the reason was probably because along with the new desings, and the image I had imprinted on how DB looked, this did jump at me. But there’s not way that it just looking nice would have called my attention enough to start watching, let alone to continue watching it if it didn’t have characters and a situation that I was so intrigued by.

In a thread about GT vs Super, I said I prefer Super all the way even despite the fact that I think the art/animation is crappier looking than in GT (at the begining at least), that's because I don’t care about that if the story and characters are so great.

[ABED]

it's different in name only. In the manga, it's all DB. The distinction is utterly arbitrary but because there was a nice time jump to start another arc, people see that as the beginning of a new series.

I think the confusion here is that you really do see the Dragon Ball and Z anime as if they were the same when they’re not.

this is gonna sound like "Nuh uh!" but seriously, they are the same. It's the same story at a different point. The original manga never made a distinction.

Super is not the same as Z, And I love it the same as I love Z. Cause I like the characters, I like the humor and I like the story.

DB has all of that. The characters you love, the humor, and the story.

This example would be closer to someone watching a series that declines overtime and the stopping it (never happened to me by the way, I know how to pick).
But so by that logic, that would be “insane” because they stopped watching a show they loved? Even if changed all the characters and tone?

No because stories decline over time, what was once fresh becomes stale, the story goes into utterly ridiculous territory in an effort to keep going. Any number of other reasons. That's not a good comparison.

Please don't get hung up on the word insane. I wasn't being literal. It was just a colloquial way of saying I think what you are doing is illogical.

You know how to pick? Never mind.

[MasenkoHA]

What is exactly weird about not being necessarily motivated by two different shows?

Because they’re not different shows

.

Z isn’t a different season, it’s literally another series.

But it’s not. It’s the same series with a Z added to the title. You know Toei doesn’t override Toriyama right? Toriyama didn’t see a point in changing the title Toei wanted to “freshen up”’ it’s little more than the illusion of a new series.

. Why would they want to rebrand someting if it was exactly the same?

Marketing gimmick

Because it’s not the same series, it’s an adaptation with a whole new set of different characters and also different tone.

This is hilariously off base. A whole new sets of characters? Literally the same characters from Dragon
Ball. Some new characters are introduced but new characters are introduced throughout just the original Dragon Ball. Also the different tone was set by the time of the Tenshinhan arc. Most long running shows tend to evolve.

So even if the anime had never been separated, I would’ve skipped through those arcs just the same, for the very same reasons.

Extremely doubtful tbh. Unless your entire love of Dragon Ball Z is focused on Vegeta and Gohan

[SuperSaiyaManZ94]

The reason the anime was rebranded as DBZ at the point where the five year time skip happens in the manga was pretty much done exactly for marketing purposes on Toei's part, given they chose Ch. 195 as the springboard for it. Even with that distinction they made back in 1989 it's still at it's core one whole 519 chapter series, they're not mutually exclusive to themselves even with the split.

[ABED]

There are different ways of watching Star Wars: release order, chronological, Machete order, etc.

What way do you have to watch the series, or what ways have you experimented with?

[SuperSaiyaManZ94]

There are different ways of watching Star Wars: release order, chronological, Machete order, etc.

What way do you have to watch the series, or what ways have you experimented with?

I have gone back and forth between watching the original and prequel trilogies (don't have the Disney released films/sequels aside from Rogue One) in both release and chronologically. I usually slot Rogue One in between ROTS and ANH as it leads pretty direct into the latter.

[ABED]

There are different ways of watching Star Wars: release order, chronological, Machete order, etc.

What way do you have to watch the series, or what ways have you experimented with?

I have gone back and forth between watching the original and prequel trilogies (don't have the Disney released films/sequels aside from Rogue One) in both release and chronologically. I usually slot Rogue One in between ROTS and ANH as it leads pretty direct into the latter.

I was talking about DB, but just using Star Wars as an example so people would understand my question. My bad for not being clearer.

[SuperSaiyaManZ94]

There are different ways of watching Star Wars: release order, chronological, Machete order, etc.

What way do you have to watch the series, or what ways have you experimented with?

I have gone back and forth between watching the original and prequel trilogies (don't have the Disney released films/sequels aside from Rogue One) in both release and chronologically. I usually slot Rogue One in between ROTS and ANH as it leads pretty direct into the latter.

I was talking about DB, but just using Star Wars as an example so people would understand my question. My bad for not being clearer.

No problem, so any way on topic of DB wise i've experimented with it both ways.

[Anonymous Friend]

I personally don't think I would be as big of a fan of the series if it weren't for the OG. Without it, over half the characters would just be standing around doing nothing and I have no clue of their actual importance. Roshi with just be a perv who tries to get frisky with all the females.

While a person would exist with none of the context, why would any reasonable person want to?

[MyVisionity]

Dva_raza is correct about DB and DBZ being two different series. It's an oversimplification, but accurate. To say that it was completely arbitrary or that things don't change is erroneous.

The idea that Star Wars should be watched chronologically is sickening to me. However, experimentation is cool.

I've watched the DBZ movies during the time within the series that they were released, and also all at once, separate from the series. I enjoy them separately because they have their own arcs like with Coola and Brolli. Or things like Goku being much more no-nonsense and Kuririn being much more nonsense. Recurring bits like Oolong, Chichi duped, camping trips, Haiya Dragon, Genki Dama, etc. I almost wish they had gone even further in distancing the movies from the series, like coloring Bulma's hair purple in all of them or something.

I worry sometimes that watching the movies while watching through the tv show might negatively impact the main story's effect. Certain spoilery bits, characterization, and repetitive plot points could take something away from the tv story. Particularly for folks that have never seen the show before.

I also like going through and watching the filler eps and arcs separately sometimes.

[MasenkoHA]

Dva_raza is correct about DB and DBZ being two different series. It's an oversimplification, but accurate. To say that it was completely arbitrary or that things don't change is erroneous.

They’re different only in the sense that Toei identifies them as different series. Fundamentally no they’re not different.

You’re right that it wasn’t completely arbitrary. For one thing the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai was the first time the series had a reasonable stopping point. For another the Z portion is marked by Goku being a father and an alien. But as far as tone and style? There’s nothing different between the Tenshinhan arc (really by the time Tao shows up in the Red Ribbon story) and Piccolo arcs and the Saiyan, Namek, and Cell arcs. The Saiyaman and Boo arcs are straight up Toriyama going back to the gag manga roots. The last couple years of “Z” have way more similarities in tone with what people think of Dragon Ball than half of the actual Dragon Ball

And for all intents and purposes the Piccolo arc completely defined the kind of stories Toriyama would tell during the Z portion.

[dva_raza]

I personally don't think I would be as big of a fan of the series if it weren't for the OG. Without it, over half the characters would just be standing around doing nothing and I have no clue of their actual importance.

I guess you can’t know just how irrelevant the OG can be for understanding and appreciating Z since you DID watch the OG.

But as someone who didn’t see it, I can tell you:
The characters in Z most certainly don't “just stand around doing nothing”, and I most certainly DO have a clue of their actual "importance". Yes, even without having seen the OG.

Roshi with just be a perv who tries to get frisky with all the females.

While a person would exist with none of the context, why would any reasonable person want to?

Lol why the fuck would I need “context” on Roshi? He’s barely in Super and Z. He’s irrelevant.
And it’s not like I don’t know who he is. I have the basics. I don’t need to see his full story to somehow enjoy or understand Z and Super better.
And here's an irony: I don't see Roshi as "just a perv who tries to get frisky with all the females" precisely because I never saw OG. I mean, I am aware of that aspect of him, but since I missed most of those scenes, the image I have of him is predominantly as the quirky master and mentor of Goku and Krillin.

Same goes for: Tenshinhan, Yamcha, The animals, Launch, (Kids: Goku, Krillin and Bulma).
All of these characters, I know who they are. I don’t need to see the “full context” to experience Z and Super better. The only exception would be Piccolo, and not even because it’s needed but because it's the one character from the OG that I do find intriguing, which is why I have said that I will watch the arc that explains his origin, because HIS context I am interested in. STILL don't need to do it to understand and enjoy either him or the Z/Super series.
My question would be why would any reasonable person watch a show they know they won't like?