Bootlegs?

Kendamu · Post by **Kendamu** » Thu Jun 12, 2008 9:42 pm

chibi_goten wrote:
NeptuneKai wrote: However when they competently released a product said companies couldn't pull off I will support their product.
Sorry, I don't get that.. can you make it a little clearer please.

He means that when FUNi can start treating Dragonball with respect he'll buy FUNi's Dragonball stuff.

Big Momma · Post by **Big Momma** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 3:24 am

chibi_goten wrote:
NeptuneKai wrote: However when they competently released a product said companies couldn't pull off I will support their product.
Sorry, I don't get that.. can you make it a little clearer please.

He's saying that if a bootlegger releases a product that is better than anything an official company could ever release, then he'd go for it.

Captain Awesome · Post by **Captain Awesome** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 6:53 am

I don't support bootlegs at all.

I mean shit, if you're going to get an illegal copy, why the hell are you paying for it, it doesn't make sense to me.

chibi_goten · Post by **chibi_goten** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 11:37 am

Kendamu wrote:
He means that when FUNi can start treating Dragonball with respect he'll buy FUNi's Dragonball stuff.

Big Momma wrote: He's saying that if a bootlegger releases a product that is better than anything an official company could ever release, then he'd go for it.

I understood what he meant by saying that, but wanted an explanation on how buying illegal unlicensed copies, even if in your opinion that they are better then the Funimation or Toei releases, is a good thing. They are still illegal none the less and are subject to government prohibition or taxation, as well as ripping off the originals, and supporting who knows what. I don't see how you can justify that, or how you could call them a good thing.

Kendamu · Post by **Kendamu** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 12:56 pm

I think the logic is similar to buying/trading VHS fansubs back in the day.

SSj_Rambo · Post by **SSj_Rambo** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 2:21 pm

Everyone should just pool their money together so we can get the Dragonbox's and share them.

laserkid · Post by **laserkid** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 3:13 pm

NeptuneKai wrote: However when they competently released a product said companies couldn't pull off I will support their product. In any event I bought enough Funimation shit to fill a large landfill.

1. I can understand not wanting to buy FUNimations DVDs but if you're going to buy the show, buy it legitely. Get a Dragon Box or a R2 DVD single collection. Hell get the Spanish DBZ DVD release which uses the dragonbox masters. There are PLENTY of legitimate releases that have the better quality transfers.

2. Sure they're more expensive then bootlegs are, but not being able to afford a legit set does NOT entitle you to steal from them (them being Akira Toriyama/Bird Studios, Toei, Pony Canyon (who did the dragon box remastering), all of the Japanese Seiyuu and animators, the music producers, ect, and at the end of the list ALSO FUNimation).

3. As stated above you're likely funding the chinese mafia. Now you can keep joking about the fact that you'd kill for a dragon ball set. But would you also assist in raping people, torturing people, extorting people, burning people's homes who don't "pay up", ect? If your answer is you're totally okay with funding thsoe kinds of activitie because you get dragon box footage cheaper then buying such legitimately (again, you can completely bypass FUNimation and get the quality releases legitely), then you, sir, have a lot of issues.

4. Now yes, Dragon Box footage has yet to meet an english translation, but from the sounds of it, you're going to have to rely on your existing understanding of the show to get what the subtiltes say anyway. If that's the case, you could always get legit Dragon Box footage DVDs (Dragonbox, R2 singles, Spanish release), and just watch raw Japanese.

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 3:36 pm

I ethically don't give a rats ass about the Chinese Mafia, I doubt me not buying DBZ would make their organization collapse. I'm a regular 4chaner so supporting the Chinese mafia is the least of the crazy twisted shit I do buddy. I like how everyone on Daizex become ethical super men Jesus reincarnations when it comes down to someone paying less for a product they virtually paid 1000's of dollars for.
Edit: And as the person below me gracefully said I wonder how much people actually know about the Chinese mafia outside the shit they spout off that they saw in the bad 80's gangster flicks.
^_^

Kendamu · Post by **Kendamu** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 3:51 pm

laserkid wrote:3. As stated above you're likely funding the chinese mafia. Now you can keep joking about the fact that you'd kill for a dragon ball set. But would you also assist in raping people, torturing people, extorting people, burning people's homes who don't "pay up", ect? If your answer is you're totally okay with funding thsoe kinds of activitie because you get dragon box footage cheaper then buying such legitimately (again, you can completely bypass FUNimation and get the quality releases legitely), then you, sir, have a lot of issues.

What exactly does the Chinese mafia do? Do you know exactly what they're into and what kinds of things they do? Is there some sort of text or video to support it? Sure, they're criminals. However, let's not assume that all organized crime syndicates do the exact same thing that you see in Italian Mafia movies.

laserkid · Post by **laserkid** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:05 pm

I'm sorry but 4 chan < chinese mafia in my book, first of all.

Second of all dude, no shit your one purchase doesn't solely fund them, but it DOES fund them, and at the very least, you helped them extort one more person. Its your prevalant ATTITUDE that DOES fund them.

Saving money is good and all, but you've just proven you don't care if you support the people who actually put work into making the show. I just gave you three ways to bypass FUNi crap, and you just proved that isn't even it.

For whatever reason, you don't seem to want to pay the people who actually made the show, and remastered the show, you want to have it.

and no, this isn't being a super ethical Jesus. if I wanted to be that way (and I don't) - I'd be reporting your ass to the FBI. I'm not going to, so don't let that worry you (The FBI have better things to do, and so do I), but were I wanting to play super ethics man, that is what I'd do.

Lastly, on the same point, stop labeling people wh odisagree with you just to ignore them. It's immature and doesn't actually adress the point.

laserkid · Post by **laserkid** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:10 pm

Kendamu wrote:What exactly does the Chinese mafia do? Do you know exactly what they're into and what kinds of things they do? Is there some sort of text or video to support it? Sure, they're criminals. However, let's not assume that all organized crime syndicates do the exact same thing that you see in Italian Mafia movies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triad_society

"Their activities include drug trafficking, contract murder, money laundering, gambling, prostitution, car theft, extortion, and other forms of racketeering."

Honestly, what did you THINK a mafia did, play chess?

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:12 pm

laserkid wrote:
Kendamu wrote:What exactly does the Chinese mafia do? Do you know exactly what they're into and what kinds of things they do? Is there some sort of text or video to support it? Sure, they're criminals. However, let's not assume that all organized crime syndicates do the exact same thing that you see in Italian Mafia movies.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triad_society

"Their activities include drug trafficking, contract murder, money laundering, gambling, prostitution, car theft, extortion, and other forms of racketeering."

Honestly, what did you THINK a mafia did, play chess?

Because Wiki is very accurate in all matters.

laserkid · Post by **laserkid** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:15 pm

Somehow I doubt the Chinese Mafia was wiki vandalized.

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:17 pm

laserkid wrote:Somehow I doubt the Chinese Mafia was wiki vandalized.

A page doesn't need to be vandalized to be inaccurate.

laserkid · Post by **laserkid** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:22 pm

Because the chinese mafia is really a fun loving group that bootleg anime and invite people over for tea, okay got it, wikipedia must be wrong always, so dragon ball was NOT made by Akira Toriyama either, because thats what wikipedia says, and clearly that also must be wrong.

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:24 pm

laserkid wrote:Because the chinese mafia is really a fun loving group that bootleg anime and invite people over for tea, okay got it, wikipedia must be wrong always, so dragon ball was NOT made by Akira Toriyama either, because thats what wikipedia says, and clearly that also must be wrong.

Because if one fact is wrong they ALL must be wrong.

SSj_Rambo · Post by **SSj_Rambo** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:25 pm

Wow, this Mafia argument is getting really hot and off topic, VegettoEX won't be pleased with this.

laserkid · Post by **laserkid** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:25 pm

Thats the logic I'm trying to point against you actually.

But since you want another source, have fun with the new york times

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.h ... A960958260

"You might never know it from pop culture and the continuing spate of Mafia books, but organized crime has been seized by its own diversity program. Asian, Russian, Hispanic, black and other ethnic gangs have long been horning in on the Cosa Nostra's dominance of drug-trafficking, financial fraud, illegal gambling, extortion, prostitution and other cherished rackets, literally changing the face of the mob, although elements of the old Mafia remain surprisingly resilient. "

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:27 pm

SSj_Rambo wrote:Wow, this Mafia argument is getting really hot and off topic, VegettoEX won't be pleased with this.

Yeah that's a good point actually, I said I'd stop posting here earlier.
If you want to continue this fun little stupid debate that won't change my mind any-which way go ahead and give me a PM you ethical hero you.

Jerseymilk · Post by **Jerseymilk** » Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:33 pm

SSj_Rambo wrote:Wow, this Mafia argument is getting really hot and off topic, VegettoEX won't be pleased with this.

I garuantee Mike is already well aware of this thread and monitoring it. Don't be so naive.

I'm not trying to act like some "ethical hero" or anything, simply pointing out really that I don't get the point of paying for illegal copies of an anime and think it's asinine. If you're that cheap and want to not pay a lot for it, go get an online fansub of it for free. Especially when you're giving the money to crime syndicates, well I think that just makes a person a patsy and I certainly wouldn't be bragging that I gave my hard earned money to them. >>

(Don't get me wrong here either: Years ago I purchased bootlegs too. I naively thought they were similar to fansubs and had no idea about the criminal link. Heck I also genuinely believed those sellers that worded them as "the Hong Kong" version" of the products. I stopped when I researched and learned the actual facts though for the same reason I said above. Didn't want to be a "patsy" thanks. Just wanted to point out that I don't in any way think I'm perfect or guiltless or something because that's getting thrown around like it's a valid argument.)