Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" Dub Turns 16; Still Unreleased

[Scsigs]

Regarding your second para, start sentences like an adult, maybe? We're usually polite here to others.

Secondly, I said, "for fun" and I know Sabat has mellowed down a lot lately, but these guys were hella insecure about their roles as these characters way back when. As long as there's marketing and demand, Kai can be shown and marketed as, "90s/ classic Z-Kai", or something to that effect. Discovery+ had Kai until last year in some countries, but now they don't, so who knows?! This dub can be streamed for a year or so somewhere where there's demand, though I know that's not very realistic.

I felt the second response was appropriate since, regardless of how some of the cast members felt 20 years ago, they've clearly chilled out a lot, except Sean Schemmel, who still has a weird possessiveness over Goku in English & didn't handle Peter Kelamis being invited to Kamehacon in 2018 particularly well. To the point where people blame him for Team Four Star's cameos in Kai getting removed despite there being multiple ways Toei more likely found out about it. People love to hate on him for his egotism. Also for the Vic Mignogna drama, despite him not being involved directly in that shit & only producing parody skits of Vic's attitude over a decade ago just because Vic stans are stupid & can't see that he;'s not a good guy, but I digress.

Yeah, you said "for fun," but even then, I don't understand what the goal of a fundraiser would be, nor how you'd go about achieving it if the goal is to get Ocean to release the dub. Outside of online illegally because they'd have to get the ok from Crunchyroll to release it officially & I doubt Crunchy cares to release an alternate dub to a show they already have one for, even for cheap, on their service, I don't see how they'd do it. It's not just unrealistic, but it's a perfect example of wishful thinking.

[SuperSaiyaManZ94]

Regarding your second para, start sentences like an adult, maybe? We're usually polite here to others.

Secondly, I said, "for fun" and I know Sabat has mellowed down a lot lately, but these guys were hella insecure about their roles as these characters way back when. As long as there's marketing and demand, Kai can be shown and marketed as, "90s/ classic Z-Kai", or something to that effect. Discovery+ had Kai until last year in some countries, but now they don't, so who knows?! This dub can be streamed for a year or so somewhere where there's demand, though I know that's not very realistic.

I felt the second response was appropriate since, regardless of how some of the cast members felt 20 years ago, they've clearly chilled out a lot, except Sean Schemmel, who still has a weird possessiveness over Goku in English & didn't handle Peter Kelamis being invited to Kamehacon in 2018 particularly well. To the point where people blame him for Team Four Star's cameos in Kai getting removed despite there being multiple ways Toei more likely found out about it. People love to hate on him for his egotism. Also for the Vic Mignogna drama, despite him not being involved directly in that shit & only producing parody skits of Vic's attitude over a decade ago just because Vic stans are stupid & can't see that he;'s not a good guy, but I digress.

Yeah, you said "for fun," but even then, I don't understand what the goal of a fundraiser would be, nor how you'd go about achieving it if the goal is to get Ocean to release the dub. Outside of online illegally because they'd have to get the ok from Crunchyroll to release it officially & I doubt Crunchy cares to release an alternate dub to a show they already have one for, even for cheap, on their service, I don't see how they'd do it. It's not just unrealistic, but it's a perfect example of wishful thinking.

Yeah, and i’ve never quite understood Schemmel’s possessive attachment to his role as Goku and that having fueled his actions at times. It’s not like he was and is the one and ONLY English dub voice for the character in FUNimation’s dubs of the DB franchise over the years (that being all the time since they started producing the dub themselves back in 1998 after parting from the syndication deal with Saban and no longer outsourcing the dub voice work to Ocean Studios) as both Ian Corlett and Peter Kelamis preceded him prior to that point before production on the dub was moved in house. Plus of course, that’s also counting all of the alternate Canadian dubs done by Ocean/Westwood for the latter half of DBZ and Blue Water for OG DB and GT which had the late Kirby Morrow, Jeremiah Yurk among others play Adult Goku in English. Throw in Richard Cox for the still unreleased Ocean dub of Kai 1.0 (best known for being the second voice of Male Ranma in Ranma 1/2 and the title half human demon character in InuYasha)

[Scsigs]

Yeah, and I’ve never quite understood Schemmel’s possessive attachment to his role as Goku and that having fueled his actions at times. It’s not like he was and is the one and ONLY English dub voice for the character in FUNimation’s dubs of the DB franchise over the years (that being all the time since they started producing the dub themselves back in 1998 after parting from the syndication deal with Saban and no longer outsourcing the dub voice work to Ocean Studios) as both Ian Corlett and Peter Kelamis preceded him prior to that point before production on the dub was moved in house. Plus of course, that’s also counting all of the alternate Canadian dubs done by Ocean/Westwood for the latter half of DBZ and Blue Water for OG DB and GT which had the late Kirby Morrow, Jeremiah Yurk among others play Adult Goku in English. Throw in Richard Cox for the still unreleased Ocean dub of Kai 1.0 (best known for being the second voice of Male Ranma in Ranma 1/2 and the title half human demon character in InuYasha).

My assumption is that it was his first big role in acting & he's gotten so much praise for it over the years, so it kinda went to his head. It's also just his attitude over the years that's the problem. Like, I can understand wanting to have a distinction between him & Peter for which exact Goku voices they were, but getting him uninvited from a convention was uncalled for. He should've just called or messaged Peter & asked him about it. I think he would've understood. It's just so dumb.

[ThunderMite42]

Yeah, and i’ve never quite understood Schemmel’s possessive attachment to his role as Goku and that having fueled his actions at times. It’s not like he was and is the one and ONLY English dub voice for the character in FUNimation’s dubs of the DB franchise over the years (that being all the time since they started producing the dub themselves back in 1998 after parting from the syndication deal with Saban and no longer outsourcing the dub voice work to Ocean Studios) as both Ian Corlett and Peter Kelamis preceded him prior to that point before production on the dub was moved in house. Plus of course, that’s also counting all of the alternate Canadian dubs done by Ocean/Westwood for the latter half of DBZ and Blue Water for OG DB and GT which had the late Kirby Morrow, Jeremiah Yurk among others play Adult Goku in English. Throw in Richard Cox for the still unreleased Ocean dub of Kai 1.0 (best known for being the second voice of Male Ranma in Ranma 1/2 and the title half human demon character in InuYasha)

As well as Nesty Calvo Ramirez in the Creative Products (Filipino English) dubs, David Gasman in the AB Groupe ("Big Green") dub, and Lex Lang in the Bang Zoom! dub of Super. And Steve Blum in Final Bout, if you really wanna count that.

[LostTimeLord]

I felt the second response was appropriate since, regardless of how some of the cast members felt 20 years ago, they've clearly chilled out a lot, except Sean Schemmel

So SylentEcho's point still stands, but applies to one important actor rather than the cast as a whole?

Yeah, you said "for fun," but even then, I don't understand what the goal of a fundraiser would be, nor how you'd go about achieving it if the goal is to get Ocean to release the dub.

I took that to mean 'if it hypothetically got released...' i.e. in a scenario where all of the rights/logistics get sorted, what happens next.
And, IMO, the answer is that Crunchyroll themselves probably wouldn't do anything with the dub. They could have included the Ocean dubs as bonus tracks on 'remastered' movies 1-3, but they didn't. They don't even bother including their own alternative dubs, like the various simuldubs that were revised for home video or the 'TV-safe' version of Dragon Ball Super; even the DBZ's 'US soundtrack' option was a new revision. Hell, clips from Funimation's TV version made their way onto the Japanese DVDs, but not the American ones!

[SuperSaiyaManZ94]

Yeah, and i’ve never quite understood Schemmel’s possessive attachment to his role as Goku and that having fueled his actions at times. It’s not like he was and is the one and ONLY English dub voice for the character in FUNimation’s dubs of the DB franchise over the years (that being all the time since they started producing the dub themselves back in 1998 after parting from the syndication deal with Saban and no longer outsourcing the dub voice work to Ocean Studios) as both Ian Corlett and Peter Kelamis preceded him prior to that point before production on the dub was moved in house. Plus of course, that’s also counting all of the alternate Canadian dubs done by Ocean/Westwood for the latter half of DBZ and Blue Water for OG DB and GT which had the late Kirby Morrow, Jeremiah Yurk among others play Adult Goku in English. Throw in Richard Cox for the still unreleased Ocean dub of Kai 1.0 (best known for being the second voice of Male Ranma in Ranma 1/2 and the title half human demon character in InuYasha)

As well as Nesty Calvo Ramirez in the Creative Products (Filipino English) dubs, David Gasman in the AB Groupe ("Big Green") dub, and Lex Lang in the Bang Zoom! dub of Super. And Steve Blum in Final Bout, if you really wanna count that.

Yeah, that’s also true but i’m talking specifically for the US/Canadian dubs not all the dub voices everywhere like the aforementioned non American dubs.

[SuperSaiyaManZ94]

Yeah, and I’ve never quite understood Schemmel’s possessive attachment to his role as Goku and that having fueled his actions at times. It’s not like he was and is the one and ONLY English dub voice for the character in FUNimation’s dubs of the DB franchise over the years (that being all the time since they started producing the dub themselves back in 1998 after parting from the syndication deal with Saban and no longer outsourcing the dub voice work to Ocean Studios) as both Ian Corlett and Peter Kelamis preceded him prior to that point before production on the dub was moved in house. Plus of course, that’s also counting all of the alternate Canadian dubs done by Ocean/Westwood for the latter half of DBZ and Blue Water for OG DB and GT which had the late Kirby Morrow, Jeremiah Yurk among others play Adult Goku in English. Throw in Richard Cox for the still unreleased Ocean dub of Kai 1.0 (best known for being the second voice of Male Ranma in Ranma 1/2 and the title half human demon character in InuYasha).

My assumption is that it was his first big role in acting & he's gotten so much praise for it over the years, so it kinda went to his head. It's also just his attitude over the years that's the problem. Like, I can understand wanting to have a distinction between him & Peter for which exact Goku voices they were, but getting him uninvited from a convention was uncalled for. He should've just called or messaged Peter & asked him about it. I think he would've understood. It's just so dumb.

Yes, and even now that still doesn’t make any sense to me almost seven years later. So, apparently he was cagey about it to the point of causing one of the previous Goku voice actors from the Ocean/Saban days to be barred from the aforementioned convention? I dunno what the issue was, as it’s not like Schemmel was the only dub voice of Adult Goku in FUNi’s dub for while yes he’s ostensibly been THE consistent VA for the grown up version of the character in the series dubs, video games and other related projects since 1999 he actually wasn’t the first voice actor that FUNimation had voicing him prior to their taking dub production in house from the Ginyu saga onward, or if you wanna go a little further back then their (god awful) dub of Dragon Ball movie 2/Sleeping Princess in Devil’s Castle which was their very first in house production the year prior.

[Scsigs]

I felt the second response was appropriate since, regardless of how some of the cast members felt 20 years ago, they've clearly chilled out a lot, except Sean Schemmel

So SylentEcho's point still stands, but applies to one important actor rather than the cast as a whole?

Yeah, you said "for fun," but even then, I don't understand what the goal of a fundraiser would be, nor how you'd go about achieving it if the goal is to get Ocean to release the dub.

I took that to mean 'if it hypothetically got released...' i.e. in a scenario where all of the rights/logistics get sorted, what happens next.
And, IMO, the answer is that Crunchyroll themselves probably wouldn't do anything with the dub. They could have included the Ocean dubs as bonus tracks on 'remastered' movies 1-3, but they didn't. They don't even bother including their own alternative dubs, like the various simuldubs that were revised for home video or the 'TV-safe' version of Dragon Ball Super; even the DBZ's 'US soundtrack' option was a new revision. Hell, clips from Funimation's TV version made their way onto the Japanese DVDs, but not the American ones!

Yes, but there's more to it than that.

They definitely should've included the Pioneer dubs on the rereleases of the first 3 Z films, as they've done similar things with other shows & movies that have been dubbed multiple times into English. It's a real shame that they didn't.

The US soundtrack version of the Z dub is mainly a revision in that they remixed the audio to have the newer recordings they did for the Orange Bricks to standardize the voice cast across both that track & the track with the Japanese music. The only real fuck-ups being a few outtake lines got used by accident, 17's audio being too low in the mix, & they put the wrong US tracks in when remixing that audio for some reason. I don't care much for the Z dub, so I don't care if the original version of it gets put on the newer releases in addition to the reversion of it since I view it as polishing a turd, but I'm not gonna fight you on it if YOU do.
As for the TV safe version of Super's dub, it was always made for broadcasts on kid's TV networks just like Kai's dub was. Since Kai's was never put on the home releases, I never expected Super's to be. It's like how they set the default audio track on their releases to the English dub with Japanese music one for all DB releases outside of the Dragon Boxes. They prefer you watch that version over the other when it comes to Z. Hell, I bet if there were no nostalgia for the original Z dub, they wouldn't even bother including the dub track with the Faulconer score anymore. Especially since Kai's dub was intended to be better produced & more accurate than the Z dub & Super continued that.

But, yeah, I don't see Crunchyroll having any interest in the Ocean dub of Kai. If it hasn't come out in the 16 years since it was recorded, it's never going to unless it somehow leaks out on to the internet. I'd like to hear it too, but it's just not realistic.

[ThunderMite42]

The only real fuck-ups being a few outtake lines got used by accident, 17's audio being too low in the mix, & they put the wrong US tracks in when remixing that audio for some reason.

The "remastered" track is also missing any post-production vocal effects, like third-form Freeza's layered voice, Android #19's robotic filter (so he just sounds like a weird baby now), and Super Boo's pitch-shifting (he's supposed to be deeper).

[Scsigs]

Yes, and even now that still doesn’t make any sense to me almost seven years later. So, apparently he was cagey about it to the point of causing one of the previous Goku voice actors from the Ocean/Saban days to be barred from the aforementioned convention? I dunno what the issue was, as it’s not like Schemmel was the only dub voice of Adult Goku in FUNi’s dub for while yes he’s ostensibly been THE consistent VA for the grown up version of the character in the series dubs, video games and other related projects since 1999 he actually wasn’t the first voice actor that FUNimation had voicing him prior to their taking dub production in house from the Ginyu saga onward, or if you wanna go a little further back then their (god awful) dub of Dragon Ball movie 2/Sleeping Princess in Devil’s Castle which was their very first in house production the year prior.

So, I don't know exactly why Sean can't be more humble. He comes off like he overthinks things & can't get passed that. I mean, hell, he blocked me on Twitter for correcting him misunderstanding something I said in a tweet I tagged him in to help me explain something to someone else regarding the Z dub. So, I don't think he thinks through things at times. I can't explain ego when it comes to someone I either don't know, or haven't seen enough from to properly judge, so who knows really?

[SuperSaiyaManZ94]

Yes, and even now that still doesn’t make any sense to me almost seven years later. So, apparently he was cagey about it to the point of causing one of the previous Goku voice actors from the Ocean/Saban days to be barred from the aforementioned convention? I dunno what the issue was, as it’s not like Schemmel was the only dub voice of Adult Goku in FUNi’s dub for while yes he’s ostensibly been THE consistent VA for the grown up version of the character in the series dubs, video games and other related projects since 1999 he actually wasn’t the first voice actor that FUNimation had voicing him prior to their taking dub production in house from the Ginyu saga onward, or if you wanna go a little further back then their (god awful) dub of Dragon Ball movie 2/Sleeping Princess in Devil’s Castle which was their very first in house production the year prior.

So, I don't know exactly why Sean can't be more humble. He comes off like he overthinks things & can't get passed that. I mean, hell, he blocked me on Twitter for correcting him misunderstanding something I said in a tweet I tagged him in to help me explain something to someone else regarding the Z dub. So, I don't think he thinks through things at times. I can't explain ego when it comes to someone I either don't know, or haven't seen enough from to properly judge, so who knows really?

Yeah, i know you had mentioned about that before when we’d discussed on this very thing way back when. Like, he seriously blocked you just because he either didn’t understand or misinterpreted what you said in response to his misunderstanding? That seems like a really odd, nonsensical thing to block someone over, so this says to me it’s some kind of bizarre ego or personality thing with him.

The Peter Kelamis convention thing is just...weird. Like, did Schemmel feel that way for some reason due to them both having been past or present voices of Goku and it rubbed him the wrong way or something because of how possessive he is about the role? Especially given the two of them had apparently never even met in person as mentioned in that post. It feels like such an odd thing to go to such a drastic action over.

[LostTimeLord]

The US soundtrack version of the Z dub is mainly a revision in that they remixed the audio to have the newer recordings they did for the Orange Bricks to standardize the voice cast across both that track & the track with the Japanese music.

They recast a few roles (like the narrator) and re-recorded entire episodes worth of lines for some characters, right? Anyone who was curious to hear it 'as it was', or simply preferred the original castings, was not catered to. My point is that Crunchyroll doesn't seem to bother including those kinds of 'archive curiosities', even when it would be relatively easy.

Since Kai's was never put on the home releases, I never expected Super's to be.

The logistics are different, as Kai's edited dub wouldn't sync up with the uncut footage (which, yes, would also apply to the Ocean dub). Whereas the kid-friendly version of Super seems to have been visually uncut, and of course the alternative recordings that aired on Adult Swim were definitely uncut.

[Scsigs]

Yeah, i know you had mentioned about that before when we’d discussed on this very thing way back when. Like, he seriously blocked you just because he either didn’t understand or misinterpreted what you said in response to his misunderstanding? That seems like a really odd, nonsensical thing to block someone over, so this says to me it’s some kind of bizarre ego or personality thing with him.

The Peter Kelamis convention thing is just...weird. Like, did Schemmel feel that way for some reason due to them both having been past or present voices of Goku and it rubbed him the wrong way or something because of how possessive he is about the role? Especially given the two of them had apparently never even met in person as mentioned in that post. It feels like such an odd thing to go to such a drastic action over.

That is literally the only conclusion I can come to on that shit. It's so dumb. I think it was because I annoyed him as well, but not sure.

He said in Geekdom101's interview with him that it was over a crediting thing where he didn't want people confusing Peter for him since he doesn't like people confusing him for Peter or Ian Corlett. It's probably also that, but it's also just like...so he reacted to that by getting Peter uninvited tot he con? That's so fucking dumb if so.

They recast a few roles (like the narrator) and re-recorded entire episodes worth of lines for some characters, right? Anyone who was curious to hear it 'as it was', or simply preferred the original castings, was not catered to. My point is that Crunchyroll doesn't seem to bother including those kinds of 'archive curiosities', even when it would be relatively easy.

...

The logistics are different, as Kai's edited dub wouldn't sync up with the uncut footage (which, yes, would also apply to the Ocean dub). Whereas the kid-friendly version of Super seems to have been visually uncut, and of course the alternative recordings that aired on Adult Swim were definitely uncut.

Yeah, a lot of the earliest recordings in the Freeza arc were redone to be more consistent with the later ones. The only person to not rerecord anything was Schemmel. I don't blame them for not keeping those around, tbh.

Kai's edited dub wouldn't be hard to edit back in the audio or shots they cut out for Nickelodeon, imo. I assume they just recorded the lines to the uncut episodes, then sent them to Nicktoons for determining content edits.

[LostTimeLord]

Kai's edited dub wouldn't be hard to edit back in the audio or shots they cut out for Nickelodeon, imo. I assume they just recorded the lines to the uncut episodes, then sent them to Nicktoons for determining content edits.

We know from the credits that Ocean was involved in post-production, so I'm assuming that Funimation took their pre-cut version and dubbed over it with their own recordings. Although I suppose they could have also just spliced Ocean's digipaint work into their version. Either way, the final mix has the music retimed around the cuts and you'd loose those aforementioned digipaint edits - as opposed to Super's audio track already matching the uncut video without any extra editing/mixing required. I was making a point specifically about material that could be used off-the-shelf.

[ThunderMite42]

Kai's edited dub wouldn't be hard to edit back in the audio or shots they cut out for Nickelodeon, imo.

It's a lot more tedious than you'd think, just ask iKaos. Pretty much every single fight has a bajillion micro-cuts whenever direct blows are dealt, and it only gets worse as the show goes on. Plus, the music would sound very jittery since it'd been retimed to fit said cuts.

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

Yeah, and i’ve never quite understood Schemmel’s possessive attachment to his role as Goku and that having fueled his actions at times. It’s not like he was and is the one and ONLY English dub voice for the character in FUNimation’s dubs of the DB franchise over the years (that being all the time since they started producing the dub themselves back in 1998 after parting from the syndication deal with Saban and no longer outsourcing the dub voice work to Ocean Studios) as both Ian Corlett and Peter Kelamis preceded him prior to that point before production on the dub was moved in house. Plus of course, that’s also counting all of the alternate Canadian dubs done by Ocean/Westwood for the latter half of DBZ and Blue Water for OG DB and GT which had the late Kirby Morrow, Jeremiah Yurk among others play Adult Goku in English. Throw in Richard Cox for the still unreleased Ocean dub of Kai 1.0 (best known for being the second voice of Male Ranma in Ranma 1/2 and the title half human demon character in InuYasha)

As well as Nesty Calvo Ramirez in the Creative Products (Filipino English) dubs, David Gasman in the AB Groupe ("Big Green") dub, and Lex Lang in the Bang Zoom! dub of Super. And Steve Blum in Final Bout, if you really wanna count that.

Theres also Dave Bridges for the Animax dub of original Dragon Ball's 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai arc that was recorded in Hong Kong and aired throughout Southeast Asia.

[Scsigs]

Kai's edited dub wouldn't be hard to edit back in the audio or shots they cut out for Nickelodeon, imo. I assume they just recorded the lines to the uncut episodes, then sent them to Nicktoons for determining content edits.

We know from the credits that Ocean was involved in post-production, so I'm assuming that Funimation took their pre-cut version and dubbed over it with their own recordings. Although I suppose they could have also just spliced Ocean's digipaint work into their version. Either way, the final mix has the music retimed around the cuts and you'd loose those aforementioned digipaint edits - as opposed to Super's audio track already matching the uncut video without any extra editing/mixing required. I was making a point specifically about material that could be used off-the-shelf.

It's a lot more tedious than you'd think, just ask iKaos. Pretty much every single fight has a bajillion micro-cuts whenever direct blows are dealt, and it only gets worse as the show goes on. Plus, the music would sound very jittery since it'd been retimed to fit said cuts.

So, to what I meant. FUNimation would've dubbed the series uncut starting in 2010. By which time, certain words they would've automatically agreed to be bad for kids to hear like swear words & any sexual innuendos or adult jokes would be the first to alter from the uncut scripts, which also accounts for the altered lines in the edited dub like the "over 9000" reference. From there, I assume they'd either send the episodes or at least the dub scripts to Nicktoons for further input on what they find acceptable in terms of dialogue. From there, they'd rerecord more lines if necessary, then send those to Nicktoons to get their input on visual edits they needed to do that they wouldn't readily know passed stuff like some of the violence & stuff like the remaining nudity Toei didn't already take care of. From there, they would send the episodes to Ocean for them to edit with a list of what they'd need to do.
Then add on more work from 4Kids when they aired the show on CW, though they'd have Sean Schemmel do his best impersonations to take care of more dialogue at points because he lived in NYC & worked for them at that time.

Thus, I'm willing to be they had a version of the edited dub that was still synced to the uncut footage. And even if they don't, they'd probably still have the isolated recordings that they could then edit into the dubbing tracks.

[ThunderMite42]

Theres also Dave Bridges for the Animax dub of original Dragon Ball's 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai arc that was recorded in Hong Kong and aired throughout Southeast Asia.

I was gonna mention him, but that dub is lost, so it's not like anyone knows what his take sounds like anyway.

[Doctor Seaweed Roll]

It's a pity there's no big demand for a Quebec French dub of Dragon Ball Kai. It could've used this dub as source and air it as a SAP track.

Yeah, I'm aware of that ridiculous Quebec dub of the World of Dragon Ball Z DVD but hey, that wasn't even recorded in Montreal, where most of the Quebec French dubs are recorded.

Isn't that the one that came in Mac & Cheese? I remember hearing about that on a defunct French Otaku Forum.

[Doctor Seaweed Roll]

Couldn't Animeigo or Media Blasters release if crunchyroll lost the licence as they are some of the few classic distributors founded pre-Y2K that are still around.