Do you think Goku would have still refused to be wished back if Cell never returned to Earth?

[fadeddreams5]

In this what-if scenario, as in the manga, Cell regenerates after his self-destruction. However, just as he's about to use IT to return to Earth and exact his revenge, he experiences a moment of introspection. The fact that he became significantly stronger after losing forces him to question his own claim of being the "perfect" lifeform. If perfection can be improved upon, was he ever truly perfect to begin with?

Driven by this contradiction, Cell abandons his plans for immediate revenge and retreats into the depths of space in search of answers and, perhaps, a path towards "true perfection."

Meanwhile, King Kai informs Goku that Cell is still alive. Naturally, this information would eventually reach Gohan as well, likely motivating him to continue training in preparation for Cell's eventual return. This begs the question, however: would Goku remain dead in this timeline, or would he accept a revival in order to pursue a rematch against Cell?

I ask because Cell is arguably the only villain Goku never seemed particularly eager to challenge for the thrill of competition. Before the Cell Games began, Goku had already decided that Gohan would be the one to defeat Cell, despite only witnessing Cell's Semi-Perfect form at the time. During the week leading up to the tournament, Goku accepted that he was outmatched and made no effort to bridge the gap at all to make the fight more exciting. When Gohan was sandbagging against Cell, Goku urged him to straight up kill him. Even after Cell's defeat, Goku never expressed any desire to fight him again like he did with Buu.

So with that in mind, would Goku even care enough to come back? Or would he simply let Gohan handle it?

[Zephyr]

I think the Cell Games is a difficult section to read and extrapolate from because it basically functioned during serialization as the original conclusion to Goku's character arc. So we can interpret what happened, Goku's actions, his words, and his motivations, through the lens of "this is how his story ends". But, of course, DB continued, and Goku came back, and so he got a new ending. And so we can interpret what happened at the Cell Games, Goku's actions, his words, and his motivations, through the lens of "this is just another chapter in the story that ends with Oob". We might get different answers depending on which of these two ways we frame the question.

If I think about the Cell Games as the conclusion to Goku's character arc, then I have to read him as basically trying to be (and one-up) Muten Roshi in the 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai and Piccolo Daimao arcs. He's giving up to make way for the next generation, and he's gonna sacrifice his life to do it. And then he'll even stay gone, like his grandfather, whose student was also kinda partially responsible for his death. Some full circles here. Between his relative disinterest in the big fight, and his apparently strong desire to stay dead once it happened, he just seems kinda over it all. Fair enough I guess, time comes for us all. Now, I don't think this really works that well as an ending for a number of reasons. Gohan did a much worse job than Goku did when "the torch was passed" to him, so Goku's confidence in him is misplaced. And his badguy magnet thing falls apart under scrutiny. So it's a sloppy ending. But it is an ending. This Goku I don't think would be terribly interested in fighting Cell. Those days are behind him. His story is done.

But when I think of the Cell Games as a part of a larger story that ends with the 28th Tenkaichi Budokai, then it all hits quite differently. His actions against Majin Vegeta make me feel like he was desperate for a fight on that level after spending 7 years in the afterlife. This in turn makes me feel like he thought staying dead 7 years ago would have been the more fun thing to do, and he was wrong. This, in turn in turn makes me feel like he stayed dead for the fun of it, and the badguy magnet thing was a bad excuse. Which means he wasn't necessarily "over it". This of course warrants that we give additional reasons for his disinterest in training and fighting Cell to the bitter end. I think the Senzu scene alone suggests that Goku is projecting himself onto Gohan, and Piccolo effectively calls this projection out. So I think the concession is the result of this projection as well. "This is Gohan's tournament", he said of his son who just spent the last year indulging in his father's favorite hobby with him. You can see the gears moving in Goku's head! But Gohan got his tournament, and he didn't like it as much as Goku'd hoped. I think there's a good chance this Goku would pursue a rematch against Cell, but it's also possible that he's still hoping the Afterlife has bigger fish than the bug man.

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It's kinda funny and kinda sad how much more Cell wanted to fight Goku than the other way around. Goku threatened to withhold martial relations from Cell, and it seemed to have worked in the moment at least. Cell thought that Goku was the only person worth fighting, and so was basically designing that whole ring for Goku. Cell was disappointed when Goku conceded (even if Gohan was a fine substitute after powering up). And considering that Goku is basically one of Cell's near-dozen "parents", it's like a kid who just wants to play with his dad, but is forced to play with his brother instead. So I like the idea of Cell running away from his fight with Gohan, and training to get stronger. Maybe dad will finally respect you if you train.

[L3anD3RStar]

For me I think the bigger question is would he have chosen to stay dead if he’d known for sure that Chi-Chi was pregnant. Or does he carelessly decide that his second son doesn’t need to know his dad?

This begs the question, however: would Goku remain dead in this timeline, or would he accept a revival in order to pursue a rematch against Cell?

Why would he? He might check on Gohan, but Goku doesn’t want a rematch against Cell. He never planned to defeat Cell himself. He hobbled his own training in order to focus on Gohan. He will want it to be Gohan.

GOKU wants that. Gohan never wanted that. Goku made the choice for him, and Gohan lives with the consequences even now.

Really, Goku is lucky that Gohan is a deeply kind and gentle boy whose capacity for forgiveness is only equaled by his capacity for self-sacrifice. Gohan would be justified in harboring some resentment for what his father put him and his family through, all because he couldn’t de-activate his fight brain long enough to understand what they were going through.

I think the Cell Games is a difficult section to read and extrapolate from because it basically functioned during serialization as the original conclusion to Goku's character arc. So we can interpret what happened, Goku's actions, his words, and his motivations, through the lens of "this is how his story ends". But, of course, DB continued, and Goku came back, and so he got a new ending. And so we can interpret what happened at the Cell Games, Goku's actions, his words, and his motivations, through the lens of "this is just another chapter in the story that ends with Oob".

For what it’s worth, it seems obvious to me that Toriyama was desperate to pass the torch just so he could stop drawing the damn manga. Maybe that’s why he pulled the plug on Gohan and the Saiyaman stuff - because he didn’t see an end to it and didn’t have the gas in the tank to devote ten more years of his life to it.

In universe, I don’t think Goku has a very good record of training children. We saw what happened to Gohan and Gotenks. They both learned a lot and became really powerful, but… that was it.

We have no reason to think Uub will be any different. Just because Goku WANTS him to take over his job doesn’t mean that’s what Uub wants.

Goku makes a much better student than a teacher. He can’t really get into the heads of his students, or relate to them in any way other than enjoying the process of fighting and getting stronger.

[Zephyr]

For what it’s worth, it seems obvious to me that Toriyama was desperate to pass the torch just so he could stop drawing the damn manga. Maybe that’s why he pulled the plug on Gohan and the Saiyaman stuff - because he didn’t see an end to it and didn’t have the gas in the tank to devote ten more years of his life to it.

In universe, I don’t think Goku has a very good record of training children. We saw what happened to Gohan and Gotenks. They both learned a lot and became really powerful, but… that was it.

We have no reason to think Uub will be any different. Just because Goku WANTS him to take over his job doesn’t mean that’s what Uub wants.

Goku makes a much better student than a teacher. He can’t really get into the heads of his students, or relate to them in any way other than enjoying the process of fighting and getting stronger.

I don't think "passing the torch" was a way to end the manga, otherwise it would have ended at the Cell Games and not even continued with Gohan in high school. His starting point for the Boo arc was "this is the end", because he was pretty much at his limit for thinking of ways to make even stronger protagonists or antagonists. He pulled the plug on Gohan's slice of life stuff for the simple reason that he figured he should eventually make a new enemy show up. Which makes sense because Dragon Ball was a kung fu manga by design that got as popular as it did because of its focus on tournaments and battles. The people are here for fights, give them what they want.

I think Goku's a fine teacher. That his previous students learned a lot is testament to that. That they personally aren't nearly as into fighting as Goku is doesn't really serve as a blemish on his ability to teach, it just means he had students ill-fit to fill his shoes. He needs a student who loves fighting and getting stronger as much as he does. I think the story definitely expects us to see Oob as being that guy, otherwise it wouldn't have ended the way it did. A future writer could open the story back up after the 28th TB and make it so that Oob wasn't the ideal successor either, but until that happens I'm willing to take the story at its (implied) word here.

[Zebra]

The reason Toriyama moved away from the high school setting was obviously because he changed his mind on Gohan being the protagonist and decided to bring Gokuu back. If Gohan's not the protagonist, then there's no reason for the story to be set at Gohan's high school.