Toriyama was only speaking about the form's design. Out of universe, it's inspired by SS2 Kid Gohan. In universe, it's not a Super Saiyan form at all.Zephyr wrote: Fri Aug 21, 2026 1:43 pmOn the one hand....Zebra wrote: Thu Aug 20, 2026 9:50 pmIt's clearly supposed to be an evolution of Ultimate. That's why Gohan was in his Ultimate form when he unlocked it.
Toriyama had every opportunity to mention Ultimate when explaining what he had in mind with Beast, and he didn't.
The first time Gohan unlocked Ultimate, he was in his base form, and we know Ultimate is rooted in base.For instance, Goku starting out a fight in Blue before turning on Ultra Instinct wouldn't mean that the latter is rooted in the former, it would mean that he started the fight at one level of strength and decided partway through the fight that a higher level was needed. And if I remember correctly, Gohan goes from Super Saiyan to Ultimate in the film, and I don't think anyone's going to try to argue that Ultimate is rooted in Super Saiyan.
Likewise, the first time Gohan unlocked Beast, he was in his Ultimate form, so ...
I see that as more Gohan releasing close to his full power. Before turning Ultimate, Gohan had to turn Super Saiyan to release his full power. Ultimate became his full power when Elder Kaioushin powered him up, so he turns into that instead.Maybe Ultimate is rooted in Super Saiyan, at least in part? In the manga, the Elder Kaioshin tells Gohan to power up like he's turning into a Super Saiyan in order to turn Ultimate on.