Unpopular DB opinions

[MasenkoHA]

You got your self an Unpopular Opinion Seal of Approval, bud! lol
I think you might be the first person I can think of who don't like Z 1st OP and ED.

Then I'll be your second. Cha-La Head Cha-La is a very overused song and so I don't like it anymore. Sometimes you really have to be careful with your nostalgia drug, too much of it will be bad, and we're at that point with that song. Can't stand it anymore.

I'll be joining the club; I'm neutral on Z's first ending and believe its first opening is very overrated. Don't get me wrong, It's not that I dislike it, but is it good enough to be the face of Dragon Ball music and be used over and over again ? honestly, no.

I would wager its status as the musical face of the franchise has more to do with it being the theme song of the show’s most popular years rather than just because it was arbitrarily chosen as the franchise best theme.


I don’t even think it’s that overused. It played in the last episode of Kai the end credits of Battle of Gods, and the title card for Super Broly and that’s it…I think? (Cant for the life of me remember if Resurrection F and Super Hero used it). It tends to get played in general promotions for the franchise because yeah no shit.

Being used in Battle of Gods at least made sense. It was a Dragon Ball Z movie and the first “new thing” with the Z moniker since 1996 aside from a couple Japan only
OVAs.

At the very least the franchise has never gone back to actually reusing Head Cha La for any post-Cell saga series themes.


As far as the song itself. I like it. It’s catchy, memorable,
not overly cheesy but the right amount of cheese and it just feels Dragon Ball even more so than Makafushigi Adventure which got dated with its emphasis on adventure before the first series was even over.

I do think We Gotta Power and Dan Dan are just as good as Head Cha La but Dan Dan feels more like “ Japanese Pop Song that got picked as a Dragon Ball theme to boost sales of said song” than an actual Dragon Ball theme.

As far as the rest go; Dragon Soul is fine but very generic “Yes you’re watching a Shonen Action Series with friendship and dreams and perseverance ”
(and the English version straight up gives me diabetes) . Fight it Out is shit from a butt and my pick for worst theme the series ever had but I do enjoy Fuji Tv’s replacement Kuu-Zen-Zetsu-Go the best Kai theme song no contest. Super Dynamic is as underwhelming as the first two arcs of Super but Genkai Toppa x Survivor is fun and energetic and definitely the best theme from modern Dragon Ball.

And I could literally put Daima’s theme song on right now and will completely forget what it sounded like as soon as it’s over.

[JulieYBM]

Wait, Cha-La Head Cha-La was used in the last episode of Dragon Ball Kai?! This is the first that I'm hearing about this. I guess that if the idea was for it to transition straight into Battle of Gods, it made perfect sense since the two projects were in production at the same time.

[MasenkoHA]

Wait, Cha-La Head Cha-La was used in the last episode of Dragon Ball Kai?! This is the first that I'm hearing about this. I guess that if the idea was for it to transition straight into Battle of Gods, it made perfect sense since the two projects were in production at the same time.

Apparently only International Versions use it. The Japanese domestic release didn’t include it I guess

https://youtu.be/koWVpGefvWQ?si=58RY2GkNEIVDxWlo

The dub actors sure do blare it out.

On a tangent good god Eric Vale’s Trunks is terrible. He will never get enough hate for still doing that terrible forced cartoony “grrr I’m a tough guy this is my tough voice” that most of the Funimation cast had the good sense to move away from by 2004

[DanielSSJ]

Apparently only International Versions use it. The Japanese domestic release didn’t include it I guess

https://youtu.be/koWVpGefvWQ?si=58RY2GkNEIVDxWlo

The dub actors sure do blare it out.

On a tangent good god Eric Vale’s Trunks is terrible. He will never get enough hate for still doing that terrible forced cartoony “grrr I’m a tough guy this is my tough voice” that most of the Funimation cast had the good sense to move away from by 2004

I think it might've gotten worse in the gap between Z and Kai

[JulieYBM]

Wait, Cha-La Head Cha-La was used in the last episode of Dragon Ball Kai?! This is the first that I'm hearing about this. I guess that if the idea was for it to transition straight into Battle of Gods, it made perfect sense since the two projects were in production at the same time.

Apparently only International Versions use it. The Japanese domestic release didn’t include it I guess

https://youtu.be/koWVpGefvWQ?si=58RY2GkNEIVDxWlo

The dub actors sure do blare it out.

On a tangent good god Eric Vale’s Trunks is terrible. He will never get enough hate for still doing that terrible forced cartoony “grrr I’m a tough guy this is my tough voice” that most of the Funimation cast had the good sense to move away from by 2004

Oh wow, that's interesting. I know that they produced Let It Burn as an insert song for The Final Chapters but I didn't expect them to use not only a second insert song, but Cha-La Head Cha-La like this. I'm surprised that they got all of the rights cleared.

Both of the Dragon Ball Kai Majin Buu arc versions are so weird. Terrible music placement and remastering, but also Let It Burn came out of it and that song is an insane banger.

[MasenkoHA]

Apparently only International Versions use it. The Japanese domestic release didn’t include it I guess

https://youtu.be/koWVpGefvWQ?si=58RY2GkNEIVDxWlo

The dub actors sure do blare it out.

On a tangent good god Eric Vale’s Trunks is terrible. He will never get enough hate for still doing that terrible forced cartoony “grrr I’m a tough guy this is my tough voice” that most of the Funimation cast had the good sense to move away from by 2004

I think it might've gotten worse in the gap between Z and Kai

Yeah he’s one of the few actors from the English side that actually got worse in Kai rather than better.

Like it was just kind of a bad performance during the Z dub of the Cell saga by Kai and Super it’s straight up unlistenable

[Scsigs]

Wait, Cha-La Head Cha-La was used in the last episode of Dragon Ball Kai?! This is the first that I'm hearing about this. I guess that if the idea was for it to transition straight into Battle of Gods, it made perfect sense since the two projects were in production at the same time.

To add to the other reply, yeah, the international cut used the cover by Flow from Battle of Gods. It's weird because the song wasn't anywhere in Kai, but I don't hate it.

Apparently only International Versions use it. The Japanese domestic release didn’t include it I guess

https://youtu.be/koWVpGefvWQ?si=58RY2GkNEIVDxWlo

The dub actors sure do blare it out.

On a tangent good god Eric Vale’s Trunks is terrible. He will never get enough hate for still doing that terrible forced cartoony “grrr I’m a tough guy this is my tough voice” that most of the Funimation cast had the good sense to move away from by 2004

I think it might've gotten worse in the gap between Z and Kai

Yeah he’s one of the few actors from the English side that actually got worse in Kai rather than better.

Like it was just kind of a bad performance during the Z dub of the Cell saga by Kai and Super it’s straight up unlistenable.

So, I disagree. I agree he's gotten more gruff over the years, but I don't think that's a bad thing. However, where I agree he got TOO gruff was in the 2010s between the Kai dub & Super's. Xenoverse 1 & 2, he was REALLY gruff, which I believe was a result of him getting too comfortable playing Sanji in One Piece, of which he uses the same voice, but a little deeper & gruffer. In Super, though, he managed to reel it back. If he kept doing the more gruff version of the voice, I could agree, but I don't think it's as bad as you say.

[PowerPhantom245]

I didn't mind Goku (or Geeku) as high school student in Dragonball Evolution.
Even though it felt awkward, as I watch few more times (which I did... lol), I think high school setting could have worked, if the movie had better writing and directing.
Despite movie had so much flaws, Goku as high school setting was least problematic.
Not to mention, franchise already had high school setting, such as teenage Gohan and Goku Jr. in GT's Hero Legacy, so it's not like there was no precedent for high school setting.
I'm NOT defending Dragonball Evolution as good movie for Goku being high school student; I just think that there was potential that it could turns into a good movie.

If Superman (2025) movie had Clark as plumber or construction worker, instead of newspaper reporter for The Daily Planet, I think it could have turned out the same way, depending on how story turns out.

If there was another attempt of live action movie or TV series and Goku was established as school student (again) or even janitor (lol), I think it can be successful... even though it's not faithful to the source material and turns out awkward.
There has been live action adaptation that has been successful, where main character occupation was not the same as source material, and that certainly applies to Dragon Ball.
Adaptation doesn't have to be completely faithful to source material.

[WittyUsername]

The problem with the high school angle in DBE is that it was seemingly only there because they wanted to be like Spider-Man. It doesn’t add anything to the story, apart from being an excuse for Goku to know Chi-Chi and it’s quickly pushed to the side anyway. The movie’s only 85 minutes long, so it shouldn’t have wasted precious time on that.

[MasenkoHA]

.
Despite movie had so much flaws, Goku as high school setting was least problematic.

I don’t think people hated Goku being in high school. They hated he was more concerned with being popular in school than learning martial arts. Making him the antithesis of Goku.

Goku going to school but still acting like Goku would have probably been a non issue

If Superman (2025) movie had Clark as plumber or construction worker, instead of newspaper reporter for The Daily Planet, I think it could have turned out the same way, depending on how story turns out.

I could be misremembering. But wasn’t reporting on Totally not Israel! crimes against the people of Definitely not Palestine! part of the movie? Because that would be one of the few times his being a journalist is part of the story. Him being a plumber or construction worker would have changed the story. Superman intervenes in a conflict that goes against the interest of the United States to save civilian lives and Clark Kent uses his
job as a reporter to defend Superman’s actions doesn’t work if he’s s a plumber

[JulieYBM]

The issue with the high school stuff in Dragon Ball Evolution really just stems from the film being a bad film. Goku is not an interesting character and Chatwin provides no sauce as an actor to elevate the weak script that he is given to work with. Like, it's pretty clear that he doesn't want to be there and associated with the film or series and I don't blame him.

[Scsigs]

I know I'm not the first person to say this, but Goku in DBE is clearly written to be more like Gohan & I imagine this was because Gohan was a more relatable character to the teen demographic Fox wanted to appeal to, not to mention a fan favorite. It may also be that, similar to FUNi when they dubbed Z, they may have thought that a more accurate Goku would've been off-putting to the average movie-goer, so they changed his personality in the adaptation process.

His relationship with Chichi is also clearly influenced by Gohan's relationship with Videl for similar reasons. Since they made Goku 18 in the movie, they couldn't really adapt how Goku & Chichi met from the series like it was originally written & they didn't wanna bother trying to do the Eastern fantasy world Toriyama wrote into the manga, so they changed it to taking place in the first 3rd in a city heavily modeled on West City or Satan City. Chichi being more of a fighter in the film is also a big giveaway, as, while Chichi DID become a martial artist when she & Goku re-met at the 23rd World Tournament, but she quickly gave that up when she & Goku got married & started their family. Now, Videl also kinda did that, but she's not the same as Chichi & I doubt that she would let Pan start training if she completely gave up martial arts.

Once you realize this, Evolution's character writing starts to make SO much more sense.

[jjgp1112]

I doubt anybody working on that movie knew enough about the source material to even make those decisions with that reasoning

[super michael]

When I watched Dragon Ball Evolution the movie, if I didn't know the characters names in the movie then I wouldn't know I was watching a Dragon Ball movie.

[PowerPhantom245]

The problem with the high school angle in DBE is that it was seemingly only there because they wanted to be like Spider-Man. It doesn’t add anything to the story, apart from being an excuse for Goku to know Chi-Chi and it’s quickly pushed to the side anyway. The movie’s only 85 minutes long, so it shouldn’t have wasted precious time on that.

I was quite surprised movie was under 90 minutes, despite it was adapted from well known IP, especially in time where most action movie are 100~120 minutes range.

I don’t think people hated Goku being in high school. They hated he was more concerned with being popular in school than learning martial arts. Making him the antithesis of Goku.

Goku going to school but still acting like Goku would have probably been a non issue

I know I'm not the first person to say this, but Goku in DBE is clearly written to be more like Gohan & I imagine this was because Gohan was a more relatable character to the teen demographic Fox wanted to appeal to, not to mention a fan favorite. It may also be that, similar to FUNi when they dubbed Z, they may have thought that a more accurate Goku would've been off-putting to the average movie-goer, so they changed his personality in the adaptation process.

His relationship with Chichi is also clearly influenced by Gohan's relationship with Videl for similar reasons. Since they made Goku 18 in the movie, they couldn't really adapt how Goku & Chichi met from the series like it was originally written & they didn't wanna bother trying to do the Eastern fantasy world Toriyama wrote into the manga, so they changed it to taking place in the first 3rd in a city heavily modeled on West City or Satan City. Chichi being more of a fighter in the film is also a big giveaway, as, while Chichi DID become a martial artist when she & Goku re-met at the 23rd World Tournament, but she quickly gave that up when she & Goku got married & started their family. Now, Videl also kinda did that, but she's not the same as Chichi & I doubt that she would let Pan start training if she completely gave up martial arts.

Once you realize this, Evolution's character writing starts to make SO much more sense.

Like I mentioned, I don't think establishing Goku in this movie universe wasn't necessarily a bad idea.
I give studio a credit for ambitious attempt to trying to appeal to large audience... even though most people who was involved in production didn't understand the franchise (e.g. writer apologized).
There was brief moment in the movie that it could have worked (seriously) where it had a potential.
The problem lies more of poor execution, because of weak writing and shockingly low runtime, it didn't have enough time to breath.
I don't know if longer runtime would have made a movie better (probably not), but at the very least, it would flesh out high school setting better (I think).
I know it doesn't sound like I'm making sense, but that's my honest opinion.

When I watched Dragon Ball Evolution the movie, if I didn't know the characters names in the movie then I wouldn't know I was watching a Dragon Ball movie.

This movie had better attempt of faithfulness compared to Transformers (Bayformers) movie, where half of the time, I was forgetting I was watching Transformers (too many bad human drama and comedy and not enough Transformers...).
At least Evolution had tons of easter eggs and reference scattered throughout the movie... even though it was crammed in short run time.

[PhantomSaiyan]

I didn't mind Goku (or Geeku) as high school student in Dragonball Evolution.
Even though it felt awkward, as I watch few more times (which I did... lol), I think high school setting could have worked, if the movie had better writing and directing.
Despite movie had so much flaws, Goku as high school setting was least problematic.

If Superman (2025) movie had Clark as plumber or construction worker, instead of newspaper reporter for The Daily Planet, I think it could have turned out the same way, depending on how story turns out.

I disagree because in the case of Superman, his job isn't important to his character, but with Goku, being an uncivilized country bumpkin that didn't go to school IS his character (with other stuff on top of it ofc, but that aspect of his character never gets left behid), that's the whole point of him when he's introduced in Chapter 1.

I agree that people can take creative liberties and make them work, but making this particular creative liberty is a really tough sell, it's a completely different version of the character that's basically unrecognizable.

Hell, even Goku's whole accent in Japanese is a country accent, it's pretty much integral to who he is

[Scsigs]

Like I mentioned, I don't think establishing Goku in this movie universe wasn't necessarily a bad idea.
I give studio a credit for ambitious attempt to trying to appeal to large audience... even though most people who was involved in production didn't understand the franchise (e.g. writer apologized).
There was brief moment in the movie that it could have worked (seriously) where it had a potential.
The problem lies more of poor execution, because of weak writing and shockingly low runtime, it didn't have enough time to breath.
I don't know if longer runtime would have made a movie better (probably not), but at the very least, it would flesh out high school setting better (I think).
I know it doesn't sound like I'm making sense, but that's my honest opinion.

A longer runtime wouldn't have helped this movie worth a shit, I can tell you that for damn sure. The Pilaf arc isn't overly complicated or long. You could easily tell that story in about 2 hours or less. The problem is that they also tried to stitch the Piccolo Daimao arc on to it which...can't. Because they made Piccolo young out the gate, he didn't need to wish on the Dragon Balls to have his youth restored, yet they kept the plot of Goku & Bulma looking for the Dragon Balls because all they had the rights to adapt were the arcs from the first anime. They did that because they wanted to make sure they could attract fans of Z who may not know about the original anime, plus didn't wanna have to put in the legwork of adapting lesser known material & risk not making money from it, which is why they licensed the rights to DB in the first place. Considering they were fusing the first & the second to last arc of the original show, there's so much context missing, not a lot of things established, & that's not even getting into how they butchered most of the characters. And that resulted in Evolution failing to please anyone because they pissed off older fans, they didn't impress newbies, & thus it failed to turn a profit. To the point where Toriyama hated it & used that spite to rewrite Battle of Gods from what Toei was working on to one of the best DB films. The only saving grace being that James Marsters was brought on as Zamasu years later because he wanted to do right by the fans & we got 1 of the best villain castings in all of English dub DB.

[MasenkoHA]

I know I'm not the first person to say this, but Goku in DBE is clearly written to be more like Gohan & I imagine this was because Gohan was a more relatable character to the teen demographic Fox wanted to appeal to, not to mention a fan favorite. It may also be that, similar to FUNi when they dubbed Z, they may have thought that a more accurate Goku would've been off-putting to the average movie-goer, so they changed his personality in the adaptation process.

His relationship with Chichi is also clearly influenced by Gohan's relationship with Videl for similar reasons. Since they made Goku 18 in the movie, they couldn't really adapt how Goku & Chichi met from the series like it was originally written & they didn't wanna bother trying to do the Eastern fantasy world Toriyama wrote into the manga, so they changed it to taking place in the first 3rd in a city heavily modeled on West City or Satan City. Chichi being more of a fighter in the film is also a big giveaway, as, while Chichi DID become a martial artist when she & Goku re-met at the 23rd World Tournament, but she quickly gave that up when she & Goku got married & started their family. Now, Videl also kinda did that, but she's not the same as Chichi & I doubt that she would let Pan start training if she completely gave up martial arts.

Once you realize this, Evolution's character writing starts to make SO much more sense.

I’m going to second Jjgp that it’s very doubtful anyone working on the movie knew enough about the source to go though that process.

It’s less “let’s make Goku “Gohan” because Gohan is more relatable” and more “So in the original story this Goku character was this wild child who lived on his own in the mountains. That’s weird right? The movie going audience loves high school protagonist right? Put him in high school. Also his wife’s name is Chi Chi, no I’m serious that’s her name, we’re gonna have her be super popular and wealthy and Goku has a crush on her and she’s going to help him with his martial arts because she’s Asian that’d what they do right?


The Goku and Chi Chi relationship in Evolution is way more derivative of Peter and MJ in the first Raimi Spider-man movie than Gohan and Videl.

[PowerPhantom245]

I disagree because in the case of Superman, his job isn't important to his character, but with Goku, being an uncivilized country bumpkin that didn't go to school IS his character (with other stuff on top of it ofc, but that aspect of his character never gets left behid), that's the whole point of him when he's introduced in Chapter 1.

It's same principle of the matter.
Goku as high school student wasn't that of an issue, but problem lies within execution.
If DC Lanterns (Green Lantern) had Hal and John as musician (pianist and rap artist respectively) instead of military, it sill would have been the same thing, depending on how story work; though it would be weird why Guardians of the Space would recruit musicians instead of military, though it's no more farfetched than franchise of floating head recruiting 5 teenagers with attitudes to fight against evil space witch. lol

I agree that people can take creative liberties and make them work, but making this particular creative liberty is a really tough sell, it's a completely different version of the character that's basically unrecognizable.

Hell, even Goku's whole accent in Japanese is a country accent, it's pretty much integral to who he is

That's the difficult part about adapting Eastern material (Japanese manga) to Western audience.
It's the reason why it took very long to get a well received American adaptation of Eastern/Japanese properties; IIRC, Alita: Battle Angel (2019), was the first successful and well received American adaptation of manga (Gunnm).
Even though I haven't read the manga, based on what I heard, there were quite difference between source material and movie.

In case of Dragon Ball, it's much HARDER to adapt compared to any Japanese IP (manga), since source material, particularly early era (Pilaf Saga, Demon King Piccolo saga), was weird and even Goku at that point in era was... weird.
Goku might be the most hard to adapt character, regardless of who makes the movie.

A longer runtime wouldn't have helped this movie worth a shit, I can tell you that for damn sure.

I agree with that.
It's not just the long runtime that was needed; it needs more revision and rework for writing... and whole bunch of stuffs.
It needs more time to breath, where I was really surprised how short the movie was; 85 minutes surely isn't enough to tell the specific arc.
I honestly think TV series/streaming would work the best, like Netflix One Piece.


Going back to the topic, it honestly doesn't matter too much that Goku was high school student in movie, even though it's awkward. In fact, (another unpopular opinion), Goku was the least problems of the movie IMO.
All I'm trying to say is that there is a POTENTIAL behind that change, and I honestly felt as movie goes on.
How hard Justin tried to portray Goku is debatable, but I do appreciate (or give credit) ambitiousness for this approach (...sort of).
Goku (or Geeku) was weird... but so as Goku in anime/manga in early era, so I guess it's consistent with that. lol

There are plenty of live action adaptation, where characters were different from source material, in some scenario turns out better than source material; heck, MCU Guardians of the Galaxy was very different from original comic, which was lesser know compared to other heroes like Iron Man, Fantastic Four, and X-men, and movies turns out successful.

The Goku and Chi Chi relationship in Evolution is way more derivative of Peter and MJ in the first Raimi Spider-man movie than Gohan and Videl.

I'm quite surprised Sony nor Raimi, sued Fox for ripping off Spider-man; I guess rip-off doesn't count as plagiarism or Dragonball Evolution was so bad that it wasn't worth suing. lol

[dragonballhero]

I know I'm not the first person to say this, but Goku in DBE is clearly written to be more like Gohan & I imagine this was because Gohan was a more relatable character to the teen demographic Fox wanted to appeal to, not to mention a fan favorite. It may also be that, similar to FUNi when they dubbed Z, they may have thought that a more accurate Goku would've been off-putting to the average movie-goer, so they changed his personality in the adaptation process.

His relationship with Chichi is also clearly influenced by Gohan's relationship with Videl for similar reasons. Since they made Goku 18 in the movie, they couldn't really adapt how Goku & Chichi met from the series like it was originally written & they didn't wanna bother trying to do the Eastern fantasy world Toriyama wrote into the manga, so they changed it to taking place in the first 3rd in a city heavily modeled on West City or Satan City. Chichi being more of a fighter in the film is also a big giveaway, as, while Chichi DID become a martial artist when she & Goku re-met at the 23rd World Tournament, but she quickly gave that up when she & Goku got married & started their family. Now, Videl also kinda did that, but she's not the same as Chichi & I doubt that she would let Pan start training if she completely gave up martial arts.

Once you realize this, Evolution's character writing starts to make SO much more sense.

I doubt anybody working on that movie knew enough about the source material to even make those decisions with that reasoning

Given how the Majin Buu arc isn't looked upon favorably in a wide sense in the West? I kind of doubt the DBE writing team had Gohan's time in high school in mind when doing this movie and writing Goku and Chi-Chi.

What's more... there's something I've always thought about regarding DBE that I'm both surprised and NOT surprised that nobody's ever made the connection to given Goten's... lack of relative popularity to his dad and brother, I guess.

Given 'Goku's' personality in the movie? Aside from going to high school and all, the whole thing of him wanting to be popular and get a girlfriend all screamed 'Goten' to me rather than 'Gohan', the latter of whom I doubt had ANY of that stuff in mind when he was attending Orange Star High School.