Gohan and his differences in other timelines

Post by **Herms** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 1:51 pm

I don't have a problem with speculation, just with referring to that speculation flat-out as Toriyama's original ending.

Onikage725 wrote:Buuuut Piccolo's should-be fatal injury isn't so fatal (fan-wanked away like an Ian Malcolm "oops")

During the 23rd Tenkaichi Budoukai, Piccolo hits Goku with beam in the exact same place, only with a much wider radius, but Goku survives. The whole idea that Piccolo was supposed to be killed by that attack just seems especially filmsy.

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 2:08 pm

This thread has totally changed subject lol.
Speculation is fun though!

Kunzait_83 · Post by **Kunzait_83** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 2:22 pm

Post by **Herms** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 2:40 pm

Forgotten Hero wrote:This thread has totally changed subject lol.
Speculation is fun though!

Bah, it's all my fault. Here's something on topic, though: as I mentioned in my newly completed personal pronoun guide, in the main timeline we see in the series, Gohan always refers to himself with the pronoun "Boku", the form common among young males. He keeps it up as a 16-year old and even as a 26-year old father at the end of the series. However, the Gohan in Future Trunks' timeline uses "Ore", the masculine form of "I" common among the older males in the series (Yamch, grown-up Kuririn, Tenshinhan, Vegeta), giving him a much more manly vibe. But in the main timeline, Ultimate Gohan does briefly use "Ore" as well when fighting Buu, but apparently he reverts to "Boku" sometime later. So there's another distinction between the main Gohan and Future Gohan.

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 4:54 pm

Herms wrote:
Forgotten Hero wrote:This thread has totally changed subject lol.
Speculation is fun though!
Bah, it's all my fault. Here's something on topic, though: as I mentioned in my newly completer personal pronoun guide, in the main timeline we see in the series, Gohan always refers to himself with the pronoun "Boku", the form common among young males. He keeps it up as a 16-year old and even as a 26-year old father at the end of the series. However, the Gohan in Future Trunks' timeline uses "Ore", the masculine form of "I" common among the older males in the series (Yamch, grown-up Kuririn, Tenshinhan, Vegeta), giving him a much more manly vibe. But in the main timeline, Ultimate Gohan does briefly use "Ore" as well when fighting Buu, but apparently he reverts to "Boku" sometime later. So there's distinction between the main Gohan and Future Gohan.

Yes indeed, thanks for the link and the Japanese lesson:P

SaiyaMel · Post by **SaiyaMel** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 5:56 pm

Mirai Gohan is my favorite Gohan, hands down.

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 6:11 pm

SaiyaMel wrote:Mirai Gohan is my favorite Gohan, hands down.

Yeah, "he is a pretty guy!"

Onikage725 · Post by **Onikage725** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 8:47 pm

Herms wrote:I don't have a problem with speculation, just with referring to that speculation flat-out as Toriyama's original ending.

Onikage725 wrote:Buuuut Piccolo's should-be fatal injury isn't so fatal (fan-wanked away like an Ian Malcolm "oops")
During the 23rd Tenkaichi Budoukai, Piccolo hits Goku with beam in the exact same place, only with a much wider radius, but Goku survives. The whole idea that Piccolo was supposed to be killed by that attack just seems especially filmsy.

Ok, I checked out both. Objectively-speaking, Goku's injury was basically a (incredibly bad) shoulder injury. Piccolo's attack on him basically busted through some ribs and his clavicle, and probably should have screwed up his lung. But Goku kept fighting, so I'll chalk that up to the art just not being anatomically correct.

Piccolo's injury by Freeza actually may well have missed his heart. Unless Namek biology has the heart opposite of the human heart, the attack probably didn't. What it most certainly did screw up is Piccolo's right lung. Not technically against the rules of survival, but I still hold the wound looked fatal. Unlike Goku's compared injury, where he went on to finish and win the fight, Piccolo was rendered instantly comatose. And since Namek healing is a deliberate act, that should still qualify as a fatal wound.

Bah, it's all my fault. Here's something on topic, though: as I mentioned in my newly completed personal pronoun guide, in the main timeline we see in the series, Gohan always refers to himself with the pronoun "Boku", the form common among young males. He keeps it up as a 16-year old and even as a 26-year old father at the end of the series. However, the Gohan in Future Trunks' timeline uses "Ore", the masculine form of "I" common among the older males in the series (Yamch, grown-up Kuririn, Tenshinhan, Vegeta), giving him a much more manly vibe. But in the main timeline, Ultimate Gohan does briefly use "Ore" as well when fighting Buu, but apparently he reverts to "Boku" sometime later. So there's another distinction between the main Gohan and Future Gohan.

What does Gohan use in GT? Mirai no Gohan, being older even then that, is old enough to be a dad (and in some ways acts as a surrogate for Trunks).

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Mon Aug 04, 2008 9:00 pm

Herms wrote:During the 23rd Tenkaichi Budoukai, Piccolo hits Goku with beam in the exact same place, only with a much wider radius, but Goku survives. The whole idea that Piccolo was supposed to be killed by that attack just seems especially filmsy.

Vegeta was killed by the same attack.

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:49 am

Vegeta was killed by the same attack.

Not exactly, he was hit in the heart.

This picture is from My Favorite Games.com

Raki · Post by **Raki** » Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:50 am

Forgotten Hero wrote:
Vegeta was killed by the same attack.
Not exactly, he was hit in the heart.
Vegeta be dead pic snipped
This picture is from My Favorite Games.com

Freeza used the same attack on Piccolo.

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:55 am

Raki wrote:
Forgotten Hero wrote:
Vegeta was killed by the same attack.
Not exactly, he was hit in the heart.
Vegeta be dead pic snipped
This picture is from My Favorite Games.com
Freeza used the same attack on Piccolo.

Yep. Are Namekian hearts located in the same area as humans and saiyajin?

Velasa · Post by **Velasa** » Tue Aug 05, 2008 1:59 am

Kunzait_83 wrote: Basically the original Freeza saga ending would've gone something like this- *snip*

I am so glad that never happened, because I would have cried my fucking eyes out and probably never watched the show again. It would be like this book I own that I adore, but once I get to the last two chapters I just have to stop because it ends so horribly.

That horrible cycle-of-pain sort of thing can stay in Mirai timelines and fanfics. I'll take the ending we got in Freezer anyday, even with what it lead to.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Tue Aug 05, 2008 2:23 am

Velasa wrote:That horrible cycle-of-pain sort of thing can stay in Mirai timelines and fanfics. I'll take the ending we got in Freezer anyday, even with what it lead to.

What about variation #3, where Piccolo doesn't die, but Goku and Freeza do, leaving Piccolo as the strongest being in the universe?

Velasa · Post by **Velasa** » Tue Aug 05, 2008 2:25 am

That would be good ^^

It would also be less horrible, as less people would have to die/stay dead/whatnot. And I'm also just a sap for Pic and Nameccians.

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Tue Aug 05, 2008 11:33 am

What about variation #3, where Piccolo doesn't die, but Goku and Freeza do, leaving Piccolo as the strongest being in the universe?

Better than Vegeta being the strongest.

ssj-tom · Post by **ssj-tom** » Tue Aug 05, 2008 1:15 pm

Okay, so We're assuming that had the story concluded with Namek's destruction, the eventual extinction of the Namekians and the Dragonballs, and the death of all the Z-warriors that it would have stayed that way. With Bulma and Gohan's survival, surely this means that there is still a chance for a storyline to be developed that focuses on Gohan growing up, being forced to become the hero and control his hidden potential back on Earth.

Surely Goku's death can also be perceived as a way of shifting the protagonist role on to Gohan, because the main focus of Dragonball was this small naive child that everyone underestimated who managed to overcome the odds every time. Don't we regress back to this ideal by having the central focus on Gohan? Not only that but with Bulma's survival doesn't that mean we could have another sort of Trunks' devastating future storyline, where Bulma desperately tries to build a time machine to correct the past. Surely, if Piccolo hadn't informed Raditz about the Dragonballs and their power, neither Vegeta nor Frieza would posess that knowledge and go searching for them, resulting in no deaths of Goku's friends. Gohan going back in time to stop Raditz before he even confronts Piccolo and Goku would result in no deaths and no mission to Namek.

Well these are just my thoughts and I suppose it sort of re-rexpresses the themes of doom overshadowing the Saiyan and Frieza saga, and perhaps even the themes of the Piccolo saga's where good intentions resulted in evil results, the fact that Kami is responsible for Piccolo, and that the Dragonballs attract such danger and evil, and that Piccolo informing Raditz of them has sealed everyone's fate.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Tue Aug 05, 2008 2:25 pm

ssj-tom wrote:Okay, so We're assuming that had the story concluded with Namek's destruction, the eventual extinction of the Namekians and the Dragonballs, and the death of all the Z-warriors that it would have stayed that way. With Bulma and Gohan's survival, surely this means that there is still a chance for a storyline to be developed that focuses on Gohan growing up, being forced to become the hero and control his hidden potential back on Earth.

That would be left open, as Dragonball was Goku's story. With Goku dead and unable to come back, DB ends.

Kunzait_83 · Post by **Kunzait_83** » Tue Aug 05, 2008 3:44 pm

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Tue Aug 05, 2008 4:15 pm

Rocketman wrote:
ssj-tom wrote:Okay, so We're assuming that had the story concluded with Namek's destruction, the eventual extinction of the Namekians and the Dragonballs, and the death of all the Z-warriors that it would have stayed that way. With Bulma and Gohan's survival, surely this means that there is still a chance for a storyline to be developed that focuses on Gohan growing up, being forced to become the hero and control his hidden potential back on Earth.
That would be left open, as Dragonball was Goku's story. With Goku dead and unable to come back, DB ends.

He could come back...

Kanzenshuu

Gohan and his differences in other timelines

Who is online