Is this a plothole?

goodguy777 · Post by **goodguy777** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 12:44 am

In the manga continuity, it was stated several times that Saiya-jins can't survive in the vacuum of space. But in the Buu-Arc, SSJ Gotenks is flying outside the planet(vacuum of space) few dozen times. Is this a plothole?

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 12:47 am

Yes, and Vegeta training out on meteors in the Garlic Jr. Saga was a mistake too.

goodguy777 · Post by **goodguy777** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 12:53 am

NeptuneKai wrote:Yes, and Vegeta training out on meteors in the Garlic Jr. Saga was a mistake too.

I'm talking about the manga continuity.

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 12:57 am

I'm not sure how to answer those questions, but I remember Bardock flying out into space to fight Freeza.

I guess my answer would be: Gotenks is within the Earth's gravity, in the Dragon Universe meteors have gravity, and Planet Vegeta's gravity field is pretty wide...I don't know, it's a wild guess?

SSj_Rambo · Post by **SSj_Rambo** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 12:58 am

We see that when a Saiya-jin is powered up while in one of the SSj forms they create a sort of barrier of ki around their body. It's been proven (and stated) that ki barriers around a person’s body are capable of repelling very strong energy attacks. So theoretically a SSj ki barrier would be capable of blocking the vacuum of space...of course that would leave the person with only the amount of oxygen that is inside of their barrier, but judging by Gotenks's speed that little amount of oxygen would be plenty.

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 1:00 am

SSj_Rambo wrote:We see that when a Saiya-jin is powered up while in one of the SSj forms they create a sort of barrier of ki around their body. It's been proven (and stated) that ki barriers around a person’s body are capable of repelling very strong energy attacks. So theoretically a SSj ki barrier would be capable of blocking the vacuum of space...of course that would leave the person with only the amount of oxygen that is inside of their barrier, but judging by Gotenks's speed that little amount of oxygen would be plenty.

So, what about Bardock? He wasn't Super Saiyajin.

SSj_Rambo · Post by **SSj_Rambo** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 1:08 am

Forgotten Hero wrote:
SSj_Rambo wrote:We see that when a Saiya-jin is powered up while in one of the SSj forms they create a sort of barrier of ki around their body. It's been proven (and stated) that ki barriers around a person’s body are capable of repelling very strong energy attacks. So theoretically a SSj ki barrier would be capable of blocking the vacuum of space...of course that would leave the person with only the amount of oxygen that is inside of their barrier, but judging by Gotenks's speed that little amount of oxygen would be plenty.
So, what about Bardock? He wasn't Super Saiyajin.

I didn't mean to say that that was possible only for Super Saiya-jins, my bad. We even see Goku in his normal form while on Namek easily block one of Jeece's most powerful energy attacks with ease. So I sure that Bardock would be able to produce a similar barrier, the only question is would it work for either of them?

Of course, many other properties of space are nullified in that special, like it's freezing temperature and the effects it would have had an all of the fighters we saw in space there, as well as the fact that sound cannot travel in space, yet Freeza hears Bardock's yell.

It is possible to go extremely high in a planet's atmosphere and it will look a lot like you are actually in space, and there is no evidence ion that special (that I am aware of) that says that that is not the case.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 1:18 am

SSj_Rambo wrote:Of course, many other properties of space are nullified in that special, like it's freezing temperature

Space isn't freezing. There's nothing to carry heat away from your body. The only heat you'd lose would be what your body actually radiates.

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 1:19 am

Yeah, I'm guessing Planet Vegeta has a high atmosphere. Which could be do to the high gravity of 10x that of Earth.

goodguy777 · Post by **goodguy777** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 1:44 am

Forgotten Hero wrote:Yeah, I'm guessing Planet Vegeta has a high atmosphere. Which could be do to the high gravity of 10x that of Earth.

Atmosphere has nothing to do with gravity because gravity depends on the mass of the planet.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 1:45 am

goodguy777 wrote:
Forgotten Hero wrote:Yeah, I'm guessing Planet Vegeta has a high atmosphere. Which could be do to the high gravity of 10x that of Earth.
Atmosphere has nothing to do with gravity because gravity depends on the mass of a planet, sun, blackholes etc.

A planet with higher gravity can hold more gases around it.

SSj_Rambo · Post by **SSj_Rambo** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 1:47 am

Rocketman wrote:
SSj_Rambo wrote:Of course, many other properties of space are nullified in that special, like it's freezing temperature
Space isn't freezing. There's nothing to carry heat away from your body. The only heat you'd lose would be what your body actually radiates.

You're right, but your body would continue radiaring heat and losing it, so it would feel as if you are in extremely freezing temperatures...plus your blood would start boiling.

goodguy777 · Post by **goodguy777** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 1:54 am

Rocketman wrote:
goodguy777 wrote:
Forgotten Hero wrote:Yeah, I'm guessing Planet Vegeta has a high atmosphere. Which could be do to the high gravity of 10x that of Earth.
Atmosphere has nothing to do with gravity because gravity depends on the mass of a planet, sun, blackholes etc.
A planet with higher gravity can hold more gases around it.

Which is which? High atmosphere or holding more gases around the planet? You stated high atmosphere first, am I wrong?

High atmosphere doesn't produce high gravity.

Gravity depends on the mass of the planet not the height of the atmosphere.

mAcChaos · Post by **mAcChaos** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 1:58 am

goodguy777 · Post by **goodguy777** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 2:00 am

mAcChaos wrote:...

Spam?

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 3:07 am

goodguy777 wrote:
Rocketman wrote:
goodguy777 wrote: Atmosphere has nothing to do with gravity because gravity depends on the mass of a planet, sun, blackholes etc.
A planet with higher gravity can hold more gases around it.
Which is which? High atmosphere or holding more gases around the planet? You stated high atmosphere first, am I wrong?

High atmosphere doesn't produce high gravity.

Gravity depends on the mass of the planet not the height of the atmosphere.

Not in the Dragon Universe...Kaio's planet is small as shit and has a 10x gravity...

This is probably a plot-hole. Toriyama probably wasn't thinking about this shit.

Yasai-R-Mighty · Post by **Yasai-R-Mighty** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 3:28 am

Well maybe saiyans can survive in very, high altitudes where the atmosphere is already so thin, that the sky appears black because there's not enough air molecules up there to scatter light. Vegeta having a higher gravity, then that of Earths could hold more gas with it's gravity, it would probably have a thicker atmosphere. So it's outer layer of atmosphere would stretch out further then Earth's. This might explain what happened in the Bardock special....Just my humble opinion anyway.

Not in the Dragon Universe...Kaio's planet is small as shit and has a 10x gravity... Confused
This is probably a plot-hole. Toriyama probably wasn't thinking about this shit.

Maybe the material Kaio's planet is made of is very dense? What makes an object have, high gravity is not necessarily the size in diameter, as much as how much mass it has. If you have two objects made of the same stuff and one is bigger then the other then it'll naturally have more mass. But a beach ball will weigh less then a piece of metal much smaller then it because, the metal has more mass it's just tightly packed in comparison.

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 3:33 am

I'm not trying to guess at what this is. I'm only putting out facts...To tell you the truth I have not funking clue. This is probably a plot hole.

Also to note, the vacuum of space. Isn't a vacuum only created when a planet is blown up or a planet's core is destroyed?

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 3:42 am

goodguy777 wrote:
mAcChaos wrote:...
Spam?

No, it was a representation of his confoundment at your apparent lack of comprehension skills. For which I can't really blame him since you attempted to argue against something that wasn't even said. Not to mention asking "which is which" between, basically, A and A.

I'll explain.

Which is which? High atmosphere or holding more gases around the planet? You stated high atmosphere first, am I wrong?

That's the same thing.

High atmosphere doesn't produce high gravity.

That wasn't what he said. He said "Yeah, I'm guessing Planet Vegeta has a high atmosphere. Which could be do to the high gravity of 10x that of Earth."

IE: Because Planet Vegeta has a higher gravity it has further reach and can contain more gasses thus giving it a higher atmosphere than the Earth.

Gravity depends on the mass of the planet not the height of the atmosphere.

And no one ever said that the gravity of a world was affected by the height of the atmosphere. What was said was that the height of the atmosphere is affected by the level of gravity.

This goes back to what I said in a previous thread. Read posts before replying to them, please.

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 3:49 am

lol, bro that was sweet!

You pretty much said what I really didn't feel like teaching this guy.

Kanzenshuu

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