Saiyans in Space?

ACCloud · Post by **ACCloud** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 1:50 am

Hey guys,

I am currently rewatching the Saiyan Saga and I just finished the episode where Vegeta and Nappa visit the bug planet of Arlia (in the dub anyway). After leaving the planet Vegeta and Nappa step outside of their spacepods, while in space, and proceed to destroy the planet.
After the '5 minute'

SSJ Goku vs Freeza it became pretty aparent that, unaided, Saiyans could not survive in space; thus disputing the end of the Arlia episode. However since the episode is only filler and can be taken as non-canon, this is not a problem.

However problems do arise in regards to the Bardock special, specifically the scene in which Bardock flies into space so as to take on Freeza. Now Toriyama used the special in the manga, and it is obvisouly supposed to be cannon. However even in the manga one panel does portray Bardock in space along with multiple 'Freeza soldiers'. (As found here:
http://www.daizex.com/general/tidbits/i ... anga_1.jpg

So just wondering, can anyone please explain this? Can Saiyans exist in space for a short period of time, do they have any special implant or aparatus to allow them to exist in Space, is it just a plothole or is it just me thinking to much?

Bussani · Post by **Bussani** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 2:14 am

Good question. I don't think there's ever been an official explanation. They might just be able to hold their breath and be strong enough to survive the vacuum for a while. Maybe their ki keeps them warm, or could even keep a pocket of air around them or something? But yeah, I'm just making stuff up.

SSj_Rambo · Post by **SSj_Rambo** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 2:25 am

There's nothing in the manga or in that TV special that says that Bardock and Freeza's henchmen were in space. It really looks that way, but when you enter the exosphere it can give you the impression that you are in space (as seen here, here and here). So the easiest thing to do is just say that they never even left the atmosphere of the planet.

An interesting theory of mine is that when a person attains SSj2 or above (or you could say SSj3 and above if you want to play it safe) the ki that surrounds their body (their aura) is powerful enough to repel the vacuum of space and act as a shield against all of the elements of space that would have killed them in their base form or lower forms.

It has been proven before that ki can serve as a force field and the ki of a Super Saiya-jin is much more powerful and strong, so to me it seems like it could be possible.

Captain Awesome · Post by **Captain Awesome** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 3:28 am

I would just use the same explanation as we have for the Bardock special..

"The planet has a really BIG atmosphere"

As for Super Saiya-jin 2 and up being able to survive in space, I don't think so, the upgrades seem to just enhance strength and speed, no new abilities are ever spoken of, not to mention the characters never actually go out into space again.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 9:23 am

SSj_Rambo wrote:There's nothing in the manga or in that TV special that says that Bardock and Freeza's henchmen were in space. It really looks that way, but when you enter the exosphere it can give you the impression that you are in space (as seen here, here and here). So the easiest thing to do is just say that they never even left the atmosphere of the planet.

1. Outer space is defined as beginning 20 miles up.

2. By your 'definition', the Space Shuttle, the Hubble Telescope, and the International Space Station are not in space.

3. There's no oxygen in the exosphere, it's too heavy. All that's up there is hydrogen, with some helium, carbon dioxide and atomic oxygen at the exobase. Since Saiyans breathe oxygen, they couldn't breathe in the exosphere.

the ki that surrounds their body (their aura) is powerful enough to repel the vacuum of space

what

How the fuck do you repel a vacuum?!

Captain Awesome wrote:I would just use the same explanation as we have for the Bardock special..

"The planet has a really BIG atmosphere"

Actually, Planet Vegeta would have a small and thick atmosphere. Its gravity is ten times stronger than Earth's, it would pull the air down ten times harder.

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 9:47 am

Rocketman wrote:

Actually, Planet Vegeta would have a small and thick atmosphere. Its gravity is ten times stronger than Earth's, it would pull the air down ten times harder.

Then again can we really apply real world science to a place where dinosaurs and hover cars coexist?

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 9:53 am

NeptuneKai wrote:Then again can we really apply real world science to a place where dinosaurs and hover cars coexist?

Neither dinosaurs nor hover cars defy the laws of science.

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 9:54 am

Rocketman wrote:
NeptuneKai wrote:Then again can we really apply real world science to a place where dinosaurs and hover cars coexist?
Neither dinosaurs nor hover cars defy the laws of science.

True enough...how about a destroyed moon having no effect on the Earth what-so-ever?

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 10:02 am

NeptuneKai wrote:True enough...how about a destroyed moon having no effect on the Earth what-so-ever?

AAAAAGGGGGHHHHHHHHHRRRRFFFFFFLLLLLLLLLLL

No sir, I don't like it.

Saiyan-Professor · Post by **Saiyan-Professor** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 1:57 pm

This is a good question and it makes me raise another that has been plaguing ever since I saw movie 8. In movie 8, an infant Broli saved himself and his father through means of his Ki-shield. We do not know how far the next closest planet was to planet Vegeta or if Broli and Paragus even went to that one out of fear that Freeza and his men would check there. Even if some oxygen was captured inside the Ki-sphere the moment he formed the barrier, it could not last very long. So does that mean that Ki could be converted into some kind of substance that will prolong life in the body when oxygen is absent? Now I know some will dismiss this as just a movie but I would really like to know an answer if one is possible.

caejones · Post by **caejones** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 2:08 pm

"Since my planet is so small, the gravity is far greater than what you're used to."
"But that doesn't make any sense!"
"Shut up, Greggory! Ok, how's this: there's an insanely powerful space pirate trapped in my planet, and that's why the gravity is so strong!"
"Yar! Get me out of here!"
"Shut up, Bojak!"

Ur...
Um...
Bardock's just that bad?
Oooh, or maybe Freeza's ship has some sort of atmosphere-containment field (TM) around it, and Bardock flew inside of that?

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 2:37 pm

Saiyan-Professor wrote:This is a good question and it makes me raise another that has been plaguing ever since I saw movie 8. In movie 8, an infant Broli saved himself and his father through means of his Ki-shield. We do not know how far the next closest planet was to planet Vegeta or if Broli and Paragus even went to that one out of fear that Freeza and his men would check there. Even if some oxygen was captured inside the Ki-sphere the moment he formed the barrier, it could not last very long. So does that mean that Ki could be converted into some kind of substance that will prolong life in the body when oxygen is absent? Now I know some will dismiss this as just a movie but I would really like to know an answer if one is possible.

I get the impression that this is the exact reason Freeza can survive in space: it's a ki technique that keeps the blood pumping and all the other physiological stuff doin' toin'.

We're also ignoring the anaerobic abilities of people who are very physically fit. If a human can last minutes without air, I see no problem with a super powerful warrior lasting minutes without air. The lack of oxygen would just make things harder.

Granted, Bardock flat out shouts in space, but we even see Vegeta talking to himself underwater in the Namek saga, at the simple cost of him needing more air when he gets out of the water.

caejones · Post by **caejones** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 2:41 pm

Well, then Gohan and Kuririn went looking for "the Mermades' Pearl" and were underwater for most of an episode conversationing.

(Filler, at the end of Garlic Jr?)

Saiyan-Professor · Post by **Saiyan-Professor** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 2:45 pm

Dayspring wrote:
Saiyan-Professor wrote:This is a good question and it makes me raise another that has been plaguing ever since I saw movie 8. In movie 8, an infant Broli saved himself and his father through means of his Ki-shield. We do not know how far the next closest planet was to planet Vegeta or if Broli and Paragus even went to that one out of fear that Freeza and his men would check there. Even if some oxygen was captured inside the Ki-sphere the moment he formed the barrier, it could not last very long. So does that mean that Ki could be converted into some kind of substance that will prolong life in the body when oxygen is absent? Now I know some will dismiss this as just a movie but I would really like to know an answer if one is possible.
I get the impression that this is the exact reason Freeza can survive in space: it's a ki technique that keeps the blood pumping and all the other physiological stuff doin' toin'.

We're also ignoring the anaerobic abilities of people who are very physically fit. If a human can last minutes without air, I see no problem with a super powerful warrior lasting minutes without air. The lack of oxygen would just make things harder.

Granted, Bardock flat out shouts in space, but we even see Vegeta talking to himself underwater in the Namek saga, at the simple cost of him needing more air when he gets out of the water.

I guess it is similar to how the body feeds off its own fat stores when it goes with out physical nourishment for an extended period. However, in this case, it feeds off Ki-reserves instead and changes it into whatever is needed to survive and apparently, he can assist others in doing the same since Paragus was along for the ride. Since Broli could be considered the ultimate survivor/predator, he would have access to techniques and abilities most others would not.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 2:49 pm

Dayspring wrote:I get the impression that this is the exact reason Freeza can survive in space: it's a ki technique that keeps the blood pumping and all the other physiological stuff doin' toin'.

It's the brain that needs a constant supply of oxygen. The heart and other organs will do all right on reserves, but the brain's gotta have fresh oxygen.

As for the ki explanation... you people are giving me a serious headache. *pops some tylenol*

SSj_Rambo · Post by **SSj_Rambo** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 3:19 pm

Rocketman wrote:
SSj_Rambo wrote:There's nothing in the manga or in that TV special that says that Bardock and Freeza's henchmen were in space. It really looks that way, but when you enter the exosphere it can give you the impression that you are in space (as seen here, here and here). So the easiest thing to do is just say that they never even left the atmosphere of the planet.
2. By your 'definition', the Space Shuttle, the Hubble Telescope, and the International Space Station are not in space.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you just trying to say I used bad pictures? Well the pictures aren't a big pat of it, I just Google searched "upper atmosphere" "exosphere" and that type of stuff and got these pictures and used them to show that you can still be inside of a planet's atmosphere when I looks like you are in space. So maybe the pictures were mislabeled, I'm sorry, I didn't mean for them to be so important.

Rocketman wrote:
the ki that surrounds their body (their aura) is powerful enough to repel the vacuum of space
what

How the fuck do you repel a vacuum?!

The same way that a space shuttle does. The walls of a space shuttle surround it's occupants and prevent any suction from reaching their bodies. That is what I was hypothesizing about the aura that surrounds a Super Saiya-jin's body.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 3:29 pm

SSj_Rambo wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you just trying to say I used bad pictures? Well the pictures aren't a big pat of it, I just Google searched "upper atmosphere" "exosphere" and that type of stuff and got these pictures and used them to show that you can still be inside of a planet's atmosphere when I looks like you are in space. So maybe the pictures were mislabeled, I'm sorry, I didn't mean for them to be so important.

No, those pictures are correct...kinda. They're all lower than where the shuttle flies, as you can see here:

The highest the shuttle has ever flown is about 500 kilometers up.

The exosphere extends out 10,000 kilometers.

The same way that a space shuttle does. The walls of a space shuttle surround it's occupants and prevent any suction from reaching their bodies. That is what I was hypothesizing about the aura that surrounds a Super Saiya-jin's body.

There's no suction in space. And you can't repel a vacuum, because a vacuum is nothing.

saiyanprincess · Post by **saiyanprincess** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 5:23 pm

Rocketman wrote:
NeptuneKai wrote:True enough...how about a destroyed moon having no effect on the Earth what-so-ever?
AAAAAGGGGGHHHHHHHHHRRRRFFFFFFLLLLLLLLLLL

No sir, I don't like it.

The moon affects the oceans tides. If the moon really were to be destroyed not only would we be subjected to meteroites and other space debris that is large enough to make it through the atmosphere but we would also be flooded by incredible tides that never pass. - Or in some parts there would be no ocean... Life would sure be different. ^_^

Forgotten Hero · Post by **Forgotten Hero** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 6:05 pm

Saiyan-Professor wrote: http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr63 ... father.jpg

Sorry couldn't resist!

Bussani · Post by **Bussani** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 8:33 pm

How the fuck do you repel a vacuum?!

Aren't you quibbling over semantics? I just took his statement to mean you'd use your ki to protect you from the vacuum of space, like a force field. It's not that far fetched of an idea considering the series we're talking about. The trick would be getting more oxygen, assuming they can't just create it from their ki (as other characters have created clothes, weapons, etc) or somehow recycle the carbon dioxide. That might sound crazy, but....Goku can fricken teleport across the universe, as well as into the afterlife itself. This kind of thing seems minor compared to that.