Saiyan classes and their hierarchy?

dragonballzgtfighter · Post by **dragonballzgtfighter** » Sat Oct 25, 2008 10:19 pm

I'm confused with all the words being used just how many Saiyan classes are there and what is their hierarchy?

Snail · Post by **Snail** » Sat Oct 25, 2008 11:38 pm

I didn't pay enough attention in History class to know what-in-the-hey I'm talking about, but I suppose you could use a triangle heirarchy of the feudel age for reference, just to get things started.

What we know is that there is indeed a figurehead; the king. Then, there are the high-class and low-class rankings. These statements are confirmed.

I don't recall any Saiyans appearing in the position of overlooking resources, and other relatable duties. One could assume that they had hired, or enslaved certain species/races to work under them, thus, leading the entire Saiyan race to fall into the rank of the warrior-class. This is just speculation of course.

Super Sonic · Post by **Super Sonic** » Sat Oct 25, 2008 11:38 pm

I'd assume they had an upper elite/nobility, middle ground, and expendable peasants.

Cypher · Post by **Cypher** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 8:37 am

I could have sworn it states somewhere in Daizenshuu 7 something to the effect that 'all Saiyajin are warriors'...I'm off to check now.

caejones · Post by **caejones** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:01 am

I recall a rather similar topic in the recent past... Hmm.
I think someone (Dayspring?) had tried to interpret the possibilities with regards to a saiyan changing class, and in so doing gave us three or so classes, except that one of them turned out not to be mentioned in the series.

Still, I think we reasoned that there are probably three classes (Really-freaking-low (Goku, maybe Raditz), low-but-not-useless (between Raditz and Nappa, I guess?), elite (Nappa was an elite, right?), and... ur... Vegeta.).
Hmm.

[edit] Oh, and one's class clearly doesn't change with power, if it's true that Bardock was surpassing the likes of Nappa and the King. (I think it was Dayspring's theory that it was possible to move up a class, but never two, hence, if Bardock started out as the lowest of the low, and there was something between that and Nappa's class, there's no way Bardock would become an elite, no matter how powerful he was; though it's probably just as likely that the saiyans just plain don't permit ascension. I'm reminded of an editorial somewhere on daizex where someone mentioned that the Saiyans were something of a reference to Japaneseracial classism or something to that effect, which is why I like to say that GT shows Toei's racism. ^^ )). [/edit]

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 1:47 pm

Nappa says he is an 'elite warrior of the nobility' when Goku starts to show him up in the Viz manga.

Raditz is probably an average Saiyan, note that his power level of 1200 was good enough for Freeza to keep him around for twenty-odd years, so the vast majority of races in the universe must be below 1000.

Goku is likely the lowest of the low, as even the low-class Bardock looked down on him.

Vegeta breaks the limits. Surely in a society like the Saiyans' the strongest being would be the King, yet Vegeta surpasses him as a boy. When first shown, Vegeta is literally the second-strongest being in the universe, with only Freeza above him.

So, constructing a scale here, with some extrapolation on their places in society:

Goku - Trash. Sent to the weakest planets and even then, not expected to live. Presumably, if there are no suitable planets available, they are simply killed. Adult power level - Low hundreds, 416 (4,160) in Goku's case. [Note that Goku got special training from four martial arts masters. His inherent strength must be much, much less.]

Raditz- Low-class. Standard Saiyan warrior and probably the bulk of the population. Grunts, ground-pounders, considered expendable. They don't seem to begrudge this, though, probably because it means MOAR FITIN! Adult power level - 1,000s (10,000s)

Nappa - Elite/Nobility class. The strongest Saiyans, probably serve as the 'governors' of the Saiyan Empire, as well as the FUBAR-brigade, sent in to fix problems the grunts can't handle. Adult power level - 8,000s (80,000s)

King Vegeta - Grand Imperial Poobah. The single strongest Saiyan of all is seated as King of the Saiyans. As in Earth monarchies, his dynasty lasts only until one of the nobles becomes strong enough to overthrow it. In addition, he is likely challenged all the time by anyone seeking to take the fast lane to the top. Adult power level - 10,000+ (100,000+)

Prince Vegeta - Saiyan messiah. Far beyond even his father, Prince Vegeta stands as the strongest being in the universe, second only to Freeza himself. No longer even dependent on a moon to unlock his full power, Prince Vegeta is the pinnacle of all of Saiyan history. The only Saiyan beyond him was the so-called "Super Saiyan". Adult power level - 18,000 (180,000, less if he uses the power ball).

Bardock bucks the curve. Presumably, low-class Saiyans die before they get enough zenkais to dramatically raise their power. A combination of luck and (maybe) his teammates pulling his buns out of the fire let him rise way above his rank. King Vegeta would have killed Bardock personally once he learned of Bardock's new powers, but his rebellion against Freeza took priority at the time.

Cypher · Post by **Cypher** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 2:03 pm

Just as another possible idea (although I agree with Rocketman's version above), could it perhaps be the case that there are only the two 'ranks'; the average, nothing-special Saiyajin (ranging from absolute scum -Goku- to slightly better, such as...uh, I'm going to say Raditz, but only through lack of other examples) and 'elite' (Nappa etc). Perhaps there is a dividing line which, if crossed, qualifies one for the title of 'elite' Saiyajin? As in, rather than a social system per se (we only really see King and Prince Vegeta as standing above anyone else in 'the past'; even King Vegeta's elites are basically just soldiers he commands, as are his caped throneroom guys) 'elite' simply denotes membership of the, say, 15% of warriors with power levels over, I don't know...3000? (Note: number arbitrarily chosen

)

A negative point against this idea is that Bardock, despite his increasing power, is still called (and/or considers himself) basically a low-level grunt; also Vegeta calling Goku 'low-level' or something to that effect about a million times even when he's stronger than the prince...which would actually support the idea- akin to concepts of aristocracy being down to blood rather than wealth necessarily- that birth (in terms of parentage as well as power level) is a relevant factor.

Just an alternative- I don't like it as much as the idea of an actual hierarchy, but it's just for the sake of discussion ^_^

Kunzait_83 · Post by **Kunzait_83** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 3:08 pm

Terra-jin · Post by **Terra-jin** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 3:14 pm

You can see why Freeza bothered to save Vegeta, if he could be at 180,000.

Can we assume that Freeza's empire had the same hierarchy? If so, then almost every single Saiyan would be an elite when in their Ôzaru form. It must've been a difficult decision for Freeza to wipe out such a valuable race.

SSj_Rambo · Post by **SSj_Rambo** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 3:19 pm

Terra-jin wrote:Can we assume that Freeza's empire had the same hierarchy? If so, then almost every single Saiyan would be an elite when in their Ôzaru form. It must've been a difficult decision for Freeza to wipe out such a valuable race.

I doubt the Saiya-jins being able to transform into uncontrollable and powerful beasts in an instant was not something of value in Freeza’s eyes. If anything, I think that that attribute of the Saiya-ijns made Freeza happier to annihilate them.

Just my opinion.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 3:19 pm

Kunzait_83 wrote:I pretty much agree with everything Rocketman said about the Saiya-jin classes shy of one thing; Vegeta was NOT the strongest being in the entire universe second only to Freeza. That would be Captain Ginyu, and that’s not even taking into account King Cold (and Coola and his men if you wanna take them as canon to the anime). Freeza’s family seems to keep an elite cadre of personal warriors close to the vest who all clearly outrank Vegeta and the Saiya-jin as a whole by a vastly substantial degree.

The Oozaru transformation is an essential part of Saiyan fighting and is heavily implied (and shown, in the anime) to be their main method of conquest. That, plus the fact that Vegeta can go Oozaru anywhere by using the power ball puts his transformation on the same level as Zarbon's or Freeza's.

Kunzait_83 · Post by **Kunzait_83** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 3:33 pm

SaiyaMel · Post by **SaiyaMel** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:27 pm

but they were also INCREDIBLY high maintenance prima donnas.

With that said - providing them the right amounts of food needed to sustain their ravenous appetites, must have been a pain given the Saiyan population size at the time (some of Freeza's workers might have had to prepare meals for them).

Wojak · Post by **Wojak** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 5:53 pm

SaiyaMel wrote:
but they were also INCREDIBLY high maintenance prima donnas.
With that said - providing them the right amounts of food needed to sustain their ravenous appetites, must have been a pain given the Saiyan population size at the time (some of Freeza's workers might have had to prepare meals for them).

As seen with Vegeta, the Saiyans probably got their food via the conquests.
Vegeta was munching the arm of an alien when getting the news about Radditz's death.
They could have used the inhabitants as cattle and thus as food.

SaiyaMel · Post by **SaiyaMel** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 8:36 pm

Wojak wrote:
SaiyaMel wrote:
but they were also INCREDIBLY high maintenance prima donnas.
With that said - providing them the right amounts of food needed to sustain their ravenous appetites, must have been a pain given the Saiyan population size at the time (some of Freeza's workers might have had to prepare meals for them).
As seen with Vegeta, the Saiyans probably got their food via the conquests.
Vegeta was munching the arm of an alien when getting the news about Radditz's death.
They could have used the inhabitants as cattle and thus as food.

Except during time after they've eaten everyone up.

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Tue Oct 28, 2008 7:26 pm

According to the Daizenshuu, 1200 is the average power level of Low Level Saiyans, while also stating that Radditz and Goku are members of the weakest caste. Since the Bardock special introduces the term "Lowest Level," it's my guess that "Lowest Level Saiyans" are merely Saiyans that are below the average PL of Low Level Warriors.

So here's how I see things now:

Officially:
1) Royalty
2) Elite
3) Low Level

Unofficially:

1) Royalty:
a) King
b) Crown Prince

2) Elite:
d) Super Elite - Saiyans that are insanely powerful. They make the Elite look weak.
e) Elite - Regular members of the Elite. These are Saiyans with power levels above the average Saiyan.

3) Low Level Saiyans:
f) Low Level Saiyans - Average Saiyan. PL between 1,200 - Elite standards.
g) Lowest Level Saiyans - Saiyans with PLs of 1,200 and under.

The real question is what's considered "Elite?" Elite Saiyans are considered weak by Freeza's army standards, so I always figured Elite Saiyans were actually only above 5,000.