Goku vs Buu, Energy Donations

[James R. Cadwell]

About Kid Buu vs. Goku:

SSJ3 Goku and Kid Buu initially had very similar power levels; otherwise Goku wouldn't have been able to match blows with Buu at all. However; any difference in power between them grew larger over the course of the fight because Goku suffered from the fatigue of battle and the energy drain of SSJ3, while Kid Buu appeared to have virtually unlimited stamina and could regenerate.

You could put two otherwise identical boxers into the ring, grant one infinite stamina and the ability to regenerate injury, and of course, he'd win and be physically unharmed at the conclusion of the match. That doesn't mean the magically-enhanced boxer is tremendously stronger than his opponent.

About the Genki Dama:

This is not a strict "energy in - energy out" attack -- it affects evil-hearted people more than those who are pure. Consequentially, I don't think we can say for certain that Gohan donated all of the energy personally available to him or that it would have a commensurate effect once part of the Genki Dama. It seems to me like the attack either taps something distinct from normal "ki" or transmutes it into a slightly different form. (IIRC, there is a distinction made between using ordinary energy and life force -- the Kikoho in DB, for example.)

I don't think the fact that Gohan's donation wasn't necessarily sufficient to destroy Kid Buu tells us that Goku couldn't beat Buu on his own.

[Deus ex Machina]

SSJ3 Goku and Kid Buu initially had very similar power levels; otherwise Goku wouldn't have been able to match blows with Buu at all. However; any difference in power between them grew larger over the course of the fight because Goku suffered from the fatigue of battle and the energy drain of SSJ3, while Kid Buu appeared to have virtually unlimited stamina and could regenerate.

While it's true that Goku seems to match Kid Boo blow for blow, it doesn't mean that they were on equal terms. Boo's fighting is completly eratic like himself; he may not have been even trying. And the boxer anaology isn't quite right either; Boo certainly doesn't have limitless stamina, he's just so much stronger than everyone else it just seems like it. In the battle of Super Boo vs. Vegetto, near the end Boo had taken so much damage that he was having a difficult time just trying to keep himself together, and his regeneration had suffered greatly.

Think about Goku and Tenshinhan's match at the last Tenkaichi tournament in dragon ball; if you went off appearances alone, you would say they had fought evenly as well, or even conclude Tenshinhan had the advantage. But of course afterwards we know that the match had never been 'close', and that Goku was going to win right from the start. I believe it's the same way with Boo.


I'll admit that it's somewhat presumptious to guage anyone's power based solely off the size of the Ki they contributed to the Genki Dama, but still the fact remains, this was probably the maximum amount he could give, based on the reasons I said before. He didn't need his Ki to fight with at the time, and he knew what was at stake. But furthermore; I don't believe that the contributors had any control over how much they give. It really had little to do with them raising their hands, but the acknowledgement that they were contributing was enough for the technique to take their energy.

[Dai]

I'll admit that it's somewhat presumptious to guage anyone's power based solely off the size of the Ki they contributed to the Genki Dama, but still the fact remains, this was probably the maximum amount he could give, based on the reasons I said before. He didn't need his Ki to fight with at the time, and he knew what was at stake. But furthermore; I don't believe that the contributors had any control over how much they give. It really had little to do with them raising their hands, but the acknowledgement that they were contributing was enough for the technique to take their energy.

Nice to see you haven't read my post in the slightest. Silly kids these days.

[Zackarotto]

"He didn't raise their arms to begin with, and I doubt he'd be so rude as to forcefully KEEP them raised." - VegettoEX

<quote="VegettoEX">He didn't raise their arms to begin with, and I doubt he'd be so rude as to forcefully KEEP them raised.</quote>

Like that, except with BBCode tags instead of HTML tags. If you can't even remember that, maybe you can click the quote button on the person's post...?

It makes everything look much more organized when the actual quote tags are used. I probably don't deserve the right to go around correcting people, but I'm just saying what everybody wants...

[PsyLiam]

Yes. What people don't want though is a big massive quote containing the entire previous post. Our attention spans are not that bad.

Er, carry on.

[Super Sonic]

The Spirit Bomb is not so much a "worthless" attack, but there were just some situations for why it didn't finish the job previously not counting movie villains. Against Vegeta, Goku lost quite a bit of the energy he gathered for it at first. If he had all of the energy he gathered originally and Vegeta wasn't in giant monkey mode, he would have finished him off. Against Frieza, well Frieza's fourth form was stronger than even he knew that it was. Heck, he said even he thought he was dead after getting hit by it. On the topic of the Earthlings raising their hands, I was thinking at first that they should just use the third wish to Porunga to make them give up the necessary energy.

[IncredibleGuy]

I like quotation marks....









but I'll switch if I end up staying here.

[SDHero]

I think that the difference comes from Goku's assessment of his own power being based off his rather limitless level he had while he was dead. Which as he had been dead for 7 years at this point, is pretty understandable. Assuming he had that kind of power, he could've concievably stayed in SSJ3 and continued to match Buu blow for blow. So, Goku goes for the only attack he's got left at that point, the Genki Dama. At this point the true potential of the Genki Dama is realized: given you can gather enough energy (and keep your opponent from pummeling you to death as you do it) you can theoretically use it to defeat any foe.

In any case, Goku thinks he has a good chance to deafeat Majin Buu, but he's saying this based on an erronious evaluation of his own strength.