Dragon Ball: Evolution- Speculation and Discussion

omegacwa · Post by **omegacwa** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:13 pm

Oh, I forgot to mention that evil characters change sides all the time in DBZ. Seriously, Piccolo, Vegeta, Fat Buu. Vegeta and Fat Buu both slaughtered countless people, blew up cities, murdered NUMEROUS GRANDFATHERS, and tried to take over the world, and yet became good guys, so suck it!

The Time Traveller · Post by **The Time Traveller** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:14 pm

omegacwa wrote:Oh, I forgot to mention that evil characters change sides all the time in DBZ. Seriously, Piccolo, Vegeta, Fat Buu. Vegeta and Fat Buu both slaughtered countless people, blew up cities, murdered NUMEROUS GRANDFATHERS, and tried to take over the world, and yet became good guys, so suck it!

Why wouldn't you count Piccolo? He was before those two, dammit.

Tsukento · Post by **Tsukento** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:14 pm

omae no kaasan wrote:Oh and one rantish thing if you'll allow it.

Ki has become some kind of amorphous fucking Lifestream bullshit, not the hard-edged throbbing raw power source we saw in the series.

...Did they just pull a Phantom Menace on us where they tried explaining what the hell "The Force" was?

Chrono Trigger · Post by **Chrono Trigger** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:14 pm

omae no kaasan wrote:Oh and one rantish thing if you'll allow it.
Ki has become some kind of amorphous fucking Lifestream bullshit, not the hard-edged throbbing raw power source we saw in the series.

Could you give some details about the last fight? Is it really short? Is it entertaining at all? Did it even look a little bit like a DB fight?

omegacwa · Post by **omegacwa** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:15 pm

The Time Traveller wrote:
omegacwa wrote:Oh, I forgot to mention that evil characters change sides all the time in DBZ. Seriously, Piccolo, Vegeta, Fat Buu. Vegeta and Fat Buu both slaughtered countless people, blew up cities, murdered NUMEROUS GRANDFATHERS, and tried to take over the world, and yet became good guys, so suck it!
Why wouldn't you count Piccolo? He was before those two, dammit.

I mentioned Piccolo, but Jr. never murdered whole cities unless I missed something, that was only Daimao, who never became good.

omae no kaasan · Post by **omae no kaasan** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:26 pm

Oh, I forgot to mention that evil characters change sides all the time in DBZ. Seriously, Piccolo, Vegeta, Fat Buu. Vegeta and Fat Buu both slaughtered countless people, blew up cities, murdered NUMEROUS GRANDFATHERS, and tried to take over the world, and yet became good guys, so suck it!

Yes, I should 'suck it' for having such an amatuerish opinion of the series. How shallow of me to take a mature approach to evaluating the film and assume things like continuity as a reward for fans.

Could you give some details about the last fight? Is it really short? Is it entertaining at all? Did it even look a little bit like a DB fight?

It's a series of very quick small ki blasts. I think most of it's been seen in the trailer actually. It's not BAD. I certainly can't say that. But there isn't much that screams DB about it.

You'd expect them to build the Kame Hame Ha up to some fantastic attack but there isn't really even much charging involved it just happens very rapidly and is over.

SPOILER FOR THE LOVE OF GOD

I SAID SPOILER

There is a moment where Goku 'masters' the beast within and says to himself, "I am Goku AND Oozaru.", and then of course the Kame Hame Ha follows shortly thereafter but Goku actually follows through with it and flies towards Piccolo.

There was a moment.

A brief moment.

Where the hairs on the back of my neck stood on end and I THOUGHT that given the MULTIPLE flashes of Oozaru we see throughout the film AND Goku's realization moments before that he's the Oozaru, that they were going to borrow a panel from the comic and show the Oozaru highlighting Goku as he approached Piccolo to smash through his stomach. I mean, given the general direction of the story (well one of them anyway) of Goku learning to control himself, it'd be the perfect opportunity for them to give us THAT much.

But no. He follows through and in a flash of light Piccolo is laying on the ground with Goku standing victorious.

omegacwa · Post by **omegacwa** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:29 pm

omae no kaasan wrote:
Oh, I forgot to mention that evil characters change sides all the time in DBZ. Seriously, Piccolo, Vegeta, Fat Buu. Vegeta and Fat Buu both slaughtered countless people, blew up cities, murdered NUMEROUS GRANDFATHERS, and tried to take over the world, and yet became good guys, so suck it!
Yes, I should 'suck it' for having such an amatuerish opinion of the series. How shallow of me to take a mature approach to evaluating the film and assume things like continuity as a reward for fans.
.

Heh man, I was responding to someone else's post, not to mention I am clearly joking.

Also, I don't see the big deal about making the two characters one, and no one has yet to give me a decent counter argument other then "Daimao was evil".

Chrono Trigger · Post by **Chrono Trigger** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:30 pm

omae no kaasan wrote: It's a series of very quick small ki blasts. I think most of it's been seen in the trailer actually. It's not BAD. I certainly can't say that. But there isn't much that screams DB about it.

You'd expect them to build the Kame Hame Ha up to some fantastic attack but there isn't really even much charging involved it just happens very rapidly and is over.

Aw that sucks. I was hoping the battle would be a bit more "martial arts" focused with people getting thrown into mountains/pillars. Oh well. Thank for answering my question! [/quote]

omae no kaasan · Post by **omae no kaasan** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:34 pm

...Did they just pull a Phantom Menace on us where they tried explaining what the hell "The Force" was?

Yes and no but it didn't annoy me. The only reason I even took note was because I'm a DB fan. If I wasn't a DB fan it would have been absolutely believable.

They talk about the 'elements' and the importance of them.

Plus there's a shitload of attention paid to Shadow Crane Fist or whatever. Was that attack even in DB? I mean, that's another reason I can't figure out WHO this movie is made for. Sometimes you make concessions in order to please the public, sometimes you make concessions to please fans. But in places that have no effect on EITHER, they've made choices that are displeasing to both parties. They could have called it any random hand-to-hand technique from the series, so that we, as fans, could go, "Hey cool!" But no, they've changed it. For what reason? Who does 'Shadow Crane Fist' please? Did it test better with audiences?

I just don't understand how someone thought those kind of decisions were good for anyone.

Pain · Post by **Pain** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:36 pm

I want to see a screen shot of Daimao getting that soup...NOW.

omae no kaasan · Post by **omae no kaasan** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:39 pm

Pain, I don't believe they actually showed her feeding him. She walks over and places a warm towel on what we're to assume is his forehead (it's still obscured) but then he stirs and rolls over and looks at her with this, "Just two more minutes Mom.", look on his face.

It was rich.

Pain · Post by **Pain** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:43 pm

omae no kaasan wrote:Pain, I don't believe they actually showed her feeding him. She walks over and places a warm towel on what we're to assume is his forehead (it's still obscured) but then he stirs and rolls over and looks at her with this, "Just two more minutes Mom.", look on his face.

It was rich.

So could you tell me how Son defeats him? And how the hell does he get into a village? Sorry for the questionare, I just have to know.

omae no kaasan · Post by **omae no kaasan** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:50 pm

So could you tell me how Son defeats him? And how the hell does he get into a village? Sorry for the questionare, I just have to know.

SPOILER

SPOILER

He's defeated by the Kame Hame Ha. Goku jumps into the air following through with it and collides with Piccolo. After a flash we see him standing victorious over Piccolo lying on the ground.

We're given no indication how he arrives at the town but I wasn't really concerned with that. He could have stumbled there on his last legs or been found (despite being in the middle of nowhere) but stingers are pretty important for films that try to employ them to create interest in a sequel.

I really half-expected to see Chatwin roll over appearing a few years older, with longer hair wearing strange armor ie. Raditz. That would have made non-fans curious as to why someone like Goku appeared so different and of course I would have totally geeked out myself.

Chrono Trigger · Post by **Chrono Trigger** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:02 pm

Omae do you think the average kid would at least enjoy this movie? Since that's who FOX is pandering too?

Tsukento · Post by **Tsukento** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:03 pm

Oh, since no one else asked.

How was the whole summoning of Shenlong? What exactly WAS the purpose of summoning him? And how did the effects come across to you?

MisterFlashdude · Post by **MisterFlashdude** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:05 pm

Tsukento wrote:Oh, since no one else asked.

How was the whole summoning of Shenlong? What exactly WAS the purpose of summoning him? And how did the effects come across to you?

Uber spoiler link of doom.

Tsukento · Post by **Tsukento** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:08 pm

MisterFlashdude wrote:Uber spoiler link of doom.

...Oh dear god.

omae no kaasan · Post by **omae no kaasan** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:13 pm

Omae do you think the average kid would at least enjoy this movie? Since that's who FOX is pandering too?

Really small foreign kids? Yes. But the toilet jokes they put in as an attempt to give it some resemblance to the original all fell flat with the Japanese family in the theater. Not even any giggling from elementary school students.

There's a certain fascination that may hit them. The same kind of fascination that hit me when I saw the greatest film of all time Super Mario Brothers: The Movie. But in years it will come to be reviled by those same children who enjoyed it at the time when they see what a poorly constructed film it was.

Oh, since no one else asked.

How was the whole summoning of Shenlong? What exactly WAS the purpose of summoning him? And how did the effects come across to you?

SPOILER

SPOILER

Yeah, as you can see, Shenron has become gold, the sky isn't even black, Shenron doesn't speak and they changed to words to summon him.

I didn't want to focus on differences because...if you focus on that you'd spend all day on it and in the end, so long as those differences are handled well they don't matter. But they're not...

Velasa · Post by **Velasa** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:13 pm

omae no kaasan wrote: OH PLEASE TELL ME WHAT GREAT MYSTERY LIES WITHI-

.................
...^%#$%^&*(*%^&%$^

It's taken me a while to even be able to type this calmly because among all the bullshit ideas this thing's been perpetrating, I thought at least Daimaou was dead and Pic'd follow, because Daimaou is not the kind of man who reforms. He's bundled up madness and burning- he does not change his opinion or grow to like people. He's Daimaou. Madness and evil incarnate, and I thought we were finally past this crap and Piccolo'd be following and we'd get a sensible explanation for all of this.

I've accepted or been able to ignore or get past a lot of crap with this movie, but this might just be the straw that breaks my $#)*!(@* back. A lot of you guys'll say I'm overreacting and it's just a trivial aspect, ect ect, but this..... this just hits all of my buttons just the wrong way and saps the man entirely of character development ("Oh, they beat me up, we're friends now!") when it seemed so much like the man was actually going to be respected in this movie, and breaking him and deleting Pic is just too goddamn much for me to accept.

Cypher · Post by **Cypher** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:17 pm

Would it really have been so goddamn difficult to have Daimaou spit up a CGI egg, or SOMETHING to make it in some way anything like the manga version of the Daimaou/Piccolo Jr. setup...?