Thoughts on the "legendary" Super Saiya-jin....

[ItsAllGood]

Hello all,

I have just finished watching "The Legendary Super Saiya-jin" , and a few things stike me as strange with Brolli's transformations.

After reading the page outlining Brolli's tranformations from his normal stage, to SSJ and his "legendary" stage, I personally believe that there is no "legendary" stage to speak of. Part of this theory stems from a couple of scenes, where Brolli is in outer space with his father.

He seems to be surrounded by a pinkish aura, and his hair does not seem to be green as noted in his "green-haired" SSJ transformation, rather it is reflecting the pink aura , so I'm assuming it's actually gold and that he is in his regular SSJ stage, just like a regular SSJ (Goku, Vegeta etc). I belive only after he was brought under control, his power was limited, which only allowed him to become a "half-powered" ssj, which we see in pictures and the movie. If his hair changes from black - to green - to gold, that would makes sense....

As for his legendary form , i believe that it is only his prefered form. Notice that in the Cell Saga. Goku perfects the SSJ form after training with Gohan in the Spirit and Time room. This allows Goku to take Cell on as an equal, even after both Trunks and Vegeta tried to defeat him in USSJ and USSJ2 forms. So, in this case, a "regular perfected" SSJ is more powerful than the "imperfected" higher stages of SSJ.

I would think that Brolli just prefered to use this form , and over time he eventually got used to it and was able to stay in the form and increase his speed and power. I think that the form we assume to be the "legendary" form is only the perfected USSJ3 form , which we never see any of the other Saiya-jins reach.

I'm sure that if any of the other Saiya-jins stayed in a "prefered" stage, they would grow used to it and perhaps overcome the downsides of using the form, such as the Goku vs Cell scenario.

There is a lot of assuming here , but this is just my opinion

Sorry for the long post, but thoughts on the matter would be great!

Cheers,

ItsAllGood

[VegettoEX]

This is why we called the stages what we call them. As the movies are Toei productions, and this specific book (daizenshuu six) is put out in association with Toei, we can pretty much consider it "fact" in terms of what information it provides.

http://www.daizex.com/misc_stuff/broli_ ... _small.jpg

From left to right:

"tsuujouji" -- "normal time" or "regular"
"suupaa saiyajin" -- SSJ
"densetsu no suupaa saiyajin" -- Legendary SSJ

http://www.daizex.com/misc_stuff/broli_ ... _small.jpg

Which is backs-up the above; from right to left this time:

"suupaa saiyajin" -- SSJ
"densetsu no suupaa saiyajin" -- Legendary SSJ

Common fan-theory has pretty much come to decide that Paragus' control device holds back Broli's ACTUAL "regular" SSJ form... which we seen in DBZ movie 10, because that device no longer exists (it blew up in movie eight). From that stage he transforms to one stage higher, the LSSJ stage.

If the producers of the movie are going to literally name stages along-side visual representations of what appeared in the movie, we're not going to argue with that! ^_~ Hopefully that makes a little sense as to why we say what we say; we try to back it up as much as we can. I can definitely see where you're coming from, though.

[Deus ex Machina]

You certainly raise an interesting theory; that Broli's "legendary" transformation is the USSJ equivelant of Goku's "Full Powered SSJ" form. However, considering that Broli is reffered to several times as the "Legendary Super Saiyan", you have to assume that he's the only one capable of doing it. Besides, Broli wouldn't have had any time to perfect that form; I'm pretty sure that it was the first time he had ever reached that stage.

Toei created another plot hole with this transformation however; if Broli can transform into a Super Saiyan, and his "Legendary" Super Saiyan, then what was the point of the first stage? Did all previous Super Saiyans reach the Legendary form? You would think that would create two legends, since their two different transformations.

[Sun_Wukong]

That whole Legendary SSJ thing is another thing Toei screwed up on when they tried to expand on it. According to Toriyama's first theory, a SSJ can only happen once every 1.000 years. I'm guessing by the time the Freeza saga had ended he had forgoten about that theory, since he was planning to end it there anyway.

Toei just completely ignored that theory creating Brolly, concidering he and Goku are the exact same age.

The way I look at it, Brolly figured out a way to controll USSJ2, while everyone else couldnt. I'm basing this on how frikkin huge every one got at USSJ2. When Goku and Vegeta first confronted Brolly, I believe that was SSJ2. Was his green-ish hair SSJ? Other than that, I'm completely lost on Brolly.

[Endishiki]

As far as Broly goes, I take this approach.

Goku is the canon Legendary SSj.

Broly is the non-canon Legendary SSj.

[The S]

My theory is that the convulted SSJ form from Movie 8 (as seen on that scan) is sort of like Goku's Giji SSJ form, but instead of not having enough power, it was because of Paragus' mind control device that he could not become a full Super Saiyan.

[*PINHEAD*]

I don't see the "Legendary" Super Saiyan thing as a form. The "Every-1000-years" idea makes more sense if the Super Saiyan was just some extraordinary Saiyan that rarely came about. That idea would make sense if DB had ended after the Freeza story arc, as originally intended, but when the other Saiyans achieved the state as well, it got confusing. Perhaps Broly is just the extremely rare, extraordinary Saiyan. Then again, I'm wrong often.

Also, the regular Super Saiyan state is not more powerful than the USSJ. It is, however, faster and less energy-consuming, making it more efficient.

[ItsAllGood]

Re-post....

[ItsAllGood]

I do agree on the regular Super Saiyan stage as not being more powerful than USSJ...with one exception. How was Goku able to give Cell such a good fight at the end of the Cell Saga if he had not at least become as powerful (in terms of pure strength) as Cell himself?

I tend to believe that Goku had gotten around the limiting factors of the regular SSJ state by the end of the Cell Saga, which included raising his strength to the USSJ level and already having the speed and energy to at least match Cell's due to his training with Gohan.

If this is the case, would this mean that the "regular" SSJ state would be more powerful than USSJ (if only in this case)? Witness Vegeta and Trunks getting beaten to a pulp due to their speed in USSJ. Goku dishes out the same amount of damage to Cell...but only in his SSJ form. So would this mean that somewhere along the line, Goku was able to include the strength of USSJ into his regular SSJ form?

[Folly]

You are mistaking the regular ssj state with the full power ssj state. Ussj and Ussj2 are higher states of the ssj1 state that increase power at the expense of speed. Essentially a flawed form. Fpssj is the utmost max of the ssj1 state. As such it is the mastered form, you could say a perfected form of ssj1, making it stronger then Ussj and Ussj2. This is why Goku was able to go toe to toe with Cell.

[*PINHEAD*]

When Son Goku went "Full Power," he was still in his regular Super Saiyan form. Because he had learned to conserve power, and did so for like more than a week, his full powered self was dramatically stronger than the USSJ. However, if he did go USSJ after conserving all that energy, that state would be more powerful, but energy would be lost fairly quickly.